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( OT ) Damned Constitution keeps geting in the way
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7037619/site/newsweek/
March 7 issue - The confession came quickly, and it sounded damning. After a few days of allegedly rough interrogation, Ahmed Omar Abu Ali—a soft-spoken high-school valedictorian from the Washington, D.C., suburbs—either cracked or simply told his questioners what they wanted to hear. While studying in the holy city of Medina, Saudi Arabia, Abu Ali said, he had met with a Qaeda operative and offered to set up a sleeper cell in the United States to organize terror attacks. He wanted to be like September 11 ringleader Muhammad Atta, Abu Ali added in his confession. The young Muslim American even talked about an assassination plot. The purported target: President George W. Bush. Abu Ali allegedly suggested that Bush could either be shot on the street or blown up in a car-bomb attack. After searching his home in Falls Church, Va., and finding seemingly incriminating documents (including a screed by Osama bin Laden's deputy Ayman al-Zawahiri), federal agents became convinced that Abu Ali was indeed "a really bad guy," as one put it. Yet even the top aides to the then Attorney General John Ashcroft didn't think they had anything resembling a solid criminal case. There was no indication the alleged Bush assassination plot ever advanced beyond the talking phase. No FBI agents were there when Abu Ali made his self-incriminating confession. If the Saudis sent Abu Ali home—as they kept offering to do—Justice officials fretted the videotape would likely get tossed out of court, and Abu Ali would walk. "We didn't know what to do with this guy," one former Justice official confided to NEWSWEEK. So for the next 20 months, Justice let Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen, languish in a Saudi jail cell. He had no access to a lawyer, and no charges were filed against him. Critics say this is a prime example of how the Bush administration has "outsourced" the detention of terror suspects to cooperative Mideast countries with poor human-rights records. But Abu Ali's Virginia-based parents—his father works as a computer analyst for the Saudi Embassy—say their son was tortured into confessing to lies, and sued the federal government last year. The judge in the civil case, John Bates, grew impatient. Bates threatened to force Justice officials to explain under oath what they knew about Abu Ali's detention. So the department arranged to charge Abu Ali back in the United States with providing material support to terrorists. |
On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:59:11 GMT, "Jim," wrote:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7037619/site/newsweek/ March 7 issue - The confession came quickly, and it sounded damning. After a few days of allegedly rough interrogation, Ahmed Omar Abu Ali—a soft-spoken high-school valedictorian from the Washington, D.C., suburbs—either cracked or simply told his questioners what they wanted to hear. While studying in the holy city of Medina, Saudi Arabia, Abu Ali said, he had met with a Qaeda operative and offered to set up a sleeper cell in the United States to organize terror attacks. He wanted to be like September 11 ringleader Muhammad Atta, Abu Ali added in his confession. The young Muslim American even talked about an assassination plot. The purported target: President George W. Bush. Abu Ali allegedly suggested that Bush could either be shot on the street or blown up in a car-bomb attack. After searching his home in Falls Church, Va., and finding seemingly incriminating documents (including a screed by Osama bin Laden's deputy Ayman al-Zawahiri), federal agents became convinced that Abu Ali was indeed "a really bad guy," as one put it. Yet even the top aides to the then Attorney General John Ashcroft didn't think they had anything resembling a solid criminal case. There was no indication the alleged Bush assassination plot ever advanced beyond the talking phase. No FBI agents were there when Abu Ali made his self-incriminating confession. If the Saudis sent Abu Ali home—as they kept offering to do—Justice officials fretted the videotape would likely get tossed out of court, and Abu Ali would walk. "We didn't know what to do with this guy," one former Justice official confided to NEWSWEEK. So for the next 20 months, Justice let Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen, languish in a Saudi jail cell. He had no access to a lawyer, and no charges were filed against him. Critics say this is a prime example of how the Bush administration has "outsourced" the detention of terror suspects to cooperative Mideast countries with poor human-rights records. But Abu Ali's Virginia-based parents—his father works as a computer analyst for the Saudi Embassy—say their son was tortured into confessing to lies, and sued the federal government last year. The judge in the civil case, John Bates, grew impatient. Bates threatened to force Justice officials to explain under oath what they knew about Abu Ali's detention. So the department arranged to charge Abu Ali back in the United States with providing material support to terrorists. Good, now they'll hopefully put the asshole in prison where he belongs. Maybe they'll round up some of his buddies to send also. Be careful! Stop snivelling and whining. It's unbecoming. It makes you sound like Harry. John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes |
From tonight's 60 Minutes:
Feb 27, 2005 6:09 pm US/Central (CBS) Last week, the Justice Department indicted an Arab-American named Ahmed Omar Abu Ali for plotting to assassinate President Bush. He was handed over to U.S. authorities after being detained without charges for 20 months in a prison in Saudi Arabia. The case is complicated by allegations of torture, but according to the indictment, it was while he was studying in Saudi Arabia that Ali made contact with al Qaeda. The kingdom’s mosques and schools have been cited as a breeding ground for extremism. |
Turn on 60 minutes right now. |
"Jim," wrote in message ... http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7037619/site/newsweek/ March 7 issue - The confession came quickly, and it sounded damning. After a few days of allegedly rough interrogation, Ahmed Omar Abu Ali—a soft-spoken high-school valedictorian from the Washington, D.C., suburbs—either cracked or simply told his questioners what they wanted to hear. While studying in the holy city of Medina, Saudi Arabia, Abu Ali said, he had met with a Qaeda operative and offered to set up a sleeper cell in the United States to organize terror attacks. He wanted to be like September 11 ringleader Muhammad Atta, Abu Ali added in his confession. The young Muslim American even talked about an assassination plot. The purported target: President George W. Bush. Abu Ali allegedly suggested that Bush could either be shot on the street or blown up in a car-bomb attack. After searching his home in Falls Church, Va., and finding seemingly incriminating documents (including a screed by Osama bin Laden's deputy Ayman al-Zawahiri), federal agents became convinced that Abu Ali was indeed "a really bad guy," as one put it. Yet even the top aides to the then Attorney General John Ashcroft didn't think they had anything resembling a solid criminal case. There was no indication the alleged Bush assassination plot ever advanced beyond the talking phase. No FBI agents were there when Abu Ali made his self-incriminating confession. If the Saudis sent Abu Ali home—as they kept offering to do—Justice officials fretted the videotape would likely get tossed out of court, and Abu Ali would walk. "We didn't know what to do with this guy," one former Justice official confided to NEWSWEEK. So for the next 20 months, Justice let Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen, languish in a Saudi jail cell. He had no access to a lawyer, and no charges were filed against him. Critics say this is a prime example of how the Bush administration has "outsourced" the detention of terror suspects to cooperative Mideast countries with poor human-rights records. But Abu Ali's Virginia-based parents—his father works as a computer analyst for the Saudi Embassy—say their son was tortured into confessing to lies, and sued the federal government last year. The judge in the civil case, John Bates, grew impatient. Bates threatened to force Justice officials to explain under oath what they knew about Abu Ali's detention. So the department arranged to charge Abu Ali back in the United States with providing material support to terrorists. I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? |
On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote:
I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? |
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? |
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? |
NOYB wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Is this the fellow that the US picked up and then turned over to the Saudis? You know the planes that don't exist that are used to move prisoners to "friendly countries" where they can be tortured legally? |
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question, but I don't trust the Bush Administration or its collaborators in Saudi Arabia to tell the truth about anything. Bush and his cohorts stand up there and lie about one important matter after another. Why would I believe them this time? If there was some deep conspiracy here, then the Bush admin could have just pushed the Saudis to execute the guy. Why extradite him back to the states? They could have arranged that he died in a shootout in Saudi Arabia just like his co-conspirator: http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/...0979097.htm?1c The guy attended the Islamic Saudi Academy...a school in Virginia that teaches Wahabbism. Here's a curriculum description for the first grade: "For the teacher: Explain that all religions, other than Islam, are false, including that of the Jews, Christians, and all others." Sounds like a fun place! |
"NOYB" wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question, but I don't trust the Bush Administration or its collaborators in Saudi Arabia to tell the truth about anything. Bush and his cohorts stand up there and lie about one important matter after another. Why would I believe them this time? If there was some deep conspiracy here, then the Bush admin could have just pushed the Saudis to execute the guy. Why extradite him back to the states? They could have arranged that he died in a shootout in Saudi Arabia just like his co-conspirator: http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/...0979097.htm?1c The guy attended the Islamic Saudi Academy...a school in Virginia that teaches Wahabbism. Here's a curriculum description for the first grade: "For the teacher: Explain that all religions, other than Islam, are false, including that of the Jews, Christians, and all others." Sounds like a fun place! I attended Junior High School in that building when it was Walt Whitman Jr. High School. A few years ago they tried to purchase some land northwest of Potomac, MD in a place called Poolesville and the community chased them out. I say keep them in their current location where everybody knows who they are and what they are doing/ |
On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:24:42 -0500, NOYB wrote:
The guy attended the Islamic Saudi Academy...a school in Virginia that teaches Wahabbism. Here's a curriculum description for the first grade: "For the teacher: Explain that all religions, other than Islam, are false, including that of the Jews, Christians, and all others." LOL, I remember my first grade teacher saying pretty much the same thing, only she included Islam in the second group. She was a nun, by the way. Sounds like a fun place! I didn't think so, but then I never did care for school. |
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:03:59 GMT, "Jim," wrote:
NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Is this the fellow that the US picked up and then turned over to the Saudis? You know the planes that don't exist that are used to move prisoners to "friendly countries" where they can be tortured legally? Jimcomma, watch a decent news channel and you'll know what all the discussion is about. John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes |
On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:32:41 -0500, "Bert Robbins" wrote:
"NOYB" wrote in message ... "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question, but I don't trust the Bush Administration or its collaborators in Saudi Arabia to tell the truth about anything. Bush and his cohorts stand up there and lie about one important matter after another. Why would I believe them this time? If there was some deep conspiracy here, then the Bush admin could have just pushed the Saudis to execute the guy. Why extradite him back to the states? They could have arranged that he died in a shootout in Saudi Arabia just like his co-conspirator: http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/...0979097.htm?1c The guy attended the Islamic Saudi Academy...a school in Virginia that teaches Wahabbism. Here's a curriculum description for the first grade: "For the teacher: Explain that all religions, other than Islam, are false, including that of the Jews, Christians, and all others." Sounds like a fun place! I attended Junior High School in that building when it was Walt Whitman Jr. High School. A few years ago they tried to purchase some land northwest of Potomac, MD in a place called Poolesville and the community chased them out. I say keep them in their current location where everybody knows who they are and what they are doing/ I'll bet you even remember when there was a Dairy Queen on the corner! John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes |
John H wrote:
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:03:59 GMT, "Jim," wrote: NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Is this the fellow that the US picked up and then turned over to the Saudis? You know the planes that don't exist that are used to move prisoners to "friendly countries" where they can be tortured legally? Jimcomma, watch a decent news channel and you'll know what all the discussion is about. John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes John, you're rapidly earning a place in my bozobin with the childish shots. |
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:11:59 GMT, "Jim," wrote:
John H wrote: On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:03:59 GMT, "Jim," wrote: NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Is this the fellow that the US picked up and then turned over to the Saudis? You know the planes that don't exist that are used to move prisoners to "friendly countries" where they can be tortured legally? Jimcomma, watch a decent news channel and you'll know what all the discussion is about. John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes John, you're rapidly earning a place in my bozobin with the childish shots. You're the one who asked the childish questions! Being placed in your 'bozobin' (isn't that what Harry K used to call his killfile?) will be a very bad thing for me. Please, please, please don't put me there. I just couldn't stand it. It would greatly detract from my self-image, and you would be responsible for any detrimental psychological effects which may take place. Pleeeeeeeez! Don't throw me in your 'bozobin'! John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes |
John H wrote:
On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:11:59 GMT, "Jim," wrote: John H wrote: On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:03:59 GMT, "Jim," wrote: NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... thunder wrote: On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:38:55 -0500, JimH wrote: I hope this *soft spoken valedictorian who studied in the holy city of Medina* gets everything coming to him that he deserves. Hey, he was only joking about setting up a sleeper cell in the US to conduct terrorist attacks and then assassinating the POTUS.....right? And just how in the hell do you know what he deserves? That little birdie been talking to you again. Personally, I believe in the concept of innocent until *proven* guilty. Why don't you try him, before you hang him? Hey...this is the United States of NeoCon...we don't even have to charge people with crimes anymore in order to hold them for years. He's been charged with a crime. And he'll have a chance to defend himself in court...which is more than he probably deserves. He was picked up by Saudi Intelligence allegedly after making contact with several known al Qaeda associates. Do you think that they were just exchanging recipes for kharuf mahshi? Saudi intelligence? ??? Is this the fellow that the US picked up and then turned over to the Saudis? You know the planes that don't exist that are used to move prisoners to "friendly countries" where they can be tortured legally? Jimcomma, watch a decent news channel and you'll know what all the discussion is about. John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes John, you're rapidly earning a place in my bozobin with the childish shots. You're the one who asked the childish questions! I recently read about an American citizen, picked up by some government agency at an airport, and sent someplace for "questioning" I asked if this was the guy; intending to clarify a point. How is that childish? Being placed in your 'bozobin' (isn't that what Harry K used to call his killfile?) will be a very bad thing for me. Please, please, please don't put me there. I just couldn't stand it. It would greatly detract from my self-image, and you would be responsible for any detrimental psychological effects which may take place. Pleeeeeeeez! Don't throw me in your 'bozobin'! Now who is being childish? As to Harry K; all I know of him is what I read here -- He's anti-bush and hated by the righties -- makes him OK in my book John H On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD, on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay! "Divide each difficulty into as many parts as is feasible and necessary to resolve it." Rene Descartes |
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia .... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." |
NOYB wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? |
"Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? What does it matter at this point? All we know is that he is an admitted terrorist. The rest will come out in court. So don't sweat. He will get his day in court. Maybe he will be freed on a legal technicality and go on to murder US citizens or even the POTUS. Maybe then you will be happy. A certain participant of this NG was recently when reporting the death of over 100 Iraqi's from a suicide bomber. |
JimH wrote:
"Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? What does it matter at this point? All we know is that he is an admitted terrorist. The rest will come out in court. So don't sweat. He will get his day in court. Maybe he will be freed on a legal technicality and go on to murder US citizens or even the POTUS. Maybe then you will be happy. A certain participant of this NG was recently when reporting the death of over 100 Iraqi's from a suicide bomber. So now you also approve of torture as a means of obtaining "confessions"? |
"Jim," wrote in message ... JimH wrote: "Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? What does it matter at this point? All we know is that he is an admitted terrorist. The rest will come out in court. So don't sweat. He will get his day in court. Maybe he will be freed on a legal technicality and go on to murder US citizens or even the POTUS. Maybe then you will be happy. A certain participant of this NG was recently when reporting the death of over 100 Iraqi's from a suicide bomber. So now you also approve of torture as a means of obtaining "confessions"? Perhaps. It depends on the situation and how you define torture. |
"Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? Why should it matter? |
"Jim," wrote in message ... JimH wrote: "Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? What does it matter at this point? All we know is that he is an admitted terrorist. The rest will come out in court. So don't sweat. He will get his day in court. Maybe he will be freed on a legal technicality and go on to murder US citizens or even the POTUS. Maybe then you will be happy. A certain participant of this NG was recently when reporting the death of over 100 Iraqi's from a suicide bomber. So now you also approve of torture as a means of obtaining "confessions"? I do. |
"NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? Why should it matter? It does matter. A lot! With extreme torture you can get anybody to sign anything. |
"Calif Bill" wrote in message ink.net... "NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? Why should it matter? It does matter. A lot! With extreme torture you can get anybody to sign anything. He claims that he was whipped by the Saudis. We're not talking permanent disfigurement, broken bones, cutting off fingers, attaching electrodes to his nuts, etc... The man was smacked across the back a few dozen times (alledgedly), and then copped to the charges of trying to assassinate Bush, trying to create sleeper cells in the states, and trying to create mass murder via terrorism. He's guilty as ****. If he walks, then he's a perfect example of a criminal beating our system "on a technicality". |
On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 20:16:42 GMT, "NOYB" wrote:
He's guilty as ****. If he walks, then he's a perfect example of a criminal beating our system "on a technicality". My kind of justice! John H "All decisions are the result of binary thinking." |
"NOYB" wrote in message link.net... "Calif Bill" wrote in message ink.net... "NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? Why should it matter? It does matter. A lot! With extreme torture you can get anybody to sign anything. He claims that he was whipped by the Saudis. We're not talking permanent disfigurement, broken bones, cutting off fingers, attaching electrodes to his nuts, etc... The man was smacked across the back a few dozen times (alledgedly), and then copped to the charges of trying to assassinate Bush, trying to create sleeper cells in the states, and trying to create mass murder via terrorism. He's guilty as ****. If he walks, then he's a perfect example of a criminal beating our system "on a technicality". I guess it is OK, the next time you get caught speeding, for the cop to beat the crap out of you as long as no broken bones or disfigurement occurs. |
"Calif Bill" wrote in message nk.net... "NOYB" wrote in message link.net... "Calif Bill" wrote in message ink.net... "NOYB" wrote in message ink.net... "Jim," wrote in message ... NOYB wrote: "Harry Krause" wrote in message ... Look, I don't know the particulars of the fellow in question Then here are some more particulars: Suspect Said to Admit Plan to Kill Bush 1 hour, 28 minutes ago By MATTHEW BARAKAT, Associated Press Writer ALEXANDRIA, Va. - A Virginia man accused of plotting with al-Qaida to assassinate President Bush has admitted his guilt on numerous occasions, an FBI agent testified Tuesday. Ahmed Omar Abu Ali, 23, admitted "multiple times" that he joined al-Qaida while studying overseas in Saudi Arabia and discussed plans with the terrorist network to assassinate President Bush, FBI agent Barry Cole said. The agent also said the suspect talked about plans for a Sept. 11-type attack in which "hijackers would board planes in Great Britain and Australia ... so they did not have to have U.S. visas." "Once into U.S. territories they would fly into designated targets," he said. Abu Ali also discussed killing U.S. congressmen, soldiers and blowing up naval ships in American ports, Cole said. He said Abu Ali's confessions are corroborated by the admissions of an al-Qaida cell leader in Saudi Arabia who surrendered to authorities. Abu Ali, a U.S. citizen who grew up in Falls Church, is charged with conspiring with al-Qaida to kill the president in a plan that prosecutors said was hatched while he studied in Saudi Arabia in 2002 and 2003. Cole said that the al-Qaida leaders gave Abu Ali two options: He could either become part of a martyr operation or he could establish a cell in the United States and he would "marry a Christian woman, assimilate into the community and he would be provided operatives." Did he confess freely, or under torture? Why should it matter? It does matter. A lot! With extreme torture you can get anybody to sign anything. He claims that he was whipped by the Saudis. We're not talking permanent disfigurement, broken bones, cutting off fingers, attaching electrodes to his nuts, etc... The man was smacked across the back a few dozen times (alledgedly), and then copped to the charges of trying to assassinate Bush, trying to create sleeper cells in the states, and trying to create mass murder via terrorism. He's guilty as ****. If he walks, then he's a perfect example of a criminal beating our system "on a technicality". I guess it is OK, the next time you get caught speeding, for the cop to beat the crap out of you as long as no broken bones or disfigurement occurs. I'd confess to speeding before he removed his nightstick from his belt. But I wouldn't falsely admit to being a terrorist planning to kill the President, and create sleeper terror cells in the States. |
"Harry Krause" wrote in message ... I guess it is OK, the next time you get caught speeding, for the cop to beat the crap out of you as long as no broken bones or disfigurement occurs. I'd confess to speeding before he removed his nightstick from his belt. But I wouldn't falsely admit to being a terrorist planning to kill the President, and create sleeper terror cells in the States. What? I thought you always carried a Glock on the front passenger seat... Or was that a different dentist? )} I had a handgun in my earlier years, but no longer own it. It was a .25 with the serial numbers scratched off the side that I got from my grandfather (who is now deceased). He went to the local pub a lot, and got to know the bartenders pretty well. Most of the guys tending bar back then were off-duty policeman. It was not uncommon for some of them to carry "throw-down" in case they shot an unarmed bad guy. I never asked where the gun came from, but later in life it dawned on me that it's probably not a good idea to carry around an unlicensed firearm that had the serial number scratched off. My brother took it after college...but I'm not sure even he owns it any longer. |
NOYB wrote:
I'd confess to speeding before he removed his nightstick from his belt. But I wouldn't falsely admit to being a terrorist planning to kill the President, and create sleeper terror cells in the States. After sufficient beating you might. |
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