Coast Guard Nonsense
 

I need to whine a little.

Yesterday, I was returning from fishing on Lake Ontario in my 14' nookular
powered aluminum yacht. It was a typical Sunday on Irondequoit Bay: Large
boats driven by nitwits were travelling at top speed through clearly marked
no-wake zones, throwing enormous wakes down the aisles of docked boats at
the marina near the inlet, and making it dicey for boats at the nearby
launch.

In the midst of all this madness, I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security. I was pulled over for a
safety check. I was cited for not having my registration, a distress flag
and a fire extinguisher. They were correct on the first two issues, but
based on their own rules and those of NY State, I'm not required to have a
fire extinguisher. Actually, I bought one when I first got the boat, but
found that there wasn't a good place to mount the thing except for right
next to the (portable) gas tank, which didn't make much sense considering
how the probability is close to 100% that a fire would start there.

I have 7 days to have a boarding officer look at the boat again, or pay a
fine and forfeit my son and my lawnmower. This inspection will be based on
opinion and interpretation, so I'm looking for votes from the peanut
gallery, even though this may be a futile effort. The boat has 3 aluminum
bench seats which do NOT have storage underneath. They're sealed and filled
with floatation material. There are no storage lockers of any kind, and the
hull is one layer - no bilge, no floor of any kind.

NY State says I'm exempt from the extinguisher requirement:
- Outboards less than 26' and of open construction

The Coast Guard's site says I must have an extinguisher if any of these
conditions are met:

a.. Inboard engines are installed.

b.. There are closed compartments and compartments under seats where
portable fuel tanks may be stored.
c.. There are double bottoms not sealed to the hull or which are not
completely filled with flotation materials.
d.. There are closed living spaces.
e.. There are closed stowage compartments in which combustible or
flammable materials are stored.
f.. There are permanently installed fuel tanks. (Fuel tanks secured so
they cannot be moved in case of fire or other emergency are considered
permanently installed. There are no gallon capacity limits to determine if a
fuel tank is portable. If the weight of a fuel tank is such that persons on
board cannot move it, the Coast Guard considers it permanently installed.)
Help me waste my time arguing with the Coast Guard. :-) That last rule
sounds silly for my situation. First of all, I can left my 6 gallon tank
with my toe. But, even so, if the engine/tank area (aft of the rear bench
seat) went up in flames, how likely is it that I'd try to lift the tank and
throw it overboard??? Excluding that, the most likely fire hazard I can
imagine is if a salmon made a fast run and my reel built up a lot of heat.

I'm done whining.

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 12:27:58 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

I need to whine a little.

The floor is yours - whine away.

Yesterday, I was returning from fishing on Lake Ontario in my 14' nookular
powered aluminum yacht. It was a typical Sunday on Irondequoit Bay: Large
boats driven by nitwits were travelling at top speed through clearly marked
no-wake zones, throwing enormous wakes down the aisles of docked boats at
the marina near the inlet, and making it dicey for boats at the nearby
launch.

Sounds like Narragansett Bay East Passage on any day you choose to
name.

In the midst of all this madness, I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security.

I suspect it may have been more situational rather than being a clear
threat to Homeland Security. However, I wasn't there, so I can't
judge. And you are a pretty straight forward guy, so I'll take your
interpretation of events as gospel. ;)

I was pulled over for a safety check.

Where you wearing a turban by any chance - have a beard - taking
pictures - anything? :)

I was cited for not having my registration, a distress flag
and a fire extinguisher. They were correct on the first two issues, but
based on their own rules and those of NY State, I'm not required to have a
fire extinguisher. Actually, I bought one when I first got the boat, but
found that there wasn't a good place to mount the thing except for right
next to the (portable) gas tank, which didn't make much sense considering
how the probability is close to 100% that a fire would start there.

Hmmmm - I must read on.

I have 7 days to have a boarding officer look at the boat again, or pay a
fine and forfeit my son and my lawnmower. This inspection will be based on
opinion and interpretation, so I'm looking for votes from the peanut
gallery, even though this may be a futile effort. The boat has 3 aluminum
bench seats which do NOT have storage underneath. They're sealed and filled
with floatation material. There are no storage lockers of any kind, and the
hull is one layer - no bilge, no floor of any kind.

NY State says I'm exempt from the extinguisher requirement:
- Outboards less than 26' and of open construction

The Coast Guard's site says I must have an extinguisher if any of these
conditions are met:

a.. Inboard engines are installed.

b.. There are closed compartments and compartments under seats where
portable fuel tanks may be stored.
c.. There are double bottoms not sealed to the hull or which are not
completely filled with flotation materials.
d.. There are closed living spaces.
e.. There are closed stowage compartments in which combustible or
flammable materials are stored.
f.. There are permanently installed fuel tanks. (Fuel tanks secured so
they cannot be moved in case of fire or other emergency are considered
permanently installed. There are no gallon capacity limits to determine if a
fuel tank is portable. If the weight of a fuel tank is such that persons on
board cannot move it, the Coast Guard considers it permanently installed.)

Help me waste my time arguing with the Coast Guard. :-) That last rule
sounds silly for my situation. First of all, I can left my 6 gallon tank
with my toe. But, even so, if the engine/tank area (aft of the rear bench
seat) went up in flames, how likely is it that I'd try to lift the tank and
throw it overboard??? Excluding that, the most likely fire hazard I can
imagine is if a salmon made a fast run and my reel built up a lot of heat.

I'm done whining.

Ok, having been through this twice, I can expound on what you could do
and then what you should do.

You could use the above as an argument in your favour. You could call
the MSO for the area, talk to the OIC (or NCOIC) and explain what
happened and how your situation does not fit the requirements for
on-board fire extinguishers. You could take this all the way to the
Commanding Officer of the District in which you were cited for failure
to have proper equipment. You could take it even further because the
rules are clearly in your favour. You could take it as far as you
could go in the USCG chain of command only to find, in the end, that
it's all up to the original Boarding Officer who you have just
embarrassed, forced him/her to do a bunch of paperwork and mightly
****ed off.

Or.........

You could get a fire extinguisher, put it on the boat and just return
to your life sans fines.

Your call. :)

It's all in how the rules are interpreted. There are standard
rule/regulation/policy interpretations that most Boarding Officers
use, however, if they deem it necessary, they can ignore those and say
that in their opinion, this, this and this is necessary. The regular
boater type folk do not have the political or economic horsepower to
change the results like a commercial outfit would.

I understand your angst.

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

Doug Kanter wrote:
... I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security.

I agree with Short Wave Sportfishing, you should call them up and get
this straightened out. There is no point whatever in paying a fine when
you appear to be in compliance.

BTW I'd like to see the requirememnt for a "distress flag" is this
something new? last I heard, you needed a distress signal of approved
type... different can o' worms.

Try poking around here, should have some useful contact info
http://www.uscg.mil/d9/wwm/marinesafety/index.htm

Good luck. So far, all the Coasties I have been inspected by have been
very professional. Sounds like you had some bad luck.

Fair Skies
Doug King

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...


Where you wearing a turban by any chance - have a beard - taking
pictures - anything? :)

I have a beard and a tan. But I believe there was another factor at work
here. My 15 yr old son's girlfriend came by to see the new house earlier in
the day. She figured she'd just be sitting around, so she was wearing a
skirt that was too short while standing up, and totally outrageous (in a
good way) when sitting. My son asked if she could come fishing with us. I'm
sure she was totally visible as the CG boat (with its higher vantage point)
passed in the other direction, and was probably the only reason they made a
quick U-turn. :-)

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Doug Kanter wrote:
... I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security.

I agree with Short Wave Sportfishing, you should call them up and get
this straightened out. There is no point whatever in paying a fine when
you appear to be in compliance.

BTW I'd like to see the requirememnt for a "distress flag" is this
something new? last I heard, you needed a distress signal of approved
type... different can o' worms.

Try poking around here, should have some useful contact info
http://www.uscg.mil/d9/wwm/marinesafety/index.htm

Good luck. So far, all the Coasties I have been inspected by have been
very professional. Sounds like you had some bad luck.

Fair Skies
Doug King


NY seems to want a distress flag. I have a dry box onboard in which I keep
stuff like first aid kit, radio, batteries, ammo, etc. The distress flag
will make a nice pad in the bottom of the box, so I have no problem with it.

Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.

Doug Kanter wrote:
I need to whine a little.

Yesterday, I was returning from fishing on Lake Ontario in my 14' nookular
powered aluminum yacht. It was a typical Sunday on Irondequoit Bay: Large
boats driven by nitwits were travelling at top speed through clearly marked
no-wake zones, throwing enormous wakes down the aisles of docked boats at
the marina near the inlet, and making it dicey for boats at the nearby
launch.

In the midst of all this madness, I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security. I was pulled over for a
safety check. I was cited for not having my registration, a distress flag
and a fire extinguisher. They were correct on the first two issues, but
based on their own rules and those of NY State, I'm not required to have a
fire extinguisher. Actually, I bought one when I first got the boat, but
found that there wasn't a good place to mount the thing except for right
next to the (portable) gas tank, which didn't make much sense considering
how the probability is close to 100% that a fire would start there.

I have 7 days to have a boarding officer look at the boat again, or pay a
fine and forfeit my son and my lawnmower. This inspection will be based on
opinion and interpretation, so I'm looking for votes from the peanut
gallery, even though this may be a futile effort. The boat has 3 aluminum
bench seats which do NOT have storage underneath. They're sealed and filled
with floatation material. There are no storage lockers of any kind, and the
hull is one layer - no bilge, no floor of any kind.

NY State says I'm exempt from the extinguisher requirement:
- Outboards less than 26' and of open construction

The Coast Guard's site says I must have an extinguisher if any of these
conditions are met:

a.. Inboard engines are installed.

b.. There are closed compartments and compartments under seats where
portable fuel tanks may be stored.
c.. There are double bottoms not sealed to the hull or which are not
completely filled with flotation materials.
d.. There are closed living spaces.
e.. There are closed stowage compartments in which combustible or
flammable materials are stored.
f.. There are permanently installed fuel tanks. (Fuel tanks secured so
they cannot be moved in case of fire or other emergency are considered
permanently installed. There are no gallon capacity limits to determine if a
fuel tank is portable. If the weight of a fuel tank is such that persons on
board cannot move it, the Coast Guard considers it permanently installed.)
Help me waste my time arguing with the Coast Guard. :-) That last rule
sounds silly for my situation. First of all, I can left my 6 gallon tank
with my toe. But, even so, if the engine/tank area (aft of the rear bench
seat) went up in flames, how likely is it that I'd try to lift the tank and
throw it overboard??? Excluding that, the most likely fire hazard I can
imagine is if a salmon made a fast run and my reel built up a lot of heat.

I'm done whining.

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 13:18:31 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .


Where you wearing a turban by any chance - have a beard - taking
pictures - anything? :)

I have a beard and a tan. But I believe there was another factor at work
here. My 15 yr old son's girlfriend came by to see the new house earlier in
the day. She figured she'd just be sitting around, so she was wearing a
skirt that was too short while standing up, and totally outrageous (in a
good way) when sitting. My son asked if she could come fishing with us. I'm
sure she was totally visible as the CG boat (with its higher vantage point)
passed in the other direction, and was probably the only reason they made a
quick U-turn. :-)

Well, that explains everything.

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

"Jim" wrote in message
...
Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.

Definitely Coast Guard. Says so on the boarding report. And, nobody else
around here has the interesting new boats that the CG uses. They were the
subject of a news article in the sports/boating section of the local paper.
They've got a v-hull with a huge styrofoam surround, sort of like a pontoon
boat. Just spoke to another boarding officer on the phone. After he got done
explaining that I shouldn't have been cited for the extinguisher, I asked
him how the boats are on Lake Ontario chop. He said "Anything more than a 3
ft chop and it makes you wanna **** blood at the end of the day". :-)

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 15:02:12 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Jim" wrote in message
...
Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.

Definitely Coast Guard. Says so on the boarding report. And, nobody else
around here has the interesting new boats that the CG uses. They were the
subject of a news article in the sports/boating section of the local paper.
They've got a v-hull with a huge styrofoam surround, sort of like a pontoon
boat. Just spoke to another boarding officer on the phone. After he got done
explaining that I shouldn't have been cited for the extinguisher, I asked
him how the boats are on Lake Ontario chop. He said "Anything more than a 3
ft chop and it makes you wanna **** blood at the end of the day". :-)

And the Lord said "Go and sin no more". :)

I rode in one of those this summer after my "incident" in the St
Lawrence Seaway. They've got cushioned air ride seats for the
Quartermaster and the crew.

But after all day, who knows.

Later,

Tom

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 15:02:12 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Jim" wrote in message
...
Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.

Definitely Coast Guard. Says so on the boarding report. And, nobody else
around here has the interesting new boats that the CG uses. They were the
subject of a news article in the sports/boating section of the local
paper.
They've got a v-hull with a huge styrofoam surround, sort of like a
pontoon
boat. Just spoke to another boarding officer on the phone. After he got
done
explaining that I shouldn't have been cited for the extinguisher, I asked
him how the boats are on Lake Ontario chop. He said "Anything more than a
3
ft chop and it makes you wanna **** blood at the end of the day". :-)

And the Lord said "Go and sin no more". :)

I rode in one of those this summer after my "incident" in the St
Lawrence Seaway. They've got cushioned air ride seats for the
Quartermaster and the crew.

But after all day, who knows.


What "incident"???

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 16:12:16 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 15:02:12 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Jim" wrote in message
...
Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.

Definitely Coast Guard. Says so on the boarding report. And, nobody else
around here has the interesting new boats that the CG uses. They were the
subject of a news article in the sports/boating section of the local
paper.
They've got a v-hull with a huge styrofoam surround, sort of like a
pontoon
boat. Just spoke to another boarding officer on the phone. After he got
done
explaining that I shouldn't have been cited for the extinguisher, I asked
him how the boats are on Lake Ontario chop. He said "Anything more than a
3
ft chop and it makes you wanna **** blood at the end of the day". :-)

And the Lord said "Go and sin no more". :)

I rode in one of those this summer after my "incident" in the St
Lawrence Seaway. They've got cushioned air ride seats for the
Quartermaster and the crew.

But after all day, who knows.

What "incident"???

Um.....well, this happened, that happened and over the side I went.

Eventually to be pulled out by the USCG.

Thus the ride back to the dock because I wouldn't set foot in that
guides boat ever again.

Take care.

Tom

"The beatings will stop when morale improves."
E. Teach, 1717

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...


What "incident"???

Um.....well, this happened, that happened and over the side I went.

Eventually to be pulled out by the USCG.

Thus the ride back to the dock because I wouldn't set foot in that
guides boat ever again.

Take care.

Tom


Hmmm. Sounds funny, but that's just me. :-)

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message ...
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...


Where you wearing a turban by any chance - have a beard - taking
pictures - anything? :)

I have a beard and a tan. But I believe there was another factor at work
here. My 15 yr old son's girlfriend came by to see the new house earlier in
the day. She figured she'd just be sitting around, so she was wearing a
skirt that was too short while standing up, and totally outrageous (in a
good way) when sitting. My son asked if she could come fishing with us. I'm
sure she was totally visible as the CG boat (with its higher vantage point)
passed in the other direction, and was probably the only reason they made a
quick U-turn. :-)


Well then bring her with you to the insepction (of the boat) and have
her wear the same stuff ...

Worry no more ;)

Matt

"Matt Lang" wrote in message
m...
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...
"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
message
...


Where you wearing a turban by any chance - have a beard - taking
pictures - anything? :)

I have a beard and a tan. But I believe there was another factor at work
here. My 15 yr old son's girlfriend came by to see the new house earlier
in
the day. She figured she'd just be sitting around, so she was wearing a
skirt that was too short while standing up, and totally outrageous (in a
good way) when sitting. My son asked if she could come fishing with us.
I'm
sure she was totally visible as the CG boat (with its higher vantage
point)
passed in the other direction, and was probably the only reason they
made a
quick U-turn. :-)


Well then bring her with you to the insepction (of the boat) and have
her wear the same stuff ...

Worry no more ;)

Matt

Hmm. That would probably work, although they'd probably want me to bring her
by about once a week. This girl's drop dead gorgeous. Fortunately or
unfortunately (not sure which yet), she doesn't realize it. My son does,
though. Yesterday, he was mowing the lawn while she was chattering at me
nearby as I tried to concentrate on changing the float assembly in the
boat's gas tank. She re-crossed her legs, he looked away from his work, and
put front 4" of the lawnmower through the basement window. Very nice.

I'm replacing the window glass with 1/4" plexiglass, since it's in a spot
where it's bound to be collided with again. Cost: $11.00. But, the lady at
the glass shop gave me a receipt for $57.25, just to see if my son turns
pale white when he sees the results of his inattention.

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

You've got her messing with one while you're messing with the other.
Poor guy, or lucky guy, depending on who's doing the messing.

bb

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

I knew there was something I liked about you. :)

Later,

Tom

"bb" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

You've got her messing with one while you're messing with the other.
Poor guy, or lucky guy, depending on who's doing the messing.

bb



She's HIS problem, and based on her personality, she's the perfect intro to
what comes later. They argue constantly about meaningless bull****, and two
days later, they have no idea what they argued about. I think they're
married already. :-)

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 22:43:24 GMT, "Doug Kanter"

wrote:


"bb" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

You've got her messing with one while you're messing with the other.
Poor guy, or lucky guy, depending on who's doing the messing.

bb



She's HIS problem, and based on her personality, she's the perfect intro
to
what comes later. They argue constantly about meaningless bull****, and
two
days later, they have no idea what they argued about. I think they're
married already. :-)


Sounds like they'd make a great addition to rec.boats!

John H

Quiet, republican slime. We're discussing pussy. :-)

heres the official word from NY
http://nysparks.state.ny.us/boats/equip/



Visual Distress Signals


State law requires all mechanically propelled vessels 16 feet in length or
greater to carry the number and type of visual distress signals as required
by the U.S. Coast Guard while operating onfederal waters. Flares or other
pyrotechnic devices must be US Coast Guard approved. New flares generally
have a three year service life, and the ones you carry must not be past
their expiration date. Never use road flares on your boat; they produce hot
slag which can drip and burn either you or your vessel.

Powerboats less than 16 feet and sailboats less than 26 feet only need to
carry visual distress signals when operating at night. Since the state has
some jurisdiction in these areas, it is recommended that all vessels sixteen
feet or greater in length carry at least three USCG approved hand held
day/night flares at all times.



In the past State Law required boaters to carry a flourescent flag for
daytime use. This requirement no longer applies if the vessel is equipped
with other sufficient daytime signals, such as day/night flares.









Fire Extinguishers

Requirements for Mechanically Propelled Vessels:

a.. Outboards Less Than 26' and of Open Construction - Exempt


b.. Less Than 26' - One (1) USCG Approved Type B-1 Extinguisher


c.. 26' to 40' - Two (2) USCG Approved Type B-1 Extinguishers


d.. 40' to 65' - Three (3) USCG Approved Type B-1 Extinguishers


e.. On any vessel, a type B-II extinguisher may be substituted for two
type B-1 extinguishers.


f.. Vessels equipped with approved fixed extinguishing systems may carry
one less B-1 extinguisher.
g..
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.759 / Virus Database: 508 - Release Date: 9/9/2004

In article ,
Doug Kanter wrote:


"Jim" wrote in message
...
Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.

Definitely Coast Guard. Says so on the boarding report. And, nobody else
around here has the interesting new boats that the CG uses. They were the
subject of a news article in the sports/boating section of the local paper.
They've got a v-hull with a huge styrofoam surround, sort of like a pontoon
boat. Just spoke to another boarding officer on the phone. After he got done
explaining that I shouldn't have been cited for the extinguisher, I asked
him how the boats are on Lake Ontario chop. He said "Anything more than a 3
ft chop and it makes you wanna **** blood at the end of the day". :-)

The USCG has had those boats around here for a while.

They're quite fast and extremely stable - but they definitely do NOT look
comfortable going out the inlet with any kind of wave action!

--
--
Karl Denninger ) Internet Consultant & Kids Rights Activist
http://www.denninger.net My home on the net - links to everything I do!
http://scubaforum.org Your UNCENSORED place to talk about DIVING!
http://www.spamcuda.net SPAM FREE mailboxes - FREE FOR A LIMITED TIME!
http://genesis3.blogspot.com Musings Of A Sentient Mind

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

I knew there was something I liked about you. :)

Then you'll love this! I'm still unpacking boxes after moving into the new
house. After box # 8,219, I don't care how much I rearrange closets,
etc.It's all a blur. So: There are two identical cabinets in the kitchen (as
opposed to the corner types, which are unique). Yesterday, one cabinet had
glasses, mugs & plates. The other had boxes of dry goods like cereal, rice,
flour, granola bars, etc. Before my son got home from school, I switched the
contents of the cabinets. When he headed for the kitchen for his 8:30 PM
snack ritual, I was in the living room, trying to contain my laughter while
he opened multiple cabinets and muttered to himself. Wednesday night, I'll
do it again. I figure it'll work about 10 times before he focuses enough to
yell. Only a live George Carlin show is better than this.

It's informal research of a sort, after reading a Time magazine article
about the teen brain. Among other things, it said teens have practically NO
sense of continuity, which explains why a kid with a 3.9 GPA can't find his
shoes (or the cereal). :-)

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 03:18:29 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

I knew there was something I liked about you. :)

Then you'll love this! I'm still unpacking boxes after moving into the new
house. After box # 8,219, I don't care how much I rearrange closets,
etc.It's all a blur. So: There are two identical cabinets in the kitchen (as
opposed to the corner types, which are unique). Yesterday, one cabinet had
glasses, mugs & plates. The other had boxes of dry goods like cereal, rice,
flour, granola bars, etc. Before my son got home from school, I switched the
contents of the cabinets. When he headed for the kitchen for his 8:30 PM
snack ritual, I was in the living room, trying to contain my laughter while
he opened multiple cabinets and muttered to himself. Wednesday night, I'll
do it again. I figure it'll work about 10 times before he focuses enough to
yell. Only a live George Carlin show is better than this.

It's informal research of a sort, after reading a Time magazine article
about the teen brain. Among other things, it said teens have practically NO
sense of continuity, which explains why a kid with a 3.9 GPA can't find his
shoes (or the cereal). :-)

LOL!!!

I just showed this to my wife and the first thing she said "Why didn't
we think of that?"

I went through this with four kids - two girls and two boys.

Actually, I miss those days. :)

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

Heh...

When we moved the stepson unloaded a lot of the boxes - most were labled by
room.

Then he says.... "The last one had no label - but it had a number 69 on
it, so I put it in the bedroom."

-W

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 03:18:29 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in
message
.. .
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

I knew there was something I liked about you. :)

Then you'll love this! I'm still unpacking boxes after moving into the
new
house. After box # 8,219, I don't care how much I rearrange closets,
etc.It's all a blur. So: There are two identical cabinets in the kitchen
(as
opposed to the corner types, which are unique). Yesterday, one cabinet
had
glasses, mugs & plates. The other had boxes of dry goods like cereal,
rice,
flour, granola bars, etc. Before my son got home from school, I switched
the
contents of the cabinets. When he headed for the kitchen for his 8:30 PM
snack ritual, I was in the living room, trying to contain my laughter
while
he opened multiple cabinets and muttered to himself. Wednesday night,
I'll
do it again. I figure it'll work about 10 times before he focuses enough
to
yell. Only a live George Carlin show is better than this.

It's informal research of a sort, after reading a Time magazine article
about the teen brain. Among other things, it said teens have practically
NO
sense of continuity, which explains why a kid with a 3.9 GPA can't find
his
shoes (or the cereal). :-)

LOL!!!

I just showed this to my wife and the first thing she said "Why didn't
we think of that?"

I went through this with four kids - two girls and two boys.

Actually, I miss those days. :)

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

How old is the stepson? That's hilarious!

Clams Canino wrote:
Heh...

When we moved the stepson unloaded a lot of the boxes - most were labled by
room.

Then he says.... "The last one had no label - but it had a number 69 on
it, so I put it in the bedroom."

-W

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 03:18:29 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in

message

...

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:07:26 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

~~ snippage ~~


It's good to mess with teenagers' heads. :-)

I knew there was something I liked about you. :)

Then you'll love this! I'm still unpacking boxes after moving into the

new

house. After box # 8,219, I don't care how much I rearrange closets,
etc.It's all a blur. So: There are two identical cabinets in the kitchen

(as

opposed to the corner types, which are unique). Yesterday, one cabinet

had

glasses, mugs & plates. The other had boxes of dry goods like cereal,

rice,

flour, granola bars, etc. Before my son got home from school, I switched

the

contents of the cabinets. When he headed for the kitchen for his 8:30 PM
snack ritual, I was in the living room, trying to contain my laughter

while

he opened multiple cabinets and muttered to himself. Wednesday night,

I'll

do it again. I figure it'll work about 10 times before he focuses enough

to

yell. Only a live George Carlin show is better than this.

It's informal research of a sort, after reading a Time magazine article
about the teen brain. Among other things, it said teens have practically

NO

sense of continuity, which explains why a kid with a 3.9 GPA can't find

his

shoes (or the cereal). :-)

LOL!!!

I just showed this to my wife and the first thing she said "Why didn't
we think of that?"

I went through this with four kids - two girls and two boys.

Actually, I miss those days. :)

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 12:27:58 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

I need to whine a little.



In the midst of all this madness, I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security. I was pulled over for a
safety check.

anybody see the contradiction here?

he wasn't stopped for security, as he admits. he was stopped for a
safety check. and that is part of the CG's mission. if you disagree
with it, get the law changed. don't complain about the CG. they're
just doing their job.
---------------------------
to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"
and enter 'wf3h' in the field

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 13:46:39 GMT, Jim wrote:

Sure it was the CG and not the Aux, or maybe Sheriff Dept.
Must have been a slow and boring day for someone.


the aux can't stop boats and can't issue citations. it is prohibited,
by law, from having any law enforcement authority.
---------------------------
to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"
and enter 'wf3h' in the field

On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 05:24:16 GMT, (Bob) wrote:

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 12:27:58 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

I need to whine a little.



In the midst of all this madness, I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security. I was pulled over for a
safety check.

anybody see the contradiction here?

he wasn't stopped for security, as he admits. he was stopped for a
safety check. and that is part of the CG's mission. if you disagree
with it, get the law changed. don't complain about the CG. they're
just doing their job.

Don't get up in arms - there was lot of tongue-in-cheek in that post.

I think everybody agrees that the USCG goes a great job.

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

I think everybody agrees that the USCG goes a great job.


What they can do ... They sure seem to be spread pretty thin.
I saw the coasties for the first time in well over a year the other afternoon
(3 guys in an RIB) and I spend ~400 hours a year on the water.

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 05:24:16 GMT, (Bob) wrote:

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 12:27:58 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

I need to whine a little.



In the midst of all this madness, I was spotted by the Coast Guard and
deemed to be a clear threat to homeland security. I was pulled over for
a
safety check.

anybody see the contradiction here?

he wasn't stopped for security, as he admits. he was stopped for a
safety check. and that is part of the CG's mission. if you disagree
with it, get the law changed. don't complain about the CG. they're
just doing their job.

Don't get up in arms - there was lot of tongue-in-cheek in that post.

I think everybody agrees that the USCG goes a great job.

Later,

Tom

Thanks for noticing the tongue-in-cheek. Apparently, Bob had a bad day
before he wrote his message.

Went to the CG station today to clear up the situation. I brought photos of
the boat's interior, and they agreed that a fire extinguisher was, in fact,
not required. But, three guys came to the desk and brainstormed about places
I might consider putting one anyway. Finally, I asked "If you were in this
boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.

"If you were in this
boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.


You could probably roll the boat, put the fire out and crank back up and go
home.

Doug Kanter wrote:
Went to the CG station today to clear up the situation. I brought photos of
the boat's interior, and they agreed that a fire extinguisher was, in fact,
not required. But, three guys came to the desk and brainstormed about places
I might consider putting one anyway. Finally, I asked "If you were in this
boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.

Well, I'm not arguing with whether or not the law *should* require a
fire extinguisher. Clearly you're OK.

But the fact is that they can come in very handy. Would you rather
abandon your boat or consider trying to save it with minimal damage?
What if you happen upon another boater with a fire?

Fair Skies
Doug

"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
Doug Kanter wrote:
Went to the CG station today to clear up the situation. I brought photos
of
the boat's interior, and they agreed that a fire extinguisher was, in
fact,
not required. But, three guys came to the desk and brainstormed about
places
I might consider putting one anyway. Finally, I asked "If you were in
this
boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.

Well, I'm not arguing with whether or not the law *should* require a
fire extinguisher. Clearly you're OK.

But the fact is that they can come in very handy. Would you rather
abandon your boat or consider trying to save it with minimal damage?
What if you happen upon another boater with a fire?

Fair Skies
Doug


Agreed ("another boat"). The problem has been that no matter now much I've
fiddled around with finding a good spot for the thing, it's always in the
way, sometimes with semi-dangerous consequences. In the stern, it tends to
get ropes tangled around it at docking time. In the bow, it gets slammed by
the anchor. In between, people slam their knees on it.

On CG guy had an interesting thought. Each of the 3 bench seats are sealed
aluminum boxes, filled with blown-in floatation, and topped with some sort
of heavy duty wood. He wondered about removing one wooden top, cutting it in
half, hinging one half, cutting out a little metal (and floatation
material), and creating just a little bit of storage - enough to stash a
small extinguisher and perhaps the hand held radio and a camera. My only
concern about this is that although the aluminum's pretty thick, I still
don't like the idea of riveting hinges to it. Wait...I just crushed my own
concern: I'd be inside the metal anyway. Nuts & bolts would work.

|Finally, I asked "If you were in this
| boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
| extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
| side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.

Number one rule of boating.. Safety First..!! I'm not sure where you do
your boating, but even a boat disabled by fire is better than spending a
cold night in the water, or on a beach soaking wet freezing your tookus
off.. Not to mention, God forbid that someone else in the boat should catch
fire too.. Sounds like you've got an answer with the seat modification..

"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
| Doug Kanter wrote:
| Went to the CG station today to clear up the situation. I brought photos
of
| the boat's interior, and they agreed that a fire extinguisher was, in
fact,
| not required. But, three guys came to the desk and brainstormed about
places
| I might consider putting one anyway. Finally, I asked "If you were in
this
| boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
| extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
| side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.
|
| Well, I'm not arguing with whether or not the law *should* require a
| fire extinguisher. Clearly you're OK.
|
| But the fact is that they can come in very handy. Would you rather
| abandon your boat or consider trying to save it with minimal damage?
| What if you happen upon another boater with a fire?
|
| Fair Skies
| Doug
|

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 13:44:45 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"DSK" wrote in message
...
Doug Kanter wrote:
Went to the CG station today to clear up the situation. I brought photos
of
the boat's interior, and they agreed that a fire extinguisher was, in
fact,
not required. But, three guys came to the desk and brainstormed about
places
I might consider putting one anyway. Finally, I asked "If you were in
this
boat and the engine caught fire, how many of you would play with a fire
extinguisher, and how many of you would throw on a vest and go over the
side?" The consensus was "Hmmmmm...good question". Personally, I'd swim.

Well, I'm not arguing with whether or not the law *should* require a
fire extinguisher. Clearly you're OK.

But the fact is that they can come in very handy. Would you rather
abandon your boat or consider trying to save it with minimal damage?
What if you happen upon another boater with a fire?

Fair Skies
Doug


Agreed ("another boat"). The problem has been that no matter now much I've
fiddled around with finding a good spot for the thing, it's always in the
way, sometimes with semi-dangerous consequences. In the stern, it tends to
get ropes tangled around it at docking time. In the bow, it gets slammed by
the anchor. In between, people slam their knees on it.

On CG guy had an interesting thought. Each of the 3 bench seats are sealed
aluminum boxes, filled with blown-in floatation, and topped with some sort
of heavy duty wood. He wondered about removing one wooden top, cutting it in
half, hinging one half, cutting out a little metal (and floatation
material), and creating just a little bit of storage - enough to stash a
small extinguisher and perhaps the hand held radio and a camera. My only
concern about this is that although the aluminum's pretty thick, I still
don't like the idea of riveting hinges to it. Wait...I just crushed my own
concern: I'd be inside the metal anyway. Nuts & bolts would work.

I like it.

Later,

Tom
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653