Looking to buy used / Boat hours mean anything?
 

I am looking to buy a used bayliner 3055 for around 55K.. prob a year
2000 model. For the money and features, this seems to be a good boat to
get.

My question is when looking at the used listings I see some with 100
hours, some with 400 hours, etc.. should I even care about the hours
listed for the engines? If it passes mechanical and everything is
working, what relevance does this have?

For example should a 100 hour boat cost more?

Thanks for the info :)
Jeff MacDuff

Engine hours mean no more, and no less than "low miles" on an
automobile.

There's a chance that a boat that has 300-400 hours on it now will
eventually outlast a boat that has only 100 hours or so......

I'd be skepitcal of a 5 or 6 year old boat with only 100 hours on it,
unless you live in a climate with a *very* short season. A boat used
only 20 hours a year is probably a very low priority item in somebody's
life, and less likely to be maintained in some important ways that have
little to do with the engine. (Has the same oil been rotting in the
crankcase since 2000?)
I'd look just as thoroughly at a 5 year old engine with 100 hours as at
a 5 year old engine with 400-500 hours (more normal usage). There's
also a chance that the hour meter was disconnected (or replaced) since
the boat was new and you could be dealing with more hours than you
think. Unlike odometer tampering, it isn't a federal crime to swap out
hour meters, etc, on a boat.

Most gas engine boats will see 1000 hours of service, with even minimal
maintenance (which is what most of them seem to get) and excluding some
random, catastrophic event. A good portion will still be running
without a rebuild at 1500 hours, and some very lucky boaters with
stringent maintenance practices will realize 2000 hours or more before
rebuild or replacement is required.

It isn't entirely accurate, but maybe useful for illustration, to view
1000 hours, 1500 hours, and 2000 hours much like 100,000 mi, 150,000
mi, and 200,000 miles on the family auto engine.

In actuality, you boat engine sees the same service that an auto engine
would experience running about 70 mph, uphill, at all times.

that helps allot actually.. I live in the seatle so the season is a
good 5 or 6 months guess.

the 400 hour boat was completly serviced in 2004 with new zinc's and
bottom paint.. not sure about the engine though so I need to find out.

What about the pricing? I see allot of 2000 bayliner 3055's listed
online ( with various addons ) between 62 and 70.. but I dont have a
good idea of what they actually sell for. Nada has a price of between
62 and 65 but in the seattle area there seems to be a slight increase
over that just given the market.

In that size boat it is definetly a buyers market. It is more of a matter
of what are you willing to pay. Start really low and see where he will come
down to. Just remember there are not a lot of poeple out there looking for
a $50,000 + used boat that they immediately have to pay dock fees for. If
they are wanting to sell - they are probably not using it and don't want to
keep paying the dock fee. I would think you can pick it up for no more than
$55k.



--
Tony
my boats and cars at http://t.thomas.home.mchsi.com
wrote in message
ps.com...
that helps allot actually.. I live in the seatle so the season is a
good 5 or 6 months guess.

the 400 hour boat was completly serviced in 2004 with new zinc's and
bottom paint.. not sure about the engine though so I need to find out.

What about the pricing? I see allot of 2000 bayliner 3055's listed
online ( with various addons ) between 62 and 70.. but I dont have a
good idea of what they actually sell for. Nada has a price of between
62 and 65 but in the seattle area there seems to be a slight increase
over that just given the market.

I think there's a 2000 Bayliner, like you're considering, up at Everett
Yacht Sales and it's listed for $49,900.

This is the time of year when boat prices start to soften up on
brokerage boats in the NW.

The best months for sales are March, April, and May- and about now the
sellers begin to get a little nervous about whether their boat is going
to sell at all, this year.

Even though sales in the Seattle area have been *fantastic* for most
brokers this year, it is still a buyer's market and always will be. The
decision-making seller is the owner of the boat, not the broker, and if
he were seeing a flood of offers the boat wouldn't continue to be for
sale. It doesn't matter whether the broker is selling 4-5 boats a week,
the seller is judging the entire market by the fact that *his* boat
remains unsold.

Have an independent mechanic check out the engine of anything you buy,
and you should have a surveyor go through the hull and systems very
carefully as well. Email me off the NG, and I will give you some names
of reliable people you could contact for these purposes in
Seattle.

That's good to know... the particular boat I am looking at is kind of
nice cause it also comes with a good dingy/motor, all the electronics,
etc... basiccly a plug and play boat. I have been looking through allot
of online websites in the NW for the boats but havent found any 3055
listed low, I am surprised 55K should be the target.. that makes me
very happy actually :)

Any good websites / dealers around here would be appreciated. The guys
at olympic boat center rub me the wrong way.

Your comment about not using and want to sell is 100% on the money. The
person selling upgraded to a 49foot bayliner and say's being a admiral
isnt very much fun.

Any good websites / dealers around here would be appreciated. The guys
at olympic boat center rub me the wrong way.


************

Experience dictates that I should refrain from recommending a specific
dealer. :-)

You must have been to the Yachtworld site by now, correct? Use the
"advanced search" function, type in the parameters you're using,
specify "Washington" under the state, and you'll get a good list of
boats available in the area. I checked the site before commenting that
one of them is listed at just under $50k.

You will see that not all dealers are using Yachtworld. It used to be a
given that they would nearly all be there, but a 30-40% price increase
earlier this year has resulted in some of them bailing out.

I see the ciera 2855 when I search on the site, but I dont see a ciera
3055 which is the model I want? Perhaps I have gone insane and cant use
the uber complicated search button?

Thanks for the info on yacht world, ya I been looking there.. but the
prices seemd a bit high.


wrote:
Any good websites / dealers around here would be appreciated. The
guys
at olympic boat center rub me the wrong way.


************

Experience dictates that I should refrain from recommending a
specific
dealer. :-)

You must have been to the Yachtworld site by now, correct? Use the
"advanced search" function, type in the parameters you're using,
specify "Washington" under the state, and you'll get a good list of
boats available in the area. I checked the site before commenting
that
one of them is listed at just under $50k.

You will see that not all dealers are using Yachtworld. It used to be
a
given that they would nearly all be there, but a 30-40% price
increase
earlier this year has resulted in some of them bailing out.

I gave you a bum steer. The guy in Everett listed his boat by its LOA,
rather than the nominal length. Unusual practice, and I should have
caught it myself. Sorry.

The prices on Yachtworld are the asking prices of all the private
sellers represented by the brokers who participate in the service.
There is no single source for the pricing, so with a wide enough view
it will accurately reflect the "asking" (as in fondest dreams) pricing
of the market in general.

Most price guides don't reflect the boat market very well- explaining
why you can find a 30-40% variation sometimes between one guidebook and
the next. An accurate book, (if one existed), *would* report lower
prices than those seen in a general industry site (such as Yachtworld)
because the same people pay the asking price for a used boat that will
pay the window sticker price down at Joe's Used Car lot......(almost
nobody).

Gould I have a 1973 Fiberform 26 with 1700 hours and it just keeps
ticking and ticking it's a Ford 301 with a mercruse alpha drive. I
changed the oil in 1989 filters in 2000, It will not quit.

wrote:

Engine hours mean no more, and no less than "low miles" on an
automobile.

There's a chance that a boat that has 300-400 hours on it now will
eventually outlast a boat that has only 100 hours or so......

I'd be skepitcal of a 5 or 6 year old boat with only 100 hours on it,
unless you live in a climate with a *very* short season. A boat used
only 20 hours a year is probably a very low priority item in somebody's
life, and less likely to be maintained in some important ways that have
little to do with the engine. (Has the same oil been rotting in the
crankcase since 2000?)
I'd look just as thoroughly at a 5 year old engine with 100 hours as at
a 5 year old engine with 400-500 hours (more normal usage). There's
also a chance that the hour meter was disconnected (or replaced) since
the boat was new and you could be dealing with more hours than you
think. Unlike odometer tampering, it isn't a federal crime to swap out
hour meters, etc, on a boat.

Most gas engine boats will see 1000 hours of service, with even minimal
maintenance (which is what most of them seem to get) and excluding some
random, catastrophic event. A good portion will still be running
without a rebuild at 1500 hours, and some very lucky boaters with
stringent maintenance practices will realize 2000 hours or more before
rebuild or replacement is required.

It isn't entirely accurate, but maybe useful for illustration, to view
1000 hours, 1500 hours, and 2000 hours much like 100,000 mi, 150,000
mi, and 200,000 miles on the family auto engine.

In actuality, you boat engine sees the same service that an auto engine
would experience running about 70 mph, uphill, at all times.

This is the time of year when boat prices start to soften up on
brokerage boats in the NW.

The fall is when they soften up. Boat pricing is generally guided by
availability, here in Nova Scotia that craft would probably be purchased
sight unseen, for that price.

wrote:

I gave you a bum steer. The guy in Everett listed his boat by its LOA,
rather than the nominal length. Unusual practice, and I should have
caught it myself. Sorry.

The prices on Yachtworld are the asking prices of all the private
sellers represented by the brokers who participate in the service.
There is no single source for the pricing, so with a wide enough view
it will accurately reflect the "asking" (as in fondest dreams) pricing
of the market in general.

Most price guides don't reflect the boat market very well- explaining
why you can find a 30-40% variation sometimes between one guidebook and
the next. An accurate book, (if one existed), *would* report lower
prices than those seen in a general industry site (such as Yachtworld)
because the same people pay the asking price for a used boat that will
pay the window sticker price down at Joe's Used Car lot......(almost
nobody).

If one was in the market for a Porsche... one had 25,000miles and the other
had 150,000 miles and they were almost the same year and near the same
price. Which one would you want to buy?



wrote in message
ups.com...
I am looking to buy a used bayliner 3055 for around 55K.. prob a year
2000 model. For the money and features, this seems to be a good boat to
get.

My question is when looking at the used listings I see some with 100
hours, some with 400 hours, etc.. should I even care about the hours
listed for the engines? If it passes mechanical and everything is
working, what relevance does this have?

For example should a 100 hour boat cost more?

Thanks for the info :)
Jeff MacDuff

If the price seems to good to be true, it probably is.


"Dry" wrote in message
...
This is the time of year when boat prices start to soften up on
brokerage boats in the NW.

The fall is when they soften up. Boat pricing is generally guided by
availability, here in Nova Scotia that craft would probably be purchased
sight unseen, for that price.

wrote:

I gave you a bum steer. The guy in Everett listed his boat by its LOA,
rather than the nominal length. Unusual practice, and I should have
caught it myself. Sorry.

The prices on Yachtworld are the asking prices of all the private
sellers represented by the brokers who participate in the service.
There is no single source for the pricing, so with a wide enough view
it will accurately reflect the "asking" (as in fondest dreams) pricing
of the market in general.

Most price guides don't reflect the boat market very well- explaining
why you can find a 30-40% variation sometimes between one guidebook and
the next. An accurate book, (if one existed), *would* report lower
prices than those seen in a general industry site (such as Yachtworld)
because the same people pay the asking price for a used boat that will
pay the window sticker price down at Joe's Used Car lot......(almost
nobody).

This is the time of year when boat prices start to soften up on
brokerage boats in the NW.


The fall is when they soften up. Boat pricing is generally guided by
availability, here in Nova Scotia that craft would probably be
purchased
sight unseen, for that price.


************

Your market is different in Nova Scotia, rather obviously.

Prices for larger boats get soft in May out here. The rationale is that
it takes a few weeks to survey, sea trial, finance and close a deal,
and that a lot of people want that new or newer boat for Memorial Day
Weekend.

During the summer months, most of the best prospects for medium size or
larger powerboats aren't shopping for boats- they're out using the
boats they already own.

Prices actually revive a bit for a few weeks after Labor Day, as the
"back from cruising, time to upgrade this boat" market kicks in- but by
mid October our prices tank until the January boat shows.

Gould I have a 1973 Fiberform 26 with 1700 hours and it just keeps
ticking and ticking it's a Ford 301 with a mercruse alpha drive. I
changed the oil in 1989 filters in 2000, It will not quit.


********************

With luck like that, you should have purchased a lottery ticket, not a
boat.

Do you recommend your "maintenance program" to others?

A 33-year old boat with 1700 hours falls into the category, "probably
not a high priority in somebody's life- and therefore may not be
regularly maintained."
If you last changed your oil 16 years ago and your filters
in the year 2000- you do fit the profile.

Hmm.. maybe I should just wait to the winter to buy a new boat... use
the boat I have for this season and then try and get a great deal in
the winter...

I am starting to regret falling in love with boating.. it's becoming a
major headache :)

On 7 May 2005 11:20:19 -0700, wrote:

Hmm.. maybe I should just wait to the winter to buy a new boat... use
the boat I have for this season and then try and get a great deal in
the winter...

I am starting to regret falling in love with boating.. it's becoming a
major headache :)

Which is why my boat is named the 'Poco Loco'.
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

well I am going to look at this boat tomorrow:
http://kennamer.com/ciera.htm

They bought a new 49foot bayliner so they want to get rid of that
one... she lowered the price to 63 for me but it's still a bit high.
Looks nice.. it's going to be hard to walk away from it in the water :)

so you guys are thinking 55K for that boat is a good price, with the
dingy?


John H wrote:
On 7 May 2005 11:20:19 -0700, wrote:

Hmm.. maybe I should just wait to the winter to buy a new boat...
use
the boat I have for this season and then try and get a great deal in
the winter...

I am starting to regret falling in love with boating.. it's becoming
a
major headache :)

Which is why my boat is named the 'Poco Loco'.
--
John H

"All decisions are the result of binary thinking."

On 6 May 2005 12:36:54 -0700, wrote:

I am looking to buy a used bayliner 3055 for around 55K.. prob a year
2000 model. For the money and features, this seems to be a good boat to
get.

Bayliners are junk. And I know, I have a long driveway.