Gunwhale padding?
 

OK, I need something and can't find it (google can't
either). There is a gunwhale guard or rubrail that is a 'P'
section of closed-cell foam covered in white canvas.

I want this stuff because it fits the gun'l naturally, it's
light, and it's great padding. I hate to scuff & scratch our
boat (or anybody else's) bringing a dinghy alongside.

I know this stuff exists because I've seen it on chandlery
shelves. But where the heck can I order it? Somebody please
help!

Thanks
Doug King

Gunwhale padding?
 

I know this stuff exists because I've seen it on chandlery
shelves. But where the heck can I order it? Somebody please
help!


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
I've seen it too just recently and for the life of me I can't remember
what the name of the stuff was or who made.

The odd thing is, I picked some up and looked at it closely.

AARRGGHH!!

Some help you are. You posted this just to torment me, right?

Just to get even, I'm going to post a lot of pics of my
Perfect Dinghy when I get it finished.

Regards
Doug King

Gunwhale padding?
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
OK, I need something and can't find it (google can't either). There is a
gunwhale guard or rubrail that is a 'P' section of closed-cell foam
covered in white canvas.

I want this stuff because it fits the gun'l naturally, it's light, and
it's great padding. I hate to scuff & scratch our boat (or anybody else's)
bringing a dinghy alongside.

I know this stuff exists because I've seen it on chandlery shelves. But
where the heck can I order it? Somebody please help!

Thanks
Doug King

?

http://www.hamiltonmarine.com/0270.h...FT9nOAodLDQPzg

Gunwhale padding?
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
I know this stuff exists because I've seen it on chandlery shelves. But
where the heck can I order it? Somebody please help!


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
I've seen it too just recently and for the life of me I can't remember
what the name of the stuff was or who made.

The odd thing is, I picked some up and looked at it closely.

AARRGGHH!!

Some help you are. You posted this just to torment me, right?

Just to get even, I'm going to post a lot of pics of my Perfect Dinghy
when I get it finished.

Regards
Doug King


I've seen stuff similar to what you are looking for ... canvas covered
closed foam, "P" section.
It was being used for bumper strips on the edge of finger slips. Maybe you
could find them under dock supplies or something.

Eisboch

Gunwhale padding?
 

ACP wrote:
http://www.hamiltonmarine.com/0270.h...FT9nOAodLDQPzg


I hunted thru the Hamilton Marine web site (among many
others) and couldn't fin this.

Thanks

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

The stuff you are looking for is actually 3/4 of a circle with tabs of
fabric. It therefore is not a P section but more like an Omega. I have
always folded the top tab under so that it looks like a P section on the
boat. The row of screws on the top of the gunwale is covered by the folded
tab. I hope this is clear.
Dave
"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
OK, I need something and can't find it (google can't either). There is a
gunwhale guard or rubrail that is a 'P' section of closed-cell foam
covered in white canvas.

I want this stuff because it fits the gun'l naturally, it's light, and
it's great padding. I hate to scuff & scratch our boat (or anybody else's)
bringing a dinghy alongside.

I know this stuff exists because I've seen it on chandlery shelves. But
where the heck can I order it? Somebody please help!

Thanks
Doug King

Gunwhale padding?
 

Doug,
I've used both styles of this stuff.

The stuff on the left side of the page is less garish in color, firm and
heavy.
The stuff on the right is a bright white, a good bit lighter, and its
ethafoam core is not bonded to the hose, so it can get misaligned.

The most reliable way i've found to attach it is with oval head self-tap
screws and finish washers



"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
ACP wrote:
http://www.hamiltonmarine.com/0270.h...FT9nOAodLDQPzg


I hunted thru the Hamilton Marine web site (among many
others) and couldn't fin this.

Thanks

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

Jim Conlin wrote:

Doug,
I've used both styles of this stuff.

The stuff on the left side of the page is less garish in color, firm and
heavy.
The stuff on the right is a bright white, a good bit lighter, and its
ethafoam core is not bonded to the hose, so it can get misaligned.

The most reliable way i've found to attach it is with oval head self-tap
screws and finish washers



Thanks Jim- it's very encouraging that I'm getting close to
putting on the gun'ls, after so much time has gone by with
very slow progress. The boat is coming out heavier than I'd
like, but it's still far lighter than anything else would
be, and it's STRONG. When you see two ~200lb men jumping up
and down on the center thwart, with the boat resting on a
simple cradle (6' between the hull supports), you begin to
think "here's a boat that will probably not experience
structural failure during normal use."

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
PICTURES - I DEMAND PICTURES!!!

Here's more than you want to know about the Amazing
Scientific Dinghy from git-go
http://community.webshots.com/album/82561569ZSrzNA

The last pics are couple weeks ago, since then I've finished
the inner skin, trimmed the edges of the hull down to the
final sheer line, and built & installed the center thwart,
and made a template for the aft seat (which will of course
be a fancy curved one, like the classics). To finish up I
need to build & install the bow & stern seats, laminate
across the top of the gun'l, flip it & fair the outside of
the hull, paint it, mount the hardware & rubrail.

The intent was to make a classic Whitehall-styled rowing
dink, more stable and easier to row than any in production,
of carbon fiber & foam core so it would also be a one-hand
job to lift & stow (or launch) it. We'll see.

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

"DSK" wrote in message
...
Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
PICTURES - I DEMAND PICTURES!!!

Here's more than you want to know about the Amazing Scientific Dinghy from
git-go
http://community.webshots.com/album/82561569ZSrzNA

The last pics are couple weeks ago, since then I've finished the inner
skin, trimmed the edges of the hull down to the final sheer line, and
built & installed the center thwart, and made a template for the aft seat
(which will of course be a fancy curved one, like the classics). To finish
up I need to build & install the bow & stern seats, laminate across the
top of the gun'l, flip it & fair the outside of the hull, paint it, mount
the hardware & rubrail.

The intent was to make a classic Whitehall-styled rowing dink, more stable
and easier to row than any in production, of carbon fiber & foam core so
it would also be a one-hand job to lift & stow (or launch) it. We'll see.

DSK


Nice job and I admire the patience you obviously have.

Eisboch

Gunwhale padding?
 

Eisboch wrote:
Nice job and I admire the patience you obviously have.


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Sweet - love to see what it looks like finished.

Nice job.

Thank you both, very much. I will add more pictures, and
promise that the launch & test ride will not be kept top
secret (unless it's a really really embarassing flop).

If it turns out that my Amazing Scientific Dinghy hull
design really is significantly better than what's currently
on the market, I may be interested in selling this one and
starting over, now that I know how to actually make foam
core & composite laminations *right*. Boats are always a
learning process!

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

"DSK" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
Nice job and I admire the patience you obviously have.


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Sweet - love to see what it looks like finished.

Nice job.

Thank you both, very much. I will add more pictures, and promise that the
launch & test ride will not be kept top secret (unless it's a really
really embarassing flop).

If it turns out that my Amazing Scientific Dinghy hull design really is
significantly better than what's currently on the market, I may be
interested in selling this one and starting over, now that I know how to
actually make foam core & composite laminations *right*. Boats are always
a learning process!

DSK


Ah .... we have another Dick Fisher on our hands.

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/ref...ullDesign.html


Eisboch

Gunwhale padding?
 

Eisboch wrote:
Ah .... we have another Dick Fisher on our hands.

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/ref...ullDesign.html


Thing is, there's virtually no demand at all for classic
looking efficient rowing craft, much less ones made with
space-age super-light materials. Everybody I have talked to
about this dinghy idea (originally, I wanted a Fatty Knees
made in carbon/kevlar) said it was stupid. Oh well.

BTW the career of C. Raymond Hunt is quite fascinating, not
only did he help originate the Boston Whaler and the
"cathedral hull" but he also originated the deep-vee and a
bunch of different original sailing designs, including an
America's Cup winner. He should be a lot more famous.

Albert Hickman was no slouch either, but he turned himself
into a grumpy idealogue who became best known for his
arrogant insistance that his Sea Sled was the ultimate
solution to all the world's problems.

Boat design is like music, there is infinite room for new
ideas, new applications of old ideas, etc etc.

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

DSK wrote:
Eisboch wrote:

Ah .... we have another Dick Fisher on our hands.

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/ref...ullDesign.html


Thing is, there's virtually no demand at all for classic looking
efficient rowing craft, much less ones made with space-age super-light
materials. Everybody I have talked to about this dinghy idea
(originally, I wanted a Fatty Knees made in carbon/kevlar) said it was
stupid. Oh well.

BTW the career of C. Raymond Hunt is quite fascinating, not only did he
help originate the Boston Whaler and the "cathedral hull" but he also
originated the deep-vee and a bunch of different original sailing
designs, including an America's Cup winner. He should be a lot more famous.

Albert Hickman was no slouch either, but he turned himself into a grumpy
idealogue who became best known for his arrogant insistance that his Sea
Sled was the ultimate solution to all the world's problems.

Boat design is like music, there is infinite room for new ideas, new
applications of old ideas, etc etc.

DSK


What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?
How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model

Gunwhale padding?
 

On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 14:22:47 -0500, DSK wrote:

Eisboch wrote:
Nice job and I admire the patience you obviously have.


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Sweet - love to see what it looks like finished.

Nice job.

Thank you both, very much. I will add more pictures, and
promise that the launch & test ride will not be kept top
secret (unless it's a really really embarassing flop).

If it turns out that my Amazing Scientific Dinghy hull
design really is significantly better than what's currently
on the market, I may be interested in selling this one and
starting over, now that I know how to actually make foam
core & composite laminations *right*. Boats are always a
learning process!

DSK

Enjoyed the post and the pictures. Like Tom, I can't wait to see the final
product.

Great job.

Gunwhale padding?
 

"Don White" wrote in message
...

What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?
How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model


I've got one of those gathering dust in an old garage. Even has the mast,
sail, rigging, centerboard, rudder and oars. Anyone want it?

Eisboch

Gunwhale padding?
 

Eisboch wrote:
"Don White" wrote in message
...

What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?
How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model



I've got one of those gathering dust in an old garage. Even has the mast,
sail, rigging, centerboard, rudder and oars. Anyone want it?

Eisboch


What...a Walker Bay with the sail option?
I'd love to have it... if only you were a bit closer.

Gunwhale padding?
 

"Don White" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"Don White" wrote in message
...

What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?
How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model



I've got one of those gathering dust in an old garage. Even has the
mast, sail, rigging, centerboard, rudder and oars. Anyone want it?

Eisboch
What...a Walker Bay with the sail option?
I'd love to have it... if only you were a bit closer.

I don't know much about the different sail types ... this one has a
particular name that I've forgotten. It reminds me of a small version of
what you see on a Chinese Junk.

I sailed it around Scituate Harbor a couple of times with onlookers waving
and laughing at me from their boats. (I am not a "little" guy). It was fun.
I even registered it at one point and used an electric trolling motor on it.

Eisboch

Gunwhale padding?
 

Eisboch wrote:
"Don White" wrote in message
...

Eisboch wrote:

"Don White" wrote in message
...


What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?
How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model



I've got one of those gathering dust in an old garage. Even has the
mast, sail, rigging, centerboard, rudder and oars. Anyone want it?

Eisboch

What...a Walker Bay with the sail option?
I'd love to have it... if only you were a bit closer.


I don't know much about the different sail types ... this one has a
particular name that I've forgotten. It reminds me of a small version of
what you see on a Chinese Junk.

I sailed it around Scituate Harbor a couple of times with onlookers waving
and laughing at me from their boats. (I am not a "little" guy). It was fun.
I even registered it at one point and used an electric trolling motor on it.

Eisboch


I see the 8' version has two different sail types. The cheaper one is
pointed at the headboard like your average sloop while the performance
plus version is rounded at the top.
In the 10' model both main sails are the rounded top type but the
performance version comes with a small jib.

Gunwhale padding?
 

Don White wrote:
What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?

Well, it's costing me about $3k worth of materials, bought
retail and with moderate regard for keeping expense down. It
doesn't include vacuum-bagging gear.


How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model

Glad you asked.
The Walker Bay looks like a cheap toy next to my dinghy. It
is about 4x heavier, has far less carrying capacity, and (if
theory proves somewhat correct) should be noticably less
stable. It will also be harder to row and slower/less
efficient if used with a motor. Of course, mine has the
advantage of being a foot longer.

However I don't think that anybody would pay 5X the price of
a Walker Bay for a similar boat no matter how blatantly
obvious it's technical advantages.

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

"DSK" wrote in message
...
Don White wrote:
What do you think a dinghy like that would be worth?

Well, it's costing me about $3k worth of materials, bought retail and with
moderate regard for keeping expense down. It doesn't include
vacuum-bagging gear.


How would it compare to a $1K Walker Bay 8' model

Glad you asked.
The Walker Bay looks like a cheap toy next to my dinghy. It is about 4x
heavier, has far less carrying capacity, and (if theory proves somewhat
correct) should be noticably less stable. It will also be harder to row
and slower/less efficient if used with a motor. Of course, mine has the
advantage of being a foot longer.

However I don't think that anybody would pay 5X the price of a Walker Bay
for a similar boat no matter how blatantly obvious it's technical
advantages.

DSK


The Walker Bay is good for kids or very light adults. It's not good for a
200+ pounder, I can unfortunately confirm.

Eisboch

Gunwhale padding?
 

Albert Hickman was no slouch either, but he turned himself
into a grumpy idealogue


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
You think he was a grumpy ideologue, you should have met George O'Day.
That guy was the sourest, grumpy, touchy, unapproachable old fart I
ever met in my life and held a similar opinion about his Day Sailors.

I have met George O'Day a few times, raced against him some
in the long-long-ago. Small world! He was a brilliant racing
skipper. He gave the impression of being less of a screaming
butt-head towards his crew than many skippers were back in
those days, however I didn't approach him for conversation..

The ironic thing about the Day Sailor is that he didn't even
design it. Uffa Fox did. Nice boat although still not the
answer to all the world's problems.

DSK

Gunwhale padding?
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Back in my late twenties, I met a guy from Thomaston, ME named Harold
"Dynamite" Payson at a Mystic Seaport Museum boat building class - it
was right after I sobered up and I was going to build a sail boat for
my own amusement and to keep me out of trouble.

Harold Payson was a character of the highest order. Lobsta' man by
trade, he built his own boats and got into building plywood boats -
most of them designed by Phil Bolger of all people. :)

http://www.instantboats.com/


Yep. I built a couple of Teals and Surfs, at one point I was
going to build an Instant Catboat. I still have the plans,
so one day I might.


Anyway, to make a long story short, I began quite a conversation with
him, ended up telling the story of why I was there and eventually
developed a level of communication that was unusual for a "fan" and
the "fanee" I guess you would call it. It became a Saturday morning
ritual for a long time chatting with him about how I was going with my
boat (The Glocester Gull adapted for sail). During one of those
conversations, he said that the Gull design would be perfect for some
"new fangled foam core" technique.


Yep, all those instant designs would be well suited for
building in foam core.


Side note - eventually, right before Christmas in 1980, I received
autographed copies of his books and all his plans in the mail along
with a very nice note about building boats and the joy derived from
it.


Nice.


I haven't built a boat since the Gull, but I can appreciate the effort
you put into it.


Someday when you have time to consider it, and not quite so
many ready-made boats under foot, you may decide to again.
It's a great pastime, especially if you have a young person
hanging around who needs something other than video games to
be interested in. It's a lot of effort, but there's also a
lot of satisfaction in completing every part & every stage
of construction. And when you're riding around in it, you
have the satisfaction of knowing that you are aboard the
BEST BUILT boat as far as the eye can see!

Regards
Doug King

Gunwhale padding?
 

On Tue, 07 Nov 2006 21:23:56 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

I haven't built a boat since the Gull, but I can appreciate the effort
you put into it.

Most excellent Doug - most excellent.

Absolutely. It is difficult to appreciate the skill, effort and
workmanship required to build even a small boat until you have tried
it yourself.

Glenn Ashmore is one of my heros. He's been working on a 40 something
cruising sailboat since my first days on the internet back in the
early to mid 90s.

Gunwhale padding?
 

Wayne.B wrote:
Glenn Ashmore is one of my heros. He's been working on a 40 something
cruising sailboat since my first days on the internet back in the
early to mid 90s.


Glenn's a hero all right. He not only did all that, he
documented it on his web site and is uniformly helpful to
others with their projects. RUTU is awesome!

DSk

Gunwhale padding?
 

DSK wrote:
Wayne.B wrote:
Glenn Ashmore is one of my heros. He's been working on a 40 something
cruising sailboat since my first days on the internet back in the
early to mid 90s.


Glenn's a hero all right. He not only did all that, he documented it on
his web site and is uniformly helpful to others with their projects.
RUTU is awesome!

DSk

What is the status of his project? Do you have an updated link.

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

Pic from this morning
http://sports.webshots.com/photo/261...35692614eOakGw

Here is the most recent pic
http://sports.webshots.com/photo/266...35692614wfZuXl

The stern sheets (seat) is not finished & installed
structurally, you can see the edge of the foam core. The
center thwart is not totally finished yet but does have the
knees tabbed in (last night's epoxy job); it is structurally
complete. The gunwhales are not finished yet and are
tremendously strong, you can lift the boat from any point
(and drop it too, ask me how I know) along the gun'l and
there is zero flex.

The bow seat is just now having the foam core cut to fit.

The surfaces look rougher than they are because of the
different shades of filler/mix used in the epoxy. It is all
finished to a satin feel from the peel ply. I will have to
do some sanding & fairing though.

The whole boat is TREMENDOUSLY strong. If I were to do it
all over again, I would use lighter cloth & save a lot of
weight. Who needs a dinghy that can support a locomotive?

DSK

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

On Sat, 11 Nov 2006 13:48:46 -0500, DSK wrote:

The whole boat is TREMENDOUSLY strong. If I were to do it
all over again, I would use lighter cloth & save a lot of
weight. Who needs a dinghy that can support a locomotive?

===========

What do you figure the finished weight will come in at?

Any plans for an outboard, and if so, how big?

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

Wayne.B wrote:
What do you figure the finished weight will come in at?


I was originally hoping for 20 ~ 25 lbs. Now I'm hoping for
30 ~ 35 lbs. The gun'l rubrail will be a big portion of that.


Any plans for an outboard, and if so, how big?


It could carry an outboard, that's one reason I made the
stern sections a little bit fatter & flatter than I would
have for aesthetics & pure rowing performance. Should carry
any reasonable 9.9hp (70 lbs? 80?) and the fat part of the
skeg is sized to clear a short shaft. It won't motor as well
as a flat-bottomed dink, of course; but I expect it should
plane.

DSK

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Very nice - I assume you are going to paint it?

Roll and Tip?


Thanks. I am going to paint it, and am hoping to use an
airless sprayer. I have done roll & tip before and can get
it pretty good that way (especially with some buffing). But
sprayed is so much more cool.




Who needs a dinghy that can support a locomotive?


Well, if you sail it on the railroad tracks....

If we're attacked by pirates, we can deploy it vertically as
a bulletproof shield!

DSK

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

DSK wrote:
Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:

Very nice - I assume you are going to paint it?

Roll and Tip?


Thanks. I am going to paint it, and am hoping to use an airless sprayer.
I have done roll & tip before and can get it pretty good that way
(especially with some buffing). But sprayed is so much more cool.




Who needs a dinghy that can support a locomotive?



Well, if you sail it on the railroad tracks....


If we're attacked by pirates, we can deploy it vertically as a
bulletproof shield!

DSK


Or if you sail the rocky roads & ditches of Derby Kansas.......

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

If we're attacked by pirates, we can deploy it vertically as a
bulletproof shield!


Don White wrote:
Or if you sail the rocky roads & ditches of Derby Kansas.......

Ahem....
I said "bulletproof"

NOT "BS proof"

DSK

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
Out of curiosity, where did you get the carbon fiber?

Or did I read that wrong?

No, you read it right. Amazing stuff.

It's readily available from airplane kit suppliers, also
race car hobbyists are apparently into molding their own
custom carbon fiber hood scoops & such.

DSK

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 00:17:44 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

I've got some fabrication experimenting I want to do this winter and I
just might try it with carbon fiber cloth rather than glass.

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cm/index.html

http://www.raka.com/Carbon.html

http://www.thomasnet.com/products/ca...0673358-3.html

http://tinyurl.com/j8xu8

Gunwhale padding? ... new pics
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
I've got some fabrication experimenting I want to do this winter and I
just might try it with carbon fiber cloth rather than glass.


Well, weigh out the advantages versus the cost. There's a
few disadvantages as well, like when you build a boat out of
it and people tend to throw it over their heads when picking
it up for the first time ;)

If you want, email me at the usual place and I'll send you
some of the helpful notes I've been sent by a few others and
things I've compiled and shared around the list. There is
really very little documentation on how to work with this
stuff. It's a lot like regular fiberglass but also different.

If you're looking for stuff that's *stupid* strong, you
might look into a kevlar/glass composite, and either vacuum
bagging or one of the other closed laminating techniques.
The next step is simply using peel ply (which is what I've
done) and it makes a HUGE difference over open molding.



Wayne.B wrote:
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cm/index.html

http://www.raka.com/Carbon.html

http://www.thomasnet.com/products/ca...0673358-3.html

http://tinyurl.com/j8xu8


heh, there's one I didn't know about. I didn't fool with
certified aviation grade stuff though.

DSK