REC.BOATS when it was about BOATS..
 

Just an open snivel-does anyone remember when this NG was a boating information
source? Where somebody with an interest in boating could post a query or just
"read the mail" and not have to wade (pun intended) through the political BS
and personal attacks?
I do...was fun and informative..not now.
One reason I bought (several) boats was because once I cleared the last channel
buoy outbound all that stuff didn't exist anymore...and this NG used to reflect
that feeling.
Can we maybe, just maybe, get back to the boating basics that was the basis of
REC.BOATS and quit chumming the dingbats? If we don't feed 'em they won't
come.
Best wishes
Mike

The content of the site is controlled by those who contribute, not those who
primarily spectate.

Post a boating topic here. It will get three or four responses, maybe, and then
disappear unless somebody calls somebody else a name or mentions a political
issue,,,,,,in which case it will go on for weeks.

It should be a boating newsgroup. Boaters should participate. Can't have one
without the other.

A casual browsing through newsgroups indicates that many groups, dedicated to a
variety of topics, seem to have identical problems.

Has the NG format outlived its usefulness as a primary resource for FAQ and
general information? Do folks with a question about, say, small craft warning
flags still hunt down a boating NG, post a question, and wait a day or so to
see if any answers emerge- or do they go to Google, type in "small craft
warning signals", and get an answer almost instantly that is probably at least
as credible as the info emerging from a newsgroup where people spend half their
time calling names?

If the non-boaters posting to rec.boats as a political sounding board
disappeared, there would be three or four new threads per day. Maybe, most
days.

Do you know of an unmoderated boating NG without any OT posts and personal
attacks?

On 26 Oct 2004 02:28:58 GMT, (CaptMP) wrote:

Just an open snivel-does anyone remember when this NG was a boating information
source? Where somebody with an interest in boating could post a query or just
"read the mail" and not have to wade (pun intended) through the political BS
and personal attacks?
I do...was fun and informative..not now.
One reason I bought (several) boats was because once I cleared the last channel
buoy outbound all that stuff didn't exist anymore...and this NG used to reflect
that feeling.
Can we maybe, just maybe, get back to the boating basics that was the basis of
REC.BOATS and quit chumming the dingbats? If we don't feed 'em they won't
come.

Sadly, it takes self-discipline from the mainline posters to keep the
noise level down.

It would appear that's not likely here. :)

Later,

Tom

"Beware the one legged man in a butt
kicking contest - he is there for a
reason."

Wun Hung Lo - date unknown

"CaptMP" wrote in message
...
Just an open snivel-does anyone remember when this NG was a boating
information
source? Where somebody with an interest in boating could post a query or
just
"read the mail" and not have to wade (pun intended) through the political
BS
and personal attacks?
I do...was fun and informative..not now.
One reason I bought (several) boats was because once I cleared the last
channel
buoy outbound all that stuff didn't exist anymore...and this NG used to
reflect
that feeling.
Can we maybe, just maybe, get back to the boating basics that was the
basis of
REC.BOATS and quit chumming the dingbats? If we don't feed 'em they won't
come.
Best wishes
Mike

Yep...I remember...what a great group it was. I don't know how it became a
magnet for the impaired, but what's even sadder, is that there are just 3 or
4 people responsible for it.

Sad day indeed...

--
-Netsock

"It's just about going fast...that's all..."
http://home.columbus.rr.com/ckg/

On Tuesday 26 October 2004 11:50 am in rec.boats Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

Sadly, it takes self-discipline from the mainline posters to keep the
noise level down.

It would appear that's not likely here. :)

What does the newsgroup's charter say about off-topic
postings ?

We probably need an RFC to update the charter and
possibly implement a cancelbot to reduce the noise.

OTOH, a visit to certain idiots by Mr Chainsaw would
probably solve the problem.

--
My real address is crn (at) netunix (dot) com
WARNING all messages containing attachments or html will be silently
deleted. Send only plain text.

"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...

If the non-boaters posting to rec.boats as a political sounding board
disappeared, there would be three or four new threads per day. Maybe, most
days.


Is it really about quantity? I think not, but either way, your memory
appears to be failing you, Chuck. Think back 5-6 years ago, and you will
recall that there were dozens of interesting on topic (or at least
entertaining) threads here daily, posted by an experientially and
geographically diverse group of people. It was a fun and interesting place
to visit and participate for those that had more than a passing interest in
boating. Sadly, the vast majority of people who offered informative content
or terrific entertainment have found other places to spend their leisure
keyboard time, probably where they are more appreciated. What's left is,
for the most part, a huge crashing bore. Christ, even a return by Skip
might be an improvement, and I never thought I'd say that.

The truth is that each of us individually has the opportunity to be part of
the problem or part of the solution. Each can choose to initiate and/or
respond the to the rote, mechanical, polarizing, and unbelievably dull
political horse****, or choose not to. For those that find politics so
interesting (I really haven't the stomach for it), there are certainly
places to find those of like interests.

I'm not exactly sure how this newsgroup became the outstanding community it
was back in it's hey day. I only go back 6-7 years here. But it is quite
obvious how it got to its current decrepit state. A very small handful of
prolific posters have the ability to change the course and tenor of the
group with ease, and mold it to their desires. The rest of us will have
much less impact, but are potential contributors to the well-being or malady
of the group, nonetheless.

We get the newsgroup we deserve, and it would seem that there are a number
of members (for lack of a better word) that like things just as they are.
But to my mind, the group has become very small and oh, so very stagnant.
The cure for that is growth and diversity of posters, hopefully ones with a
genuine interest in boating. But I can see that anybody who stumbles into
rec.boats for the first time, looking for an interesting boating-related
internet experience, would take a quick look and say thanks, but no thanks.
Sort of hard to grow your membership when the vast majority of your content
is completely unrelated to the title of the group. Add to that the number
of interesting former posters that have moved on (for the same reason), and
it's no wonder the group has suffered so.

Subject: REC.BOATS when it was about BOATS..
From: (Gould 0738)

The content of the site is controlled by those who contribute, not those who
primarily spectate.

Those who "spectate" are not part of the problem. The problem is those who
"contribute" nothing but OT post and those contributers (be they normal boating
contributors or just OT contibutors) who can't keep their hands from the
keyboard everytime they read an OT post.

Post a boating topic here. It will get three or four responses, maybe, and
then
disappear unless somebody calls somebody else a name or mentions a political
issue,,,,,,in which case it will go on for weeks.

Most boating topics only require 3-4 responses to "solve" the problem. Sounds
like you're trying to justify OT posting as if it's some way to keep the NG
going. I disagree. I've seen other NG's where people refrain from responding to
OT's, where the daily numbers may be much lower and sometimes real low,
but....so what?

It should be a boating newsgroup. Boaters should participate. Can't have one
without the other.

A newsgroup is not of value because you see a large number of postings.... it's
value is in the quality of it's postings relating to the subject matter.


A casual browsing through newsgroups indicates that many groups, dedicated to
a
variety of topics, seem to have identical problems.

This is a given, but the quality of many remains high because most regular
posters refrain from commenting (for the most part) to OT post.


Has the NG format outlived its usefulness as a primary resource for FAQ and
general information? Do folks with a question about, say, small craft warning
flags still hunt down a boating NG, post a question, and wait a day or so to
see if any answers emerge- or do they go to Google, type in "small craft
warning signals", and get an answer almost instantly that is probably at
least
as credible as the info emerging from a newsgroup where people spend half
their
time calling names?

Most questions would not require that much waiting time. What they do require,
is too much time, wading through the OT BS trying to find their post and
responses.


If the non-boaters posting to rec.boats as a political sounding board
disappeared, there would be three or four new threads per day. Maybe, most
days.

So?


Do you know of an unmoderated boating NG without any OT posts and personal
attacks?

Nope, but I've seen many where it's obvious that group ettiquette keeps these
in check for the simple reason that the "regulars" refrain from being drawn in.

Sorry, but it appears to me, you're making excuses as to why we should continue
to allow the status quo in this NG regarding OT posting, and I disagree.

However!!! BG I'm off the soap box!!!

Shen

Lloyd Sumpter wrote:
On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 02:28:58 +0000, CaptMP wrote:


Just an open snivel-does anyone remember when this NG was a boating information
source? Where somebody with an interest in boating could post a query or just
"read the mail" and not have to wade (pun intended) through the political BS
and personal attacks?
I do...was fun and informative..not now.


Actually, it's still fun and informative, just not boating-related. I get
my boating/fishing info from another board, and I get What the Typical
American is Thinking from this one. Usually kinda scary, but informative.

Lloyd Sumpter, Canadian, Green Party supporter.


You better watch your back, Lloyd. Rumor has it that we are going to
invade Canada to steal your flu shot supplies.

Eisboch

"Eisboch" wrote in message
...

You better watch your back, Lloyd. Rumor has it that we are going to
invade Canada to steal your flu shot supplies.


no need...just send us your sick & tired elderly citizens and we will take
care of them.

I own 2 1/2 boats. A 26' Parker, a 36" Lobster Boat and 1/2 of a canoe. I
even use them so there.



Oh oh. You need to type more carefully, amigo. Thou art wide open after that
one.
:-)

In article ,
(Gould 0738) writes:

Post a boating topic here. It will get three or four responses, maybe, and
then
disappear unless somebody calls somebody else a name or mentions a political
issue,,,,,,in which case it will go on for weeks.

I have read this newsgroup off and on for almost 10 years.

It has always been full of junk. The first time I came here, the Harry-Skipper
wars were going on and consumed tremendous amounts of bandwidth. They
continued for years.

The last few years, the politics has outweighed the other stuff, but I don't
know that the signal to noise ratio is any worse now than it was in 1995. I do
think the invective is worse, because of those (primarily but not exclusively)
rightwingers who cannot carry on a reasoned political discussion, but, instead,
attack any view with which they do not agree with ad hominem invective--but
then the politics of character assassination seems to be the right-wing way.

Then again, when you can adduce no evidence to support your position, the best
available alternative is personal attack. Attack enough, and folks might
forget that the emperor has no clothes.

Frank Bell
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

A. Top Posting.

Q. What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

In article , Lloyd Sumpter
writes:

I get What the Typical
American is Thinking from this one. Usually kinda scary, but informative.

Lloyd, what you see here is not typical.

Thank heavens.

Frank Bell
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

A. Top Posting.

Q. What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

basically, the o.t.s are just that.
After all, no one likes an O.T. poster, sorta speaks for it self.

Do you think the feel good about it.?

No, there are boaters, there are nice people, and then , there are O.T.
posters.

I have to admit that there really never was a 36' Lobster Boat, but it sure
did stir up the right wing trash didn't it.


"Gould 0738" wrote in message
...
I own 2 1/2 boats. A 26' Parker, a 36" Lobster Boat and 1/2 of a canoe.
I
even use them so there.



Oh oh. You need to type more carefully, amigo. Thou art wide open after
that
one.
:-)

You mean this group is not REC.VOTES? Rats that means my vote is adrift
at sea. Ahoy matey been out voting and caught me a biggun!!

FRANKWBELL wrote:
In article ,
(Gould 0738) writes:


Post a boating topic here. It will get three or four responses, maybe, and
then
disappear unless somebody calls somebody else a name or mentions a political
issue,,,,,,in which case it will go on for weeks.


I have read this newsgroup off and on for almost 10 years.

It has always been full of junk. The first time I came here, the Harry-Skipper
wars were going on and consumed tremendous amounts of bandwidth. They
continued for years.

The last few years, the politics has outweighed the other stuff, but I don't
know that the signal to noise ratio is any worse now than it was in 1995. I do
think the invective is worse, because of those (primarily but not exclusively)
rightwingers who cannot carry on a reasoned political discussion, but, instead,
attack any view with which they do not agree with ad hominem invective--but
then the politics of character assassination seems to be the right-wing way.

Then again, when you can adduce no evidence to support your position, the best
available alternative is personal attack. Attack enough, and folks might
forget that the emperor has no clothes.

Frank Bell
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

A. Top Posting.

Q. What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 18:40:34 GMT, "Harry Krause"
wrote:

I own 2 1/2 boats. A 26' Parker, a 36" Lobster Boat and 1/2 of a canoe. I
even use them so there.

======================================

The 36 inch lobster boat sounds interesting. Is it radio controlled?

Half canoes are interesting also depending on which way they were
divided.

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:44:07 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 18:40:34 GMT, "Harry Krause"
wrote:

I own 2 1/2 boats. A 26' Parker, a 36" Lobster Boat and 1/2 of a canoe. I
even use them so there.

======================================

The 36 inch lobster boat sounds interesting. Is it radio controlled?

Half canoes are interesting also depending on which way they were
divided.

Stem to stern. :)

Later,

Tom

"Beware the one legged man in a butt
kicking contest - he is there for a
reason."

Wun Hung Lo - date unknown

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:44:07 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 18:40:34 GMT, "Harry Krause"
wrote:

I own 2 1/2 boats. A 26' Parker, a 36" Lobster Boat and 1/2 of a canoe.
I
even use them so there.

======================================

The 36 inch lobster boat sounds interesting. Is it radio controlled?

Half canoes are interesting also depending on which way they were
divided.

I can't believe Harry is finally telling the truth about that lobsta
boat. He probably did the same thing umpteen years ago when he first
mentioned it, but no one caught the symbol.

John H

On the 'PocoLoco' out of Deale, MD,
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

There are 10 kinds of people in the world,
those who can do binary and those who can't!

Too funny. Notice that he names the manufacturer of the 25 footer but not
the never seen lobster boat.

On 10/26/2004 10:14 AM, Eisboch wrote:

Lloyd Sumpter wrote:

Actually, it's still fun and informative, just not boating-related. I get
my boating/fishing info from another board, and I get What the Typical
American is Thinking from this one. Usually kinda scary, but informative.

Lloyd Sumpter, Canadian, Green Party supporter.


You better watch your back, Lloyd. Rumor has it that we are going to
invade Canada to steal your flu shot supplies.

Too late: http://www.komotv.com/stories/33641.htm

(Hey, this is even an on-topic post! Am I allowed to do that?) ;)


--
~/Garth - 1966 Glastron V-142 Skiflite: "Blue-Boat"
"There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing about in boats."
-Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

On 10/27/2004 9:38 AM, JohnH wrote:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:44:07 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:


On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 18:40:34 GMT, "Harry Krause"
wrote:


I own 2 1/2 boats. A 26' Parker, a 36" Lobster Boat and 1/2 of a canoe. I
even use them so there.

======================================

The 36 inch lobster boat sounds interesting. Is it radio controlled?

Half canoes are interesting also depending on which way they were
divided.


I can't believe Harry is finally telling the truth about that lobsta
boat.

Good thing you can't believe it; You did realize that you and Wayne are
responding to Jon Smithe, right?



--
~/Garth - 1966 Glastron V-142 Skiflite: "Blue-Boat"
"There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing about in boats."
-Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

On 10/27/2004 4:14 PM, JohnH wrote:

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 16:07:01 -0700, Garth Almgren
wrote:

On 10/27/2004 9:38 AM, JohnH wrote:

I can't believe Harry is finally telling the truth about that lobsta
boat.

Good thing you can't believe it; You did realize that you and Wayne are
responding to Jon Smithe, right?


I haven't responded to Harry Krause in several weeks.

Nor did I say you did. You replied to Wayne who replied to Jon who was
pretending to be Harry.

Someone responded to Harry's post

Except it wasn't Harry's post.

about his 36" lobsta boat, which was the
first honest post Harry's made. Are you saying he doesn't even have a
radio-controlled lobsta boat?

I wouldn't know what boats Jon has, since I've never met him and I can't
recall ever reading about any boats he owns. He seems to spend most of
his time here either attacking or impersonating Harry.


So, when I thought he had finally told the truth, it was a lie?

Yes. A lie and a poor attempt at an impersonation.

Though, imitation *is* the sincerest form of flattery. :)

You mean he didn't really change his email to ?

Looks like he did indeed change it from to
. Appropriate, no? :)



--
~/Garth - 1966 Glastron V-142 Skiflite: "Blue-Boat"
"There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing about in boats."
-Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 16:30:36 -0700, Garth Almgren
wrote:

I wouldn't know what boats Jon has, since I've never met him and I can't
recall ever reading about any boats he owns. He seems to spend most of
his time here either attacking or impersonating Harry.

===========================================

Yeah, we've been had. It was posted from IP address 24.98.9.150 (AT&T
Atlanta) which is where Mr Smithe's posts originate. Sure hope no one
tries to hack his PC or plant a virus ;-)