GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition to its trawler-style Heritage Series in
Summer 2008. The Grand Banks
41 Heritage EU displays the same timeless lines and distinctive
"Europa" styling that have made
earlier models popular around the world for decades. But innovative
approaches to design,
production, and on-board technology make the 41EU a standout among its
GB predecessors and
new competitors alike.

The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006. The twin
Zeus pods, mounted in tunnels in the hull, are steerable and use
independent vectoring for
dramatically improved high-speed handling and easier docking. Cruising
speeds with twin
Cummins QSB5.9 diesels are estimated at 14 to 16 knots, with estimated
top speeds of 22 to 24
knots based on engine size.

The Zeus pod system provides two other important benefits: greater
fuel efficiency - with an
estimated 30% increased fuel economy at a higher cruising speed - and
more living space, with
the pods requiring less area devoted to the engine room than
traditional shaft drive systems.

"We have devoted considerable time and research to making the new 41EU
a top performer in all
respects, from handling and speed and fuel economy, to reliability and
seaworthiness, style and
comfort," Said Rob Livingston, President of Grand Banks Yachts. "We
were very impressed by
the Zeus drive, Cummins' Quantum engine technology, and their approach
to systems
integration. It opened up all kinds of opportunities to make this an
ideal boat for both new and
current GB owners."

Featuring an advanced joystick control system, Zeus also delivers
precise turning and closequarters
maneuvering, with a unique station-keeping feature that uses GPS
technology to keep
the 41EU firmly in place. It also maintains a fixed heading within a
tight area, even in strong
currents.

The 41 Heritage EU will be the first boat of her kind to utilize the
new Zeus system.

Grand Banks Yachts is bringing other advancements to the design and
construction of the 41EU.
Three different modified deep-V hull forms were exhaustively tank-
tested to optimize the design
for efficiency at both high and low speeds. The lines of the deckhouse
add contemporary
nuances to the iconic GB profile. And interior layouts continue the
company's recent trend toward
a more sophisticated, stylish living spaces.

Not to be overlooked, the new model's 41-foot size is itself of
notable importance. Since the
retirement of the best-selling 42 Heritage model in 2005, demand for a
new Grand Banks
Heritage Series model in the 40-foot range has grown strong among
consumers worldwide.

"Boaters will be amazed and impressed by what we have been able to
accomplish in a 41-foot
vessel," said Livingston. "With less space required for the engine
room, accommodations and
living areas are what you would expect from a much larger boat. There
really is nothing else like it
in her size."

Grand Banks will promote the 41EU throughout the fall boat show
season, and provide many
opportunities for interested boaters to learn more about this ground-
breaking new model before
its launch in Summer 2008.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition

The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.


Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.


Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?


You mean posting the item in its entirety is worse than posting an
edited version of an item and being caught doing so?

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

BAR wrote:
HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.


Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that
idiotic forward facing prop system?


You mean posting the item in its entirety is worse than posting an
edited version of an item and being caught doing so?

I forgot to say being caught over and over.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.


Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?


Wow, the audacity of someone who uses a post in rec.boats to cut and
paste a boating related PR release.

He could have just as easily cut and pasted a political news article
that everyone can read on any news site.

What was Chuck thinking! If he keeps that up someone might actually
comment on one of his PR releases and then a damn boating discussion
might result. I know you hate it when rec.boats becomes cluttered with
damn boating discussions.

What was he thinking of.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition

The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.

Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

Relax, Harry.

This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.

No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently. Because
the thrust can be directed, there is no need for a rudder- just like
an outboard or an I/O. Lack of the drag associated with a rudder helps
improve speed and efficiency. Because each drive pod vectors
independently, there are some fancy new tricks that can be utilized
for bringing a boat to the dock. You could literally steer the boat
with a joystick, select an angle and the boat will go in that
direction.

Zeus drives can be electronically coupled to a GPS and used for anchor
watch. Want to stay put in exactly the same spot, without drifiting
with wind or current? The Zeus drives will monitor the GPS readings
and keep the boat in the originally requested position.

Commercial vessels have used this sort of drive for a long time. The
cuirse ship we took to AK last June had either 5 or 7 of these drive
units (don't recall which) and was steered by a joystick. Of course
the
pods were many multiples larger and heavier than will be used on the
2008 GB.

Sorry to disrupt your world. When I decide to post about gluing a rod
holder to a styrofoam ice chest, I'm sure that will meet with your
approval (although I could give a ratz arse either way).

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Aug 28, 6:25 am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition

The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.

Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

No, the Zues drive faces to the rear.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"HK" wrote in message
. ..
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand
Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.


Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?


Transom envy?

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

Relax, Harry.

This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.

No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently.


That's the plastic boat I want, the one with two huge chunks of metal
full of gears and complicated machinery hanging down from the bottom,
where you can't see any part of it. Now, on a steel-hulled displacement
boat built to commercial standards, and where divers and competent
maintenance is available at shipyards, and where money is no real
object, well, maybe.

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

capt.bill11 wrote:
On Aug 28, 6:25 am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

No, the Zues drive faces to the rear.


Yeah, just read that. That's what I want...a huge complicated drive
hanging off the bottom of a plastic boat.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 14:35:07 GMT, "Rom" wrote:


"HK" wrote in message
...
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand
Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.

Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

Transom envy?

~~ snerk ~~

Good one.

For the record, I don't have a dog in this fight - I just appreciate a
funny line. :)

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Aug 28, 7:42?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

Relax, Harry.

This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.

No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently.

That's the plastic boat I want, the one with two huge chunks of metal
full of gears and complicated machinery hanging down from the bottom,
where you can't see any part of it. Now, on a steel-hulled displacement
boat built to commercial standards, and where divers and competent
maintenance is available at shipyards, and where money is no real
object, well, maybe.

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know you're not really familiar with the architecture of anything
larger than your fishing skiff, but if you would read before you react
you would learn from the press release that the props and pods are
protected in two different ways. First, there is a skeg on each that
should prevent serious damage from a soft grounding. Second, pods
mount in prop tunnels, additionally reducing the amount of exposed
surface.

A couple of other things to know, that aren't included in the release:
Cummins *recommends* mounting the pods in tunnels or depressions so
the forward facing tips extend no deeper than the keel of the vessel-
and that will allow the keel to help protect the props. The skeg is
designed to sheer, if necessary.

Most twin engine inboards will have for more running gear exposed,
considering struts, shafts, etc, than is exposed with the Zeus pod.
When striking a swamped container, deadhead, etc at high speed with a
traditonal twin engine inboard there is a risk of taking out a strut
and opening a hole of maybe a square foot or more below the waterline.
(Mayday!) The Zeus pod, like Volvo's IPS, is designed to sheer cleanly
in the event of an extremely serious impact. You will lose your
$20,000 drive but maybe save your $2,000,000 boat.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 7:42?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?
Relax, Harry.
This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.
No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently.
That's the plastic boat I want, the one with two huge chunks of metal
full of gears and complicated machinery hanging down from the bottom,
where you can't see any part of it. Now, on a steel-hulled displacement
boat built to commercial standards, and where divers and competent
maintenance is available at shipyards, and where money is no real
object, well, maybe.

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know you're not really familiar with the architecture of anything
larger than your fishing skiff, but if you would read before you react
you would learn from the press release that the props and pods are
protected in two different ways. First, there is a skeg on each that
should prevent serious damage from a soft grounding. Second, pods
mount in prop tunnels, additionally reducing the amount of exposed
surface.


Yeah, Chuck, I know. I looked at a number of renderings and schematics
of "Zeus." Your problem here is that you actually believe these news
releases.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Aug 28, 8:35?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 7:42?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?
Relax, Harry.
This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.
No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently.
That's the plastic boat I want, the one with two huge chunks of metal
full of gears and complicated machinery hanging down from the bottom,
where you can't see any part of it. Now, on a steel-hulled displacement
boat built to commercial standards, and where divers and competent
maintenance is available at shipyards, and where money is no real
object, well, maybe.

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know you're not really familiar with the architecture of anything
larger than your fishing skiff, but if you would read before you react
you would learn from the press release that the props and pods are
protected in two different ways. First, there is a skeg on each that
should prevent serious damage from a soft grounding. Second, pods
mount in prop tunnels, additionally reducing the amount of exposed
surface.

Yeah, Chuck, I know. I looked at a number of renderings and schematics
of "Zeus." Your problem here is that you actually believe these news
releases.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes I do believe:

1. GB will use the Cummins Zeus drive on the 2008 41 Europa
2. Zeus drives are a rear-facing duo-prop pod system designed to be
mounted in a prop tunnel.
3. The engineers at Cummins considered the risk of grounding and
impact when designing the system.

Which of those ideas is untrue?

Cummins could save a lot of dough if they only knew.......they could
put you on staff for 50-times what you now make sitting around posting
to a couple of dozen newsgroups 24/7, (still wouldn't cost them a
dime) fire their mechanical engineers, and you'd be there to tell them
the "truth" about their crappy systems. :-)

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 8:35?am, HK wrote:

Yeah, Chuck, I know. I looked at a number of renderings and schematics
of "Zeus." Your problem here is that you actually believe these news
releases.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes I do believe:

1. GB will use the Cummins Zeus drive on the 2008 41 Europa
2. Zeus drives are a rear-facing duo-prop pod system designed to be
mounted in a prop tunnel.
3. The engineers at Cummins considered the risk of grounding and
impact when designing the system.

Which of those ideas is untrue?

Cummins could save a lot of dough if they only knew.......they could
put you on staff for 50-times what you now make sitting around posting
to a couple of dozen newsgroups 24/7, (still wouldn't cost them a
dime) fire their mechanical engineers, and you'd be there to tell them
the "truth" about their crappy systems. :-)



Yes, Chuck, I am sure the engineers "considered" the risk of grounding
and impact. They considered it and decided that their customers would be
the guinea pigs. After some of these units are sold, we may actually
read about a few "incidents" that result from these lower units in
"hard" groundings.

Hey, you're the same guy who touted the wonderful technological advances
at the Bayliner factory. Maybe you need a new nick here...how about
"Chopper Gun Chuck"?

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 11:35:41 -0400, HK wrote:

Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 7:42?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?
Relax, Harry.
This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.
No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently.
That's the plastic boat I want, the one with two huge chunks of metal
full of gears and complicated machinery hanging down from the bottom,
where you can't see any part of it. Now, on a steel-hulled displacement
boat built to commercial standards, and where divers and competent
maintenance is available at shipyards, and where money is no real
object, well, maybe.

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know you're not really familiar with the architecture of anything
larger than your fishing skiff, but if you would read before you react
you would learn from the press release that the props and pods are
protected in two different ways. First, there is a skeg on each that
should prevent serious damage from a soft grounding. Second, pods
mount in prop tunnels, additionally reducing the amount of exposed
surface.


Yeah, Chuck, I know. I looked at a number of renderings and schematics
of "Zeus." Your problem here is that you actually believe these news
releases.

Let's see...believe a news release or believe Harry. Hard choice....
especially given Harry's tremendous experience.
--
John H

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Aug 28, 9:02?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 8:35?am, HK wrote:
Yeah, Chuck, I know. I looked at a number of renderings and schematics
of "Zeus." Your problem here is that you actually believe these news
releases.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes I do believe:

1. GB will use the Cummins Zeus drive on the 2008 41 Europa
2. Zeus drives are a rear-facing duo-prop pod system designed to be
mounted in a prop tunnel.
3. The engineers at Cummins considered the risk of grounding and
impact when designing the system.

Which of those ideas is untrue?

Cummins could save a lot of dough if they only knew.......they could
put you on staff for 50-times what you now make sitting around posting
to a couple of dozen newsgroups 24/7, (still wouldn't cost them a
dime) fire their mechanical engineers, and you'd be there to tell them
the "truth" about their crappy systems. :-)

Yes, Chuck, I am sure the engineers "considered" the risk of grounding
and impact. They considered it and decided that their customers would be
the guinea pigs. After some of these units are sold, we may actually
read about a few "incidents" that result from these lower units in
"hard" groundings.

Hey, you're the same guy who touted the wonderful technological advances
at the Bayliner factory. Maybe you need a new nick here...how about
"Chopper Gun Chuck"?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So none of the ideas I "believe" are untrue, and you conclude by
calling names. Typical. And really, really, sad. You were a pretty
bright guy at one time. Now you can't even paticipate in a technical
discussion with any objectivity, but simply start the personal insults
and name calling in Round 1. What happened? Go glue your rod holder to
the ice chest, Harry.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 9:02?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 8:35?am, HK wrote:
Yeah, Chuck, I know. I looked at a number of renderings and schematics
of "Zeus." Your problem here is that you actually believe these news
releases.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Yes I do believe:
1. GB will use the Cummins Zeus drive on the 2008 41 Europa
2. Zeus drives are a rear-facing duo-prop pod system designed to be
mounted in a prop tunnel.
3. The engineers at Cummins considered the risk of grounding and
impact when designing the system.
Which of those ideas is untrue?
Cummins could save a lot of dough if they only knew.......they could
put you on staff for 50-times what you now make sitting around posting
to a couple of dozen newsgroups 24/7, (still wouldn't cost them a
dime) fire their mechanical engineers, and you'd be there to tell them
the "truth" about their crappy systems. :-)
Yes, Chuck, I am sure the engineers "considered" the risk of grounding
and impact. They considered it and decided that their customers would be
the guinea pigs. After some of these units are sold, we may actually
read about a few "incidents" that result from these lower units in
"hard" groundings.

Hey, you're the same guy who touted the wonderful technological advances
at the Bayliner factory. Maybe you need a new nick here...how about
"Chopper Gun Chuck"?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So none of the ideas I "believe" are untrue, and you conclude by
calling names. Typical. And really, really, sad. You were a pretty
bright guy at one time. Now you can't even paticipate in a technical
discussion with any objectivity, but simply start the personal insults
and name calling in Round 1. What happened? Go glue your rod holder to
the ice chest, Harry.


You're just sliding down that hill again, Chuck. Your goal, stated or
otherwise, is to promote anything and all things that might sell boats.
I have no ongoing business interests in the boating world. I think
hanging large appendages out of the bottom of a plastic pleasure boat is
inherently risky and certainly riskier than the typical inboard prop
shaft and rudder combo. A steel commercial vessel with watertight
compartments and bulkheads, well, that's different, eh?

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"HK" wrote in message
...


You're just sliding down that hill again, Chuck. Your goal, stated or
otherwise, is to promote anything and all things that might sell boats.
I have no ongoing business interests in the boating world. I think hanging
large appendages out of the bottom of a plastic pleasure boat is
inherently risky and certainly riskier than the typical inboard prop shaft
and rudder combo. A steel commercial vessel with watertight compartments
and bulkheads, well, that's different, eh?


Harry, you seem to be taking the position that the only safe type of engine
on a small pleasure boat is an outboard (probably run like I used to as a
kid ... with the latch disengaged so if you hit bottom or something, the
engine just pivoted up).

Nothing wrong with an outboard, if fact I'd prefer it to an I/O, but both
are not practical for some boats. I've seen a SeaRay with conventional twin
screws and rudders have the entire strut on one side ripped out of the hull
when it's prop picked up and wrapped a submerged 2" hawser. I also
recently saw a mangled mess of props, bent shafts and a hole almost 2 feet
long in a boat that got out of the channel in Wood's Hole and ran up on the
rocks.

Eisboch

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...

You're just sliding down that hill again, Chuck. Your goal, stated or
otherwise, is to promote anything and all things that might sell boats.
I have no ongoing business interests in the boating world. I think hanging
large appendages out of the bottom of a plastic pleasure boat is
inherently risky and certainly riskier than the typical inboard prop shaft
and rudder combo. A steel commercial vessel with watertight compartments
and bulkheads, well, that's different, eh?


Harry, you seem to be taking the position that the only safe type of engine
on a small pleasure boat is an outboard (probably run like I used to as a
kid ... with the latch disengaged so if you hit bottom or something, the
engine just pivoted up).

Nothing wrong with an outboard, if fact I'd prefer it to an I/O, but both
are not practical for some boats. I've seen a SeaRay with conventional twin
screws and rudders have the entire strut on one side ripped out of the hull
when it's prop picked up and wrapped a submerged 2" hawser. I also
recently saw a mangled mess of props, bent shafts and a hole almost 2 feet
long in a boat that got out of the channel in Wood's Hole and ran up on the
rocks.

Eisboch




No, that is not my position. Though on a *small* power pleasure boat
like mine, I don't believe inboards make much sense.

On straight inboard boats, I prefer the shafts and drives be at least
partially protected by a significant keel ahead of those appendages.
There are plenty of inboards with such bottom protection. But even bare
struts, shafts and props present less of an inviting target and probably
don't hang down as low as these new variations on I/O drives that come
through the bottom of the hull. Plus they are very complex, just the
sort of thing you need when "cruising" to faraway ports. Keep in mind
that commercial vessels with these sorts through the bottom propulsion
systems have access to maintenance and repair facilities not usually
available to "yachtsmen."

I've previously stated my feelings about I/O's. I think they are ok on
trailerboats that are under regular inspection by their owners when the
boats are regularly hauled out of the water. I've seen more than a
couple of I/O boats go down by the stern at marinas because their stern
gasket sprung a big leak.

If I were in the market for a 30-35 footer, diesel, I'd want to give
serious consideration to some of the newer, higher efficiency "jet"
drive boats. There's nothing much on the bottom of these boats but an
encased water inlet. Nothing hanging down there.

I mentioned that a local dealer recently sold a 36-foot Grady with three
250-hp outboards. Nice boat, but 750 outboard horsepower? Thanks, but no
thanks.

I have a brochure now on these Zeus drives. They remind me of an I/0 in
many ways, with the lower unit mounted "lower" than usual. It seems to
me that a jackshaft equipped I/O offers the same "advantages" without
all the horrific extra complexity. Of course, the largest diesel
jackshaft engine I've seen was only 380 shp.

As for the "fancy" electronic positioning Chuck was touting, it's really
not that big a deal.
As

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 14:34:52 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:

I also
recently saw a mangled mess of props, bent shafts and a hole almost 2 feet
long in a boat that got out of the channel in Wood's Hole and ran up on the
rocks.

Woods Hole can be one scary place when the current is ripping through
there. I have done a fair amount of boating over the years and still
regard it as one of the most dangerous places on the east coast.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 14:34:52 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:

I also
recently saw a mangled mess of props, bent shafts and a hole almost 2 feet
long in a boat that got out of the channel in Wood's Hole and ran up on the
rocks.

Woods Hole can be one scary place when the current is ripping through
there. I have done a fair amount of boating over the years and still
regard it as one of the most dangerous places on the east coast.

I watched a cruising trawler pushed onto the underwater sandbars of St.
Augustine inlet one fine summer day about 12 years ago. There was a
strong southerly wind, breaking surf in the inlet and an incoming tide.
The boat was hard aground, but I don't believe it suffered any serious
damage. Two power cruisers pulled it loose, and it putted along on its way.

That was the first and only time I ever saw a powerboat run aground
there. The channel itself is deep and well-marked, and the sandbars are
obvious. Typically, sailboats have a difficult time there because of the
winds, tides, and lack of engine power. We'd see several sailboats a
year bang onto the sandbars at that location from our vantage point on
the south side, adjacent to the stone jetty.

This inlet is the one around the corner from Salt Run in St. Augustine.

The year we moved, a shrimp trawler ran aground just outside the inlet,
heading south. It sank and became a dangerous derelict. The boat went
down about 50 yards offshore of the beginning of the nude beach.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.

And yet two years into deployment and there are no reported failures of the
IPS systems.

So much for luddites like you Harry.

Better efficiency, better manueverability and better engine room layout.
Sounds like a great idea.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On straight inboard boats, I prefer...

Prefer for what? Certainly not actual OWNERSHIP or operation. No, instead
it's just fodder for you to shoot your mouth off like some sort of hillbilly
on a porch.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

I think hanging large appendages out of the bottom of a plastic pleasure
boat is inherently risky

The bigger risk in plastic pleasure boats, as you so ignorantly put it,
isn't below the waterline. The operators are the bigger risk, regardless of
the propulsion system.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Aug 28, 12:01?pm, HK wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...

You're just sliding down that hill again, Chuck. Your goal, stated or
otherwise, is to promote anything and all things that might sell boats.
I have no ongoing business interests in the boating world. I think hanging
large appendages out of the bottom of a plastic pleasure boat is
inherently risky and certainly riskier than the typical inboard prop shaft
and rudder combo. A steel commercial vessel with watertight compartments
and bulkheads, well, that's different, eh?

Harry, you seem to be taking the position that the only safe type of engine
on a small pleasure boat is an outboard (probably run like I used to as a
kid ... with the latch disengaged so if you hit bottom or something, the
engine just pivoted up).

Nothing wrong with an outboard, if fact I'd prefer it to an I/O, but both
are not practical for some boats. I've seen a SeaRay with conventional twin
screws and rudders have the entire strut on one side ripped out of the hull
when it's prop picked up and wrapped a submerged 2" hawser. I also
recently saw a mangled mess of props, bent shafts and a hole almost 2 feet
long in a boat that got out of the channel in Wood's Hole and ran up on the
rocks.

Eisboch

No, that is not my position. Though on a *small* power pleasure boat
like mine, I don't believe inboards make much sense.

On straight inboard boats, I prefer the shafts and drives be at least
partially protected by a significant keel ahead of those appendages.
There are plenty of inboards with such bottom protection. But even bare
struts, shafts and props present less of an inviting target and probably
don't hang down as low as these new variations on I/O drives that come
through the bottom of the hull. Plus they are very complex, just the
sort of thing you need when "cruising" to faraway ports.

You have a point on the complexity issue. Otherwise you are
enunciating through your fedora, especially when it comes to
protection.

The entire keel and the foreward sections of the hull protrude
substantially deeper than the Zeus drives on the 41 GB. Visualize a
semi displacement hull, instead of a planing hull, and you may be able
to appreciate why the Zeus drives are not unduly exposed. The total
surface exposure is much less than with traditional exposed shafts and
struts, and a serious wack may be substantially less likely to sink
the boat.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"HK" wrote in message
...
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Aug 28, 3:25?am, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
Grand Banks Yachts today announced plans to release an
extraordinary new addition
The two-stateroom 41EU will be the first Grand Banks to utilize the
Zeus Propulsion System from
Cummins MerCruiser Diesel, a revolutionary new propulsion system
launched in 2006.
Wow...reposting of an entire commercial PR release. Is this that idiotic
forward facing prop system?

Relax, Harry.

This doesn't concern you- it's something that people who actually use
a boat or may be buying an inboard boat in the future might find
interesting.

No, it has nothing to do with the Volvo IPS system. (Which is far from
idiotic). Zeus drives face aft. They incorporate counter rotating
props, and each of the two pods can be vectored independently.


That's the plastic boat I want, the one with two huge chunks of metal full
of gears and complicated machinery hanging down from the bottom, where you
can't see any part of it. Now, on a steel-hulled displacement boat built
to commercial standards, and where divers and competent maintenance is
available at shipyards, and where money is no real object, well, maybe.

It's one thing to ding the bottom or even a reef with a standard
inboard...you might get get away unscathed, or you might damage a prop
blade or, well, sure, worse things can happen. But the kinds of repair
bills "Zeus" will enable...whoooo-hoooooo.

For someone not smart enough to reduce tire pressure to prevent an empty
trailer from bouncing you sure knows alot about enginimeering.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 17:50:40 -0400, HK wrote:

I watched a cruising trawler pushed onto the underwater sandbars of St.
Augustine inlet one fine summer day about 12 years ago. There was a
strong southerly wind, breaking surf in the inlet and an incoming tide.
The boat was hard aground, but I don't believe it suffered any serious
damage. Two power cruisers pulled it loose, and it putted along on its way.

Inlets can be nasty, no question.

Woods Hole has got many different dimensions to it however: Ferrocious
currents, confusing buoy layout, nasty rocks right in the middle of a
channel fork, small boats fishing in the middle of the maelstrom,
split second decisions to be made, large commercial traffic to be
dodged, etc. It's not a good place to be in poor visibility but there
is also a fair amount of fog in the area.

The shipyards around there, particularly in New Bedford/Fairhaven,
make a good living patching up the ensuing wrecks. No one is immune
it seems. Last time we were in New Bedford there was a 120 ft mega
yacht side by side with a 40 something steel hulled sail boat. Both
had a big gash in the side.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"Rom" wrote in message news:OO4Bi.81$ih.1@trnddc01...

For someone not smart enough to reduce tire pressure to prevent an empty
trailer from bouncing *you sure knows alot* about enginimeering.


I hope he knows more than you about the Queen's English.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

Don White wrote:
"Rom" wrote in message news:OO4Bi.81$ih.1@trnddc01...
For someone not smart enough to reduce tire pressure to prevent an empty
trailer from bouncing *you sure knows alot* about enginimeering.


I hope he knows more than you about the Queen's English.



He also doesn't know that before I left the trailer dealer's, he lowered
the air pressure on all four times from 50 psi to 30 psi. It wasn't the
tire pressure, it was the crappy state of the Interstate highway between
I-64 in Norfolk and where the the long and much newer connected to I-95
began. I-95 is also in terrible condition between Springfield and
Richmond, Virginia, but I wasn't on I-95 for long...just long enough to
pick up the connector to 301, a much older road that is properly
maintained.

But, as ROM has shown here, he's just another rec.boats dickwad.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"HK" wrote in message
...
Don White wrote:
"Rom" wrote in message news:OO4Bi.81$ih.1@trnddc01...
For someone not smart enough to reduce tire pressure to prevent an empty
trailer from bouncing *you sure knows alot* about enginimeering.


I hope he knows more than you about the Queen's English.

He also doesn't know that before I left the trailer dealer's, he lowered
the air pressure on all four times from 50 psi to 30 psi. It wasn't the
tire pressure, it was the crappy state of the Interstate highway between
I-64 in Norfolk and where the the long and much newer connected to I-95
began. I-95 is also in terrible condition between Springfield and
Richmond, Virginia, but I wasn't on I-95 for long...just long enough to
pick up the connector to 301, a much older road that is properly
maintained.

But, as ROM has shown here, he's just another rec.boats dickwad.



30psi is not low enough.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"Don White" wrote in message
...

"Rom" wrote in message news:OO4Bi.81$ih.1@trnddc01...

For someone not smart enough to reduce tire pressure to prevent an empty
trailer from bouncing *you sure knows alot* about enginimeering.


I hope he knows more than you about the Queen's English.

Woooosh

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Aug 28, 12:01?pm, HK wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"HK" wrote in message
...

You're just sliding down that hill again, Chuck. Your goal, stated or
otherwise, is to promote anything and all things that might sell
boats.
I have no ongoing business interests in the boating world. I think
hanging
large appendages out of the bottom of a plastic pleasure boat is
inherently risky and certainly riskier than the typical inboard prop
shaft
and rudder combo. A steel commercial vessel with watertight
compartments
and bulkheads, well, that's different, eh?

Harry, you seem to be taking the position that the only safe type of
engine
on a small pleasure boat is an outboard (probably run like I used to as
a
kid ... with the latch disengaged so if you hit bottom or something,
the
engine just pivoted up).

Nothing wrong with an outboard, if fact I'd prefer it to an I/O, but
both
are not practical for some boats. I've seen a SeaRay with conventional
twin
screws and rudders have the entire strut on one side ripped out of the
hull
when it's prop picked up and wrapped a submerged 2" hawser. I also
recently saw a mangled mess of props, bent shafts and a hole almost 2
feet
long in a boat that got out of the channel in Wood's Hole and ran up on
the
rocks.

Eisboch

No, that is not my position. Though on a *small* power pleasure boat
like mine, I don't believe inboards make much sense.

On straight inboard boats, I prefer the shafts and drives be at least
partially protected by a significant keel ahead of those appendages.
There are plenty of inboards with such bottom protection. But even bare
struts, shafts and props present less of an inviting target and probably
don't hang down as low as these new variations on I/O drives that come
through the bottom of the hull. Plus they are very complex, just the
sort of thing you need when "cruising" to faraway ports.

You have a point on the complexity issue. Otherwise you are
enunciating through your fedora, especially when it comes to
protection.

The entire keel and the foreward sections of the hull protrude
substantially deeper than the Zeus drives on the 41 GB. Visualize a
semi displacement hull, instead of a planing hull, and you may be able
to appreciate why the Zeus drives are not unduly exposed. The total
surface exposure is much less than with traditional exposed shafts and
struts, and a serious wack may be substantially less likely to sink
the boat.



Only sinking boat I was ever on, was a 43' inboard, wooden boat, and wrapped
a cable in the propeller. Ripped the strut loose, and so we proceded to
have a bucket brigade bailing until the CG got there to tow us in.

GB going to Zeus drives (pods) on a new 2008 model
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...


Woods Hole can be one scary place when the current is ripping through
there. I have done a fair amount of boating over the years and still
regard it as one of the most dangerous places on the east coast.

My first time through Woods Hole (on the way to the Vineyard) was a tense
passage, mainly due to all the horror stories I had heard. That was on the
Navigator. I haven't been through on the GB yet and if and when I do, I'll
be very picky about timing the passage with regard to the tide and current.
The Navigator has the power you need. The GB doesn't.

Another dangerous inlet, in my opinion, is Jupiter Inlet in Florida. Fetch
can build some rough water as you approach and the "channel" is constantly
shifting due to storms.

Eisboch