Something I've wondered....
 

Why do most boats have "right hand" steering? Almost all cars in the
US are set up with left hand steering and we drive on the right side of
the road, obviously for passing purposes. I would think that small
craft would have the same set up.

it is traditional only? or is there some mystical reasoning for it?

Thanks!
Tim

Something I've wondered....
 

Very informative...thanks!


"Mys Terry" wrote in message
...
On 7 Jun 2006 10:41:50 -0700, "Tim" wrote:

Why do most boats have "right hand" steering? Almost all cars in the
US are set up with left hand steering and we drive on the right side of
the road, obviously for passing purposes. I would think that small
craft would have the same set up.

it is traditional only? or is there some mystical reasoning for it?

Thanks!
Tim

Starboard:
The Vikings called the side of their ship its board, and they placed
the steering oar, the "star" on the right side of the ship, thus that
side became known as the "star board." It's been that way ever since.
And, because the oar was in the right side, the ship was tied to the
dock at the left side. This was known as the loading side or
"larboard". Later, it was decided that "larboard" and "starboard" were
too similar, especially when trying to be heard over the roar of a
heavy sea, so the phrase became the "side at which you tied up to in
port" or the "port" side.

Something I've wondered....
 

Terry & Chuck,
Those are the best explainations I've heard yet.
Correct: very informative.

Now with that information , here's my assumption on sail boat steering.
seeing that large sailing ships from ancient days, w/ exception of the
tiller steering, the wheel would be of best advantage being mounted in
the center, due to equal pull on the ropes to the
rudder.(?)

also the large ships, had the wheel mounted high on deck for full
visibility on both sides.

I don't know at all, I'm simply making an assumption.

A friend of mine has a pretty cool sail boat (about 30-32 ft.)and now
that I think about it,
His wheel IS more to the right (starboard) side, probably due to access
to the cabin.

"Larboard" it's been a long time since I've heard that phrase!






Mys Terry wrote:
On 7 Jun 2006 11:45:14 -0700, "
wrote:


Tim wrote:
Why do most boats have "right hand" steering? Almost all cars in the
US are set up with left hand steering and we drive on the right side of
the road, obviously for passing purposes. I would think that small
craft would have the same set up.

it is traditional only? or is there some mystical reasoning for it?

Thanks!
Tim

Actually, there is a very practical and common sense reason for
starboard steering stations.

While you must keep an adequate watch in all directions, your first
obligation is to keep watch to starboard. In a meeting or crossing
situation it is the vessel approaching from starboard to which you will
be expected to give way. Vessels approaching from your starboard beam
will assume stand on status (but prudent skippers won't absolutely bank
on it until it is evident the boat to port is complying with the
rules). Because those vessels are likely to assume stand on status, it
could be argued that the starboard side presents the greatest hazard.

Sailboats tend to have the wheel in the center, and with a tiller, you
often switch from side to side. How come, if what you said above is
true? Haven't sailboats been around a lot longer than powerboats?


The reason your steering wheel is on the left side of the car when you
drive on the right side of the road is that the greatest hazard is the
oncoming traffic, headed straight toward you at perhaps 70-80 mph and
often only a few feet away.


I believe that is incorrect, Chuck. The basic reason for left hand
steering in countries where you drive on the right, and right hand
steering in countries where you drive on the left is because you can
see farther around curves and get a better view down cross streets of
intersections if you are out near the middle of the road.


The explanation about "starboard" being derived from the Norse "steer
(ing) board" is correct, but at one time not all that long ago it *was*
common for pleasure craft to have port side stations. Perhaps this was
because people wanted their speedboat to be like a car? Who knows? The
trend in recent decades has definitely been to starboard helms, and it
does provide for safer operation.

And then there are all those Center Consoles...

Something I've wondered....
 

"Mys Terry" wrote in message
...
On 7 Jun 2006 12:21:04 -0700, "Tim" wrote:


also the large ships, had the wheel mounted high on deck for full
visibility on both sides.


A couple of years ago I was talking to the captain of the replica of
Columbus's
boat, The Nina. He said that due to the configuration of the boat, the
person at
the wheel could not see ahead, and had to depend entirely on crew at the
bow for
steering directions, especially in close quarters.



I have the opposite problem. From the upper station, I can't see the stern
and, when docking in a tight slip, have to depend on someone standing in the
rear of the cockpit with their hands above their head, pointing in the
direction to move the stern to avoid hitting the finger slips. A familiar
slip is no problem as I learn to line up with a permanent object behind the
slip.

I need some big back-up mirrors.

RCE

Something I've wondered....
 

Mys Terry wrote:


Sailboats tend to have the wheel in the center, and with a tiller, you
often switch from side to side. How come, if what you said above is
true? Haven't sailboats been around a lot longer than powerboats?


There are also many powerboats with wheels in the center, particularly
up on flying bridges where visibility thorugh most of the spectrum is
more easily achieved..
Almost nobody is building a new powerboat with the wheel to port these
days, while it was more common back in the 1950's and 1960's.

Sailboats are another matter, of course, because you have to account
for heeling. It would be fairly dumb to have the wheel to one extreme
or the other and be required to sit on the low side when heeled to port
or starboard. I don't pay much attention to sailboats, frankly,
but I did notice one motorsailor recently that had a slick steering
setup, with two wheels on the aft bulkhead of the main cabin. I assume
that when heeled to starboard, the helmsman can move to the port wheel,
and vice versa.




The reason your steering wheel is on the left side of the car when you
drive on the right side of the road is that the greatest hazard is the
oncoming traffic, headed straight toward you at perhaps 70-80 mph and
often only a few feet away.


I believe that is incorrect, Chuck. The basic reason for left hand
steering in countries where you drive on the right, and right hand
steering in countries where you drive on the left is because you can
see farther around curves and get a better view down cross streets of
intersections if you are out near the middle of the road.

Those would be additional good reasons for the configuration, but do
not invalidate the reason I advanced.



The explanation about "starboard" being derived from the Norse "steer
(ing) board" is correct, but at one time not all that long ago it *was*
common for pleasure craft to have port side stations. Perhaps this was
because people wanted their speedboat to be like a car? Who knows? The
trend in recent decades has definitely been to starboard helms, and it
does provide for safer operation.

And then there are all those Center Consoles...

Yes. Take a careful look at a center console. There is virtually always
unobstructed visibility to both port and starboard and very little
superstructure. Nobody is peering out of a cabin window, smeared with
rain, trying to keep a proper watch.

The preference for starboard helm is to facilitate the highest priority
watch- to starboard.

If the primary motivation was to honor the Norse tradition of the
rudder on the right hand side of the boat, one would have to wonder why
we have departed so far from the Norse traditions in other aspects of
the sport? Why no square sails and yardarms on sloops? Why don't we go
boating with 24 of our closest friends and 48 oars rather than a diesel
engine? About the only Norse traditions that seem to have survived is a
compulsion to
drink and celebrate to excess and deflower any and all virgins
encountered enroute. :-)

Something I've wondered....
 

"Mys Terry" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 7 Jun 2006 17:16:05 -0400, "RCE" wrote:



I have the opposite problem. From the upper station, I can't see the
stern
and, when docking in a tight slip, have to depend on someone standing in
the
rear of the cockpit with their hands above their head, pointing in the
direction to move the stern to avoid hitting the finger slips. A familiar
slip is no problem as I learn to line up with a permanent object behind
the
slip.

I need some big back-up mirrors.

RCE


Now THAT is a photo I want to see, "over there"!

Take a look. Now I have to find a pair of these suckers.

RCE

Something I've wondered....
 

wrote in message
oups.com...

Mys Terry wrote:


Sailboats tend to have the wheel in the center, and with a tiller, you
often switch from side to side. How come, if what you said above is
true? Haven't sailboats been around a lot longer than powerboats?


There are also many powerboats with wheels in the center, particularly
up on flying bridges where visibility thorugh most of the spectrum is
more easily achieved..
Almost nobody is building a new powerboat with the wheel to port these
days, while it was more common back in the 1950's and 1960's.


The Navigators still have the upper station to port, mainly because there's
a ladder leading up from inside the pilothouse just off center to starboard.
The pilothouse station is on the centerline.

RCE

Something I've wondered....
 

On Wed, 7 Jun 2006 18:07:27 -0400, "RCE" wrote:


"Mys Terry" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 7 Jun 2006 17:16:05 -0400, "RCE" wrote:



I have the opposite problem. From the upper station, I can't see the
stern
and, when docking in a tight slip, have to depend on someone standing in
the
rear of the cockpit with their hands above their head, pointing in the
direction to move the stern to avoid hitting the finger slips. A familiar
slip is no problem as I learn to line up with a permanent object behind
the
slip.

I need some big back-up mirrors.

RCE


Now THAT is a photo I want to see, "over there"!

Take a look. Now I have to find a pair of these suckers.

RCE


I like 'em. They're unobtrusive, inconspicuous, and go well with the other
trim. Now, do they have the lights in the mirrors to show if you're going
to port or starboard?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Something I've wondered....
 

Mys Terry wrote:

The preference for starboard helm is to facilitate the highest priority
watch- to starboard.


Sorry Chuck, but that is pure unmitigated baloney that you are making up as you
go along. I've been boating for almost 50 years and I have never heard that ONCE
anywhere but in your post.


So, where have you been? I freely admit that I don't pay much
attention to sailboats.
If you want to make narrow and absolute statements about powerboats
without having to be so insecure about them that anybody with a
different opinion is a threat to you, you should bone up a little bit
first..

(They say there's a difference between 50 years of experience, and one
year of experience 50 times).


Here's link to some other people expressing the same opinion, so you
can now say you have heard it twice:

http://boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1483


Or, you can visit this site and read a comment by a spokesman for a
boat manufacturer (that places the helm to starboard) that "visibility
from inside the cabin in our number one priority....." with regard to
location of the helm.

http://www.fishsniffer.com/cgi-bin/f...1117771557/240


There you go, you have just tripled your experience regarding reasons
for helm placement (beyond sustaining Norse tradition) in a single day.


And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

Something I've wondered....
 

On 7 Jun 2006 17:03:26 -0700, "
wrote:


Mys Terry wrote:

The preference for starboard helm is to facilitate the highest priority
watch- to starboard.


Sorry Chuck, but that is pure unmitigated baloney that you are making up as you
go along. I've been boating for almost 50 years and I have never heard that ONCE
anywhere but in your post.


So, where have you been? I freely admit that I don't pay much
attention to sailboats.
If you want to make narrow and absolute statements about powerboats
without having to be so insecure about them that anybody with a
different opinion is a threat to you, you should bone up a little bit
first..

(They say there's a difference between 50 years of experience, and one
year of experience 50 times).


Here's link to some other people expressing the same opinion, so you
can now say you have heard it twice:

http://boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1483


Or, you can visit this site and read a comment by a spokesman for a
boat manufacturer (that places the helm to starboard) that "visibility
from inside the cabin in our number one priority....." with regard to
location of the helm.

http://www.fishsniffer.com/cgi-bin/f...1117771557/240


There you go, you have just tripled your experience regarding reasons
for helm placement (beyond sustaining Norse tradition) in a single day.


And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

That food store doesn't even carry boiled peanuts. How could their baloney
be worth a damn?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Something I've wondered....
 

On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 00:24:34 GMT, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 20:20:21 -0400, JohnH penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

That food store doesn't even carry boiled peanuts. How could their baloney
be worth a damn?

ROFLMAO...... John, I don't care what Harry says.... you're OK.....

Now, I need to teach you to say, "y'all" properly.....

Proper my ass.

y'all -- singular

all y'all -- plural

What am I missing?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Something I've wondered....
 

To Stbd or to port, who gives a S*&$@. Get used to what you've got and use
it, or relocate it to a position you prefer.


otn

Something I've wondered....
 

JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 00:24:34 GMT, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 20:20:21 -0400, JohnH penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

That food store doesn't even carry boiled peanuts. How could their baloney
be worth a damn?

ROFLMAO...... John, I don't care what Harry says.... you're OK.....

Now, I need to teach you to say, "y'all" properly.....

Proper my ass.

y'all -- singular

all y'all -- plural

What am I missing?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Plenty on this one John.

Y'all-- singular

Y'allz -- plural

*snarf*

Something I've wondered....
 

Mys Terry wrote:
On 7 Jun 2006 21:42:45 -0700, "Tim" wrote:


JohnH wrote:

On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 00:24:34 GMT, Gene Kearns
wrote:


On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 20:20:21 -0400, JohnH penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:



And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

That food store doesn't even carry boiled peanuts. How could their baloney
be worth a damn?

ROFLMAO...... John, I don't care what Harry says.... you're OK.....

Now, I need to teach you to say, "y'all" properly.....

Proper my ass.

y'all -- singular

all y'all -- plural

What am I missing?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Plenty on this one John.

Y'all-- singular

Y'allz -- plural

*snarf*


Youse'all


You sure do talk funny south of the border!

Something I've wondered....
 

Mys Terry wrote:
On 7 Jun 2006 17:03:26 -0700, "
wrote:


Or, you can visit this site and read a comment by a spokesman for a
boat manufacturer (that places the helm to starboard) that "visibility
from inside the cabin in our number one priority....." with regard to
location of the helm.

http://www.fishsniffer.com/cgi-bin/f...1117771557/240



Yeah, they HAD to put it there because of where they put the stand up head! It
was blocking the view too much if they put the wheel anywhere else. In other
words, it does NOT support your claim.

I never said you were the only person who might be wrong about the reasons why
the wheel is on the starboard side.

No, but now you have chosen to completely ignore the other site I
offered as well as misconstrue the site you are referencing. Did you
recently live in Derby, KS?

The boat builder was defending a decision to place the head on the
starboard side, immediately aft of the helm, because placing it in the
aft port quarter blocked visiblity
from the starboard forequarter where the helm is placed. By placing it
in the aft starboard quarter and putting windows on all sides of the
head, (that can be momentarily screened when needed for privacy), there
is a direct view aft from the starboard helm. If the head were placed
in the aft port quarter and the helmsman were trying to look through it
at an angle visibility would be reduced.

You also said that I was "making it up as I go along" and that you had
"never heard anybody else" advance a reason other than Norse tradition
in "50 years of boating". I believe
that I was able to advance your education considerably with the site
that you chose either not to look at or to ignore in your lame
rebuttal. Perhaps the other boaters on the site you ignored are "full
of baloney" as well?

But go right ahead and believe that people who don't share your
*opinion* are "wrong".
My point that there are a number of practical reasons for locating the
helm to starboard has not been refuted by your mean spirited insults
and nonsense. Nor are the practical reasons others advance for locating
the helm to starboard refuted by your assertion that they are wrong as
well.

Shall we play duelling web sites? Can you post a single reference
stating that the only reason for the overwhelming majority of
powerboats locating the helm to starboard is Norse tradition? Or are
you "making it up as you go along?"

Aren't you a sailor? If so, you are probably also unaware of yet an
additional reason that many of the smallest powerboats put the helm to
starboard. Rotation of a large prop on a single screw runabout can
actually cause a slight list to port at higher speeds. If there is only
one person aboard it will be the helmsman, and placing him or her to
starboard tends to correct the list. Placing the helmsman to port would
exaggerate the list. This isn't a problem on larger displacement,
deeper draft, or slower boats but it is a factor on runabouts.

If you have been boating 50 years then you clearly remember the first
decade after WWII.
Mass produced runabouts, heck even the wide spread of a "middle class"
lifestyle where a family would have a runabout on a boat trailer, were
new phenomena. Putting the helm to port, (as was common in that era),
was a good marketing ploy in North America. "Don't worry, Mr. Jones! Of
course you can drive a boat! Look, it's got a steering wheel, a
windshield and a horn- just like your family car!" The wholesale
relocation of the helm to the starboard side of the boat (and the
exceptions prove the rule) may be consistent with Norse tradition but
it was not motivated by that tradition.

Something I've wondered....
 

otnmbrd wrote:
To Stbd or to port, who gives a S*&$@. Get used to what you've got and use
it, or relocate it to a position you prefer.


otn

What!? At the risk of violating Norse tradition? :-)

Something I've wondered....
 

Mys Terry wrote:

Although a starboard helm may have some advantages, the "minor reason"
remains where everything else flowed from, including the colregs.

You have to learn which is the cart and which is the horse.

The steering wheel is on the starboard side due to tradition.

Absolutely right. You see? You are both right.

P.S. My jet boat has the wheel on the Larboard side, but it also has a
foot throttle. The reason jet boat manufacturers give for putting the
helm on the port side (those that do) is because there is no prop
torque making it advisable to put the wheel to starboard, and it gives
most drivers the feel they are used to in a car.

But, why to props turn the way they do?
Why does the craft to the Starboard have the right of way?
Why is the helm usually to starboard?

No one but my three-year-old daughter would think me an expert, but I
would bet:
Norse tradition.

And why does Norse tradition put the star to starboard?
Probably because people are mostly right-handed.

So why is the helm usually on the right?
Human nature.

Something I've wondered....
 

Interesting...

I thought it would having something to do with the rotation of the
prop and its force. Putting the weight (YOU) on that one side
would balance it out....


Tim wrote:
Why do most boats have "right hand" steering? Almost all cars in the
US are set up with left hand steering and we drive on the right side of
the road, obviously for passing purposes. I would think that small
craft would have the same set up.

it is traditional only? or is there some mystical reasoning for it?

Thanks!
Tim

Something I've wondered....
 

On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 11:04:44 GMT, Mys Terry
wrote:

On 7 Jun 2006 21:42:45 -0700, "Tim" wrote:


JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 00:24:34 GMT, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 20:20:21 -0400, JohnH penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

That food store doesn't even carry boiled peanuts. How could their baloney
be worth a damn?

ROFLMAO...... John, I don't care what Harry says.... you're OK.....

Now, I need to teach you to say, "y'all" properly.....

Proper my ass.

y'all -- singular

all y'all -- plural

What am I missing?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Plenty on this one John.

Y'all-- singular

Y'allz -- plural

*snarf*

Youse'all

Southern Brooklyn?
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Something I've wondered....
 

On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 01:06:07 GMT, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 20:26:11 -0400, JohnH penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

On Thu, 08 Jun 2006 00:24:34 GMT, Gene Kearns
wrote:

On Wed, 07 Jun 2006 20:20:21 -0400, JohnH penned the following well
considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:


And finally, if you are really interested in unmitigated baloney, allow
me to recommend

http://www.gourmetfoodstore.com/spec...P5LPJ95D1587G2

That food store doesn't even carry boiled peanuts. How could their baloney
be worth a damn?

ROFLMAO...... John, I don't care what Harry says.... you're OK.....

Now, I need to teach you to say, "y'all" properly.....

Proper my ass.

y'all -- singular

all y'all -- plural

What am I missing?

A lot, in NC.....! I thought we had some work to do....

In the Piedmont and Coast:

Singular and Plural: Hey, y'all, I'm going to the mall...... y'awn,
too?

In the Mountains.....
I'm a-goin' to the mall, you'uns want to?

On the outer banks.....

I won't even try.... they sound like they were transplanted directly
from Devonshire, England.... go figure.... 'friggin crooks....

Uh.... oh, yeah...... I speak the first dialect... then the
second...... I have NOTHING to do with anybody that sounds british....
Irish lineage, ya' know....

I don't even pretend to know how those damn easterners talk. Anyone that
says 'y'all', when they mean 'all y'all', just can't do grammar justice.

I believe, nay, I know that 'you'uns' and 'young'uns' both refer to
children.
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

Something I've wondered....
 

wrote:
Interesting...

I thought it would having something to do with the rotation of the
prop and its force. Putting the weight (YOU) on that one side
would balance it out....



Very much a factor in small, single engine runabouts.

Not a factor in larger boats, where shifting a couple of hundred pounds
from one side to another will not make a significant difference in the
trim.

Most pilothouse boats and boats with interior helms will favor a
starboard or centerline location for the helm. Boats with starboard
lower helms will have either starboard or centerline upper helms, (as a
general tendency). Port helms are rare enough that the exceptions prove
the rule.