Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

This is what Maxprop said: "Show us a photo of you--clad any way you choose--on the same boat you showed
us in another photo, and I'll believe you're not Neal. Of course you can't do this because you *are* Neal."

So I posted this photo of me standing in the cockpit clad any way I chose on the same boat.
http://www.badongo.com/pic/420193 And, what did Maxprop say? This is what he says...
"It's terrible, actually. The boat would be down by the stern as well. Neal should stick with being a
conservative--he does that pretty well. That would be "bow," madame colregs expert. Ten miles an hour??
Not knots? And from the surface of the water, there isn't a knot and one half. You're terrible at this,
Neal. Give it up. Throw in the towel before you embarrass yourself further. Oh, now we're back to proper
terminology, eh? What sort of sailor refers to "pulleys" and "hanks" in the same breath?? Next time you're
at Wal-Mart, buy "Sailing for Dummies."

What a jerk! Next time you're(see the contraction - screw you, Maxprop!) at Wal-Mart get a book about how
to be a gentleman. Gentlemen don't lie and you lied. You're worse than Tom. He lies outta ignorance but you
lie on purpose because you're a freaking liar..... You said you'd believe I wasn't Capt. Neal if I posted that
picture and you lied about it. What a LOSER as Tom's so fond of saying.

Cheers,
Ellen

P.S. Get out your windows magnifier and look at the waterline on the transom on the empty boat. Then look at
the water line on the one with me in it. The water line's down at least an inch maybe two inches. Do it and you'll
be ashamed of your false claims. I expect Katy to be not too bright but I thought you had half a brain.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

..... You said you'd believe I wasn't Capt. Neal if I posted that
picture and you lied about it.

If it makes you feel any better, I believe you. I mean why would you go
through all of this if it wasn't you? You could have easily sidestepped the
whole issue.

Bill

--
Message posted via http://www.boatkb.com

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

scbafreak via BoatKB.com wrote:
..... You said you'd believe I wasn't Capt. Neal if I posted that
picture and you lied about it.


If it makes you feel any better, I believe you. I mean why would you go
through all of this if it wasn't you? You could have easily sidestepped the
whole issue.

Bill

Gimme a break....you the dumbest person in the world???

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Ellen MacArthur wrote:
This is what Maxprop said: "Show us a photo of you--clad any way you choose--on the same boat you showed
us in another photo, and I'll believe you're not Neal. Of course you can't do this because you *are* Neal."

So I posted this photo of me standing in the cockpit clad any way I chose on the same boat.
http://www.badongo.com/pic/420193 And, what did Maxprop say? This is what he says...
"It's terrible, actually. The boat would be down by the stern as well. Neal should stick with being a
conservative--he does that pretty well. That would be "bow," madame colregs expert. Ten miles an hour??
Not knots? And from the surface of the water, there isn't a knot and one half. You're terrible at this,
Neal. Give it up. Throw in the towel before you embarrass yourself further. Oh, now we're back to proper
terminology, eh? What sort of sailor refers to "pulleys" and "hanks" in the same breath?? Next time you're
at Wal-Mart, buy "Sailing for Dummies."

What a jerk! Next time you're(see the contraction - screw you, Maxprop!) at Wal-Mart get a book about how
to be a gentleman. Gentlemen don't lie and you lied. You're worse than Tom. He lies outta ignorance but you
lie on purpose because you're a freaking liar..... You said you'd believe I wasn't Capt. Neal if I posted that
picture and you lied about it. What a LOSER as Tom's so fond of saying.

Cheers,
Ellen

P.S. Get out your windows magnifier and look at the waterline on the transom on the empty boat. Then look at
the water line on the one with me in it. The water line's down at least an inch maybe two inches. Do it and you'll
be ashamed of your false claims. I expect Katy to be not too bright but I thought you had half a brain.






Nope..you're wrong. Max said "post a picture of you" and since you
posted the picture of some underwear model instead, the whole deal's
off. You are Neal. To post a picture of you, you need to post a pic of
Neal on the Tangerine.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Gimme a break....you the dumbest person in the world???

No. You are spending so much time saying "if you do this I'll believe you"
then it happens and you say "that's not good enough". People that are as
negative as you really bother me. Dumb is backtracking what you say and not
admitting when you are wrong. Dumb is spending your time trying to put
someone else down so that you can feel better about yourself.

You know nothing about me, or Ellen for that matter, and you keep making
assumptions that we are somehow unintelligent or liars. You aren't the only
one here that has been indulging in this behavior. When did it become okay
to talk to people like that? Do you go up to people on the street and cal
them names and tell them everything they say is a lie? Maybe Ellen works
really hard to look like that and she doesn't apreciate when people say that
she couldn't possibly be that girl in the picture, the girl in picture is a
floozy bikini model. Do you ever think that the people on the computer are,
in fact, people and they have no reason to go through this much just to lie
to you. If she was lying then she would have never offerd to take a picture.
She could have very easily given some excuse for why she can't get a picture
up. Instead she said there will be a pic, and then there was.

--
Message posted via BoatKB.com
http://www.boatkb.com/Uwe/Forums.asp...iling/200701/1

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"katy" wrote
Nope..you're wrong. Max said "post a picture of you" and since you posted the picture of some underwear model
instead, the whole deal's off. You are Neal. To post a picture of you, you need to post a pic of Neal on the
Tangerine.

Duh! You do only have half a brain. What you just said makes no sense. No sense at all.
And I'll tell you why. Again this is what Maxprop said: "Show us a photo of you--clad any
way you choose--on the same boat you showed us in another photo, and I'll believe you're
not Neal. Of course you can't do this because you *are* Neal."
You're saying if there was a picture of Capt. Neal in the Tangerine then he'd believe
Capt. Neal wasn't Capt. Neal. Yes, that's certainly logical, Katy. Don't you think? NOT!
You keep saying it's a fake photoshopped picture. But, if that's the case how come
the transom is down maybe two inches further in the water than when the boat's empty.
Look at the pictures closely and you'll have to admit it's the case. Cut and pasted pictures
don't weigh anything, Katy. Duh!

Cheers,
Ellen

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"scbafreak via BoatKB.com" u25927@uwe wrote

No. You are spending so much time saying "if you do this I'll believe you"
then it happens and you say "that's not good enough". People that are as
negative as you really bother me. Dumb is backtracking what you say and not
admitting when you are wrong. Dumb is spending your time trying to put
someone else down so that you can feel better about yourself.

You know nothing about me, or Ellen for that matter, and you keep making
assumptions that we are somehow unintelligent or liars. You aren't the only
one here that has been indulging in this behavior. When did it become okay
to talk to people like that? Do you go up to people on the street and cal
them names and tell them everything they say is a lie? Maybe Ellen works
really hard to look like that and she doesn't apreciate when people say that
she couldn't possibly be that girl in the picture, the girl in picture is a
floozy bikini model. Do you ever think that the people on the computer are,
in fact, people and they have no reason to go through this much just to lie
to you. If she was lying then she would have never offerd to take a picture.
She could have very easily given some excuse for why she can't get a picture
up. Instead she said there will be a pic, and then there was.


Thanks, Bill. You're a gentleman. You guys are rare in this group.... Some of these people
around here just have this fetish.... You can show them and show them and they keep asking
for more. Katy's probably just jealous but Tom and Maxprop are rude and ungentlemanly.

Cheers,
Ellen

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Ellen MacArthur wrote:
"katy" wrote

Nope..you're wrong. Max said "post a picture of you" and since you posted the picture of some underwear model
instead, the whole deal's off. You are Neal. To post a picture of you, you need to post a pic of Neal on the
Tangerine.


Duh! You do only have half a brain. What you just said makes no sense. No sense at all.
And I'll tell you why.

Becasue you have no brain at all.

Again this is what Maxprop said: "Show us a photo of you-

optimal word "you" and since you posted a pic of a bimbo, which
obviosuly isn't you, the whole deal's off...you are soooooooooo...we;;,
you know..anyone who prefaces half their posts with "duh" probably rode
the short bus to school...

-clad any
way you choose--on the same boat you showed us in another photo, and I'll believe you're
not Neal. Of course you can't do this because you *are* Neal."
You're saying if there was a picture of Capt. Neal in the Tangerine then he'd believe
Capt. Neal wasn't Capt. Neal. Yes, that's certainly logical, Katy. Don't you think? NOT!
You keep saying it's a fake photoshopped picture. But, if that's the case how come
the transom is down maybe two inches further in the water than when the boat's empty.
Look at the pictures closely and you'll have to admit it's the case. Cut and pasted pictures
don't weigh anything, Katy. Duh!

Cheers,
Ellen



Don't try to think about this too hard...your head might explode but
then, at least the gulls would have something to sqyabble over...

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

scbafreak via BoatKB.com wrote:
Gimme a break....you the dumbest person in the world???


No. You are spending so much time saying "if you do this I'll believe you"
then it happens and you say "that's not good enough". People that are as
negative as you really bother me. Dumb is backtracking what you say and not
admitting when you are wrong. Dumb is spending your time trying to put
someone else down so that you can feel better about yourself.

You know nothing about me, or Ellen for that matter, and you keep making
assumptions that we are somehow unintelligent or liars. You aren't the only
one here that has been indulging in this behavior. When did it become okay
to talk to people like that? Do you go up to people on the street and cal
them names and tell them everything they say is a lie? Maybe Ellen works
really hard to look like that and she doesn't apreciate when people say that
she couldn't possibly be that girl in the picture, the girl in picture is a
floozy bikini model. Do you ever think that the people on the computer are,
in fact, people and they have no reason to go through this much just to lie
to you. If she was lying then she would have never offerd to take a picture.
She could have very easily given some excuse for why she can't get a picture
up. Instead she said there will be a pic, and then there was.


Get a life, Bill...how many eyars have you been here? And you can't
tell that'
s Neal? Maybe you never
knew" Neal...don't be gullible...this is not some little bimbette
posting to this group, this is a gnarly almost 60 y/o man with nothing
else to do since he was a bad boy and called the hounds of Hel;l down on
himself. It's all part of the "Neal" game. It's been played out here
before and will until the day his Alzheimer's prevents him from turning
on his computer or the bottle sends him into delerious trmens one too
many times.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

katy wrote:

scbafreak via BoatKB.com wrote:

Gimme a break....you the dumbest person in the world???



No. You are spending so much time saying "if you do this I'll believe
you"
then it happens and you say "that's not good enough". People that are as
negative as you really bother me. Dumb is backtracking what you say
and not
admitting when you are wrong. Dumb is spending your time trying to put
someone else down so that you can feel better about yourself.

You know nothing about me, or Ellen for that matter, and you keep making
assumptions that we are somehow unintelligent or liars. You aren't
the only
one here that has been indulging in this behavior. When did it become
okay
to talk to people like that? Do you go up to people on the street and
cal
them names and tell them everything they say is a lie? Maybe Ellen works
really hard to look like that and she doesn't apreciate when people
say that
she couldn't possibly be that girl in the picture, the girl in picture
is a
floozy bikini model. Do you ever think that the people on the
computer are,
in fact, people and they have no reason to go through this much just
to lie
to you. If she was lying then she would have never offerd to take a
picture.
She could have very easily given some excuse for why she can't get a
picture
up. Instead she said there will be a pic, and then there was.


Get a life, Bill...how many eyars have you been here? And you can't
tell that'
s Neal? Maybe you never
knew" Neal...don't be gullible...this is not some little bimbette
posting to this group, this is a gnarly almost 60 y/o man with nothing
else to do since he was a bad boy and called the hounds of Hel;l down on
himself. It's all part of the "Neal" game. It's been played out here
before and will until the day his Alzheimer's prevents him from turning
on his computer or the bottle sends him into delerious trmens one too
many times.
Hi there Katy,

Well I've had my share of run-ins with old A.D.N. before, but although
the M.O. may be similar, that boat wasn't *yellow*.

Mind you, Ellen needs feeding up a bit judging by what change of
waterline there was.

Still waiting to see a piccy of the damaged edge of the sail being held
up by Ellen, wearing clothes so I dont get all distracted.

Now, Ellen, if your reading this, dont get all offended that I might
doubt you, After all, this group is known for elaborate co-operative
trolling and the CRaptain was an expert. . .

--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk
[at]=@, [dash]=- & [dot]=. *Warning* HTML & 32K emails -- NUL:
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Early 60's, Uffa Fox designed,
All varnished hot moulded wooden racing dinghy.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"scbafreak via BoatKB.com" u25927@uwe wrote in message
news:6c7ce0457c4c1@uwe...
..... You said you'd believe I wasn't Capt. Neal if I posted that
picture and you lied about it.

If it makes you feel any better, I believe you. I mean why would you go
through all of this if it wasn't you? You could have easily sidestepped
the
whole issue.

Bill

You are providing some amusement for Neal, Bill.

Max

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"scbafreak via BoatKB.com" u25927@uwe wrote in message
news:6c7d7f85a2b47@uwe...
Gimme a break....you the dumbest person in the world???

No. You are spending so much time saying "if you do this I'll believe
you"
then it happens and you say "that's not good enough". People that are as
negative as you really bother me. Dumb is backtracking what you say and
not
admitting when you are wrong. Dumb is spending your time trying to put
someone else down so that you can feel better about yourself.

C'mon, Bill, use that melon on top of your neck for a change. Any idiot can
cut and paste a glamor photo of a person onto a sailboat photo. Katie and I
asked for a verifiable photo of "her" in her boat. That photo is no more
verifiable than any of the others that Neal has provided. Aren't you even
the least bit suspicious that she's in a glamor pose, rather than just
sitting in the cockpit, relaxed and posing in such a manner that there could
be no doubt as to the veracity of her claim? You are remarkably gullible,
and Neal is having you for lunch. OTOH, I'm beginning to believe you, too,
are Neal.

You know nothing about me, or Ellen for that matter, and you keep making
assumptions that we are somehow unintelligent or liars. You aren't the
only
one here that has been indulging in this behavior. When did it become
okay
to talk to people like that? Do you go up to people on the street and cal
them names and tell them everything they say is a lie? Maybe Ellen works
really hard to look like that and she doesn't apreciate when people say
that
she couldn't possibly be that girl in the picture, the girl in picture is
a
floozy bikini model. Do you ever think that the people on the computer
are,
in fact, people and they have no reason to go through this much just to
lie
to you. If she was lying then she would have never offerd to take a
picture.
She could have very easily given some excuse for why she can't get a
picture
up. Instead she said there will be a pic, and then there was.

Nice speech, Bill. Are you through?

Max

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"Ellen MacArthur" wrote in message
reenews.net...

"scbafreak via BoatKB.com" u25927@uwe wrote

No. You are spending so much time saying "if you do this I'll believe
you"
then it happens and you say "that's not good enough". People that are as
negative as you really bother me. Dumb is backtracking what you say and
not
admitting when you are wrong. Dumb is spending your time trying to put
someone else down so that you can feel better about yourself.

You know nothing about me, or Ellen for that matter, and you keep making
assumptions that we are somehow unintelligent or liars. You aren't the
only
one here that has been indulging in this behavior. When did it become
okay
to talk to people like that? Do you go up to people on the street and
cal
them names and tell them everything they say is a lie? Maybe Ellen works
really hard to look like that and she doesn't apreciate when people say
that
she couldn't possibly be that girl in the picture, the girl in picture is
a
floozy bikini model. Do you ever think that the people on the computer
are,
in fact, people and they have no reason to go through this much just to
lie
to you. If she was lying then she would have never offerd to take a
picture.
She could have very easily given some excuse for why she can't get a
picture
up. Instead she said there will be a pic, and then there was.


Thanks, Bill. You're a gentleman. You guys are rare in this group....
Some of these people
around here just have this fetish.... You can show them and show them and
they keep asking
for more. Katy's probably just jealous but Tom and Maxprop are rude and
ungentlemanly.

Bwwaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. From Neal, that's priceless.

Max

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"Ian Malcolm" wrote in message
news:eopf20

Well I've had my share of run-ins with old A.D.N. before, but although the
M.O. may be similar, that boat wasn't *yellow*.

I doubt if that yellow POS Neal used to post was ever his boat either. The
guy probably owns a 55' Oyster, circumnavigates, and gets his rocks off by
yanking the chains of the terminally stupid herein.

Mind you, Ellen needs feeding up a bit judging by what change of waterline
there was.

Still waiting to see a piccy of the damaged edge of the sail being held up
by Ellen, wearing clothes so I dont get all distracted.

Now, Ellen, if your reading this, dont get all offended that I might doubt
you, After all, this group is known for elaborate co-operative trolling
and the CRaptain was an expert. . .

Still is.

Max

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Ian Malcolm wrote:
.

Hi there Katy,

Well I've had my share of run-ins with old A.D.N. before, but although
the M.O. may be similar, that boat wasn't *yellow*.

Mind you, Ellen needs feeding up a bit judging by what change of
waterline there was.

Still waiting to see a piccy of the damaged edge of the sail being held
up by Ellen, wearing clothes so I dont get all distracted.

Now, Ellen, if your reading this, dont get all offended that I might
doubt you, After all, this group is known for elaborate co-operative
trolling and the CRaptain was an expert. . .


Ian,
You haven't ehard about the Stste of Florida coming down hard on its'
transient boater population? They have been confiscating boats and
closing down moorigs like Neal's...old engine blocks, etc. in an attempt
to clean up the waterways....we sispect that that is what may have
happened to the Banana...either that, or the thing just fell apart
finally...

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

katy wrote:

Ian Malcolm wrote:

Hi there Katy,

Well I've had my share of run-ins with old A.D.N. before, but although
the M.O. may be similar, that boat wasn't *yellow*.


Ian,
You haven't ehard about the Stste of Florida coming down hard on its'
transient boater population? They have been confiscating boats and
closing down moorigs like Neal's...old engine blocks, etc. in an attempt
to clean up the waterways....we sispect that that is what may have
happened to the Banana...either that, or the thing just fell apart
finally...

Well if they wanted to clean up the waterways and get the best ROI, it
makes sense they'd start with low hanging 'fruit' like ADN. Mind you,
only a southern burocrat could call ADN transient, he *never* bloody
moved . . . :-)

Wonder if whatever official tried to dispose of it (whether forcibly or
as a derelict wreck) succeded? I have visions of it and ADN being
evicted from Florida on the back of a flatbed and both of them now
residing on the centre of a roundabout in the middle of a flowerbed with
a banner flying from the mast:-

***********************
* Welcome to *
* Wichita *
* Kansas *
* *
* 'The Air Capital' *
* 'of the World' *
* *
* Pop: 2,688,418 *
* Twinned with *
* Kaifeng, China *
***********************

Needless to say, the poor Florida state official probably cant even get
elected as dogcatcher now . . .

--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk
[at]=@, [dash]=- & [dot]=. *Warning* HTML & 32K emails -- NUL:
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Early 60's, Uffa Fox designed,
All varnished hot moulded wooden racing dinghy.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"Ian Malcolm" wrote

Still waiting to see a piccy of the damaged edge of the sail being held up by Ellen, wearing clothes so I dont get all
distracted.

Now, Ellen, if your reading this, dont get all offended that I might doubt you, After all, this group is known for
elaborate co-operative trolling and the CRaptain was an expert. . .


I can take pictures of the sail and post them but I can't hold up the sail and
take the pictures at the same time. You'll just have to be satisfied with pictures
of the sail. I even read the instruction book for the camera again and now I
know how to take *macro* pictures which is another name for close ups.
Some advice about whether the sail's worth bothering with would be nice.
I'm thinking maybe I should take out all the old hanks which are all green and
stiff and toss them in the trash then I can take out the old corroded grommets.
Then maybe a sail shop could sew a long piece of heavy sailcloth along the length
of the luff. Then I can melt or cut holes in the right spots and put new grommets in.
Then I can put new hanks in. The sail's little - only 60 square feet so I don't see
why it needs a wire running up the luff. But I think it needs some webbing looped
through the head grommet and tack grommet and sewed on up and down for
a foot or so.
Getting the old rusty wire out is gonna be trouble. I wonder if it would hurt
to just cut the sail cloth along the edge and get it out that way. Sewing on a new
strip of sailcloth would cover up the cut and rusty sailcloth.....
Does Armour All work on sails. Making them look newer and bluer where it's
faded and stained? Or is it too slippery so the deck will get to slippery? Is there
something else that can be sprayed on the sails to brighten them up and seal the
pores so the wind doesn't go through and they work better. My sails are thin.
They're more like spinnaker cloth than thick crinkly sail cloth.

Cheers,
Ellen

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Ellen MacArthur wrote:

"Ian Malcolm" wrote

Still waiting to see a piccy of the damaged edge of the sail being held up by Ellen, wearing clothes so I dont get all
distracted.

Now, Ellen, if your reading this, dont get all offended that I might doubt you, After all, this group is known for
elaborate co-operative trolling and the CRaptain was an expert. . .

Knowing and accepting that I am probably talking to one of ADN's many
socks, but on the off chance you are for real or ADN is pretending to be
the fount of all nautical wisdom and is relating our replies to some
cute young new boatowner, pretending they are his own words, I'll have a
shot at being helpfull. At least its vicarious sailing :-)

I can take pictures of the sail and post them but I can't hold up the sail and
take the pictures at the same time.

The same person who took all your other photos could take this one . . .

You'll just have to be satisfied with pictures
of the sail. I even read the instruction book for the camera again and now I
know how to take *macro* pictures which is another name for close ups.

I really would like to see an over-all shot of the bottom 1/3 or so
(where the wire broke) as well as the closeups. Why not spread it out
accross the cockpit and sit on the coacroof to take a picture of as much
of it as you can fit in the frame?

Some advice about whether the sail's worth bothering with would be nice.

On a dead calm day, wet the sail to give it some weight and tension the
luff between two stakes or posts a few feet off the ground then tension
the clew keeping the sail level until the shape of the sail hanging down
looks about right. Crouch down and look at the shape. The maximum depth
of the curve should be rather nearer to the luff than the leach. If its
past half way back, replace the sail. If there is *any* doubt, tape
accross the sail with black electrical tape parallell to the foot at
20%, 40%, 60% and 80% of the height KEEPING THE TAPE ABSOLUTLY SLACK and
as streight as you can when you apply it then stretch the sail as above
and take us all a photo showing the *whole* sail from the foot looking
towards the head, down at a shallow angle. It also helps ifyou can get
someone to hold a thin streight rod just barely touching the luff and
leach at the 40% height so we have a reference line.

I'm thinking maybe I should take out all the old hanks which are all green and
stiff

Good first step, but have you priced replacements? They may come good if
soaked for an hour or two in a 25% solution of a Formic acid ciontaining
kettle descaler, working their pistons at intervals and when they have
freed up, rinseing *very* thouroughly, drying and spraying with a good
brand of silicone lubricant.

If they are sewn on, put them aside to fit later otherwise if held by a
bronze 'claw' you may need to anneal the claw with a blow torch while
protecting the body of the hank with a sopping wet rag to avoid loosing
the temper in the spring. Any which show signs of cracking in the claw,
dont work freely or seem to have lost their spring must be replaced.

Thereafter spray evey 6 months taking care not to get *any* silicone on
the deck or sail.

and toss them in the trash then I can take out the old corroded grommets.
Then maybe a sail shop could sew a long piece of heavy sailcloth along the length
of the luff.

Getting a sail shop to do *anything* wont be cheap and they have a much
better press for putting eyelets in than you or I can hope to have. Take
the hanks off then ask the shop if the sail is worth saving and if so,
roughly how much to do the whole job except refitting the hanks? N.B. a
general Canvas shop will NOT have the expertize you need unless they
have a sailmaker on the staff.

Then I can melt or cut holes in the right spots and put new grommets in.

Unless the holes are badly chewed, you can probably re-use them if you
go to a slightly larger size. You use the punch in the eyelet kit to cut
the holes. A small patch hand sewn over the luff wire and accross both
sides of the hole can be used to fix any bad ones. Tapeing the whole
luff unless done by a pro, is likely to upset the luff tensioning and
give an unsatisfactory result.
Ideally you'd hand stitch the rings for all the new eyelets before
closing the 'hat' over the new leathering using the punch and die in the
kit.

Then I can put new hanks in. The sail's little - only 60 square feet so I don't see
why it needs a wire running up the luff.

To get a streight luff. When hoisted on a small boat, all the load
should be on the luff wire with the forestay just slack. All the hanks
do is controll it while hoisting or lowering. Consult a decent book on
traditional knotcraft or sailmaking for the correct way to tye the hanks in.

But I think it needs some webbing looped
through the head grommet and tack grommet and sewed on up and down for
a foot or so.

NO WAY. Only applicable to a sail with a high tensile fabric tape the
whole length of the luff.
What you actually need is a loosely fitted luff wire extending right to
the eye at one end and actually forming part of that eye and with a
talurit eye in the other end about an inch beyond the corner of the
sail. The eye at the free end of the sail is laced to the corner to set
the cloth tension for best sail shape after the sail has been hoisted as
tight as possible. Thereafter check the laceing occasionaly. Its
handiest to have the head fixed to the wire and the tack free.

Getting the old rusty wire out is gonna be trouble. I wonder if it would hurt
to just cut the sail cloth along the edge and get it out that way. Sewing on a new
strip of sailcloth would cover up the cut and rusty sailcloth.....

DONT cut the sail. Oxalic acid will dissolve the rust. Its usually sold
as a powder wood bleach. I reccomend a strong solution in hot water,
applied and left to dry in the sun a few times then the next day more
solution and gently working at the edge will probably free up whats left
of the wire. Once you have removed it, patch any holes and work a piece
of solid wire in to let you pull through a nice new piece of 3mm 7x19,
which it's worth treating with melted beeswax before you use it. Then
you just need to get the talurits on the end swaged, and do the other
items discussed above and you're golden.

Does Armour All work on sails. Making them look newer and bluer where it's
faded and stained? Or is it too slippery so the deck will get to slippery? Is there
something else that can be sprayed on the sails to brighten them up and seal the
pores so the wind doesn't go through and they work better. My sails are thin.
They're more like spinnaker cloth than thick crinkly sail cloth.

There are companies that re-proof sails commercially. I am not sure if
its worth doing though. Dodgy seams can be oversewn by hand if the
sail cloth is still sound enough to hold stitches, if not, its new sail
time. There is a product callled seamcoat or something like that for
treating properly stiched seams to protect and strengthen otherwise
sound seams. DONT use ArmourAll. It wont do any good and will make
futture repair work impossible.

Cheers,
Ellen

How about a nice picture of you sailing just for me? It would cheer me
up in our horrible winter weather no end. I'd like to see you on the
helm with the boat sailing with a bone in her teeth.

--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk
[at]=@, [dash]=- & [dot]=. *Warning* HTML & 32K emails -- NUL:
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Early 60's, Uffa Fox designed,
All varnished hot moulded wooden racing dinghy.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Hedging again Nellen,

http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ILLDRINKTOTHAT

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

Thom Stewart wrote:

Hedging again Nellen,

Probably, but as I said it (N)Ellen's new thread, if (S)he does repaiir
that sail properly, I think some *respect* would be due. If it IS ADN,
and he wants to keep up the deception, he'll need to do some real work.
I think some occupational therapy might be very good for him . . .

--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk
[at]=@, [dash]=- & [dot]=. *Warning* HTML & 32K emails -- NUL:
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Early 60's, Uffa Fox designed,
All varnished hot moulded wooden racing dinghy.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"Ian Malcolm" wrote
Knowing and accepting that I am probably talking to one of ADN's many socks, but on the off chance you are for real or
ADN is pretending to be the fount of all nautical wisdom and is relating our replies to some cute young new boatowner,
pretending they are his own words, I'll have a shot at being helpfull. At least its vicarious sailing :-)

Thanks for being helpful. It's what I hoped for when I subscribed here.
Instead I got people bitching me out for being somebody else....

The same person who took all your other photos could take this one . . .

I can do them faster myself. Besides I only need somebody to take pictures
of me.

I really would like to see an over-all shot of the bottom 1/3 or so (where the wire broke) as well as the closeups.
Why not spread it out accross the cockpit and sit on the coacroof to take a picture of as much of it as you can fit in
the frame?

As you saw I put it up instead. Easier to see how it looks that way.

On a dead calm day, wet the sail to give it some weight and tension the luff between two stakes or posts a few feet
off the ground then tension the clew keeping the sail level until the shape of the sail hanging down looks about
right. Crouch down and look at the shape. The maximum depth of the curve should be rather nearer to the luff than the
leach. If its past half way back, replace the sail. If there is *any* doubt, tape accross the sail with black
electrical tape parallell to the foot at 20%, 40%, 60% and 80% of the height KEEPING THE TAPE ABSOLUTLY SLACK and as
streight as you can when you apply it then stretch the sail as above and take us all a photo showing the *whole* sail
from the foot looking towards the head, down at a shallow angle. It also helps ifyou can get someone to hold a thin
streight rod just barely touching the luff and leach at the 40% height so we have a reference line.

Man, that all sounds too complicated. Even if I did all that and found out the
sail is all stretched out I'd still probably want to keep using it. Elle Niño only has two
feet of draft and doesn't go to weather very good because it doesn't get much
grip on the water so bagged out sails probably don't make that much difference.
But you sure sound like you know a lot about sails and their shape.

Good first step, but have you priced replacements? They may come good if soaked for an hour or two in a 25% solution
of a Formic acid ciontaining kettle descaler, working their pistons at intervals and when they have freed up, rinseing
*very* thouroughly, drying and spraying with a good brand of silicone lubricant.

Yes, I'm gonna take all the corroded brass parts out and throw them away.
Like I told Tom I'm gonna use plastic swivel hanks instead and it'll solve
two problems at once. http://www.sailmakerssupply.com/prod_detail_list/24

If they are sewn on, put them aside to fit later otherwise if held by a bronze 'claw' you may need to anneal the claw
with a blow torch while protecting the body of the hank with a sopping wet rag to avoid loosing the temper in the
spring. Any which show signs of cracking in the claw, dont work freely or seem to have lost their spring must be
replaced.

Those claws are corroded and brittle. Two claws broke when I tried
to pry them off with a screwdriver That's why I got a couple new ones.
But the new ones were so stiff I had to hit them with a hammer to close
them up. I couldn't even squeeze them together with pliars.

Getting a sail shop to do *anything* wont be cheap and they have a much better press for putting eyelets in than you
or I can hope to have. Take the hanks off then ask the shop if the sail is worth saving and if so, roughly how much to
do the whole job except refitting the hanks? N.B. a general Canvas shop will NOT have the expertize you need unless
they have a sailmaker on the staff.

That's why I decided to do it myself. Like I said to Tom, I'm gonna get
some sail tape and use a friend's sewing machine and sew it on myself. I can
even put in a little bolt rope to fit the hole in the swivel hanks.

Unless the holes are badly chewed, you can probably re-use them if you
go to a slightly larger size. You use the punch in the eyelet kit to cut the holes. A small patch hand sewn over the
luff wire and accross both sides of the hole can be used to fix any bad ones. Tapeing the whole luff unless done by a
pro, is likely to upset the luff tensioning and give an unsatisfactory result.

Maybe if I'm careful with sewing it and make sure the tape is tight it'll
work. Besides when pulling the halyard real hard it'll stretch the cloth out.
That's one reason why I don't want wire in the luff. It doesn't stretch...

Ideally you'd hand stitch the rings for all the new eyelets before closing the 'hat' over the new leathering using the
punch and die in the kit.

Won't need to do any of that with the plastic screw on swivel hanks....

To get a streight luff. When hoisted on a small boat, all the load should be on the luff wire with the forestay just
slack. All the hanks do is controll it while hoisting or lowering. Consult a decent book on traditional knotcraft or
sailmaking for the correct way to tye the hanks in.

Won't it all be on the luff anyway? It'll have tape and a little bolt rope to
take the pull away from the stay.

NO WAY. Only applicable to a sail with a high tensile fabric tape the whole length of the luff.

Is luff tape high tensile fabric?

What you actually need is a loosely fitted luff wire extending right to the eye at one end and actually forming part
of that eye and with a talurit eye in the other end about an inch beyond the corner of the sail. The eye at the free
end of the sail is laced to the corner to set the cloth tension for best sail shape after the sail has been hoisted as
tight as possible. Thereafter check the laceing occasionaly. Its handiest to have the head fixed to the wire and the
tack free.

That's how it used to be but it's too hard for me to do that myself.....

DONT cut the sail. Oxalic acid will dissolve the rust. Its usually sold as a powder wood bleach. I reccomend a strong
solution in hot water, applied and left to dry in the sun a few times then the next day more solution and gently
working at the edge will probably free up whats left of the wire. Once you have removed it, patch any holes and work
a piece of solid wire in to let you pull through a nice new piece of 3mm 7x19, which it's worth treating with melted
beeswax before you use it. Then you just need to get the talurits on the end swaged, and do the other items discussed
above and you're golden.

I won't cut the sail. I'll snip the stitches in a few places and get the
wire out the back way. I can resew the sail by hand using the original
holes and it'll be easy to push the needle through.

There are companies that re-proof sails commercially. I am not sure if its worth doing though. Dodgy seams can be
oversewn by hand if the sail cloth is still sound enough to hold stitches, if not, its new sail time. There is a
product callled seamcoat or something like that for treating properly stiched seams to protect and strengthen
otherwise sound seams. DONT use ArmourAll. It wont do any good and will make futture repair work impossible.

OK I won't use ArmourAll. It would probably make me slip right off the
deck anyway. Maybe I can spray it with starch.

How about a nice picture of you sailing just for me? It would cheer me up in our horrible winter weather no end. I'd
like to see you on the helm with the boat sailing with a bone in her teeth.

I'll see what I can do since you've been so nice to me. Maybe I could get
somebody in another boat to take a picture like that.... A bone in her teeth means
fast, doesn't it? Thanks, you've been very helpful.

Cheers,
Ellen

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"Ellen MacArthur" wrote in message
reenews.net...

Yes, I'm gonna take all the corroded brass parts out and throw them
away.
Like I told Tom I'm gonna use plastic swivel hanks instead and it'll solve
two problems at once. http://www.sailmakerssupply.com/prod_detail_list/24

Do not use those awful things. They are Ok when the sail is up and tensioned
but before you hoist and whenever you lower it you will find that the sail
will fall into folds and this will allow the hanks to turn and slip off the
wire so you will have to crawl out on the foredeck all the time to replace
them and by the time you get back to the halliard some will have come off
again...
I hav a 14' sailing dinghy with them on and am going to replace them when I
get time. They are cheap and nasty.
Use bronze snap hanks. I do not like the ones that involve bending a tang.
I use the ones with two holes that allow you to seize them on.

Maxprop's a freaking jerk liar....
 

"Edgar" wrote
Do not use those awful things. They are Ok when the sail is up and tensioned
but before you hoist and whenever you lower it you will find that the sail
will fall into folds and this will allow the hanks to turn and slip off the
wire so you will have to crawl out on the foredeck all the time to replace
them and by the time you get back to the halliard some will have come off
again...
I hav a 14' sailing dinghy with them on and am going to replace them when I
get time. They are cheap and nasty.
Use bronze snap hanks. I do not like the ones that involve bending a tang.
I use the ones with two holes that allow you to seize them on.

Thanks, but I'm gonna try them. If they keep coming off by themselves I
can always get rid of them. One little screw hole's not gonna hurt the sail. I
can always put brass grommets and brass hanks on later if the plastic ones
don't work. But it looks like they have to be twisted 90 degrees to get them
off. And only 90 degrees one way. I think maybe yours are upside down
or something.

Cheers,
Ellen