Dave wrote:

On Fri, 05 May 2006 07:56:19 -0400, Martin Baxter said:

That is *one* good thing you can say for Canada's system,

Do I correctly understand you're not entirely thrilled with Canada's system?

It has it's good points and it's bad. If you are not really sick, i.e.
about to die, it can take a dogs age to get anything done. Wait times
for hip and knee replacements can typically run between 3 and 6 months.
You can easily twiddle your thumbs in a ER for 4 hours unless you're
hemorrhaging a couple of units every 10 minutes.

On the other hand bypass surgery occurs in just a few days. My brother
went to his GP with chest pain, two days later he was on the table
getting a quad bypass.

Of course, contrary to what the Government says, it is a two tier
system. If you have the bucks and want something done right now, go to
the 'states and pay for it, or try Alberta.

It is certainly not "free" as many seem to tout, we pay among the
highest taxes in the world to finance our health care system. My
province introduced a "Health Care Surtax" on top of the general tax
levy two years ago. For me that amounts to an additional $600 a year,
(the Cdn $ is now up to $0.90 US), no it's not cheap, but it is
universal and will do it's best to save your life in an emergency.

There are now many procedures and test not covered by OHIP, i.e. PSA
test, cosmetic surgeries, a good many dermatological related things,
most physiotherapy, chiropractic (thank God), podiatry and you must pay
for them yourself.

For you personally, up until two years ago one could get a thorough
ophthalmic exam at no cost every year, now one must pay,
ophthalmologists are not terribly pleased, nor am I, (I only have
presbyopia, but hey I'm not getting any younger and it's nice to get
completely checked out every couple of years.)

I think ours is a better system than yours, at least it won't bankrupt
you in the event something like a quad bypass, but it certainly leaves
something to be desired.

Cheers
Marty

P.S. for Katy, presbyopia does not mean that I'm Presbyterian.

Martin Baxter wrote:
Dave wrote:
On Fri, 05 May 2006 07:56:19 -0400, Martin Baxter said:

That is *one* good thing you can say for Canada's system,
Do I correctly understand you're not entirely thrilled with Canada's system?

It has it's good points and it's bad. If you are not really sick, i.e.
about to die, it can take a dogs age to get anything done. Wait times
for hip and knee replacements can typically run between 3 and 6 months.
You can easily twiddle your thumbs in a ER for 4 hours unless you're
hemorrhaging a couple of units every 10 minutes.

On the other hand bypass surgery occurs in just a few days. My brother
went to his GP with chest pain, two days later he was on the table
getting a quad bypass.

Of course, contrary to what the Government says, it is a two tier
system. If you have the bucks and want something done right now, go to
the 'states and pay for it, or try Alberta.

It is certainly not "free" as many seem to tout, we pay among the
highest taxes in the world to finance our health care system. My
province introduced a "Health Care Surtax" on top of the general tax
levy two years ago. For me that amounts to an additional $600 a year,
(the Cdn $ is now up to $0.90 US), no it's not cheap, but it is
universal and will do it's best to save your life in an emergency.

There are now many procedures and test not covered by OHIP, i.e. PSA
test, cosmetic surgeries, a good many dermatological related things,
most physiotherapy, chiropractic (thank God), podiatry and you must pay
for them yourself.

For you personally, up until two years ago one could get a thorough
ophthalmic exam at no cost every year, now one must pay,
ophthalmologists are not terribly pleased, nor am I, (I only have
presbyopia, but hey I'm not getting any younger and it's nice to get
completely checked out every couple of years.)

I think ours is a better system than yours, at least it won't bankrupt
you in the event something like a quad bypass, but it certainly leaves
something to be desired.

Cheers
Marty

P.S. for Katy, presbyopia does not mean that I'm Presbyterian.

I knew that, Martin. So how much of your tax dollar per annum do
you contribute for health care?

katy wrote:


P.S. for Katy, presbyopia does not mean that I'm Presbyterian.

I knew that, Martin. So how much of your tax dollar per annum do
you contribute for health care?


Guess I should have included the smiley. ;-)

The average Canadian family pays about 48% of it's income in taxes,
(federal and provincial income, federal and provincial sales, booze,
gas..etc.), 40% of that goes to health care.

Cheers
Marty

Martin Baxter wrote:
katy wrote:
P.S. for Katy, presbyopia does not mean that I'm Presbyterian.
I knew that, Martin. So how much of your tax dollar per annum do
you contribute for health care?


Guess I should have included the smiley. ;-)

The average Canadian family pays about 48% of it's income in taxes,
(federal and provincial income, federal and provincial sales, booze,
gas..etc.), 40% of that goes to health care.

Cheers
Marty

OK, so according to 2001 stats, a median family income in Canada was
about 68k and you are paying around 13k out of your taxes for health
care that doesn't cover some things. If we were to COBRA (pay for
total policy on own) our BCBS plan, which covers many of the things
you've listed as exclusions, would cost us 9K per annum for a family
policy. We do have some small co-pays, which usually add up to
another 1.5k/annum ... and when we need something done, it's done
quickly and efficiently. The E-room thing is the same all
over...the mortuary has to follow you in before they'll see you
immediately...My aunt, 80 years old, has her Medicare A and a
Medicaid policy on top of that. She went into the dovs 2 weeks ago
for pain in her hip...her surgery is scheduled for next Tuesday...he
wanted to do it this week but she had to make arrangements for her
cat and had some other personal things she wanted to get done. My
sister has foster kids, all on Meidcaid policies. They're seen
immediately, no co-pays. (I'm just sticking the welfare stuff
....Medicaid...in here because someone will immediately jump in
screaming about the poor and disadvantaged...who BTW, are never
turned away of there is a legitimate concern..).

katy wrote:

Martin Baxter wrote:
katy wrote:
P.S. for Katy, presbyopia does not mean that I'm Presbyterian.
I knew that, Martin. So how much of your tax dollar per annum do
you contribute for health care?


Guess I should have included the smiley. ;-)

The average Canadian family pays about 48% of it's income in taxes,
(federal and provincial income, federal and provincial sales, booze,
gas..etc.), 40% of that goes to health care.

Cheers
Marty

OK, so according to 2001 stats, a median family income in Canada was
about 68k and you are paying around 13k out of your taxes for health
care that doesn't cover some things. If we were to COBRA (pay for
total policy on own) our BCBS plan, which covers many of the things
you've listed as exclusions, would cost us 9K per annum for a family
policy. We do have some small co-pays, which usually add up to
another 1.5k/annum ...

So we pay about about the same allowing for exchange, there are however
two important differences: Everbody gets equal coverage here including
the indigent. No one can get dumped by his carrier.

Cheers
Marty

Martin Baxter wrote:
katy wrote:
Martin Baxter wrote:
katy wrote:
P.S. for Katy, presbyopia does not mean that I'm Presbyterian.
I knew that, Martin. So how much of your tax dollar per annum do
you contribute for health care?

Guess I should have included the smiley. ;-)

The average Canadian family pays about 48% of it's income in taxes,
(federal and provincial income, federal and provincial sales, booze,
gas..etc.), 40% of that goes to health care.

Cheers
Marty
OK, so according to 2001 stats, a median family income in Canada was
about 68k and you are paying around 13k out of your taxes for health
care that doesn't cover some things. If we were to COBRA (pay for
total policy on own) our BCBS plan, which covers many of the things
you've listed as exclusions, would cost us 9K per annum for a family
policy. We do have some small co-pays, which usually add up to
another 1.5k/annum ...

So we pay about about the same allowing for exchange, there are however
two important differences: Everbody gets equal coverage here including
the indigent. No one can get dumped by his carrier.

Cheers
Marty
Does your medical coverage put age limits on some procedures like in
Great Britain? It is my understanding that in GB, if you are over
50, kidney transplant and I believe, dialysis, are not
available..also some heart treatments.

"Martin Baxter" wrote
So we pay about about the same allowing for exchange, there are however
two important differences: Everbody gets equal coverage here including
the indigent. No one can get dumped by his carrier.


The problem in both (all?) countries is the lack of good old capitalistic
competition. The solution for the USA is to use our anti-trust laws to break
the back of the American Medical Association. Don't hold your breath ....