A question of concern
 

Peter HK wrote:
"Duncan Heenan" wrote in message
...


Society's moral judgements are reflected in the law. There is no law
against unqualified people sailing boats, there is one regarding
people who drive cars, who have to be licensed and medically fit.
Your example is a poor one

Here there are requirements for boat licences that do require
competency/medical fitness exactly like car licences. Thus the
analogy is apt.


Really? That's a bit of a slippery argument, sport. Unless there've been
some legislative changes I'm unaware of, those rules apply to power boats
over 6hp. AFAIK a 100 year old blind man is perfectly at liberty t take his
70 foot sailboat out unfettered by any form of legislation. (this must still
be the case, because I'm sure there are a few of them sailing out of my
harbour).

because the demented man driving the car was doing so illegally.
Society has, by not requiring sailors to take tests, ruled that
anyone can go sailing on their own decision alone.

See above.

Relying on a doctor to decide on what
you should or should not do is rather like letting the motor mechanic
decide where you should drive your car to. I can see no reason to
give any more credence to a doctor's moral views than anyone else's,
lest of all the 'patient', especially when the patient doesn't even
feel ill.


I wasn't discussing "moral" views rather medicolegal issues. There
are Laws- which you seem to accept as a basis for society according
to your first sentence- dealing with mental capacity, substituted
decision making etc. I have to work within that framework.


This whole thread is surely posed from a moral viewpoint? Even if it is
legally possible to stop this guy setting sail, is it morally or ethically
correct to do so? If it is not legally possible to stop him, is it morally
or ethically correct to allow him to go (and perhaps more importantly put
others) in harms way?

It's not my place to judge, but if I was 85 and even halfway competent, I'd
think I'd earned the right to make the call myself. At 65 his partner has
probably earned the same right.

IMO it's irresponsible for anyone to put to sea with absolutely no skills,
and I can't imagine it will be much fun for a 65yo to do so, so I'm picking
it would be a pretty short trip in any event, one way or another. But that
is their mistake to make.

Ian

A question of concern
 

"Ian George" wrote in message
...

Really? That's a bit of a slippery argument, sport. Unless there've been
some legislative changes I'm unaware of, those rules apply to power boats
over 6hp. AFAIK a 100 year old blind man is perfectly at liberty t take
his 70 foot sailboat out unfettered by any form of legislation. (this must
still be the case, because I'm sure there are a few of them sailing out of
my harbour).

The rules have changed here in Queensland in the last year or so. I
understand that any vessel with a 6 hp or greater motor, even if an
auxiliary on a sailboat, requires a licenced skipper. I suppose that means
anyone can take out an engineless sailboat, no matter how large. Not many 70
footers without engines though.

The regulations include a compulsory course and on the water testing, by
registered testing authorities, so your blind man wouldn't make it. However,
he could still take out a dinghy.

I'm glad I got my licence years ago before all this nonsense but they'll
probably bring in retesting/renewal if they can make it pay!

Peter HK

A question of concern
 

Peter HK wrote:
"Ian George" wrote in message
...

Really? That's a bit of a slippery argument, sport. Unless there've
been some legislative changes I'm unaware of, those rules apply to
power boats over 6hp. AFAIK a 100 year old blind man is perfectly at
liberty t take his 70 foot sailboat out unfettered by any form of
legislation. (this must still be the case, because I'm sure there
are a few of them sailing out of my harbour).

The rules have changed here in Queensland in the last year or so. I
understand that any vessel with a 6 hp or greater motor, even if an
auxiliary on a sailboat, requires a licenced skipper. I suppose that
means anyone can take out an engineless sailboat, no matter how
large. Not many 70 footers without engines though.

I live in Queensland. I haven't read the regulations for years, but isn't
there something about the boat needing to be capable of planing?


The regulations include a compulsory course and on the water testing,
by registered testing authorities, so your blind man wouldn't make
it. However, he could still take out a dinghy.

I'm glad I got my licence years ago before all this nonsense but
they'll probably bring in retesting/renewal if they can make it pay!

As did I, mainly so I could drag kids around behind the Fizz-boat and do
some fishing.

I was until now unaware that I needed one to operate my 10m sailboat. Are
you sure of this?

Ian

A question of concern
 

"Ian George" wrote in message ...
.

I live in Queensland. I haven't read the regulations for years, but isn't
there something about the boat needing to be capable of planing?

Used to be the case but no longer


I was until now unaware that I needed one to operate my 10m sailboat. Are
you sure of this?

Ian

See http://www.msq.qld.gov.au/qt/msq.nsf/index/licensing

Our local yacht club highlighted this about 2 years ago so that everyone could go through the older simpler system before the change.

Peter HK

A question of concern
 

While reading aus.sport.sailing, I noticed "Peter HK"
felt compelled to write:

"Ian George" wrote in message ...

I live in Queensland. I haven't read the regulations for years, but isn't
there something about the boat needing to be capable of planing?

Used to be the case but no longer


I was until now unaware that I needed one to operate my 10m sailboat. Are
you sure of this?

Ian

See http://www.msq.qld.gov.au/qt/msq.nsf/index/licensing

Our local yacht club highlighted this about 2 years ago so that everyone could go through the older simpler system before the change.

I have had a licence for years so either didn't hear or didn't notice
this change. In fact, before licensing was mandatory I got a
boatmaster under the voluntary system in NZ about 30years ago (upon
discovering that dinghy prowess around the bouys hadn't taught me
anything about docking, anchoring, bouyage or navigation or any one of
a hundred other trivial issues :)

I feel constrained to point out, however, that this new 'lifetme
licence' doesn't appear capable of stopping me at 100 yo and
technically blind from terrorising you in my 70 footer (assuming of
course that I make it to 100, lose my eyesight and my boat magically
doubles in size at some stage :)

But thanks for the info.

Cheers,
Ian