How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it. While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family, but would love to venture to deeper waters to do
some fishing with my freinds.

Now I know prior to making any excursion that is outside a somewhat
controlled environemnt (i.e. Hudson river), I really have to get
comfortable with the boat and know how it handles, as well as how I
can handle it. The boat is pretty loaded with VHF, Compass, GPS/
Sounder, and your common safety equipment. So if I can maybe gather
some opinions to the following it would be greatly appreciated.

- How far offshore is reasonable in this style, size, and equipped
boat?

- What else should I consider getting to ensure any offshore trip
would be a safe one?

- Are there any places or clubs to meet up with other boaters heading
out to the hot fishing spots that might allow someone less experienced
to follow them out? (This would offer a level of safety that if
something did go wrong there are other boats in the area)

Thanks in advance. I am excited to get in the water, the waiting is
killing me. I assume if your reading this newsgroup in February you
are also as eager to see the thermometor tip some warmer numbers.

MJK

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"King5899" wrote in message
oups.com...


- How far offshore is reasonable in this style, size, and equipped
boat?


It all depends on the weather, wind and sea state. I've crossed Cape Cod Bay
in a 16' Boston Whaler. (stupid). I've also had a few unplanned, white
knuckled fishing adventures in a 36' Egg Harbor.


- What else should I consider getting to ensure any offshore trip
would be a safe one?

IMO?

1. Radar.

I don't think anyone is experienced until they encounter their first
offshore venture when suddenly, out of nowhere, a fog develops that limits
your visibility to 5 feet beyond the bow.

2. GPS-Equipped Emergency Locator Beacon.

3. Life raft.

4. Learn traditional navigation. Don't assume your GPS is going to always
work.


My other personal requirement for offshore boating is a boat with twin
engines. Many disagree.


- Are there any places or clubs to meet up with other boaters heading
out to the hot fishing spots that might allow someone less experienced
to follow them out? (This would offer a level of safety that if
something did go wrong there are other boats in the area)

Around here most serious fishing buffs are rather territorial and secretive
regarding their favorite "hot spots", but it's still a good idea to fish in
the general vicinity of other boats. Meet and make some fishing friends.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 7, 10:30 pm, "King5899" wrote:

~~ snip ~~

- How far offshore is reasonable in this style, size, and equipped
boat?

Depends on weather. As Eisboch, when I was younger, it was
nothing to take a 13 foot Boston Whaler sport out to Halfway
Rock off Marblehead or even out further on a good day.

However, you have some limitations - like fuel milage. That
5.7 is going to suck some gas along the way, so that's a
consideration. I wouldn't try it until I know what I can expect
for gallons per hour at cruise and know it cold in varying
conditions.

"Reasonable" is a personal concept. I wouldn't do it unless
the weather was perfect and I had a boat going with me just
in case - in particular with a single engine 25 foot boat.

Things can get snarky in a hurry 15/20 miles out and in
a smaller boat, it can be flat out dangerous. That area
of the North Atlantic is a very interesting place and one
I wouldn't want to screw around with in a small boat.

- What else should I consider getting to ensure any offshore trip
would be a safe one?

You can't "ensure" that any offshore trip will be a safe one - there
are too many weather variables, too many possibilities. You
can only limit the possibilities.

I'll second Eisboch on the safety equipment and on the radar -
essential for offshore running.

The only other items I'd add to Eisboch's list is a kicker engine of
some type and I'd make sure I had an up to date tow package
with Sea//Tow, Safe Sea, Boat US or the franchise of your
choice. Tows can be expensive.

I'd also add that a advanced navigation course would be in
order.

And a decent radar reflector for those situation where you
can't see the bow from cockpit. :)

- Are there any places or clubs to meet up with other boaters heading
out to the hot fishing spots that might allow someone less experienced
to follow them out? (This would offer a level of safety that if
something did go wrong there are other boats in the area)

Yes, although for offshore fishing, it's better to charter with
an experienced captain and pick his/her brains about the
various techniques used to catch fish. Offshore fishing is
considerably different than inshore and you can spend a lot
of time, money and effort with little to show for it at the end
of the day. You will actually save money in the long run
by chartering a trip rather than beating the hell out of your
25 footer.

Lastly, my opinon is that if you are serious about offshore
fishing, in particular to places like the Mud Hole, get a bigger
boat. There is a "mosquito" fleet what hits that area every
tuna run - basically boats like yours that tow bladders filled
with gas that allows you to stay out longer.

The size of your boat is going to be an issue if you take one
or two guys along with you - in particular if you do manage
to hook up with a tuna.

Thanks in advance. I am excited to get in the water, the waiting is
killing me. I assume if your reading this newsgroup in February you
are also as eager to see the thermometor tip some warmer numbers.

Have fun and be carefull.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it. While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 8, 9:04 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it. While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway. Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On 8 Feb 2007 07:52:58 -0800, "Short Wave Sportfishing"
wrote:

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway. Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.

Especially when you are upside down with people in the water.

People who are moving up from smaller boats tend to think of a 25
footer as being large. I used to, because most of my time on the
water as a kid was spent in 14 to 17 ft runabouts.

However even with our new SeaRay 270 it is still pretty easy to get
beat up on open water. We were out on the Gulf of Mexico two weeks
ago with just a moderate 12 kt breeze, and that was plenty. Not
dangerous by any means, but rough enough to require a substantial
speed reduction.

Now if I still had my old Bertram 33, it would have been damn the
torpedoes...

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 8, 2:28�am, "RCE" wrote:


My other personal requirement for offshore boating is a boat with twin
engines. *Many disagree.

I think twins are important if you are a gas boat. Less important for
a diesel. Once you get a diesel started it will run until you shut it
off unless it overheats (entirely preventable) or is denied
combustible fuel. (Fuel problems tend to affect both engines, so twins
are less of an issue from that perspective). Witness- nearly every
commercial fishing boat ever built; offshore for sometimes a couple of
weeks and running with a single diesel. May be less true than before,
with all of the intricate comptuerization now incorporated into a
modern diesel- but I suspect in most cases a diesel would continue to
run if the electronics crapped out- just wouldn't run very well.

And of course, don't leave the dock without a VHF and a decent
antenna.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Feb 8, 2:28?am, "RCE" wrote:


My other personal requirement for offshore boating is a boat with twin
engines. Many disagree.

I think twins are important if you are a gas boat. Less important for
a diesel. Once you get a diesel started it will run until you shut it
off unless it overheats (entirely preventable) or is denied
combustible fuel. (Fuel problems tend to affect both engines, so twins
are less of an issue from that perspective). Witness- nearly every
commercial fishing boat ever built; offshore for sometimes a couple of
weeks and running with a single diesel. May be less true than before,
with all of the intricate comptuerization now incorporated into a
modern diesel- but I suspect in most cases a diesel would continue to
run if the electronics crapped out- just wouldn't run very well.

And of course, don't leave the dock without a VHF and a decent
antenna.


I agree with your point of diesel vs gas although modern diesels are
increasingly reliant on electronics to run. There are, however, other
propulsion system failures or accidents that could leave you dead in the
water while doing offshore cruising and/or fishing. IMO being dead in the
water, 30 or 40 miles from land in rough seas is second only to fire in
terms of danger.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Feb 8, 9:04 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it. While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway. Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.


Do new boaters still get all nervous about passing through Plum Gut on a
quiet day, or don't you get out that way at all?

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 8, 1:36 pm, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in ooglegroups.com...





On Feb 8, 9:04 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it. While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway. Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.

Do new boaters still get all nervous about passing through Plum Gut on a
quiet day, or don't you get out that way at all?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes, new boaters are nervous about the Plum Gut
and I go there all the time. It's a hop, skip and a jump
from the Stonington launch ramp at Barn Island.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Feb 8, 1:36 pm, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
ooglegroups.com...





On Feb 8, 9:04 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it.
While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway. Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.

Do new boaters still get all nervous about passing through Plum Gut on a
quiet day, or don't you get out that way at all?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes, new boaters are nervous about the Plum Gut
and I go there all the time. It's a hop, skip and a jump
from the Stonington launch ramp at Barn Island.


My sister considered it to be like an amusement park ride. But, she was not
the owner of the boat. :-)

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 8, 12:13 pm, "RCE" wrote:

I agree with your point of diesel vs gas although modern diesels are
increasingly reliant on electronics to run. There are, however, other
propulsion system failures or accidents that could leave you dead in the
water while doing offshore cruising and/or fishing. IMO being dead in the
water, 30 or 40 miles from land in rough seas is second only to fire in
terms of danger.

Hooking up with a decent sized mako and having it jump
into the boat is one that I've actually witnessed.

Funniest "accident" I've ever seen. The fish was
flopping around the stern and three guys hanging
onto the top of the console and the T-Top.

I know a guy who had the prop shaft supports ripped out
the bottom of his boat by a whale that came out of
nowhere - hit the stern and everything went bye-bye.

Fortunately, it didn't sink - some quick thinking bystanders
came to the guys rescue with some tarps, the CG sent
a pump and two bigger boats came alongside and limped
the owners boat in until Sea//Tow could get to it.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
ups.com...

I know a guy who had the prop shaft supports ripped out
the bottom of his boat by a whale that came out of
nowhere - hit the stern and everything went bye-bye.



We met up with some guys in a big Sea Ray on the voyage to Florida and did
some partying at the marina we stopped at. The next day (nursing hangovers)
we elected to stay on the ICW and they decided to run off-shore.

They ended up wrapping a submerged chunk of 2" hawser on one of their shafts
and ripped the cutlass bearing mounting plate right out of the hull.
Fortunately they were able to stuff the hole enough and maintain headway on
the other engine until the Coast Guard arrived.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 8, 2:21 pm, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in oglegroups.com...





On Feb 8, 1:36 pm, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
ooglegroups.com...

On Feb 8, 9:04 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it.
While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway. Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.

Do new boaters still get all nervous about passing through Plum Gut on a
quiet day, or don't you get out that way at all?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes, new boaters are nervous about the Plum Gut
and I go there all the time. It's a hop, skip and a jump
from the Stonington launch ramp at Barn Island.

My sister considered it to be like an amusement park ride. But, she was not
the owner of the boat. :-)- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know boaters who think running the East Passage of
Narraganset Bay in a SW wind seas 4 to 6 as fun.

While I've done it, I didn't consider it fun.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Feb 8, 2:21 pm, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
oglegroups.com...





On Feb 8, 1:36 pm, "JoeSpareBedroom" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
ooglegroups.com...

On Feb 8, 9:04 am, Wayne.B wrote:
On 7 Feb 2007 20:30:55 -0800, "King5899" wrote:

I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo
III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine
survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it.
While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm
up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I
have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family,

The Sundancer 250 is a good river and bay boat but you will soon
discover that it has its limitations there also. It was not
designed
as an off shore boat so it is severly weather limited for that use.

I agree with all of the previous advice: radar, liferaft, EPIRB,
kicker engine, navigation courses, SeaTow membership, etc.

In addition, I would encourage you to get a lot more experience
with
the boat and its equipment. Over time you will get a much better
appreciation for what it can and can not do safely, and you will
gain
experience in how to manage difficult conditions.

The Jersey shore is a dangerous place in conditions that are only
moderately severe. The inlets can have breaking seas even when the
wind is not blowing, all it takes is a large swell and an outgoing
tide. 25 foot boats get rolled and people lost every year after
getting caught by an inopportune breaking wave.

Great point. It's like working the Charlestown Breachway.
Perfectly
calm day outside, six foot breakers on the tide going into.

Tough to do in a smallish boat.

Do new boaters still get all nervous about passing through Plum Gut on
a
quiet day, or don't you get out that way at all?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Yes, new boaters are nervous about the Plum Gut
and I go there all the time. It's a hop, skip and a jump
from the Stonington launch ramp at Barn Island.

My sister considered it to be like an amusement park ride. But, she was
not
the owner of the boat. :-)- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I know boaters who think running the East Passage of
Narraganset Bay in a SW wind seas 4 to 6 as fun.

While I've done it, I didn't consider it fun.


Don't remember that, but since I was a kid, I probably just imprinted stuff
that would've made for a good sitcom.

- Wandering into that submarine practice zone, IIRC west of Block Island.
Dad said "Nah..that's not where we are." I'd just taken the power squadron
course, and I was positive we were in the zone. We're puttering along,
trolling for stripers or something, and a half mile away, a sub surfaces,
contacts us, and politely re-educates my dad. I said nothing. I don't know
what he was thinking. Maybe "Hey - I'm ex-Navy. I'm allowed".

- Demo of why plastic dishes are good on boats: Dad didn't care if winds
from a certain direction always meant crazy water (even for a 42' Owens). Ex
torpedo bomber pilots have no fear, apparently. So, one day, north of Orient
Point, things got interesting. The boat was all over the place. The first
sign of trouble was when my mom's stoneware dishes became too much for the
latches on the cabinets below. Big noise, all dishes declared dead. Then, my
sister brings the Chapman book up to the bridge and points out the artist's
rendering of pitchpoling. She had a weird sense of timing. My younger sister
slept through the whole thing.

- Townsend marina, Greenport: Dad & mechanic standing in bilge of 32' Luhrs,
95 degrees, mosquitoes as thick as pea soup, oil up to their ankles. I
must've been nagging him for bait money or some such thing - I don't recall.
He climbs out of the bilge, says "Get over here", I follow him to the bow,
where he picks me up and tosses me into the water. Much laughter from
adjacent boats. No more kid noise till engine was fixed. :-)

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Thu, 8 Feb 2007 15:41:09 -0500, "RCE" wrote:

They ended up wrapping a submerged chunk of 2" hawser on one of their shafts
and ripped the cutlass bearing mounting plate right out of the hull.

It's amazing how much stuff like that is out there, most of it
floating polypropolene line and netting from commercial fishing boats.

We heard a distress conversation 2 years ago between a 110 ft Broward
and the coast guard. They had become entangled in floating line
somewhere off the Carolina coast and were dead in the water.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Feb 2007 15:41:09 -0500, "RCE" wrote:

They ended up wrapping a submerged chunk of 2" hawser on one of their
shafts
and ripped the cutlass bearing mounting plate right out of the hull.

It's amazing how much stuff like that is out there, most of it
floating polypropolene line and netting from commercial fishing boats.

We heard a distress conversation 2 years ago between a 110 ft Broward
and the coast guard. They had become entangled in floating line
somewhere off the Carolina coast and were dead in the water.



For the benefit of the OP, the Hudson is loaded with chunks of wood, and
sometimes entire trees. There are so many so-called "creeks" that empty into
the river, many of them big enough to carry lots of debris, especially
during the spring thaw and a month or three afterward. This is why many of
the creeks were used for moving lumber.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Feb 8, 12:41�pm, "RCE" wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in oglegroups.com...



I know a guy who had the prop shaft supports ripped out
the bottom of his boat by a whale that came out of
nowhere - hit the stern and everything went bye-bye.

We met up with some guys in a big Sea Ray on the voyage to Florida and did
some partying at the marina we stopped at. *The next day (nursing hangovers)
we elected to stay on the ICW and they decided to run off-shore.

They ended up wrapping a submerged chunk of 2" hawser on one of their shafts
and ripped the cutlass bearing mounting plate right out of the hull.
Fortunately they were able to stuff the hole enough and maintain headway on
the other engine until the Coast Guard arrived.

Eisboch


An excellent illustration of the point that twins don't always make a
boat safer.
With twin inboards, the shaft aft of the shaft log is perilously
exposed. I'd be willing to bet that more sinkings occur each year due
to ripping a strut away from the hull (and creating a 2-3 sq ft (!)
breach) than from a loss of motive power.
Losing headway won't usually put a boat into peril unless there is a
pretty nasty blow going on- but ripping off a strut upon striking a
deadhead, a hawser, a reef, a whale, etc can easily sink a boat in a
dead calm.

For my money, I like the shaft protruding about a foot or so from the
cutlass bearing, protected by a keel, skeg, and rudder. Much safer
than running naked.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
oups.com...


An excellent illustration of the point that twins don't always make a
boat safer.

No, not "always". But having twins improves your chances. If the engine
still runs, one
otherwise disabled drive can help by using it's engine as a high volume
bilge pump
while the other is used to head for shallow water.


For my money, I like the shaft protruding about a foot or so from the
cutlass bearing, protected by a keel, skeg, and rudder. Much safer
than running naked.

Certainly agree there.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions

I've taken my 20' Wellcraft, 200hp merc out 30-35 miles in the Gulf of
Mexico on a few occasions, up to 11 miles regularly, and found the following
to be good practice.

1. Check the weather, both on NOAA's website and the Weather channel. If
the waves are predicted to be over 1-2's or wind hits the 15 knot mark it
will be a shorter trip. By the time we get to the pass, we would have
checked for reports on the VHF from boats already out there and whether the
seas were building or diminishing. Through most of the summer the almost
daily "afternoon scattered thunder storms" are an issue. We take that
seriously and plan the trip to be out and back by early afternoon and may
not go at all. We constantly check the weather, noting direction of the
clouds and wind.
2. Safety: In addition to the required and standard we have spare prop,
prop wrench, plugs, tools, fuses (for radio, engine, etc.) twin batteries
with selector switch, twin bilge pumps (a 700 and a 2000gph), a back-up hand
held VHF, etc. I have a good knowledge of mechanics (having rebuilt this
engine, the transom on the boat, replaced gas gauges, re-wired and really,
been through every sq inch of this engine and boat). We wear inflatable
life vests plus have the others available and immediately accessible. We
go through a checklist before every trip that lists everything from
"sunglasses to bait to GPS. (If you want, I could email you the checklist I
made up on Excel as a guide).

On your fuel, know your normal range. The rule is 1/3 out, 1/3 back and 1/3
for reserve.

Do you have the tools and knowledge to remove a 6/0 hook? How treat the two
inch gash that needs stitches? Can you instantly radio your current
position before you sink? Does everyone on the boat know where the fire
extinguisher is? and how to use the radio? and the proper dialog (Mayday,
Securite, Pan Pan http://www.boatingsafety.com/vhf1.htm ).

Before we head out, we check all equipment--lights, horn, VHF, GPS,
fish/depth finder, bilge pumps, etc. We tell someone where we are going and
when we expect to be back. If we change plans and are still in cell phone
range we let them know.

Get the Coast Guard to give you an inspection and get their suggestions for
additional equipment beyond that "required".

I take my 81 year old Mom out frequently. Just be safe, don't take chances,
if any questions or doubts on the weather, err on the conservative side. We
can not, nor can you go out far any time we like. The weather tells us when
we can.
LD


"King5899" wrote in message
oups.com...
I just purchased a '98 Sundancer 250 with a single 5.7 EFI/Bravo III.
The boat is in excellent condition, and a full hull and engine survey
proved it was quite the solid boat, with many hours to go on it. While
sitting waiting up here in the northeast for the weather to warm up I
keep reading more and more about fishing off the Jersey shore. I have
read articles about catching Tuna, Dolphin and all sorts of
interesting fish in locations like the Mud hole, which is 15 miles
offshore. I purchased the boat primarily as a Hudson river and bay
boat for the family, but would love to venture to deeper waters to do
some fishing with my freinds.

Now I know prior to making any excursion that is outside a somewhat
controlled environemnt (i.e. Hudson river), I really have to get
comfortable with the boat and know how it handles, as well as how I
can handle it. The boat is pretty loaded with VHF, Compass, GPS/
Sounder, and your common safety equipment. So if I can maybe gather
some opinions to the following it would be greatly appreciated.

- How far offshore is reasonable in this style, size, and equipped
boat?

- What else should I consider getting to ensure any offshore trip
would be a safe one?

- Are there any places or clubs to meet up with other boaters heading
out to the hot fishing spots that might allow someone less experienced
to follow them out? (This would offer a level of safety that if
something did go wrong there are other boats in the area)

Thanks in advance. I am excited to get in the water, the waiting is
killing me. I assume if your reading this newsgroup in February you
are also as eager to see the thermometor tip some warmer numbers.

MJK

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

LD wrote:
After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions

Good suggestions.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 11:53:56 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing penned the
following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

LD wrote:
After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions
Good suggestions.

Good suggestions, but if there is the potential for the necessity of
transiting narrow and/or busy inlets or other passages in poor
visibility, RADAR is money well spent.

We've never regretted having those "extra eyes."

Agreed.

And the North Atlantic is a tad different than the Gulf
of Mexico.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
...


LD wrote:
After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over
kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions

Good suggestions, but if there is the potential for the necessity of
transiting narrow and/or busy inlets or other passages in poor
visibility, RADAR is money well spent.

We've never regretted having those "extra eyes."



I agree and am a little surprised that "LD" thinks it's an overkill. Not
only for busy inlets, but for crawling your way back home in pea soup
without running into others that don't have radar or other objects floating
in the water like lobster pot floats with lines that just love to wrap
around your props. I'd agree that if your boating is restricted to
immediate coastlines and inland rivers, the need isn't as great, although
you can still get into trouble if the heavy fog develops. I know I did once
in a 17' center console. I was only 100 yards off shore of Scituate, MA, a
heavy fog developed in a matter of minutes, and I spent an hour trying to
find the harbor channel markers while avoiding submerged and not so
submerged rocks in 4-6 foot breakers. Visibility was about 25 feet. It
wasn't fun.

Another note about fog. It doesn't necessarily "roll in". It can develop
without warning if the temperature, dew point and barometric pressure
combine in the right conditions to produce it. I've seen it go from crystal
clear to pea soup in a matter of minutes, usually when the barometric
pressure suddenly drops quickly due to an approaching front and the water
vapor in the atmosphere condenses.

I am not suggesting that every small boat should have radar, but those
situations *do* occur. If you do a lot of boating and it hasn't happened
yet ..... it will.

You don't need a super, high powered, 60 mile radar to avoid collisions or
running over stuff in the water. I think JVC and others make a reasonably
priced unit with plenty of range.

Radar. Don't leave the dock without it.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions


I agree that if all you want to do is spend a few hours offshore,
radar is way overkill. I've done plenty of sailing off the New Jersey
coast without radar. And while it was in a boat that's a little more
capable than a 25' Sundancer, what I have in survivability you more
than make up for in speed.

You should have more than enough warning to get back in before
anything serious develops. That area has very few "pop up" severe
storms. What bad weather that the Jersey coast gets is usually
forcast in plenty of time for you to get back in if you pay attention
to the radio. When the storms are coming over Maryland or PA, you can
turn around and get in before they make transiting the inlet
hazardous. The people that get in trouble are the ones that don't
heed the warnings.

As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.

Steve

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions


As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.

Where would that be?

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over
kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions


As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.

Where would that be?

That's right... no radar on any boat I sailed on... and sometimes we were in
pea soup fog.
We would take a bearing just before entering the fog bank and then
calculated our course.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Don White" wrote in message
...


That's right... no radar on any boat I sailed on... and sometimes we were
in pea soup fog.
We would take a bearing just before entering the fog bank and then
calculated our course.



And cross your fingers that nobody else crossed your path.

Although, a sailboat in heavy fog probably isn't moving very fast.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 19:52:59 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions


As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.

Where would that be?

New Jersey coast. My marina was close to Towsend's Inlet, which is
between Sea Isle City and Avalon. It's about average as far as NJ
inlets are concerned. Which means ok in good conditions, not so ok in
poor conditions.

I would watch the boats go in and out of the inlet and look at all the
boats in my marina as well as many others and a surprisingly tiny
minority of them had radar.

Steve

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

Steve wrote:
On Sun, 11 Feb 2007 19:52:59 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions
As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.
Where would that be?

New Jersey coast. My marina was close to Towsend's Inlet, which is
between Sea Isle City and Avalon. It's about average as far as NJ
inlets are concerned. Which means ok in good conditions, not so ok in
poor conditions.

I would watch the boats go in and out of the inlet and look at all the
boats in my marina as well as many others and a surprisingly tiny
minority of them had radar.

Just curious. Not a lot of small boats have radar.

I personally wouldn't be without it.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

Don White wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over
kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions
As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.
Where would that be?

That's right... no radar on any boat I sailed on... and sometimes we were in
pea soup fog.
We would take a bearing just before entering the fog bank and then
calculated our course.

Well, you are Canadian.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
. ..

"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
...


LD wrote:
After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over
kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions

Good suggestions, but if there is the potential for the necessity of
transiting narrow and/or busy inlets or other passages in poor
visibility, RADAR is money well spent.

We've never regretted having those "extra eyes."



I agree and am a little surprised that "LD" thinks it's an overkill. Not
only for busy inlets, but for crawling your way back home in pea soup
without running into others that don't have radar or other objects
floating in the water like lobster pot floats with lines that just love to
wrap around your props. I'd agree that if your boating is restricted to
immediate coastlines and inland rivers, the need isn't as great, although
you can still get into trouble if the heavy fog develops. I know I did
once in a 17' center console. I was only 100 yards off shore of Scituate,
MA, a heavy fog developed in a matter of minutes, and I spent an hour
trying to find the harbor channel markers while avoiding submerged and not
so submerged rocks in 4-6 foot breakers. Visibility was about 25 feet.
It wasn't fun.

Another note about fog. It doesn't necessarily "roll in". It can develop
without warning if the temperature, dew point and barometric pressure
combine in the right conditions to produce it. I've seen it go from
crystal clear to pea soup in a matter of minutes, usually when the
barometric pressure suddenly drops quickly due to an approaching front and
the water vapor in the atmosphere condenses.

I am not suggesting that every small boat should have radar, but those
situations *do* occur. If you do a lot of boating and it hasn't happened
yet ..... it will.

You don't need a super, high powered, 60 mile radar to avoid collisions or
running over stuff in the water. I think JVC and others make a reasonably
priced unit with plenty of range.

Radar. Don't leave the dock without it.

Eisboch


Conditions may vary depending on where one boats. We do not see the fog
events on Lake Erie as you see in the NE Atlantic. The need for radar also
depends on the type of boating one does.

I had radar on my 32 footer and used it mainly to monitor possible
approaching storms. We only made daytime crossings and I kept an eye on
weather and sea conditions.....if they were not favorable, we would not
travel.

The majority of boaters on Lake Erie do not travel by night and the majority
do not have radar.

The key piece of hardware I used most was my gps/chartplotter, something I
would consider more practical in my area than radar.

BTW: True or false - If you have a radar unit does it always *have* to be
on when underway?

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"JimH" wrote in message
...


Conditions may vary depending on where one boats. We do not see the fog
events on Lake Erie as you see in the NE Atlantic. The need for radar
also depends on the type of boating one does.

I had radar on my 32 footer and used it mainly to monitor possible
approaching storms. We only made daytime crossings and I kept an eye on
weather and sea conditions.....if they were not favorable, we would not
travel.

The majority of boaters on Lake Erie do not travel by night and the
majority do not have radar.

The key piece of hardware I used most was my gps/chartplotter, something I
would consider more practical in my area than radar.

BTW: True or false - If you have a radar unit does it always *have* to be
on when underway?


True, although often debated. Rule 7 of Navigation rules, to quote:

"Radar is not required on vessels under 1600 GT (Title 33 CFR part 164.35),
however, Rule 7 states that proper use shall be made of radar equipment if
fitted and operational."

In other words, whoever has one must use it.

And I guess I agree with your view regarding different boating areas.

Eisboch

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
. ..

Screwed that up. Here's Rule 7:

a) Every vessel shall use all available means appropriate to the
prevailing circumstances and conditions to determine if risk of collision
exists. If there is any doubt such risk shall be deemed to exist.
(b) Proper use shall be made of radar equipment if fitted and
operational, including long-range scanning to obtain early warning of risk
of collision and radar plotting or equivalent systematic observation of
detected objects.

(c) Assumptions shall not be made on the basis of scanty information,
especially scanty radar information.

(d) In determining if risk of collision exists the following
considerations shall be among those taken into account:

1.. Such risk shall be deemed to exist if the compass bearing of an
approaching vessel does not appreciably change;
2.. Such risk may sometimes exist even when an appreciable bearing
change is evident, particularly when approaching a very large vessel or a
tow or when approaching a vessel at close range.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
. ..

"JimH" wrote in message
...


Conditions may vary depending on where one boats. We do not see the fog
events on Lake Erie as you see in the NE Atlantic. The need for radar
also depends on the type of boating one does.

I had radar on my 32 footer and used it mainly to monitor possible
approaching storms. We only made daytime crossings and I kept an eye on
weather and sea conditions.....if they were not favorable, we would not
travel.

The majority of boaters on Lake Erie do not travel by night and the
majority do not have radar.

The key piece of hardware I used most was my gps/chartplotter, something
I would consider more practical in my area than radar.

BTW: True or false - If you have a radar unit does it always *have* to
be on when underway?


True, although often debated. Rule 7 of Navigation rules, to quote:

"Radar is not required on vessels under 1600 GT (Title 33 CFR part
164.35), however, Rule 7 states that proper use shall be made of radar
equipment if fitted and operational."

In other words, whoever has one must use it.

And I guess I agree with your view regarding different boating areas.

Eisboch


Yep. At least COLREG Rule 7 would suggest that:
http://www.boatsafe.com/nauticalknow...g/colregs.html

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

"Don White" wrote in message
...


That's right... no radar on any boat I sailed on... and sometimes we were
in pea soup fog.
We would take a bearing just before entering the fog bank and then
calculated our course.



And cross your fingers that nobody else crossed your path.

Although, a sailboat in heavy fog probably isn't moving very fast.

Eisboch

Plus..on a sailboat you can hear everything...and we do sound our horn 1
long & 2 short blasts every two minutes.

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98 Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
Don White wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over
kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions
As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.
Where would that be?

That's right... no radar on any boat I sailed on... and sometimes we were
in pea soup fog.
We would take a bearing just before entering the fog bank and then
calculated our course.

Well, you are Canadian.

Compliments aren't going to get you anywhere......

How far offshore would be reasonable from the Jersey shore? '98Sea Ray Sundancer 25',
 

Don White wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
Don White wrote:
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
Steve wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:29:41 -0500, "LD"
wrote:

After reading through the posts and although I think RADAR is way over
kill
for me, I have a few additional suggestions
As long as you don't head out when the forcast is already bad, you'll
be fine without radar. I'd say probably less than 10% of the boats
transiting my home inlet, a fairly hazardous one as far as inlets in
that area go, have radar.
Where would that be?
That's right... no radar on any boat I sailed on... and sometimes we were
in pea soup fog.
We would take a bearing just before entering the fog bank and then
calculated our course.
Well, you are Canadian.

Compliments aren't going to get you anywhere......

It wasn't a compliment. :)