I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal. I think business should have
minimal regulation. I believe in well defined and vigorously enforced
property rights. I believe in the Constitution.
You are a wacko Neo-Con. All you can comprehend is far right religious
wackoism or the opposite extreme, far left wackoism. If you choose to drive
down the highway of life with your right tires constantly rubbing the curb,
go ahead. You wacko!

Gilligan, who proudly voted Republican by writing in Goldwater.

"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 02:21:26 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

You forgot to mention that Afghan poppy production is up over five fold
and
now supplies 87% of the world's heroin. It's great to see unfettered
capitalism in place and the resourcefullness of the Afghani people in
recognizing a high demand cash crop! I applaud them!


It's amazing how you whacko liberals can find one little problem in a
sea of success, blow it out of proportion, and then yell, "See, I told
you so!"

We'll take care of those problems as we get to them.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

"Horvath" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.

What has that got to do with them being legal or illegal. Either way, weak
people will do bad things to themselves.

Horvath wrote in message . ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.

I agree with Gilligan, Legalise it and let the losers snuff themselfs
out,
less burden on the system. The cost will drop, and less drug related
crimes will happen. **** we should do like Canada and give the herion
guys lots of needles and a enough smack to OD.

Joe





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

Right you are Joe. Let the weakling kills themselves. If it's legal the
profit motive is less, so less crime. Fat people are addicted to food, you
don;t see them killing for food (yet) or chubbies selling food on the street
corner.

Simply look at what Prohibition did to the US. The war on drugs is the same.
If something is outlawed, it just gives a monopoly to the criminals.

All victimless crimes should be legal.

Gilligan



"Joe" wrote in message
om...
Horvath wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.

I agree with Gilligan, Legalise it and let the losers snuff themselfs
out,
less burden on the system. The cost will drop, and less drug related
crimes will happen. **** we should do like Canada and give the herion
guys lots of needles and a enough smack to OD.

Joe





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

On 24 Nov 2004 18:55:21 -0800, (Joe) wrote
this crap:

Horvath wrote in message . ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.


You have no idea what you are talking about. It's completely
different.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

Horvath wrote in message . ..
On 24 Nov 2004 18:55:21 -0800, (Joe) wrote
this crap:

Horvath wrote in message . ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.


You have no idea what you are talking about. It's completely
different.


BULL****! Ive seen it all from junkies covered with cotton feaver
sores to dead drunks with there faces split in half when they had a
head on wreck with a telephone pole. Once I had the pleasure of
scraping a young girl off a submarine she did a swan dive on from 8
stories up, she was drunk and doing acid. Oh and the guy who choked on
his own vomit while on smack, he drowned.

But face it Horvath aint nothing you can do. If they want it they
will get it and take it.

Ive got better things to do then babysit retards who can not control
thier own actions or handle thier drug of choice. And I think anyone
should be free to do or take what ever he or she choses to do. Be an
adult and be responsiable for your own actions.

BTW I also know many people that smoke weed daily and own multi
million dollars businesses or have high profile careers and have no
problem with it at all. Just like I know some people that know when to
say when while drinking.

It aint the type of drug, it's the type of person using that drug.
Like Gilligan said, all victim less crimes should be abolished. And
the people that do victimise others should pay to the max.


Joe








Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

But, how does one define a 'victim'?

Does a victim have to be a human being? If so, it would
not be a crime to kill endangered species. It would
not be a crime to wantonly pollute the environment.
You could just dump your crap anywhere. And what
about shooting somebody's dog. A dog certainly is not
human.

Until you can define 'victim' it is ludicrous to use
the term 'victimless crime'.

Can the environment be a victim? Can a fetus be a victim?
Can an empty building somebody torches be a victim?

"Victimless crime" - a typical example of liberal doublespeak.

Shame on Gilligan and any others for using the term, let
alone advocating for it.

CN


"Joe" wrote in message om...
Horvath wrote in message . ..
On 24 Nov 2004 18:55:21 -0800, (Joe) wrote
this crap:

Horvath wrote in message . ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.


You have no idea what you are talking about. It's completely
different.


BULL****! Ive seen it all from junkies covered with cotton feaver
sores to dead drunks with there faces split in half when they had a
head on wreck with a telephone pole. Once I had the pleasure of
scraping a young girl off a submarine she did a swan dive on from 8
stories up, she was drunk and doing acid. Oh and the guy who choked on
his own vomit while on smack, he drowned.

But face it Horvath aint nothing you can do. If they want it they
will get it and take it.

Ive got better things to do then babysit retards who can not control
thier own actions or handle thier drug of choice. And I think anyone
should be free to do or take what ever he or she choses to do. Be an
adult and be responsiable for your own actions.

BTW I also know many people that smoke weed daily and own multi
million dollars businesses or have high profile careers and have no
problem with it at all. Just like I know some people that know when to
say when while drinking.

It aint the type of drug, it's the type of person using that drug.
Like Gilligan said, all victim less crimes should be abolished. And
the people that do victimise others should pay to the max.


Joe








Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

No shame at all. I'm 100% consistent:

"I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal. I think business should have
minimal regulation. I believe in well defined and vigorously
enforced
property rights. I believe in the Constitution.
You are a wacko Neo-Con. All you can comprehend is far right religious
wackoism or the opposite extreme, far left wackoism. If you choose to drive
down the highway of life with your right tires constantly rubbing the curb,
go ahead. You wacko!

Gilligan, who proudly voted Republican by writing in Goldwater."

All the problems you have mentioned exist because of ill defined property
rights.

Pollution, shooting dog = destroying some elses property.

Victim = someone who has had their unalienable rights violated.

Unalienable rights = life, liberty, property (the fruits of your labor)

Victimless crime = a "crime" created by the state where two or more enter
into a non coercive mutual agreement to the benefit of both parties,
including individual action. The state defines the behavior (even of a
single individual) or outcome of the agreement as a crime. Examples:
prostitution, reading certain material, consuming certain substances,
gambling, smoking, displaying the Declaration of Independence in schools,
hanging the ten commandments in a public place, saying things that may be
"offensive", travel to Cuba, etc. No one's unalienable rights are violated
by these actions.



"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
But, how does one define a 'victim'?

Does a victim have to be a human being? If so, it would
not be a crime to kill endangered species. It would
not be a crime to wantonly pollute the environment.
You could just dump your crap anywhere. And what
about shooting somebody's dog. A dog certainly is not
human.

Until you can define 'victim' it is ludicrous to use
the term 'victimless crime'.

Can the environment be a victim? Can a fetus be a victim?
Can an empty building somebody torches be a victim?

"Victimless crime" - a typical example of liberal doublespeak.

Shame on Gilligan and any others for using the term, let
alone advocating for it.

CN


"Joe" wrote in message
om...
Horvath wrote in message
. ..
On 24 Nov 2004 18:55:21 -0800, (Joe) wrote
this crap:

Horvath wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal
or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.


You have no idea what you are talking about. It's completely
different.


BULL****! Ive seen it all from junkies covered with cotton feaver
sores to dead drunks with there faces split in half when they had a
head on wreck with a telephone pole. Once I had the pleasure of
scraping a young girl off a submarine she did a swan dive on from 8
stories up, she was drunk and doing acid. Oh and the guy who choked on
his own vomit while on smack, he drowned.

But face it Horvath aint nothing you can do. If they want it they
will get it and take it.

Ive got better things to do then babysit retards who can not control
thier own actions or handle thier drug of choice. And I think anyone
should be free to do or take what ever he or she choses to do. Be an
adult and be responsiable for your own actions.

BTW I also know many people that smoke weed daily and own multi
million dollars businesses or have high profile careers and have no
problem with it at all. Just like I know some people that know when to
say when while drinking.

It aint the type of drug, it's the type of person using that drug.
Like Gilligan said, all victim less crimes should be abolished. And
the people that do victimise others should pay to the max.


Joe








Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

Capt. Neal® wrote in message ...
But, how does one define a 'victim'?

Victim: Someone hurt by someones elses actions.


Does a victim have to be a human being? If so, it would
not be a crime to kill endangered species.

yes it would, you would be taking that species away from other people
who enjoy them. Its like stealing.

It would
not be a crime to wantonly pollute the environment.

yes it would. You do not own the enviroment...it owns you.

You could just dump your crap anywhere.

Then others would have to pay to clean it up. The ones who pay are
victims.

And what
about shooting somebody's dog. A dog certainly is not
human.

It is property of another human. And it has a right to be treated
humainly.


Until you can define 'victim' it is ludicrous to use
the term 'victimless crime'.

Can the environment be a victim?

Yes

Can a fetus be a victim?

Yes

Can an empty building somebody torches be a victim?

Yes if it has an owner, or someone has to pay to put it out.

"Victimless crime" - a typical example of liberal doublespeak.

It's not that complicated Neal.

Joe


Shame on Gilligan and any others for using the term, let
alone advocating for it.

CN






"Joe" wrote in message om...
Horvath wrote in message . ..
On 24 Nov 2004 18:55:21 -0800, (Joe) wrote
this crap:

Horvath wrote in message . ..
On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:16:27 GMT, "Gilligan"
wrote this crap:

I'm no liberal in the modern sense at all. I'm a classic liberal or
libertarian. I think drugs should be legal.


You've probably never seen one of your good friends whacked out on
coke.


So what? Ive seen thousand wacked out on Jack Daniels and such.


You have no idea what you are talking about. It's completely
different.


BULL****! Ive seen it all from junkies covered with cotton feaver
sores to dead drunks with there faces split in half when they had a
head on wreck with a telephone pole. Once I had the pleasure of
scraping a young girl off a submarine she did a swan dive on from 8
stories up, she was drunk and doing acid. Oh and the guy who choked on
his own vomit while on smack, he drowned.

But face it Horvath aint nothing you can do. If they want it they
will get it and take it.

Ive got better things to do then babysit retards who can not control
thier own actions or handle thier drug of choice. And I think anyone
should be free to do or take what ever he or she choses to do. Be an
adult and be responsiable for your own actions.

BTW I also know many people that smoke weed daily and own multi
million dollars businesses or have high profile careers and have no
problem with it at all. Just like I know some people that know when to
say when while drinking.

It aint the type of drug, it's the type of person using that drug.
Like Gilligan said, all victim less crimes should be abolished. And
the people that do victimise others should pay to the max.


Joe








Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!