"Donal" the cowardly liar wrote:
OK, I'll accept that, but its pretty selective quoting there. My
complete
statement was:

"So where in the Colregs does it say you can't run on radar alone? Of
course,
one should always have a visual (and sound) watch, but that is moot if
there is
effectively zero visibility. And yet many vessels maintain their
normal
schedule in thick fog."

I think its pretty clear I'm not advocating running without a lookout,
only that
in practice the vessel is depending on radar for virtually all of its
info.

No, no no, no, no!!!!!

In practice any vessel *must* obey the CollRegs. Don't you agree?

What is your point here? You've admitted that its legal to proceed even
if
there is zero visibility.

Oooops. I was wrong if I said that. I suspect that I said that it might
be more dangerous to allow the speed to drop below the point where a vessel
can maintain steerage.

You stated in no uncertain terms that traffic proceeds in the Channel at 12
knots even in thick fog. I cited a recent case where 10 knots was not
considered a factor in a collision in zero visibility. Farwell's says "A ship
that is making proper use of radar in, say, the open ocean, cannot be
realistically expected to take all way off when the fog becomes so dense that it
is not possible to see beyond its bows."

Further, although you might be able to claim that the strict wording of the
ColRegs implies any movement in thick fog is imprudent, that is not the current
interpretation of the courts. And, as we now all know, the courts effectively
modify the ColRegs.

And what's this "Oooops" business? Now you're flip flopping on this issue again
with just an "Oooops"? After all the **** you've been giving me when you know I
didn't mean what you claim? You're a real piece of work, Donal, a real asshole!

Further, this stupid reply is to a post 9 days ago!!! What, have you been
stewing about this for 9 days and you now think you have some intelligent to
add? I don't think so.


You've insisted that a lookout must be posted, and
I've agreed wholeheartedly. My only point has been that in the absence of
visual input the helmsman is relying primarily on radar.

Nonsense! Your initial argument was that Joe was correct in his assertion
that navigating under Radar alone was acceptable. Do you want me to post
your words again?


No, when you post them you keep leaving out "Of course, one should always have a
visual (and sound) watch". Why is that? Is it because you are a cowardly liar?
Everyone else has no trouble understanding my words. Its only cowardly liars
that don't.

I did imply that in zero visibility, the helmsman is effectively navigating on
radar alone. And there must also be a visual lookout. And we know that the
lookout cannot be the same person as the helmsman - The reason is that the
helmsman must focus on the radar and compass, and therefore cannot serve as the
lookout. Why is this so complicated for you to understand? If you want to make
a case that Joe implied the lookout is not needed, feel free; I would agree that
that is wrong.

I suggest you give it up Donal, you've convinced everyone that you are a
cowardly liar and a fool. You really can't sink any lower without imitating
Jax.





Are you arguing simply
with my choice of words? If you think "virtually all of its info" or
"essentially on radar alone" are not proper ways to say it I might concede
the
point just to end this silly discussion.

Would you accept the wording of the CollRegs?


I sense a grade school argument coming on ....



Or are you claiming that the helmsman must rely primarily on visual input,
even
in limited visibility? If this is your point, I think you need to go back
to
your class.

Tell us what the CollRegs say.

Then tell us why your opinion outweighs the CollRegs.


I was right; Donal, the fool is using his kindergarten logic again. Sad, truely
sad.



Or are you simply saying that its OK to do rely primarily on radar, but 25
knots
is simply too fast? To this I would claim, it depends on the situation.

It doesn't depend on the situation. You either accept the CollRegs, or you
don't.


I've asked this question several times - you seem to keep changing your answer.
Do you beleive that all traffic must stop in thick fog? If your answer is yes,
why do you think the courts have ruled otherwise?

You keep making this vague claim that its all in the ColRegs - you even claimed
at one point the ColRegs might have specific speed limits. Perhaps you could
show us where that is.

You keep implying that "Safe Speed" is determined by visibility alone; Rule 6(b)
is pretty clear that radar equipment will change that determination.



I said
many times that I couldn't address Joe's situation, but I know of a number
of
runs where 7 to 14 knots is considered acceptable in the fog, and I
suspect that
some go 35 knots or more away from land. Since the HSC is largely closed
to
recreational boats, 25 knots may be accepted there.

So if you have a point here, please state it, and stop lying about what
I've
said.

Please stop calling me a liar. Just because somebody disagrees with you
does not automatically mean that they are a liar. It *is* possible that you
might be wrong.


I'm wrong? What part of "Of course, one should always have a visual (and
sound) watch" implies that I don't think there should be a lookout? I don't
call you a liar because you're wrong, I call you a liar because you continue to
misrepresent what I said. Frankly, I have no idea what you are trying to claim
other than a lookout is needed, and I not sure anyone has disagreed with that.

Mind you, I never said the Joe's hypothetical actions were OK, I only said that
if you have a visual lookout, navigating effectively on radar alone is not
necessarily prohibited by the rules. I presented a number of court rulings,
investigations, and the standard textbook to support my case.

What have you done? You've repeatedly lied about my position, but you've never
actually stated what your position is, other than claiming that yours is
supported by the ColRegs, and anyone that disagrees with you obviously doesn't
believe in the rules.

Get some rest, Donal. See a professional. Maybe get some medication - this all
seems to be too much for you.