#72
 

This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1
chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm
going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I
have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take
it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it.

#72
 

On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 18:22:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1
chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm
going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I
have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take
it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it.

Just put it in the gun rack in your truck. ;-)

#72
 

On 12/10/19 8:29 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 18:22:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1
chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm
going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I
have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take
it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it.

Just put it in the gun rack in your truck. ;-)


Not nearly powerful enough to take down those prairie dogs, squirrels,
and ground hogs that plague Tim's farm. Real men use one of these:

https://youtu.be/xohy9gWz7kk

:)

I think the vid mentions the cost of rounds... $40 each. :)

Haven't bought any new firearms recently. My Walther pistol and CZ
Scorp, both 9mm, are pretty "quiet" with the suppressor affixed. The
Walther has a really nice trigger, and I'd rank the pistol the
second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow SP-01. That's
the only one I've regretted selling.

#72
 

Keyser Soze wrote:
On 12/10/19 8:29 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 18:22:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1
chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm
going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I
have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take
it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it.

Just put it in the gun rack in your truck. ;-)


Not nearly powerful enough to take down those prairie dogs, squirrels,
and ground hogs that plague Tim's farm. Real men use one of these:

https://youtu.be/xohy9gWz7kk

:)

I think the vid mentions the cost of rounds... $40 each. :)

Haven't bought any new firearms recently. My Walther pistol and CZ
Scorp, both 9mm, are pretty "quiet" with the suppressor affixed. The
Walther has a really nice trigger, and I'd rank the pistol the
second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow SP-01.
That's the only one I've regretted selling.

$2.60.

#72
 

On Thu, 12 Dec 2019 17:06:02 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I'd rank the pistol the
second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow SP-01.

===

Was your SP-01 capable of firing in double action mode on the first
round, i.e., round in the chamber, hammer down?

#72
 

Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 12/10/19 8:29 PM, wrote: On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 18:22:27 -0500, Alex wrote: This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1 chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it. Just put it in the gun rack in your truck. ;-) Not nearly powerful enough to take down those prairie dogs, squirrels, and ground hogs that plague Tim's farm. Real men use one of these:https://youtu.be/xohy9gWz7kk:)I think the vid mentions the cost of rounds... $40 each. :)Haven't bought any new firearms recently. My Walther pistol and CZ Scorp, both 9mm, are pretty "quiet" with the suppressor affixed. The Walther has a really nice trigger, and I'd rank the pistol the second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow SP-01. That's the only one I've regretted selling.

Shoot at any stumps lately, Fat Harry?
--
..


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

#72
 

On 12/12/19 8:33 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 12 Dec 2019 17:06:02 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I'd rank the pistol the
second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow SP-01.

===

Was your SP-01 capable of firing in double action mode on the first
round, i.e., round in the chamber, hammer down?



I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

I happened to "fondle" a new CZ 75 the other day at my LGS. This was the
standard model, not an SP-01 Shadow like I had, and with a decocker
instead of a safety. DA/SA. Still a great pistol, even in fully stock form.

These days, when I'm not using my 9mm pistol at the range, it rests in
my side of the bed nightstand with a suppressor attached. It's a Walther
PPQ Q4 TAC M2 (ahh, nomenclature!), this one:

https://waltherarms.com/?p=1330

I put a red dot on the pistol. Very nice trigger.

#72
 

On 12/13/19 8:24 AM, Justan Ohlphart wrote:

Keyser Soze Wrote in message:

On 12/10/19 8:29 PM, wrote: On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 18:22:27 -0500, Alex wrote: This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1 chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it. Just put it in the gun rack in your truck. ;-) Not nearly powerful enough to take down those prairie dogs, squirrels, and ground hogs that plague Tim's farm. Real men use one of these:https://youtu.be/xohy9gWz7kk:)I think the vid mentions the cost of rounds... $40 each. :)Haven't bought any new firearms recently. My Walther pistol and CZ Scorp, both 9mm, are pretty "quiet" with the suppressor affixed. The Walther has a really nice trigger, and I'd rank the pistol the second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow SP-01. That's the only one I've regretted selling.


Shoot at any stumps lately, Fat Harry?




No, ****-for-brains. I know "Stumpy" gave you the closest thing to a
woody you had in years, but he is no more. He gave his life to
accommodate the cabin's septic drain field. I suppose I could have sent
you a scrap of Stumpy so you'd have something to sniff.

#72
 

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:53:10 -0500, Keyser Soze wrote:

On 12/13/19 8:24 AM, Justan Ohlphart wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 12/10/19 8:29 PM, wrote: On Tue, 10 Dec 2019 18:22:27 -0500, Alex wrote: This is certainly my heaviest firearm. It's an Armalite AR-50A1 chambered in .50 BMG. Without the 2 lb scope it weighs 38 lbs. I'm going to take it to the 1000 yard range a few hours from my home. I have to decide between a soft case or a Pelican case before I can take it anywhere. No one seems to offer a holster for it. Just put it in the gun rack in your truck. ;-) Not nearly powerful enough to take down those prairie dogs, squirrels, and ground hogs that plague Tim's farm. Real men use one of these:https://youtu.be/xohy9gWz7kk:)I think the vid mentions the cost of rounds... $40 each. :)Haven't bought any new firearms recently. My Walther pistol and CZ Scorp, both 9mm, are pretty "quiet" with the suppressor affixed. The Walther has a really nice trigger, and I'd rank the pistol the second-best I've ever fired or owned, after the CZ Shadow
SP-01. That's the only one I've regretted selling.

Shoot at any stumps lately, Fat Harry?



No, ****-for-brains. I know "Stumpy" gave you the closest thing to a
woody you had in years, but he is no more. He gave his life to
accommodate the cabin's septic drain field. I suppose I could have sent
you a scrap of Stumpy so you'd have something to sniff.

Were you getting so lonely you could cry? Is that why you're back being a sweetheart?

#72
 

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?

#72
 

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?


Seems odd, he would buy a semiautomatic and convert it to basically a poor
excuse for a single action revolver.

#72
 

On 12/13/19 5:17 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?


I thought I was reasonable clear... "You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked."

On the two SAO's I owned, you racked the slide to put a round in the
chamber. When you did that, the hammer was back and cocked, and the
firearm was ready to fire. If you wanted to carry that way, you'd flick
on the safety. I don't recall how you would get a round in the pipe
without cocking the hammer, and, I was taught to never drop the hammer
on a live round in a SAO pistol unless you wanted the round to go off.
Even with a heavily knurled hammer, your finger could slip off the
hammer and the round could be hit enough to be fired.

#72
 

On 12/13/19 6:30 PM, Bill wrote:
wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?


Seems odd, he would buy a semiautomatic and convert it to basically a poor
excuse for a single action revolver.


I used the two SAO 9 mm pistols I owned for target shooting and for
competition. SAO triggers typically offer shorter take up, lighter pull
and crisper breaks than DA or DA/SA triggers. I also had the firing pin
block removed on my CZ. :) Great pistol and much more accurate for me
than the Sig P226 X-5 I had previously.

The Walther I use now has a very crisp, short take up trigger apparatus,
much smoother than the Glocks and other striker pistols I've fired.
No external safety or decocker, but I don't carry it and the only time
it is loaded, cocked, and ready to fire is when it is in my nightstand
with the can attached. I hope I never have to use it.

The Ruger Mark IV I have is also SAO, with an external safety that keeps
the firearm from firing even if a round is in the pipe and the internal
trigger is cocked. The stock trigger has a fairly long pull, but it
reasonably smooth.

#72
 

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 17:17:59 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?

Use the decocker?

#72
 

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 18:31:38 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 12/13/19 5:17 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?


I thought I was reasonable clear... "You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked."

On the two SAO's I owned, you racked the slide to put a round in the
chamber. When you did that, the hammer was back and cocked, and the
firearm was ready to fire. If you wanted to carry that way, you'd flick
on the safety. I don't recall how you would get a round in the pipe
without cocking the hammer, and, I was taught to never drop the hammer
on a live round in a SAO pistol unless you wanted the round to go off.
Even with a heavily knurled hammer, your finger could slip off the
hammer and the round could be hit enough to be fired.


My Ruger doesn't have a safety. The thumb deal where the safety would
be decocks the hammer. Then it is a DA for the first shot and SA from
then on. I agree you do have to get used to the difference in
triggers between the first and subsequent shots but that would be part
of the "extend and fire" drill.

#72
 

#72
 

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."
===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?

That's how it works if you don't have a decocker.

Don't most DAs have a decocker?

#72
 

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 19:51:37 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 17:17:59 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?

Use the decocker?

That's what I'd do.

#72
 

On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 10:29:37 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 19:51:37 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 17:17:59 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?

Use the decocker?

That's what I'd do.

===

Does the CZ have a decocker?

#72
 

On 14 Dec 2019 17:07:03 GMT, Keyser Soze wrote:

wrote:
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 10:29:37 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 19:51:37 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 17:17:59 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."

===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?

Use the decocker?

That's what I'd do.

===

Does the CZ have a decocker?


cz makes many lines of pistols and models within various lines. Some have
decockers. The one I had did but when I bought it customized, the decocker
was swapped for a traditional SAO safety.

If you're afraid of totally missing a target with the DA, then spending extra money to remove the
decocker so you can search for the SA safety makes great sense.

#72
 

#72
 

On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:59:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."
===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?
That's how it works if you don't have a decocker.
Don't most DAs have a decocker?
Not many.

I guess I have just been around the good ones ;-)

#72
 

On 12/15/19 2:26 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:59:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."
===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?
That's how it works if you don't have a decocker.
Don't most DAs have a decocker?
Not many.

I guess I have just been around the good ones ;-)

Based on observations at the three public ranges I visit from time to
time, I can report that the mostly "polymer" pistols I see have neither
a traditional safety lever nor a traditional decocker lever. These
pistols are mostly Glocks and clones of Glocks. The one aspect of my
Walther I don't like is that it has neither a safety lever nor a
decocker lever.

#72
 

On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 09:34:34 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 12/15/19 2:26 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:59:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."
===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?
That's how it works if you don't have a decocker.
Don't most DAs have a decocker?
Not many.

I guess I have just been around the good ones ;-)

Based on observations at the three public ranges I visit from time to
time, I can report that the mostly "polymer" pistols I see have neither
a traditional safety lever nor a traditional decocker lever. These
pistols are mostly Glocks and clones of Glocks. The one aspect of my
Walther I don't like is that it has neither a safety lever nor a
decocker lever.

Which one is it? The PPs have a decocker.

Glocks are DAO so a decocker would have no function. The striker is
"uncocked" until you pull the trigger.

#72
 

Alex Wrote in message:
wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote: wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze wrote: I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other "customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer down, aka "idiot proof safe." === I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope your thumb doesn't slip? That's how it works if you don't have a decocker. Don't most DAs have a decocker?Not many.

He probably was thinking of da/sa
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#72
 

On 12/15/19 12:55 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 09:34:34 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 12/15/19 2:26 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:59:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."
===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?
That's how it works if you don't have a decocker.
Don't most DAs have a decocker?
Not many.

I guess I have just been around the good ones ;-)

Based on observations at the three public ranges I visit from time to
time, I can report that the mostly "polymer" pistols I see have neither
a traditional safety lever nor a traditional decocker lever. These
pistols are mostly Glocks and clones of Glocks. The one aspect of my
Walther I don't like is that it has neither a safety lever nor a
decocker lever.

Which one is it? The PPs have a decocker.

Glocks are DAO so a decocker would have no function. The striker is
"uncocked" until you pull the trigger.


Mine is a PPQ...this one. https://waltherarms.com/ppq-q4-tac-2/

I've not seen a recent PPQ with a decocker. I've send four or five
different models.

I was responding to your previous comment, "...around the good ones..."

#72
 

On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 12:56:02 -0500 (EST), Justan Ohlphart
wrote:

Alex Wrote in message:
wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote: wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze wrote: I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other "customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer down, aka "idiot proof safe." === I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode
for the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope your thumb doesn't slip? That's how it works if you don't have a decocker. Don't most DAs have a decocker?Not many.

He probably was thinking of da/sa

DAO has no use for a decocker and SA only should not be carried hammer
down on a loaded chamber in the first place. We have to be talking
about DA/SA.

#72
 

wrote:
On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 12:56:02 -0500 (EST), Justan Ohlphart
wrote:

Alex Wrote in message:
wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex
wrote: wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote: I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it
was shipped to my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it
to SAO, among other "customizations," so it had no "double action
mode." You had to rack the slide to put a round in the pipe and
that, of course, would cock the hammer. At that point, if you
wished, you could flick on the manual safety, and "carry" cocked
and locked. I never did that. I carried in Condition 3 when I
carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in Condition 4...no
mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer down, aka "idiot
proof safe." === I can see an advantage to carrying with a
round in the chamber but with the hammer down - as long as the gun
has a double action mode
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and
hope your thumb doesn't slip? That's how it works if you don't
have a decocker. Don't most DAs have a decocker?Not many.

He probably was thinking of da/sa

DAO has no use for a decocker and SA only should not be carried hammer
down on a loaded chamber in the first place. We have to be talking
about DA/SA.



With modern single action, should be able to carry hammer down on a loaded
chamber. The trigger lifts a striker in to position between the hammer and
firing pin has been required for at least 20 years. So a dropped firearm
would not discharge.

#72
 

On Sunday, December 15, 2019 at 3:52:06 PM UTC-5, Bill wrote:
wrote:
On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 12:56:02 -0500 (EST), Justan Ohlphart
wrote:

Alex Wrote in message:
wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex
wrote: wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote: I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it
was shipped to my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it
to SAO, among other "customizations," so it had no "double action
mode." You had to rack the slide to put a round in the pipe and
that, of course, would cock the hammer. At that point, if you
wished, you could flick on the manual safety, and "carry" cocked
and locked. I never did that. I carried in Condition 3 when I
carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in Condition 4...no
mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer down, aka "idiot
proof safe." === I can see an advantage to carrying with a
round in the chamber but with the hammer down - as long as the gun
has a double action mode
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and
hope your thumb doesn't slip? That's how it works if you don't
have a decocker. Don't most DAs have a decocker?Not many.

He probably was thinking of da/sa

DAO has no use for a decocker and SA only should not be carried hammer
down on a loaded chamber in the first place. We have to be talking
about DA/SA.



With modern single action, should be able to carry hammer down on a loaded
chamber. The trigger lifts a striker in to position between the hammer and
firing pin has been required for at least 20 years. So a dropped firearm
would not discharge.

Even the old 3 screw Ruger Blackhawks can be refitted by the factory for free to have the striker (transfer bar) to make it safe to carry fully loaded.. However, reportedly it devalues the pistol and ruins its otherwise outstanding trigger. None of my 3 screws have the "upgrade". They are range queens and see no carry duty.

#72
 

On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 13:11:25 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 12/15/19 12:55 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 09:34:34 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 12/15/19 2:26 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:59:27 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it was shipped to
my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it to SAO, among other
"customizations," so it had no "double action mode." You had to rack the
slide to put a round in the pipe and that, of course, would cock the
hammer. At that point, if you wished, you could flick on the manual
safety, and "carry" cocked and locked. I never did that. I carried in
Condition 3 when I carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in
Condition 4...no mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer
down, aka "idiot proof safe."
===

I can see an advantage to carrying with a round in the chamber but
with the hammer down - as long as the gun has a double action mode for
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and hope
your thumb doesn't slip?
That's how it works if you don't have a decocker.
Don't most DAs have a decocker?
Not many.

I guess I have just been around the good ones ;-)

Based on observations at the three public ranges I visit from time to
time, I can report that the mostly "polymer" pistols I see have neither
a traditional safety lever nor a traditional decocker lever. These
pistols are mostly Glocks and clones of Glocks. The one aspect of my
Walther I don't like is that it has neither a safety lever nor a
decocker lever.

Which one is it? The PPs have a decocker.

Glocks are DAO so a decocker would have no function. The striker is
"uncocked" until you pull the trigger.


Mine is a PPQ...this one. https://waltherarms.com/ppq-q4-tac-2/

I've not seen a recent PPQ with a decocker. I've send four or five
different models.

I was responding to your previous comment, "...around the good ones..."

As I said, a DAO has no need for a decocker. The normal state is
striker or hammer down. It cocks as you pull the trigger.

#72
 

On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 20:52:04 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

wrote:
On Sun, 15 Dec 2019 12:56:02 -0500 (EST), Justan Ohlphart
wrote:

Alex Wrote in message:
wrote: On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 21:43:26 -0500, Alex
wrote: wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2019 08:43:53 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote: I bought my CZ new from the CZ Custom Shop and before it
was shipped to my local gun store, I had the Custom Shop convert it
to SAO, among other "customizations," so it had no "double action
mode." You had to rack the slide to put a round in the pipe and
that, of course, would cock the hammer. At that point, if you
wished, you could flick on the manual safety, and "carry" cocked
and locked. I never did that. I carried in Condition 3 when I
carried. Usually, though, the pistol was kept in Condition 4...no
mag in the pistol, no round in the chamber, hammer down, aka "idiot
proof safe." === I can see an advantage to carrying with a
round in the chamber but with the hammer down - as long as the gun
has a double action mode
the first round. How do you get a round in the chamber without
cocking the hammer? Do you have to lower the hammer manually and
hope your thumb doesn't slip? That's how it works if you don't
have a decocker. Don't most DAs have a decocker?Not many.

He probably was thinking of da/sa

DAO has no use for a decocker and SA only should not be carried hammer
down on a loaded chamber in the first place. We have to be talking
about DA/SA.



With modern single action, should be able to carry hammer down on a loaded
chamber. The trigger lifts a striker in to position between the hammer and
firing pin has been required for at least 20 years. So a dropped firearm
would not discharge.

There is just little advantage since cocking most of them is somewhat
cumbersome on the draw stroke. On a 1911, that is not even a
recognized "condition".