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Honda 40hp or 50hp ?
I'm buying an 18' pontoon that weighs 1050 lbs. I decided on the 40hp
Honda but I'm wondering if the 50hp would be better for pulling my kids on a tube. Besides tubing, I'll also be trolling for walleyes, trout, etc. Both motors weigh 212 lbs. Any recommendations? I need to decide soon. |
If you are pulling toys you should probably go for the 50. I imagine it is
really the same motor, just one that "breathes" better. I have a 60 merc (highest HP for that block) on my pontoon and it runs out about 24@ 5500 |
Definetly get the 50hp. Depending on the tube - it can be a load.
-- Tony my boats at http://t.thomas.home.mchsi.com "Marko" wrote in message om... I'm buying an 18' pontoon that weighs 1050 lbs. I decided on the 40hp Honda but I'm wondering if the 50hp would be better for pulling my kids on a tube. Besides tubing, I'll also be trolling for walleyes, trout, etc. Both motors weigh 212 lbs. Any recommendations? I need to decide soon. |
I know nothing about these engines.
It is interesting that they weigh exactly the same, this tells me that they may BE the same, much like some of the Evinrude/Johnson engines are the same (9.9 and the 15, for an example) minor differences in carb jets, and so forth. I'd do some research and see if you could save some money with the 40 and get the performance of the 50 with the turn of a screw driver. Anyone know? Jim Marko wrote: I'm buying an 18' pontoon that weighs 1050 lbs. I decided on the 40hp Honda but I'm wondering if the 50hp would be better for pulling my kids on a tube. Besides tubing, I'll also be trolling for walleyes, trout, etc. Both motors weigh 212 lbs. Any recommendations? I need to decide soon. |
If your boat is rated for max 40hp then go for the 40hp (or actually the
40hp Yamaha 4 stroke is a little lighter ). If it is rated for 50hp, then go for the 50hp Honda or maybe the 50/60hp Yamaha because it is fuel injected for 2005. I would recommend the new FI 60hp Yamaha (237#) or Mercury FI 60hp (248#) because they are fuel injected 4 strokes as long as you are rated for at least 60hp. -- Bill Kiene Kiene's Fly Shop Sacramento, CA, USA Web site: www.kiene.com "Marko" wrote in message om... I'm buying an 18' pontoon that weighs 1050 lbs. I decided on the 40hp Honda but I'm wondering if the 50hp would be better for pulling my kids on a tube. Besides tubing, I'll also be trolling for walleyes, trout, etc. Both motors weigh 212 lbs. Any recommendations? I need to decide soon. |
There is a lot more to it than just carb jets. For instance a kit to upgrade
a 9.9 to a 15 runs you about $800.00. That is according to my local Johnson dealer. -- Bill Chesapeake, Va "Jim" wrote in message ink.net... I know nothing about these engines. It is interesting that they weigh exactly the same, this tells me that they may BE the same, much like some of the Evinrude/Johnson engines are the same (9.9 and the 15, for an example) minor differences in carb jets, and so forth. I'd do some research and see if you could save some money with the 40 and get the performance of the 50 with the turn of a screw driver. Anyone know? Jim Marko wrote: I'm buying an 18' pontoon that weighs 1050 lbs. I decided on the 40hp Honda but I'm wondering if the 50hp would be better for pulling my kids on a tube. Besides tubing, I'll also be trolling for walleyes, trout, etc. Both motors weigh 212 lbs. Any recommendations? I need to decide soon. |
I had looked into the 6 to 8 horsepower engines. The answer I got was
carb jetting. Otherwise exactly the same engine. I thought the 9.9 to 15 might be the same issue. This was a couple of years ago, and probably is arguable, but this is what my research showed me. My next engine will be a Honda, a 15 (or so) will replace my Johnson 25. Jim IBNFSHN wrote: There is a lot more to it than just carb jets. For instance a kit to upgrade a 9.9 to a 15 runs you about $800.00. That is according to my local Johnson dealer. |
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I'm prepared to go with the 50hp if my dealer is willing to work with
me. My boat is rated for a max of 75hp so no problem there. My only question is can I troll as slow with the 50hp as I can with the 40hp? I have little experience with 4-strokes but I hear you can idle right down to 1 mph. Thanks for the responses. |
In theory you will not be able to troll as slow w/ the 50 as w/ the 40.
Both engines should idle in gear at about 600 to 700 rpms. The 50 will have a slightly larger prop in terms of pitch so you will be moving faster. Probably only by 1 mph or so. However, your minimum speed is based on this rpm. On a boat rated for the 75 - I would personally not go lower than the 60 but you have to decide. W/ the 50 chances are you will be wide open the whole time you are pulling the tube. Do you really want to run the engine wide open all the time. -- Tony my boats at http://t.thomas.home.mchsi.com "Marko" wrote in message om... I'm prepared to go with the 50hp if my dealer is willing to work with me. My boat is rated for a max of 75hp so no problem there. My only question is can I troll as slow with the 50hp as I can with the 40hp? I have little experience with 4-strokes but I hear you can idle right down to 1 mph. Thanks for the responses. |
It looks like theses motors use the same block, likely intake and
exhaust. HP difference may come from carb and rpm. Weight of these motors is pretty much the same. Often the more powerful motor will use less fuel at certain speeds as it doesnt have to work as hard. The only issue that would point at the 40 HP is money. If cost for the 50 isnt prohibitive then get that. I wouldnt recommend getting the 40 and lateron tweak it to get 50 HP (not worth it). I dont know how well tubing with a pontoon boat works ... might require twin 400HP ? ;) Matt (Marko) wrote in message . com... I'm buying an 18' pontoon that weighs 1050 lbs. I decided on the 40hp Honda but I'm wondering if the 50hp would be better for pulling my kids on a tube. Besides tubing, I'll also be trolling for walleyes, trout, etc. Both motors weigh 212 lbs. Any recommendations? I need to decide soon. |
I wonder if you can ride in one (with a load) with a 50hp Honda (lightest
50hp 4 stroke) and a 60hp Yamaha ( lighest 60hp 4 stroke and FI for 2005)? Sometime we buy certain brands of outboard motors becuase we like a particular dealer's service department and they carry only brand X and Y but not Z. -- Bill Kiene Kiene's Fly Shop Sacramento, CA, USA Web site: www.kiene.com "Marko" wrote in message om... I'm prepared to go with the 50hp if my dealer is willing to work with me. My boat is rated for a max of 75hp so no problem there. My only question is can I troll as slow with the 50hp as I can with the 40hp? I have little experience with 4-strokes but I hear you can idle right down to 1 mph. Thanks for the responses. |
On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 17:39:45 -0400, "IBNFSHN" wrote:
There is a lot more to it than just carb jets. For instance a kit to upgrade a 9.9 to a 15 runs you about $800.00. That is according to my local Johnson dealer. A few years ago I did extensive examination of parts microfiches to find out the difference between my Evinrude 20, and the 25 and 30 models which are all the same block. I posted the details here. The difference is air/fuel in and exhaust out and maintaining the balance. I ended up opening the intake manifold restriction with a dremel tool to equal that of the 25, and installing the main jet specified for the 25, effectively converting the 20 to 25 hp for the price of a jet ($7.) Going up another step to 30 hp would have required enlarging the exhaust output (drilling a small hole), which would have entailed re and re the power head, new gasket kit, etc. I didn't want to go that far. I suppose it wouldn't be that easy with more modern engines due to the electronic FI systems, but maybe one could simply replace a control module in addition to mod.s as above. Scott W. |
Jim wrote in message thlink.net...
I had looked into the 6 to 8 horsepower engines. The answer I got was carb jetting. Otherwise exactly the same engine. I thought the 9.9 to 15 might be the same issue. Not just carb jetting. Need to add more air to match the increased fuel from the larger jets to keep the air/fuel mix correct. Thus the carb venturi is bigger too, so the whole carb body will be a different part number. On the Johnson 2 stroke 9.9 & 15, the 15 had (had?) a different tuner on the exhaust to resonate at higher RPM. Other engine combos have also had different intake manifolds and/or different cylinder heads. %mod% |
!!! Boat Purchase Update !!!
I called my dealer and asked what it would take to upgrade from the Honda 40 to the 50. He said "don't waste your money, they're basically the same engine." He also said you don't gain much moving up in horsepower with pontoons, which I've heard before. He was very insistant that the 40hp was the best motor for my "smaller" pontoon. I don't believe everything this guy says. The 40 I agreed to is a 2003 so I'm wondering if he just wants to move it. It's a huge store so I'm sure he has 2003 50's too. Honda told me that the 2003's and 2004's are IDENTICAL so I thought I'd save a couple hundred bucks. Should I stick with the 40 or push for the 50? |
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There is some degree of truth that more HP doesn't change the speed that much.
Pontoons are not speedboats and they never really "plane". You do get a degree of laminar flow across the pontoons and there is definately a step but it takes a lot more power to get a tad bit more speed. When I went down from 75 to 60 my top speed changed about 1-2 MPH. Ask them what the prop recomendation is for both and what the predicted RPM is with that prop. |
On Thu, 26 Aug 2004 10:40:58 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote: On 26 Aug 2004 06:35:29 -0700, (Marko) wrote: Should I stick with the 40 or push for the 50? ========================================= It's very rare to hear someone complain about having too much power but the opposite is quite common. Short, sweet and succinct - the perfect answer. Later, Tom |
On Thu, 26 Aug 2004 09:58:58 -0700, Scott W. wrote:
On 26 Aug 2004 06:35:29 -0700, (Marko) wrote: I called my dealer and asked what it would take to upgrade from the Honda 40 to the 50. He said "don't waste your money, they're basically the same engine." Get a spec. sheet and read it. If everything's the same, why not have 10 more HP? Another good answer, but I suspect that it's a case of leftoveritis on the part of the dealer. I have a good friend in the boat business and he will turn himself inside out to move New Old Stock in particular engines. However, it makes sense to go with the 50 if only because, as Wayne said, in this case, morererer is betterererrerrrrr. When I talk to folks about boats, the main complaint is almost always underpowered. Unless he makes the 40 VERY attractive, stick to your guns and get the 50. Ten horse power can make a difference here - the additional 10 horsepower is like adding 25% more Kw. By the way, when they say they are the same engine, that's true to this extent - they may be the same long block, it's the timing and computer controls controlling fuel flow that give you the extra horsies. Later, Tom S. Woodstock, CT ----------- "Angling may be said to be so like the mathematics that it can never be fully learnt..." Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653 |
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When I went down from 75 to 60 my top speed changed about 1-2 MPH.
That's interesting. I thought the opposite because of the nature of the two hulls. Unless that 1-2 Mph represents a large percentage of total speed. I went from 23-25 to 22-24 (depending on the load). |
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Short Wave Sportfishing wrote in message . ..
On 26 Aug 2004 16:38:41 GMT, (Greg) wrote: When I went down from 75 to 60 my top speed changed about 1-2 MPH. That's interesting. I thought the opposite because of the nature of the two hulls. Unless that 1-2 Mph represents a large percentage of total speed. I went from 23-25 to 22-24 (depending on the load). Interesting. A 20% drop in horsepower resulted in, for all practical purposes, the same speed. I assume that the props were similar in size and pitch? When operating non planning vessels you can throw outragous amounts of HP at them with little effect in speed :( Matt |
Just out of curiosity, which was more efficient in terms of GPH? No comparison in fuel consumption, the 60 EFI is a lot better, particularly at slower speeds. You really don't buy a 4 stroke if you want to go fast (WOT) and at 3000-3400 16-17MPH the 60 is a lot better on gas. |
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