Well you're right about that!
One's position just depends on what side one's bread is buttered. And you're
also right that both the employer and the union can screw each other and the
workers; it's a delicate balance of power.
Scout

"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message
news:sYKYd.23522$ZO2.7026@edtnps84...
I've been a member of several unions during my employment history.
I afford them as much trust as I do my employer.... little if any.
To rise to the defence of any soulless entity... be it union , employer or
government is pointless. Align yourself with whatever profits you... for
as long as it does so.

A case in point would be the Giant Mine strike in Yellowknife..... where
the personal prejudices of both union boss and employer destroyed the
lives of many.
The union members were left to hang due to the petty squabbles of a few
and the indifference of the government and law enforcement.

CM



"Scout" wrote in message
...
CM,
I don't know what your experience is with unions. But I do know what I've
been through, and my father, and his father. Your points are made
eloquently, but do not mesh with what I know to be truth. Perhaps things
are different in Canada, or in Philadelphia.
Scout

"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message
news:YpFYd.46457$fc4.9578@edtnps89...

"Scout" wrote in message

Very good. And because they had that day, hired goons no longer show up
and split your head open with a baseball bat for wanting a fair share
of the profits of a company's efforts. Had you seen that, you might be
glad to have a brother close by. These heavy handed "negotiations" made
bar room fights look like a day at the beach.

Not really a viable example Scout... since there are many things in
society that are no longer condoned and that had nothing to do with
union activity.


It's all very well and good to espouse a philosophy that worked in the
day of the agrarian citizen, but the sheer number of people in the
modern workforce demands different rules. Hobbes would have agreed with
me. People are inherently greedy; generally speaking they are pricks.
ASA provides all the evidence one needs to believe that is true.
Government and big business are one and the same, and together they are
still the Leviathan. Mutually beneficial contracts are needed today
more than ever. God bless a nation where a guy like Scotty can make the
offer of "take it or shove it." He can do so only because others have
paid the cost, and continue to pay the price, for that privilege.

Our ancestors have collectively paid the price to have us achieve our
current freedoms and society... this in no way suggests that methods
acceptable even 50 years ago are legitimate today. Your statement on
the general tendencies of people seem to illustrate a rather negative
view of society in general. I do not find the people posting to ASA as
pricks at all.... [Except for Gaynzy who is an annoying little
homo].... their posturing and statements are a fine tool with which to
hone my abilities to defend a position. Considering the anonymity
provided by this medium... it's a wonder the verbal engagements are not
far worse. In effect we self police.

In regards to Scotty's ability to establish his rate of pay... this has
been available for as long as we have existed and is not the result of
union activity. If you provide a service or commodity that is superior
to others in the same field.... you have the right to charge what the
consumer will bear.

CM