"Donal" wrote in message ...

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...


"Donal" wrote in message
...

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
ups.com...
BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND

hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which
vessel has the right of way?

A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel.
B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel.
C. The larger vessel.
D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal.
E. Neither.


E.

Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow
is the give-way vessel.

As always, you are correct!

It follows that the other vessel has
the right of way.

Wrong.


It's right of way makes it the stand-on
vessel.

Nope!!



I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand
about this.

Why not?

Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must
take any necessary action to avoid a collision?

There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem
to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe.

And don't YOU realize that in the COLREGS all vessels must
follow the Rules that apply. In the case of stand-on and
give-way the stand on vessel is required to stand on and
the give-way vessel is required to give way. Only if the
give-way vessel does not follow the rules and causes
a close quarters situation where there is a possibility
of a collision is the stand-on vessel allowed to deviate
from the Rules.

This means the stand-on vessel has the right of way. That
it is not granted the right of way does not make the fact
of its right of way any less so.

CN

Capt. Neal® wrote:


That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people
so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish
latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more
pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable
of seeing the bigger picture.

CN


G You won't get an argument from me, about that. However, every time a
"Rules" thread comes up, this is one point that many will consider
important.
Personally, if I'm talking with someone who doesn't mind the term, then
I feel free to use it. However, if talking with those who have a problem
with it's use, for whatever reason, I refrain.

otn

A

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
ups.com...
BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND

hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which
vessel has the right of way?

A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel.
B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel.
C. The larger vessel.
D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal.

John Cairns wrote:


It is a good point. I have a friend that has served as an expert witness at
trial, they will divvy up the blame, even if you have the "right of way".

John Cairns



If you only, truly understand one rule .... Rule 2 .... you will realize
that it is next to impossible to have a collision where you won't have
at least some percentage of the blame.

otn

There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you seem
to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe.


Awwwww geee, Donal. I thumpt I was doing pretty good.

Shen

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...

"Donal" wrote in message
...

Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must
take any necessary action to avoid a collision?

There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you
seem
to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe.

And don't YOU realize that in the COLREGS all vessels must
follow the Rules that apply. In the case of stand-on and
give-way the stand on vessel is required to stand on and
the give-way vessel is required to give way. Only if the
give-way vessel does not follow the rules and causes
a close quarters situation where there is a possibility
of a collision is the stand-on vessel allowed to deviate
from the Rules.

Wrong!!!!

In these circumstances, the "stand on" vessel is not *allowed* to deviate,
it is *required* to deviate from the rules.


Regards


Donal
--

What you have forgotten is that the starboard rule does not always apply
between power vessels.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Capt. Neal® wrote:


"Donal" wrote in message ...

"Bart Senior" wrote in message
roups.com...

BOTH INTERNATIONAL and INLAND

hen two power-driven vessels are crossing, which
vessel has the right of way?

A. The vessel which is to starboard of the other vessel.
B. The vessel which is to port of the other vessel.
C. The larger vessel.
D. The vessel that sounds the first whistle signal.
E. Neither.


E.


Wrong! A vessel that has another on its own starboard bow
is the give-way vessel. It follows that the other vessel has
the right of way. It's right of way makes it the stand-on
vessel.

I can't figure what's so hard for some people to understand
about this.

I always sit in my motor dinghy straddling the center thwart
and looking primarily to starboard. I do this so I can give-way
to vessels that are on a crossing course and are on my starboard
bow. This tells me that vessel has the right of way. In other it's
way shall not be impeded by me.

I hope this helps.

CN

CN

"Donal" wrote in message ...

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...

"Donal" wrote in message
...

Don't you understand that the Coll Regs also state that all vessels must
take any necessary action to avoid a collision?

There is NO right of way under the Coll Regs. I'm surprised that you
seem
to know as little about the Coll Regs as Shen, or Joe.

And don't YOU realize that in the COLREGS all vessels must
follow the Rules that apply. In the case of stand-on and
give-way the stand on vessel is required to stand on and
the give-way vessel is required to give way. Only if the
give-way vessel does not follow the rules and causes
a close quarters situation where there is a possibility
of a collision is the stand-on vessel allowed to deviate
from the Rules.

Wrong!!!!

In these circumstances, the "stand on" vessel is not *allowed* to deviate,
it is *required* to deviate from the rules.


Semantics! I could argue in the same vane and say there is no rule
countermanding the captains actions as long as whatever action
he took avoided the collision. The caption is the final authority-
not the rules.

CN

Capt. Neal® wrote:



I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way".

otn


That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people
so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish
latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more
pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable
of seeing the bigger picture.


The big picture is that a real sailor does not assume the other vessel
will hold her course or give way in simple crossing situation. Only a
fool thinks there is a 'right of way' in this scenario. A real sailor
knows the other vessel may not give way for a multitude of reasons
includind CBD, RAM and NUC -let alone trawling.

Hope this helps.

Cheers

But there IS a right of way. The rules give it to the stand-on vessel.

Otherwise there would be chaos.

Just like the green traffic light gives you the right of way does
not mean it will keep some idiot from running the read light
and smashing into you but you do have the right of way until
such time as that happens.

Same holds true with the Colregs. They are a guide and a good one.
But like any guide they cannot be written to cover every eventuality.
That is why right of way is not an absolute but there is right of
way nonetheless.

CN



"Nav" wrote in message ...


Capt. Neal® wrote:



I think you'll find that Donal is objecting to the phrase "right of way".

otn


That objection is trite IMHO. Why it bothers some people
so much is beyond understanding. That they seem to relish
latching onto such an unimportant issue when other far more
pressing matters are at hand shows they may not be capable
of seeing the bigger picture.


The big picture is that a real sailor does not assume the other vessel
will hold her course or give way in simple crossing situation. Only a
fool thinks there is a 'right of way' in this scenario. A real sailor
knows the other vessel may not give way for a multitude of reasons
includind CBD, RAM and NUC -let alone trawling.

Hope this helps.

Cheers