How to pith a toad (non-excretory)
 

"Peter Wiley" wrote:
How times have changed. When I was a kid, that's where chicken dinner
came from, and that's what happened to roosters that got a bit too
cocky. They really could run around with their heads chopped off.

I cried my eyes out one time when I went outside and discovered my favorite
rooster hanging headless from the clothesline. Thoroughly enjoyed him for
dinner that night. We really are raising a bunch of woosies.

Seahag

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"DSK" wrote:
Seahag wrote
Cetol is great once you learn how to use it.

Maybe that's the trouble. Of all the people I've ever seen use it, the
best looks like a layer of smeared-on orange jello. The new stuff "Cetol
Lite" looks a little better.

Judging by how quickly it turns to crap, and how much touch up work it
seems to need to avert this, IMHO it doesn't last one minute longer than
varnish, either. Makes more sense to put on a coat of paint.


.... It's way more forgiving on
older teak than varnish. I can't tell you how frustrating it is to put
on
16 coats of varnish only to have the plugs and seams blow damn near
every
spring. F**k varnish:^)

Never had this problem. Sounds like the wood is getting too much
moisture into it. What are you using for a base coat? What's it bedded
on? 16 coats of varnish ought to hold up much better than that. Right
now we're on coat #11 (my wife is doing 99% of it).

I had a conversation with a guy on our dock who is PO'd about his Cetol
that he switched to last year. He got fed up with varnish (apparently he
got the impression that 3 or 4 coats was enough to last a year) and
sanded his gunwhale, eyebrow, handrails (now *there's* a PITA) etc etc
down to bare wood so as to put on Cetol Lite. Looked like orange jello,
but at least you could almost see the wood grain. Now it's mostly flaked
off and the wood's got black spots again.


I sand the wood to 220 grit and apply 3 coats as per lable. Then after a
week I knock the inevitable chunks off with a 220 hand sanding and put on a
final coat. It isn't varnish, but I can live with the results. I put on a
coat in the fall and spring if I can. The weather was awful last year so I
didn't get it on in time so the edges failed. I've been touching it up this
last couple of weeks and it's getting there. The stuff blends in pretty
well. I've used the Cetol lite at work but I'm concerned it doesn't have
the umph to last a whole year.

What's up with mast supports? Are you switching to deck stepped masts?


The main mast step is on the sole so there needs to be something between
that and the keel besides 18" of air. There were a couple of loose
chunks
of oak, but we'd like something more likely to stay in place when the
you
know hits the fan.

I'd consider molding in some fiberglass supports. From what you've
already done with the hanging knees, it shouldn't be too hard. Metal
corrodes and wood rots. Besides you can mold in a little gutter & basin
to catch the sap running out of the mast ;)

That's what we're gonna do, it was just hard to figure out exactly how:^)

Seahag

How to pith a toad (non-excretory)
 

They really could run around with their heads chopped off.

They bleed out better that way....my gramma and my mom always did the deed
by stringing a line, hanging them by their feet and slitting their
throats...they'd do the dance macabre without getting all mucky...
--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

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ANyway, if you sent your emails to an address that actually
exists they would have a better chance of gettign through....

I replied to what appeared in my mailbox....

--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

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Doug, I've been using Cetol for 9 years with no problems and it certainly
doesn't look orange. Alien's floors were done with cetol.

Hey stupid- an interior finish does not have to stand up to UV.


Hey, moron, you were talking about it looking ORANGE, not where it was applied.
Maybe it only looks orange to you outside, brainless?
Still, Ghost's Cetol is still in place after 5 seasons.
As usual, Doug, you manage to make an ass of yourself. You're quite the Cetol
expert!

Jerk! Bwahahahahahaha!

RB

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Bobsprit wrote:


Proper use of Cetol
1) Sand with 80, then 160 if you like

160? Pretty unusual grit, 120 or 180 sure.

2) Wash with water bleach mixture
3) Wipe down with acetone. Teak should appear light colored with no grey!

I think the secret here is the acetone, (not a very nice solvent to be using in close confines of your cabin BTW), it acts a degreaser and strips the
natural oils from the surface of the teak and lets the cetol get a 'grip'.

I think teak decks should be left unfinished but occasionaly holy stoned, teak joinery should have regular application of teak oil, no varnish or cetol.

Cheers
Marty

How to pith a toad (non-excretory)
 

"katysails" wrote in message ...
They really could run around with their heads chopped off.

They bleed out better that way....my gramma and my mom always did the deed
by stringing a line, hanging them by their feet and slitting their
throats...they'd do the dance macabre without getting all mucky...

We use to do 100 at a time, white leggerds. It was something to see 5
or 10 at a time running and flipping around the yard. Did not matter
much if they got dirty we would dunk then in boiling water to remove
the feathers.

We did not chopp or slit anything, just lay a pipe across its neck
and yank its feet the head just popped off.

Now the furry little bunny rabbits were a different story.

And every fall we would dress out at least one big deer and one head
of cattle.

And we had a 5 acre garden to tend to. Oh for the good ol days in
Springtown.

Joe

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I think the secret here is the acetone, (not a very nice solvent to be using in
close confines of your cabin BTW), it acts a degreaser and strips the
natural oils from the surface of the teak and lets the cetol get a 'grip'.

yep. The bleach water mix is to get the sanding dust off and to brighten the
wood a bit for better color. Acetone really drys out the upper surface and teak
is naturally oily wood. Works great, looks good and lasts and lasts.
Unless you're dumb like Doug!

RB

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Bobsprit wrote:
yep. The bleach water mix is to get the sanding dust off and to brighten the
wood a bit for better color.

Funny, I have never used bleach on any of our wood. If you want to get
off the dust, using a shop vac with a brush attachment works best.
Putting water onto wood that you are going to try and put a finish on is
not a good idea, especially in a humid climate.

... Acetone really drys out the upper surface and teak
is naturally oily wood.

Haven't done that on our current boat. However we have used a thinned
clear coat which penetrates into the wood.

... Works great, looks good and lasts and lasts.
Unless you're dumb like Doug!

If I'm dumb, then how come people have left us notes on the boat saying
how beautiful the woodwork is? We have the prettiest boat with the
prettiest varnish for miles and miles around.

Fresh Varnish- Doug King

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Seahag wrote:
I sand the wood to 220 grit and apply 3 coats as per lable.

One of the benefits of Cetol is that you don't have to wait as long
between coats, right? This year we're using a new varnish that can also
be applied over a wet coat.

We started out using 80 grit to take of the DPO's layer of polyurethane
(now that ought to be a criminal offense). Then 150 to smooth it; both
with power sander. Then the first couple of coats of sealer/primer went
on, hand sanding (using a block on much of it) with 180 grit then 220.
By this time it's actually going pretty well since you feel like you're
making progress. The worst part is the initial sanding, takes forever
and you feel like you're accomplishing nothing.

After 5 or 6 coats of sealer/primer, we switched to real varnish and 400
grit wet/dry. The wood was totally sealed at this point and already
looking gorgeous. 3 or 4 more coats sanding with 400 then 600 grit &
soapy water. The last 2 or 3 coats went on with this new 'Jet-Dry'
stuff. Some of it is not really mirror smooth but it still looks good.

A few people looking at our caprail have assumed it was coated with some
new kind of miracle clear plastic.


... Then after a
week I knock the inevitable chunks off with a 220 hand sanding and put on a
final coat. It isn't varnish, but I can live with the results.

The important thing is that you're satisfied with it.


... I put on a
coat in the fall and spring if I can. The weather was awful last year so I
didn't get it on in time so the edges failed. I've been touching it up this
last couple of weeks and it's getting there. The stuff blends in pretty
well.

Varnish blends perfectly ;)

... I've used the Cetol lite at work but I'm concerned it doesn't have
the umph to last a whole year.

Nothing lasts a whole year if you're far enough south. UV tears up
everything.

Judging by what I've seen, of the people who use Cetol or one of the
other 'labor saving' finishes, it's still more work than most are
willing to put into it... and it doesn't look anywhere near as good. Our
finish is maybe 20% more work to put on and 10% more work to maintain,
but IMHO it looks 1,000% better. But that's easy for me to say, I do
very little of the sanding and almost none of the actual varnishing... I
am too busy in the engine room ;)

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

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Funny, I have never used bleach on any of our wood. If you want to get
off the dust, using a shop vac with a brush attachment works best.

Nope. It doesn't. Water/Bleach, then acetone will leave the wood bone dry and
less oily. You clearly don't know how to use cetol, so why not shut up already,
Doug?

RB

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If I'm dumb, then how come people have left us notes on the boat saying
how beautiful the woodwork is?

Uh, maybe because we're talking about Cetol, Dumbass?
What an idiot Doug is.

RB

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Funny, I have never used bleach on any of our wood. If you want to get
off the dust, using a shop vac with a brush attachment works best.

Bobsprit wrote:
Nope. It doesn't.

Really? How do you know?

I have had the good luck to work with several people who make a nice
living doing yacht brightwork. They use a small shop vac with a brush,
one and all.

But you're smarter than them, Boobsie. Really you are. That's why you
win all the time!

DSK

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I have had the good luck to work with several people who make a nice
living doing yacht brightwork. They use a small shop vac with a brush,
one and all.

My yard does a lot of brightwork on large yachts. They don't use shop vacs to
prep anything. It's just not thorough enough. Water, then acetone is. A vac is
for cleanup, not prepping for cetol!!!
Moron!

RB

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Bobsprit wrote:
My yard does a lot of brightwork on large yachts.

So?

... They don't use shop vacs to
prep anything. It's just not thorough enough.

Also because they're probably lazy. And they require thimbles & shackles
on dock lines.

The results speak for themselves... a finish you can read a newspaper
in, and is admired sincerely by all who see it.

... A vac is
for cleanup,

What do you think getting the sanding dust off a surface is?

Bubbles, you're nuts!

DSK

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"Martin Baxter" wrote:

I think teak decks should be left unfinished but occasionaly holy stoned,
teak joinery should have regular application of teak oil, no varnish or
cetol.

I gave away my holy stone with the old boat. Gee whiz, I sure wish I could
find a new one.

Seahag

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"DSK" wrote:
Seahag wrote:
I sand the wood to 220 grit and apply 3 coats as per lable.

One of the benefits of Cetol is that you don't have to wait as long
between coats, right? This year we're using a new varnish that can also
be applied over a wet coat.

24 hours..next day like.


We started out using 80 grit to take of the DPO's layer of polyurethane
(now that ought to be a criminal offense)

hahaha...I've started with 24 grit on bad teak. Ya know, after the jerks
use a brush or pressure washer.

Then 150 to smooth it; both
with power sander. Then the first couple of coats of sealer/primer went
on, hand sanding (using a block on much of it) with 180 grit then 220.
By this time it's actually going pretty well since you feel like you're
making progress. The worst part is the initial sanding, takes forever
and you feel like you're accomplishing nothing.

After 5 or 6 coats of sealer/primer, we switched to real varnish and 400
grit wet/dry. The wood was totally sealed at this point and already
looking gorgeous. 3 or 4 more coats sanding with 400 then 600 grit &
soapy water. The last 2 or 3 coats went on with this new 'Jet-Dry'
stuff. Some of it is not really mirror smooth but it still looks good.

On the 5 th coat try laying the varnish on across the grain and tipping it
out with the grain. Lightly 220 it a few days later. lay on a 'normal'
coat. Let that dry real good and then sand the whole thing down until it's
all powder white. Wash with soap and water and then get serious. You will
have exposed wood, but the low bits are filled. I really enjoyed varnishing
Lahaina, bitch had some amazing wood.

Dang...I'm tired just reliving some of it!

Seahag

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... A vac is
for cleanup,

What do you think getting the sanding dust off a surface is?


Doug, you cleary know nothing about Cetol. You don't use it and reading the can
doesn't count for much. Cetol is quite popular and I've tried several methods.
The one I use works best, even better than the acetone/acid wash suggested by
Sikkens. The sad part is that you haven't tried the method, so you simply don't
know.
Move on, little boy.

RB

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DSK wrote:

Bobsprit wrote:

yep. The bleach water mix is to get the sanding dust off and to
brighten the
wood a bit for better color.


Funny, I have never used bleach on any of our wood. If you want to get
off the dust, using a shop vac with a brush attachment works best.

You guys ever heard of a 'Tack cloth'?

Putting water onto wood that you are going to try and put a finish on is
not a good idea, especially in a humid climate.

Water on wood, great way to undo all that sanding and raise the grain, doesn't anybody hear do any cabinet work?

Cheers
Marty

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Seahag wrote:

"Martin Baxter" wrote:

I think teak decks should be left unfinished but occasionaly holy stoned,

teak joinery should have regular application of teak oil, no varnish or
cetol.

I gave away my holy stone with the old boat. Gee whiz, I sure wish I could
find a new one.

I know what you mean Haggie, can't seem to find a decent size chunk of pumice for love 'nor money these days.

I thought you could find big pieces in Hawaii, just get someone to bring a chunk back, cut it in half with a diamond saw
and Bob's yer uncle (which may not be a good thing on this news group ;-o)?

Cheers
Marty

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Water on wood, great way to undo all that sanding and raise the grain, doesn't
anybody hear do any cabinet work?

Won't raise the grain if you follow with acetone.

RB

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Yes, some of us do cabinet work. Yes, I have
heard of a tack cloth, but stopped using them when
I figured out what I was doing. Many tack cloths
have oils and rosins that can actually affect the
bonding or the finish. Plain clean cheese cloth
works well.
And I do wipe down with water as part of the
finishing. But I sand again afterward. The idea
is to raise the grain, then sand it off. That way
it won't raise when I use alcohol dye stain.
S

"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
: DSK wrote:
:
: Bobsprit wrote:
:
: yep. The bleach water mix is to get the
sanding dust off and to
: brighten the
: wood a bit for better color.
:
:
: Funny, I have never used bleach on any of our
wood. If you want to get
: off the dust, using a shop vac with a brush
attachment works best.
:
: You guys ever heard of a 'Tack cloth'?
:
: Putting water onto wood that you are going to
try and put a finish on is
: not a good idea, especially in a humid
climate.
:
: Water on wood, great way to undo all that
sanding and raise the grain, doesn't anybody hear
do any cabinet work?
:
: Cheers
: Marty
:
:

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Pony Express wrote:

Yes, some of us do cabinet work. Yes, I have
heard of a tack cloth, but stopped using them when
I figured out what I was doing. Many tack cloths
have oils and rosins that can actually affect the
bonding or the finish. Plain clean cheese cloth
works well.
And I do wipe down with water as part of the
finishing. But I sand again afterward. The idea
is to raise the grain, then sand it off. That way
it won't raise when I use alcohol dye stain.
S

Ah ha! Someone who knows a bit about woodworking! Will use water and re-sand also if
applying a water base finish, Flecto Diamond water based polyurethane is surprisingly hard
and durable. I've got a couple of oars I built for my dink finished with stuff, been on for
three years and still look good, seen a lot of sun.

As for tack rag, make your own and it won't have anything but a trace of boiled linseed oil, should be
tacky, not wet, so close to dry that it won't leave any oils behind.


Cheers
Marty

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"Martin Baxter" wrote:
DSK wrote:

Bobsprit wrote:

yep. The bleach water mix is to get the sanding dust off and to
brighten the
wood a bit for better color.


Funny, I have never used bleach on any of our wood. If you want to get
off the dust, using a shop vac with a brush attachment works best.

You guys ever heard of a 'Tack cloth'?

Putting water onto wood that you are going to try and put a finish on is
not a good idea, especially in a humid climate.

Water on wood, great way to undo all that sanding and raise the grain,
doesn't anybody hear do any cabinet work?

I only use water after the first coat of finish has dried.

Seahag