On 11/11/2015 4:01 PM, John H. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Nov 2015 13:15:05 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 11/11/2015 1:04 PM, John H. wrote:
On Wed, 11 Nov 2015 09:20:54 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 11/11/2015 6:51 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Nov 2015 15:38:52 -0800, Califbill billnews wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/10/2015 4:57 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/10/2015 3:41 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 10 Nov 2015 11:22:38 -0800, Califbill billnews wrote:
wrote:
On Tue, 10 Nov 2015 09:48:37 -0800, Califbill billnews wrote:
I think there are laws a lot of places about filming in to neighbors
private spaces. I know here your security cameras can not film the
neighbors private areas. Front door is ok, etc.
That might just be a California thing to slow down the paparazzi
I do not know of the backyard if easily seen is a private place, but
i bet
most states have such laws. Like filming in locker rooms or public
toilets.
California's voyeurism laws on page 11:
The filming/viewing must be..." the interior of a bedroom, bathroom,
changing room,
fitting room, dressing room, or tanning booth, or the interior of any
other area in
which the occupant has a reasonable expectation of privacy" or
"...under or through
clothing."
http://www.ndaa.org/pdf/voyeurism_statutes_mar_09.pdf
In this document the term 'reasonable expectation of privacy' is used
very
frequently. A clear definition of same is hard to find, but it seems
to be 'the
interior' of various types of rooms. I could not find 'back yard'
mentioned anywhere.
Does a person in their own backyard have a 'reasonable expectation of
privacy'? I
think not, but then again, it depends. If my next door neighbor has a
window facing
my back yard and can see over my fence, then I can't reasonably expect
that I won't
be observed in my back yard.
Likewise, as I have an upstairs window looking over his deck (and hot
tub) they
shouldn't 'reasonably expect the privacy' to be bathing nude.
Common sense dictates that being able to see your neighbor's backyard
from your house or property is *not* a violation of his"reasonable
expectation of privacy". Flying a remotely controlled, camera equipped
drone *over* your neighbor's property and video recording whatever is
happening certainly is, IMO.
John, I accidentally deleted the reply you made to my post (above) so I
can't reply to it directly.
All the statutes you are citing don't have anything to do with remotely
controlled drones, quads or whatever you want to call them. They were
most likely drafted and put into the laws well before the advent of of
cheap drones equipped with cameras. This is exactly the point I was
making at the beginning of this thread. The FAA has not yet determined
how to deal with this ... if they are going to deal with it at all.
It matters not if you can video record your neighbor's backyard from
your property or house. Current laws govern that. It's completely
different to purposely fly a remotely controlled drone *over* your
neighbor's property, especially to take video recordings.
You have a resonance expectation of privacy in your back yard. You know
your neighbors and may know they are not home. A drone would be in the
same category as putting a camera on a long stick and taking pictures over
the fence. Both should get jail / fine. You have your young kids mostly
naked in the wading pool. And someone reaches over the fence and snaps
pics? Legal or illegal? Most likely subject to a jury awarding huge
amounts of money to you and your kids if the photographer has assets.
...or standing in your upstairs bedroom taking pictures over the fence. Morally, I
agree with you. Legally, you'd have a lot of proving to do. From what I've read of
the CA law, you'd not have a legal leg to stand on. But, the law I posted was from
2009, so maybe things have changed now.
Some of the FAA regulations were changed in 2012 to cover RC aircraft
but they still do not address the issue of flying them over other
people's property and video recording.
Each state has its own voyeurism laws. Doubt if the FAA will ever get involved in
that.
I am not even talking about voyeurism. I am of the mindset that flying
a RC drone, quad, whatever at low altitudes over other people's property
should be considered a violation of their reasonable right to privacy
and should be included in RC restrictions. The fact that you don't
think it could be enforced doesn't mean the restriction shouldn't be
placed and made part of published regulations.
So it should be illegal to fly a drone over a neighboring farmer's field? Or would it
only be illegal to fly over his back yard? And if the question is privacy, how would
you know whether or not the drone had a camera? Or a first person view capability?
The mission of the FAA is 'is to provide the safest, most efficient aerospace system
in the world.'
Drones flying over back yards at low altitude pose no threat to the safety or
efficiency of the aerospace system.
sigh I guess this isn't worth any further discussion.
We were originally talking about flying the damn things over
neighbor's back yards. Now you want to discuss flying over
a neighboring farmer's field.
We were originally talking about reasonable right to privacy.
Now you want to talk about how they pose no threat to the safety
or efficiency of the aerospace system.
What you haven't acknowledged yet is the jury is still out on
how the FAA or other government agency is going to decide on
the privacy issue. Again, it's a relatively new capability of
cheap, camera equipped quads that any yahoo with an Amazon account
or credit card can buy for $100.