I am unfamiliar with the personal disagreements here but I just looked
over a few pics of this guy Bob's Beneteau. It looks like a nice boat
but Beneteaus have always turned me off as being lightly built and
sorta impractical. Those odd shaped ports are gonna be difficult to
replace. I do like the swim platform although I have never used one.
The rigging seems kinda light for a boat this size.
I have not looked at Beneteaus for years so my impressions are from at
least 8 yrs ago. The one I looked at had a very lightly made toerail
that seemed to be riveted, I was amazed to see such a thing on a new
boat those days. There is a newer Beneteau near my boat and every time
I look at its rigging it just looks too light.
I'd prefer a boat with more standard made components for easy repair
and replacement but maybe this will not be a problem. It's Bob's money
and I hope he enjoys his boat.
BTW, I sail an old 28' S2 with very spartan accomodations which I
prefer (to each his own).

wrote in message
oups.com...
I am unfamiliar with the personal disagreements here but I just looked
over a few pics of this guy Bob's Beneteau. It looks like a nice boat
but Beneteaus have always turned me off as being lightly built and
sorta impractical. Those odd shaped ports are gonna be difficult to
replace. I do like the swim platform although I have never used one.
The rigging seems kinda light for a boat this size.
I have not looked at Beneteaus for years so my impressions are from at
least 8 yrs ago. The one I looked at had a very lightly made toerail
that seemed to be riveted, I was amazed to see such a thing on a new
boat those days. There is a newer Beneteau near my boat and every time
I look at its rigging it just looks too light.
I'd prefer a boat with more standard made components for easy repair
and replacement but maybe this will not be a problem. It's Bob's money
and I hope he enjoys his boat.
BTW, I sail an old 28' S2 with very spartan accomodations which I
prefer (to each his own).


Cruel to be kind. It's a fugly boat that can be had cheaply, which is
bubbles first consideration. Your old S2 is head and shoulders, quality
wise, over any Beneteau bubbles will ever own.

John Cairns

I am perfectly willing to believe that advances in materials technology
has made such lighter rigging and fittings feasible, I can only say how
it appears to me. How do these boats with odd fittings and strange
shaped ports hold up? I wouldnt call the Beneteau ugly, just different
(but remember, i also defend the Mac26). Euro-styling leaves me cold
although I dont want to be seen defending traditional designs either.

wrote in message
oups.com...
I
I wouldnt call the Beneteau ugly,

I would.

Scotty

wrote in message
oups.com...
I am perfectly willing to believe that advances in materials technology
has made such lighter rigging and fittings feasible, I can only say how
it appears to me. How do these boats with odd fittings and strange
shaped ports hold up? I wouldnt call the Beneteau ugly, just different
(but remember, i also defend the Mac26). Euro-styling leaves me cold
although I dont want to be seen defending traditional designs either.

Those portlights are fugly, period. And given their size and number they
better be absolutely bulletproof, if a boarding wave takes one out the thing
will sink in a heartbeat. Problem with a lot of newer boats, designer has a
particular set of design parameters/re interior volume, and you can't design
a graceful looking boat and meet these criteria. Beneteau is building boats
for the charter market to a large degree, and they want their boats to look
"modern". Problem is, after several years these designs look badly dated.
IMHO, it's fugly. I've never had any trouble offering opinions like that.
Macs are also fugly for the reason I've stated above, trying to stuff a lot
of interior volume into a short LOA. And, if both the Mac and Beneteau
appear to have skimped on the rigging, they've done so because they know
that the typical owner, like bubbles, won't be sailing in winds north of 20
kts., and won't be sailing in conditions where he has to be concerned about
boarding waves taking the portlights out.

John Cairns

Cairns hits the nail on the head when he remarks about current high
styling that will soon look dated. Such high styling is also soon
physically dated as the large expanses of plexiglas (or whatever) get
crazed etc.
I like the Mac cuz they basically thumb their noses at traditionalists
while opening up sailing to part of the market that would otherwise not
sail.
I hate to criticize somebody elses boat but my impression of the
Beneteau is essentially my impression of eurostyling in general. Its
like listening to Abba and calling it music. Yeah, its fun now, but
really no substance.
My impression of Catalina is that they've figured out how to do
something well without costing a fortune. They are not ultra-expensive
but truly functional at reasonable cost, the essence of good
engineering. They are not flashy but do what they do very well.
Flashy is good for some people, long term functionality is good for
others.

"John Cairns" wrote
Those portlights are fugly, period. And given their size and
number they
better be absolutely bulletproof, if a boarding wave takes one
out the thing
will sink in a heartbeat. Problem with a lot of newer boats,
designer has a
particular set of design parameters/re interior volume, and you
can't design
a graceful looking boat and meet these criteria. Beneteau is
building boats
for the charter market to a large degree, and they want their
boats to look
"modern". Problem is, after several years these designs look
badly dated.
IMHO, it's fugly. I've never had any trouble offering opinions
like that.
Macs are also fugly for the reason I've stated above, trying to
stuff a lot
of interior volume into a short LOA. And, if both the Mac and
Beneteau
appear to have skimped on the rigging, they've done so because
they know
that the typical owner, like bubbles, won't be sailing in winds
north of 20
kts., and won't be sailing in conditions where he has to be
concerned about
boarding waves taking the portlights out.


Well said, John.
Case in point, notice how all bubbles talks about is the swim
platform and 'interior'.

Scotty

"Scotty" wrote in message
...

"John Cairns" wrote
Those portlights are fugly, period. And given their size and
number they
better be absolutely bulletproof, if a boarding wave takes one
out the thing
will sink in a heartbeat. Problem with a lot of newer boats,
designer has a
particular set of design parameters/re interior volume, and you
can't design
a graceful looking boat and meet these criteria. Beneteau is
building boats
for the charter market to a large degree, and they want their
boats to look
"modern". Problem is, after several years these designs look
badly dated.
IMHO, it's fugly. I've never had any trouble offering opinions
like that.
Macs are also fugly for the reason I've stated above, trying to
stuff a lot
of interior volume into a short LOA. And, if both the Mac and
Beneteau
appear to have skimped on the rigging, they've done so because
they know
that the typical owner, like bubbles, won't be sailing in winds
north of 20
kts., and won't be sailing in conditions where he has to be
concerned about
boarding waves taking the portlights out.


Well said, John.
Case in point, notice how all bubbles talks about is the swim
platform and 'interior'.

Scotty

If you spend the majority of your time at the dock or daysailing with
lubbers, these would be the most important considerations.

John Cairns

wrote:
Cairns hits the nail on the head when he remarks about current high
styling that will soon look dated.

Sure. That's what 'style' is all about. Like ruff collars or
corsets. Fins on cars. OTOH real beauty never goes out of
style, like the Fender Telecaster.


I hate to criticize somebody elses boat but my impression of the
Beneteau is essentially my impression of eurostyling in general.

You mean, the "melted cheese sandwich" look?

My impression of Catalina is that they've figured out how to do
something well without costing a fortune.

Depends on how you define "well" and "fortune."

IMHO any money spent on a boat is pretty much wasted, an
entertainment expense. So how much fun you have with it is
pretty much the only measure of whether or not it's worth it.



... They are not ultra-expensive
but truly functional at reasonable cost

Actually, they're not. They lose value on the used market
quicker than many other types, are slower, less seaworthy,
etc etc. If you going to spend X dollars on a boat, the
definition of "function" depends on what you want out of it,
and no production excels in any quantifiable measure...
that's why they're mass-produced.




... They are not flashy but do what they do very well.

Provide a place to sit & drink while listening to Jimmy Buffet?

Actually, some Catalinas have been sold in enough quantities
that they have one-design racing classes. That's a good
function.

DSK