Chicago Paddling-Fishing wrote:
Paul Tomblin wrote:
: In a previous article, Chicago Paddling-Fishing said:
:Paul Tomblin wrote:
:: kids loose without basic instruction. If that had been my kids (and if I
:: hadn't given them instruction already) and I saw them lurching along like
:: that, I would have pulled them out of whatever program they were in and
:: found another program with competent leadership.
If things happened as indicated, I would agree with you completely. The
"leader" of the trip should be held accountable for ensuring everyone
has the proper basic instruction and safety training and they adhere to it.

:Well... first let me say that I'm a boy scout leader... nether the boy scouts
:nor the girl scouts allow youth members of the opposing genders (there are no
:boys in girl scouts and there are no girls in boy scouts).
I'd just like to say this isn't accurate. The BSA has a program called
Venturers (formerly Explorers) that is a co-ed scout crew (instead of
troop). There are plenty of them across the country and both genders
can reach the top level of scouting, which I think is Ranger for the
Venturer program. I believe only boys can get an Eagle Scout ranking,
however, through the Venturing program.

While I generally agree that Scouts are abysmally equipped and trained,
Paul's reaction seems a bit extreme. I don't know what happened
exactly, but from his description of events, it seems to me Paul should
have been able to do something to call attention to himself and avoid
the collision altogether. Letting them know he was there would have
been the first thing to do, whether they were "on the other bank" or
not, even if it's just to be friendly. Then they would have at least
acknowleged his presence and been more likely to TRY to avoid him. They
may not have been successful, but odds are they would have done something.

Karma or not, I don't know. I know nothing of Paul except the few posts
I've read in this thread. It definitely could have been handled
differently, though for better or worse is anyone's guess.


Which brings up the point of what you do with your spare time... maybe offer
to help a youth group near you as a way of self preservation?

This is a very good suggestion. It helps keep you up to date with how
kids are (even just a small subculture of them) and will also keep you
thinking and acting young. It sucks sometimes, because, well they're
teenagers and teenagers suck, but generally speaking it's a great
experience. And what can be better than molding someone in your own
image? Teaching them the things you think are important the way you
find it important for them to learn.



:Since the youth group wasn't paying attention to you but you saw them, did
:you announce yourself or announce that you were passing? Even on bikes or

: We were going in opposite directions - they were coming upriver, I was
: coming down. They were on one side of the river, I was on the other until
: they lurched across.

This doesn't make sense to me. Typically I find kayaks to be far more
maneuverable than canoes so it seems to me, if you had been paying
attention, Paul, you should have been able to avoid them, whether or not
they "lurched" across. Like you said, there was more than enough space
to squeeze by, if that picture is an accurate depiction of the area.



So, your saying you couldn't avoid the gaggle(whatever that means?) of girls
in a canoe that was coming head on at you... perhaps it's years of being
involved in scouts, or that one day early on when i was following a scout on
bike and he fell off his bike for no reason, wiping me out... that I learned
long ago to not pass closely... while there was no reason I could see for the
kid in front of me to fall (not that I could see), I did't blame anyone else
except me that I got wiped out because you just never know what a kid is
going to do next... it's supposed to be adults who watch out for them... not
the other way around...

Well said.