Dennis, you might be able to find some type of infoto compare the two,
he

http://www.boattest.com/index.aspx




wrote:
We have decided that our small bowrider does not suit us well on Grand
Lake in Oklahoma, so we have decided that a 26-28' cruiser will work
fien for our lifestyle. I have narrowed it down to used units from
either Sea Ray or Rinker both boats we are looking at have the 7.4 w/
B3-the Sea Ray is a 1998 with 800 + hours and the Rinker is a 1999
with about 400 hours. Now I realize that care and maintenance are a
very big factor on top of the hours, so what I am looking for is some
thoughts on these 2 vessels and any experiences you may have had-good
or bad.

Thanks,

Dennis

On Mar 12, 1:00�pm, "JimH" wrote:


I am not familiar with the quality of Rinker boats. *That is why I asked him
to compare hardware and fittings to see how it compares to the Sea Ray. *For
all I know it *may* meet or exceed Sea Ray's "quality".........with BTW
became an urban legend shortly after Brunswick purchased them.- Hide quoted text -


(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).

"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall. The
quality also went into the dumper at that same time.

JimH wrote:
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall. The
quality also went into the dumper at that same time.



I had never heard that SeaRay's quality went into the dumper. I had
always thought of SeaRay as a mid range boat and had never heard the
"Bayliner" horror stores. I mean it would be funny if someone said "OK,
this blond pulled up in a SeaRay and said she could not get the boat on
plane..... " It is funny that SeaRay's quality went into the dumper
just about the same time Bayliner's quality want from being in the
dumper to them making a decent entry level boat. I guess Brunswick
couldn't afford to make two good boats so they decided to put a major
effort to rebuild the Bayliner brand by destroying the SeaRay brand.

Yeah, that's the ticket.

"JimH" wrote in message
...

"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall.
The quality also went into the dumper at that same time.


BTW: David Pascoe seems to agree. A local surveyor with a great reputation
(he surveyed 3 of my boats and is a buyers surveyor) also agrees that they
are over rated and over priced..

Some food for thought:

http://www.docksidereports.com/boatr..._sundancer.htm

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/boatrevie...dancer_290.htm

While Pascoe is not God, he does show some serious production flaws in
fairly high priced boats. But I guess the gold chain wearing crowd with
small private parts think they are being admired when they cruise the water
in their Sea Ray as image is everything to some. ;-)

JimH wrote:
"JimH" wrote in message
...
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall.
The quality also went into the dumper at that same time.


BTW: David Pascoe seems to agree. A local surveyor with a great reputation
(he surveyed 3 of my boats and is a buyers surveyor) also agrees that they
are over rated and over priced..

Some food for thought:

http://www.docksidereports.com/boatr..._sundancer.htm

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/boatrevie...dancer_290.htm

While Pascoe is not God, he does show some serious production flaws in
fairly high priced boats. But I guess the gold chain wearing crowd with
small private parts think they are being admired when they cruise the water
in their Sea Ray as image is everything to some. ;-)



Did you read the article?

Summing up: On the outside, the overall quality is pretty good. Not much
chintzy hardware, and the basic structures are holding up well. With
care, it still looks good. The rub rails aren't all loose, dented and
falling off, and stress cracking is minimal. As a used boat, it offers
excellent value. As a new boat, they're still hard to beat quality wise,
but the quality margin over the competition can be a pretty thin line at
times.

JimH wrote:
"JimH" wrote in message
...
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall.
The quality also went into the dumper at that same time.


BTW: David Pascoe seems to agree. A local surveyor with a great reputation
(he surveyed 3 of my boats and is a buyers surveyor) also agrees that they
are over rated and over priced..

Some food for thought:

http://www.docksidereports.com/boatr..._sundancer.htm

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/boatrevie...dancer_290.htm

While Pascoe is not God, he does show some serious production flaws in
fairly high priced boats. But I guess the gold chain wearing crowd with
small private parts think they are being admired when they cruise the water
in their Sea Ray as image is everything to some. ;-)



Most of the big Sea Rays I see are dock queens.

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
JimH wrote:
"JimH" wrote in message
...
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall.
The quality also went into the dumper at that same time.


BTW: David Pascoe seems to agree. A local surveyor with a great
reputation (he surveyed 3 of my boats and is a buyers surveyor) also
agrees that they are over rated and over priced..

Some food for thought:

http://www.docksidereports.com/boatr..._sundancer.htm

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/boatrevie...dancer_290.htm

While Pascoe is not God, he does show some serious production flaws in
fairly high priced boats. But I guess the gold chain wearing crowd with
small private parts think they are being admired when they cruise the
water in their Sea Ray as image is everything to some. ;-)

Most of the big Sea Rays I see are dock queens.

Regardless of size, Sea Ray boats are not at the Mercedes Benz class
standards as Chuck was previously referring to.

Anyone thinking that SR quality did not take a nose dive shortly after
Brunswick purchased them knows nothing about boats.

JimH wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
JimH wrote:
"JimH" wrote in message
...
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:



(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).


Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall.
The quality also went into the dumper at that same time.

BTW: David Pascoe seems to agree. A local surveyor with a great
reputation (he surveyed 3 of my boats and is a buyers surveyor) also
agrees that they are over rated and over priced..

Some food for thought:

http://www.docksidereports.com/boatr..._sundancer.htm

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/boatrevie...dancer_290.htm

While Pascoe is not God, he does show some serious production flaws in
fairly high priced boats. But I guess the gold chain wearing crowd with
small private parts think they are being admired when they cruise the
water in their Sea Ray as image is everything to some. ;-)
Most of the big Sea Rays I see are dock queens.

Regardless of size, Sea Ray boats are not at the Mercedes Benz class
standards as Chuck was previously referring to.

Anyone thinking that SR quality did not take a nose dive shortly after
Brunswick purchased them knows nothing about boats.



JimH,

You need to talk to your surveyor, David Pascoe, he seems to disagree
with your appraisal of SeaRay going down the crapper.

His comments concerning a 1995 SeaRay include: Many of our readers
think that we knock Sea Ray too hard. Some ask questions like, "You
don't like Sea Rays very much, do you?" Actually, compared to the
competition, we like them just fine, albeit with some serious nitpicking.

However, being the largest selling boat builder in the world, and
although their boats have a reasonably well-deserved reputation for
quality we've long felt that, for the price, there was plenty of room
for improvement

On Mar 12, 5:31�pm, "JimH" wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message

...





JimH wrote:
"JimH" wrote in message
. ..
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
groups.com...
On Mar 12, 1:00?pm, "JimH" wrote:

(Brunswick bought Sea Ray in 1986).

Yep, and they did not influence designs until 1989 or 1990 if I recall.
The quality also went into the dumper at that same time.

BTW: *David Pascoe seems to agree. *A local surveyor with a great
reputation (he surveyed 3 of my boats and is a buyers surveyor) also
agrees that they are over rated and over priced..

Some food for thought:

http://www.docksidereports.com/boatr..._sundancer.htm

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/boatrevie...dancer_290.htm

While Pascoe is not God, he does show some serious production flaws in
fairly high priced boats. *But I guess the gold chain wearing crowd with
small private parts think they are being admired when they cruise the
water in their Sea Ray as image is everything to some. * ;-)

Most of the big Sea Rays I see are dock queens.

Regardless of size, Sea Ray boats are not at the Mercedes Benz class
standards as Chuck was previously referring to.


I think you overrate Mercedes.


Anyone thinking that SR quality did not take a nose dive shortly after
Brunswick purchased them knows nothing about boats.- Hide quoted text -


Among mass-pro boats turned out in high numbers for a broad market,
Sea Ray is a top tier product. There are some boats that compete, but
among mass-pro boats turned out in high numbers for a broad market
there are none that are clearly better over such a wide spectrum; from
runabouts to 60-footers. There are better "niche" boats in some
categories, yes. There are also some mass-pro boats that compete
pretty well in the general quality category that people will choose
for subjective reasons.

About half the "Sea Ray has gone to hell" stuff that circulated for a
while was spawned by the competition. Joe Boater drops by the BRAND X
dealership, says he's looking for a boat, and that he has just come
from the Sea Ray store. A poor salesperson (the norm, unfotunately)
might respond with "Oh, you mean you've been looking at an overpriced
Bayliner! See this magazine article? Sea Ray doesn't even exist
anymore, they were bought out by Bayliner last year! Everybody knows
that Bayliner is going to ruin the product and that they just bought
the company for the name. Bayliner is getting such a bad reputation
that pretty soon nobody will buy a Bayliner either new or used, so the
plan is to turn out Bayliner boats with the Sea Ray name on them and
see how many people can be fooled into buying one."

There's little doubt that Brunswick changed a few things about Sea
Ray, but only because Brunswick is the parent company of more
competitively priced Bayliner did so many people just assume that all
the changes were bad. If Connie Ray hadn't sold out to Brunswick, the
entire brand would have disappeared. "Extinct" is not a better
boat. :-)

Heck, even our own Harry Krause, not the world's biggest fan of
Bayliner, has owned a Brunswick product, (he once had a Sea Pro).
Owners of Boston Whaler, Hatteras, and other premium Brunswick
trademarks probably don't feel like they have a POS vessel simply
because Brunswick also builds some boats designed to sell for less.

When David Pascoe takes some of the known baloney off his site,
(backyard bondo repairs represented as OEM layup, total misinformation
about diesel theory, etc), he will be taken more seriously by the
boating community at large.