They just revamped their website so I it appears they are still very
much in business. Many of their distributors sell very few Kayaks
because of their price range and appear not to know much about the
linup. Try Peter at KlepperWest.com. He is dedicated to folding kayaks,
and has an extensive linup. He will also give you a good price.

back40 wrote:
Are these *******s going bankrupt? Attemptng to place an order for
their "Airline Java Sit On Top" kayak through "Mountain Co-op"
distributor resulted in a a sarcastc response indicating no knowledge
of the model.
Given the current economic uncertainties and bankruptcies, would I be
better avised tgo place an order for a folding kayak thorugh Folbot?

MEC does not advertise that model.
They don't ship any Feathercraft boats to the states. (a lot of their
products have restricted distribution)

I've dealt recently with Feathercraft, and would definitely NOT describe
them as "*******s".

Good luck with your boat purchase.

"back40" wrote in message
...

Are these *******s going bankrupt? Attemptng to place an order for
their "Airline Java Sit On Top" kayak through "Mountain Co-op"
distributor resulted in a a sarcastc response indicating no knowledge
of the model.
Given the current economic uncertainties and bankruptcies, would I be
better avised tgo place an order for a folding kayak thorugh Folbot?

Correction, they do advertise it.
My mistake.

"Tom Morrison" wrote in message
news:h_pXb.499516$ts4.190720@pd7tw3no...
MEC does not advertise that model.
They don't ship any Feathercraft boats to the states. (a lot of their
products have restricted distribution)

I've dealt recently with Feathercraft, and would definitely NOT describe
them as "*******s".

Good luck with your boat purchase.

"back40" wrote in message
...

Are these *******s going bankrupt? Attemptng to place an order for
their "Airline Java Sit On Top" kayak through "Mountain Co-op"
distributor resulted in a a sarcastc response indicating no knowledge
of the model.
Given the current economic uncertainties and bankruptcies, would I be
better avised tgo place an order for a folding kayak thorugh Folbot?

"back40" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 14:09:17 GMT, "Tom Morrison"
wrote:

MEC does not advertise that model.

They certainly do!


http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_l...=1076769588495

They don't ship any Feathercraft boats to the States.

I'm in Canada, not the States, and the MEC I called is also in Canada
- Toronto.

I think that mail order sales are handled out of Vancouver. That might
explain why you got the run-a-round from the Toronto store. You still might
be able to get it for 2K + shipping.



(a lot of their
products have restricted distribution)

I can see that - restricted to those willing to pay more than the
advertised price!

I've dealt recently with Feathercraft, and would definitely NOT describe
them as "*******s".

Ostensibly they are changing their dealer setup. Odd that a major
retailer like MEC in Toronto would be dropped. I'm just happy I didn't
place an order with anyone and give out a credit card number.
I don't know what's going on, but when staring at an ad on Internet,
while simulateneously talking with the firm on the phone, trying to
place an order, and getting denials that they ever listed such a
product, or such a price, something is not kosher.


Feathercraft is a small outfit I think. Personally, I would have no issue
giving them my credit card #. I had a problem with one of the parts I
ordered for my K1. They replaced it fast, free, without any request to
return the deffective part.

It looks like they have chosen to market their products directly in Canada.


Good luck with your boat purchase.

Purchase is on hold while I look for reputable builder/dealer.

Perhaps the problem is with the dealer. Western Folding Kayaks had a
great selection, Feathercraft has shown themselves responsive and caring
to their customers. I have nothing to say but good things in my dealings
with them. From all folding kayaks I have paddled, the feathercrafts are
the only ones on par with the hard shells as far as performance. And the
quality is top notch. If leg space is an issue, you might also consider
the K1. It takes longer to assemble than the sit-on-tops but is a fast,
stable and very roomy boat. I found the sit-on-tops to be a bit
unstable, inherent from sitting above the water line. However, I tested
the Java, and speedwise, it is also on par with some hardshells.

back40 wrote:
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 16:12:21 GMT, "Tom Morrison"
wrote:

[....]


I think that mail order sales are handled out of Vancouver. That might
explain why you got the run-a-round from the Toronto store. You still might
be able to get it for 2K + shipping.


They emailed me, saying they have just ONE left, and I can have it for
the advertised price. That's real big of them. "LAST ONE" - hmmm,
conjures up visions of a dusty "display" model, or a return.....Or,
maybe it _Is_ a bargain price on a line they won't be handling
anymore. Do I want to risk it?
All I wanted was to order the boat, and, like Janis Joplin, "wait for
delivery." Instead, it was the runaround.



Feathercraft is a small outfit I think. Personally, I would have no issue
giving them my credit card #. I had a problem with one of the parts I
ordered for my K1. They replaced it fast, free, without any request to
return the deffective part.


I sailed. After some years, interest waned, the maintenance became a
dreary chore, the boat didn't see the water for some seasons, and
finally the marina closed. Boat in storage since. I had a stroke,
which affected sense of balance. Thought a kayak would get me back on
the water, and help with recovery. It did. A plastic Dimension Nomad.
(I looked at Feathercraft, but it seemed like an awful lot of money
for some waterproof fabric and aluminum tubing.) But time and old age
marches on - after an hour or more of sitting in the same position,
with no room to move my legs, I'm so stiff I literally have to fall
out of the thing.
Thinking a sit on top might be more comfortable, at least allowing one
to stretch legs and move knees a bit, I've been looking. The Java
looked interesting - at last, a more reasonable price from
Feathercraft. Is it new and innovative, or did they just come up with
something cheap to make - after all, in this economy, there can't be
an endless supply of millionaires shopping for six thousand dollar
kayaks! Maybe I should get a couple of air matresses and three lengths
of aluminum conduit, and make my own Java!


It looks like they have chosen to market their products directly in Canada.


Well, perhaps they should be more open about such things, instead of
playing games. If there is a rift between Feathercraft and its
dealers, that's their problem, not mine. I don't feel like playing
monkey in the middle.
Folbot sounds like the answer. Like you, my sister's S.O. has a
Feathercraft, which he hauls to St. Lucia, and spends weeks on
Northern camping trips. He swears by it. But how much is the
superiority fact and how much mythology? Gordon Sinclair, a now gone
broadcaster, owned a Rolls, but candidly admitted it wasn't really any
more dependable than an Olsmobile.

"back40" wrote in message
...

I've never paddled a sit on top, but it seems logical that sitting
higher would raise the centre of gravity, and make them less stable.
But, I have seen paddlers fooling around in them at the local beach,
and for the antics going on, the craft seemed remarkably stable.
However, I don't think I want a hard shell sit on top. The long
cockpit opening in the Folbot Greenland II certainly should allow
freedom of leg movement.


I was a bit skeptical from its appearance, but read nothing but good
reviews. Of course, reviews should be taken with a grain of sand.
Speed isn't the prime consideration for me - comfort and stability are
important. I'm 6'1" and just under 250 lbs. and that limits the
choices somewhat.



Even the Folbot singles have generous cockpit openings, if that's what you
are looking for. The price is reasonable, and the company very nice. They
are stable. Not the fastest or most responsive things out there, and not the
"one with the kayak" type, so there's tradeoffs, depending on what you want.
You'll probably need to work on the seating a bit, though, to improve
under-thigh and lower-back support.

Personally, I'm glad Feathercraft has gone to direct ordering from their
website.

Mike (has a Greenland II for us, wants a Kahuna for me)

"back40" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 20:30:37 GMT, "Mike Hackett"
wrote:


Even the Folbot singles have generous cockpit openings, if that's what
you
are looking for. The price is reasonable,

Yes, especially now their annual sale on till month-end.

and the company very nice.

Read reviews from many happy owners, just one disgruntled one who said
things broke (plastic crossframe?) the first time out. Warranty
service seems first-rate.

They are stable. Not the fastest or most responsive things out there, and
not the
"one with the kayak" type, so there's tradeoffs, depending on what you
want.

You'll probably need to work on the seating a bit, though, to improve
under-thigh and lower-back support.
I did read comments on the lack of a footrest.
Personally, I'm glad Feathercraft has gone to direct ordering from their
website.

It would seem logical to either sell factory direct, OR through
dealers, but not both, since your own dealers wind up competing with
you, (and situtations like I encountered happen).

Mike (has a Greenland II for us, wants a Kahuna for me)

You have a Greenland II! That is the boat I am now considering,with
the sail rig, and if I could ask your advice...I would primarily be
paddling solo. More than a few people have said they regretted buying
a double for solo use, because the added height and beam makes
paddling in the solo position awkward, and the greater windage when
only loaded with one paddler makes it a handful in crosswinds or rough
water.
Have you found this to be the case? Would I be making a mistake buying
this for solo use?
It is, after all, only a few inches longer than my current rotomold,
2 inches more height, but there is ten inches more beam, although that
should provide considerably more stability, and being a large paddler
myself, I didn't think it should be a problem.
The Kodiak model is also more roomy than my Dimension Nomad, and has a
larger cockpit opening, AND is considerably cheaper than the
Greenland, BUT is the only model for which Folbot does not offer
aluminum crossframes. Given my bulk, I'd rather have the metal, and
the ability to carry another paddler occasionally, or a lot of camping
gear would be a plus.
The closest paddle for me is Lake Ontario, hence added freeboard and
stability would provide more peace of mind.



The GII is a great boat. Get the solo kit and you should be fine. Check out
the solo sprayskirt mods on http://www.folbot.com/forum.html for sturdier
options.

Dave


Red Greenland II
http://webkatz.net/kayak/gII.html

"back40" wrote in message
...

It would seem logical to either sell factory direct, OR through
dealers, but not both, since your own dealers wind up competing with
you, (and situtations like I encountered happen).

Yeah, not a great situation, I have to think this is sort of a transition
period they are in. One thing I'm wondering is if they finally do become
direct-sales only, will they drop their prices to more like a wholesale
price.



You have a Greenland II! That is the boat I am now considering,with
the sail rig, and if I could ask your advice...I would primarily be
paddling solo. More than a few people have said they regretted buying
a double for solo use, because the added height and beam makes
paddling in the solo position awkward, and the greater windage when
only loaded with one paddler makes it a handful in crosswinds or rough
water.
Have you found this to be the case? Would I be making a mistake buying
this for solo use?
It is, after all, only a few inches longer than my current rotomold,
2 inches more height, but there is ten inches more beam, although that
should provide considerably more stability, and being a large paddler
myself, I didn't think it should be a problem.
The Kodiak model is also more roomy than my Dimension Nomad, and has a
larger cockpit opening, AND is considerably cheaper than the
Greenland, BUT is the only model for which Folbot does not offer
aluminum crossframes. Given my bulk, I'd rather have the metal, and
the ability to carry another paddler occasionally, or a lot of camping
gear would be a plus.
The closest paddle for me is Lake Ontario, hence added freeboard and
stability would provide more peace of mind.


I'm a bad person to ask about solo paddling. I thought I would be doing that
sometimes, and did buy the solo seat kit, but, have never taken it out by
myself. I get relatively few chances to go paddling and so far they've all
been joint ventures, the three seasons I've had it. Frankly, I'd consider it
a bit of a barge to paddle solo, which is why I keep liking to imagine
there's a Kahuna in my future. I'm sure it works, and of course the
potential payload would be tremendous. But at this point I have little
interest going out in it by myself, because I'd always be thinking how far
from an optimal single-person craft it would be. My paddling location is the
Hudson River so I'm usually wanting to cover some distance, even more so if
I were by myself.

Unless you really want the two-person capability, sailing, or payload, I'd
think a Kodiak or Yukon would be a better choice. The plastic crossframes
would not concern me at all, they are plenty strong enough for their
intended purpose. I think the main advantages of the new aluminum tube
versions are some minor weight savings and a bit larger inside perimeter.

Mike

I still trying to figure out what the fuzz is all about.
How's the bad guy? Feathercraft, MEC, or somebodyelse?

So MEC had one left in stock for mail order, (or was it Feathercraft)?
It's the last one, so what? If it is OK? MEC often buys stuff once a year on bulk to
get good pricing (but I guess boats are not in that category -just to expensive to
stock them).

The local MEC store had none in stock, that's easy to understand given the price and
demand in such a product.

So why not mail-order, since their price seems OK and competitive to the Feathercraft
price. It's not unusual that dealers are able to sell below manufacturers direct
pricing. Makes sense, than manufacturers don't want to compete with their dealers,
otherwise they would not have them for long.

Based on language and attitude in the first message I don't want to know how the
conversation in the store went. I found MEC staff so far very cooperative and
helpful, in the store and on the phone.

My 0..02 $

Ulli

"back40" wrote in message
...

If I find it is a handful when paddling solo, I can always place an ad
in the personals - "Wife wanted, must have own paddle."


And that's not a bad thing either

See you on the forum.

Webkatz