"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 29 Apr 2004 14:40:33 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
.. .

On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 17:46:30 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:



Ok, if we stick to your binary view of property, you are either
on
your property or someone else's. When you leave your property, am
I
to
assume that you are intending to damage someone else's property?

Don't say stupid things. We're talking about a dog, not a person.

Why not? The principle's the same.

Don't be ridiculous. I define **** on my property as damage. It's my
property, so my definition is the only one that's valid.

The law would seem to disagree with you.

Actually, the simple concept of "private property" is the basis of a
whole
slew of laws. Regardless of how these laws are picked apart, only one
phrase
is needed to shut down arguments: private property. This is why people
can
get away with painting a house pink and putting stupid stuffed sheep and
plastic flamingoes on their front lawns.

Now you sound like a libertarian, placing property rights above
individual rights. And in many (and a growing number of) places you
CAN'T paint your house pink or put tacky lawn ornaments out.

Usually in places where those restrictions are made known to buyers before
they sign on the dotted line.


To say that a dog intends to do damage every time he leave his lawn is
also false. A dog is a four legged anarchist. He's just doing his
thing.

I never said the dog intended to do it. I said that the owner intends for
the dog to do it.

That premise is false as it is based on the assumption that the dog
owner premeditated the act. Most dog owners do not apply that much
thought to a simple act of letting their critter out to roam.

Ding ding ding! You've won 100 points. Most dog owners do not apply that
much thought. Exactly. That would be called "thoughtless". Here's a strawman
you'll love. I decide to practice with my .40 cal handgun in my house. A
bullet goes through the wall and wounds my neighbor, or even better, his
dog. After all the commotion is over and someone bails me out of jail, the
neighbor asks "What the **** were you thinking???" My response: "Well, I
really didn't apply that much thought, and I had no idea it would travel
almost 50 feet."


The owner lets the dog roam because the owner is lazy. He
doesn't want to take the time to walk the dog, and/or the owner doesn't
want
to take the time to clean up dog crap in his OWN yard. So, the owner
transfers that work to other people.

But what about the many cases where the dog DOES drop in their own
yard first? Are you denying that these examples are usually the rule
and not the exception.? A dog tends to "go" where it is most
comfortable and familiar, and that usually means in his own yard.

What about dogs ****ing on peoples' lawns and plants? If you don't think
THIS is an issue, browse message in rec.dogs or whatever the NG is called.
At least once a week, someone will ask how to deal with what urine does to
lawns and plants, and he'll get LOADS of responses. Those responses must
come from people who've never seen the problem, right? Hint: Dogs mark
territories constantly as they roam.