Just finished my 1500 hour
 

No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

The big problem with Yamaha is they have the most expensive parts in
the outboard arena. One problem with parts in all manufacturers is
they don't have any parts shipped in bulk. When every little screw and
washer gets it's own plastic envelope with separate tracking for each
one, you quickly make a nickel part $2.
At IBM, stuff like that was shipped 144 at a time to the distribution
center and ended up being too cheap to inventory. You just made sure
box wasn't empty.
Back when I was doing a lot with Harleys and also had some spare time
on my hands around the industrial parts counters in Rockville, I
tracked down quite a few of those things (along with a few other guys
I knew who were working on them) and had a list of the Harley part
number along with the number you could use at a counter store.
Typically you could save 75-80% and in a lot of cases actually get a
higher rated part. (bearings in particular)
On outboards, probably the worst case is the kit you buy to rebuild
tilt and trim assemblies. On my Merc you needed 2 kits, they were both
over $50 each 20 years ago and there was about $2 worth of O rings in
there along with one or 2 proprietary gaskets that you can buy
separately.
I just had the same thing with my F70. There are O rings under the
holders for the cylinder anodes that are $2.90 each (with the
discount). The anode itself is only $2.30
When I looked, I have those exact O rings in my O ring assortment box
from Harbor Fright. If I went to the Ace Hardware and bought them in
an envelope they are 2 for .79 which is still more than they should
be.
I understand the part is a couple pennies and handling the envelope is
the expensive part.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:24:57 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

The big problem with Yamaha is they have the most expensive parts in
the outboard arena. One problem with parts in all manufacturers is
they don't have any parts shipped in bulk. When every little screw and
washer gets it's own plastic envelope with separate tracking for each
one, you quickly make a nickel part $2.
At IBM, stuff like that was shipped 144 at a time to the distribution
center and ended up being too cheap to inventory. You just made sure
box wasn't empty.
Back when I was doing a lot with Harleys and also had some spare time
on my hands around the industrial parts counters in Rockville, I
tracked down quite a few of those things (along with a few other guys
I knew who were working on them) and had a list of the Harley part
number along with the number you could use at a counter store.
Typically you could save 75-80% and in a lot of cases actually get a
higher rated part. (bearings in particular)
On outboards, probably the worst case is the kit you buy to rebuild
tilt and trim assemblies. On my Merc you needed 2 kits, they were both
over $50 each 20 years ago and there was about $2 worth of O rings in
there along with one or 2 proprietary gaskets that you can buy
separately.
I just had the same thing with my F70. There are O rings under the
holders for the cylinder anodes that are $2.90 each (with the
discount). The anode itself is only $2.30
When I looked, I have those exact O rings in my O ring assortment box
from Harbor Fright. If I went to the Ace Hardware and bought them in
an envelope they are 2 for .79 which is still more than they should
be.
I understand the part is a couple pennies and handling the envelope is
the expensive part.

Have to go along with that based on my experience.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Some models have a combination module that incorporates the starter
and tilt/trim relays. I thought that was what you meant. I just heard
about it, to be honest I never really looked at mine that closely but
since it is in the driveway, I will before splashdown.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 14:09:52 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Some models have a combination module that incorporates the starter
and tilt/trim relays. I thought that was what you meant. I just heard
about it, to be honest I never really looked at mine that closely but
since it is in the driveway, I will before splashdown.

I'll bet it's got a solenoid on the starter, dedicated to the starter. Solenoids and relays aren't
the same thing.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:17:21 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 14:09:52 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Some models have a combination module that incorporates the starter
and tilt/trim relays. I thought that was what you meant. I just heard
about it, to be honest I never really looked at mine that closely but
since it is in the driveway, I will before splashdown.

I'll bet it's got a solenoid on the starter, dedicated to the starter. Solenoids and relays aren't
the same thing.

===

Solenoid actually refers to a type of electomechanical construction
with a coil and plunger, not the function. Some solenoids, like on a
starter, have an external mechanical linkage in addition to their
electrical switching, others act as a self contained, high current
relay that only do switching. Other solenoids actuate valves with no
electrical control function at all.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:39:22 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:17:21 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 14:09:52 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Some models have a combination module that incorporates the starter
and tilt/trim relays. I thought that was what you meant. I just heard
about it, to be honest I never really looked at mine that closely but
since it is in the driveway, I will before splashdown.

I'll bet it's got a solenoid on the starter, dedicated to the starter. Solenoids and relays aren't
the same thing.

===

Solenoid actually refers to a type of electomechanical construction
with a coil and plunger, not the function. Some solenoids, like on a
starter, have an external mechanical linkage in addition to their
electrical switching, others act as a self contained, high current
relay that only do switching. Other solenoids actuate valves with no
electrical control function at all.


I agree. This is just an old term that came around the time we had
"condensers" in the ignition system.
It is similar to calling an outboard a "motor". I just try not to be
pedantic about it ;-)

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On 6/21/2018 12:54 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.


Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 02:03:42 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:39:22 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:17:21 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 14:09:52 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Some models have a combination module that incorporates the starter
and tilt/trim relays. I thought that was what you meant. I just heard
about it, to be honest I never really looked at mine that closely but
since it is in the driveway, I will before splashdown.

I'll bet it's got a solenoid on the starter, dedicated to the starter. Solenoids and relays aren't
the same thing.

===

Solenoid actually refers to a type of electomechanical construction
with a coil and plunger, not the function. Some solenoids, like on a
starter, have an external mechanical linkage in addition to their
electrical switching, others act as a self contained, high current
relay that only do switching. Other solenoids actuate valves with no
electrical control function at all.


I agree. This is just an old term that came around the time we had
"condensers" in the ignition system.
It is similar to calling an outboard a "motor". I just try not to be
pedantic about it ;-)

Yamaha isn't pedantic either. Ask for a solenoid (for that 150hp four-stroke I had) and they ask for
much better than $500.

Like I said, Tim found one for a bit over $25 that fit perfectly.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 05:06:52 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 12:54 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.


Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.


===

Our first cruising sailboat had a small Volvo diesel with something
like that. It was called a Dynastart, worked OK as a starter but left
a lot to be desired as a generator. I think it was only rated at 10
amps charging, and like all Volvo parts, was incredibly overpriced..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wfTJWI__i8

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On 6/21/2018 8:35 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 05:06:52 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 12:54 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.


Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.


===

Our first cruising sailboat had a small Volvo diesel with something
like that. It was called a Dynastart, worked OK as a starter but left
a lot to be desired as a generator. I think it was only rated at 10
amps charging, and like all Volvo parts, was incredibly overpriced..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wfTJWI__i8



I think I am recalling the early 60's Renault Dauphine. It's starter
was also the generator.

Apparently this system is still used in gas powered golf carts.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On 6/21/18 8:43 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 6/21/2018 8:35 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 05:06:52 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 12:54 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds
another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of
the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the
computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things
to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away
(wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those
years.Â*Â* Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet.Â* And the shifter cam in the
handle
broke.Â*Â* They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the
starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for
about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the
'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that
Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.


Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.


===

Our first cruising sailboat had a small Volvo diesel with something
like that.Â* It was called a Dynastart, worked OK as a starter but left
a lot to be desired as a generator.Â* I think it was only rated at 10
amps charging, and like all Volvo parts, was incredibly overpriced..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wfTJWI__i8



I think I am recalling the early 60's Renault Dauphine.Â* It's starter
was also the generator.

Apparently this system is still used in gas powered golf carts.



I remember those, and some really ugly Citroens, DKWs (two cycle) and
other somewhat strange European cars of that era.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 05:57:03 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 02:03:42 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:39:22 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 17:17:21 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 14:09:52 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

Some models have a combination module that incorporates the starter
and tilt/trim relays. I thought that was what you meant. I just heard
about it, to be honest I never really looked at mine that closely but
since it is in the driveway, I will before splashdown.

I'll bet it's got a solenoid on the starter, dedicated to the starter. Solenoids and relays aren't
the same thing.

===

Solenoid actually refers to a type of electomechanical construction
with a coil and plunger, not the function. Some solenoids, like on a
starter, have an external mechanical linkage in addition to their
electrical switching, others act as a self contained, high current
relay that only do switching. Other solenoids actuate valves with no
electrical control function at all.


I agree. This is just an old term that came around the time we had
"condensers" in the ignition system.
It is similar to calling an outboard a "motor". I just try not to be
pedantic about it ;-)

Yamaha isn't pedantic either. Ask for a solenoid (for that 150hp four-stroke I had) and they ask for
much better than $500.

Like I said, Tim found one for a bit over $25 that fit perfectly.

It is what I said about Yamaha charging ridiculous prices for parts.
Mercury was a little better but not much. I know when I needed tilt
trim relays for my old 75, Merc wanted almost $40 each but I could get
exactly the same part for about $8 as a lawn tractor part. There was
nothing particularly "marine" about the one Merc sells.
On my 60 they had changed to the plug in "ice cube" relay that cars
are full of these days. They still want a ridiculous price for them
but I have a bunch I got from a surplus place for about $3 each and I
use them for all sorts of stuff.
It is really a pretty nice relay SPDT rated at 30a with a 12vdc coil.
You can just use spade connectors or buy the socket for another buck
or so.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 08:35:04 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 05:06:52 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 12:54 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.


Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.


===

Our first cruising sailboat had a small Volvo diesel with something
like that. It was called a Dynastart, worked OK as a starter but left
a lot to be desired as a generator. I think it was only rated at 10
amps charging, and like all Volvo parts, was incredibly overpriced..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wfTJWI__i8

That is the problem when you try to use a high torque motor as a
generator.
These days generators are about as dead as disco anyway because an
alternator is so much more efficient. I suppose there are still
special applications where a generator is the way to go but that is
not charging batteries in a boat/car.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

On 6/21/2018 12:33 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 08:35:04 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 21 Jun 2018 05:06:52 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/21/2018 12:54 AM, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 05:28:11 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 20:24:50 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 19:36:32 -0400, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 22:09:37 -0000 (UTC), Bill wrote:

wrote:
No big deal. I did throw a belt at it. It was a tad over $100 in
parts, I did the water pump kit on the 1400 hour. That adds another
$50 or so.
It took about 4 hours, not much compared to the $700 in labor the
Yamaha dealer charges, plus full retail on the parts instead of the
~30% off you get on the internet.
Nothing exciting turned up (no water in the oil etc) and the computer
says I still have never thrown a code for anything.
So far so good on my 2012 F70. I still have a few little things to do
on the boat but we will splash for our regular boat ride tomorrow.
I might go ahead and work on the trailer before I put it away (wheel
bearing clean and pack mostly)


My 2003 Yamaha T-8 has only had two problems in all those years. Piece of
dirt or something on the idle jet. And the shifter cam in the handle
broke. They make good engines and assemblies.

Well, don't break anything. I busted the plastic case for the starter solenoid. Yamaha wanted well
over $500 for a new solenoid. Tim got me one that worked for about $26.75!

If I ever lose that $500 "all in one" starter, tilt, trim solenoid, I
will get a couple "ice cube" relays and a good old starter solenoid.

I'm talking about the 'starter' solenoid. The one mounted on the 'starter'. Don't know about the one
to which you refer. Not all 'good old starter solenoids' fit that Yamaha starter.

I looked and you are right. It is the old GM style starter solenoid
right on the motor on my F70. The guys must be talking about an old
design.
I guess that is how it is with a motor that doesn't break. You never
really get a good look at it. I doubt the motor cover has been off my
F70 more than 25-30 times in 6 years. I know it sometimes goes the
whole 100 hours between service intervals without coming off.


Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.


===

Our first cruising sailboat had a small Volvo diesel with something
like that. It was called a Dynastart, worked OK as a starter but left
a lot to be desired as a generator. I think it was only rated at 10
amps charging, and like all Volvo parts, was incredibly overpriced..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wfTJWI__i8

That is the problem when you try to use a high torque motor as a
generator.
These days generators are about as dead as disco anyway because an
alternator is so much more efficient. I suppose there are still
special applications where a generator is the way to go but that is
not charging batteries in a boat/car.



I was looking up this subject trying to find the car I remembered
as having this setup (early 60's Renault) and discovered that the
starter/generator combination is still used in at least some gas powered
golf carts.

Granted, the torque as a starter and current generating capacity as a
generator are minimal.

Just finished my 1500 hour
 

Mr. Luddite
- show quoted text -
Seems I have a recollection of a automobile at one time that the
starter motor also served as the generator once the engine was
running.

.......

Yes, Dodge had a gear driven starter/generator that was called the “silent start system. Because when you hit the switch all you heard was the engine turning over until it started or the battery was dead.

It was obviously a great idea that’s why every car has them. 😳🙄