Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 11/5/2014 10:56 AM, James wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 11/4/2014 5:35 PM, James wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a
350 Chevy OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has
the same engine in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser
engine. I don't know if he's referring to the fact that they're
both 350 Chevy's or Mercury built the OMC also. I haven't gone
to see the boat yet. The picture of the engine shows that it's
definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim


If you are asking for general opinions on the boat, here's mine:

That's a pretty old boat. A lot depends on how it was maintained,
how many hours are on the engine, the condition of just about
everything, and on and on and on.

IIRC a marine gas engine, well maintained is good for about
1,000 to 1,500 hours of operation before a rebuild or repower
typically becomes necessary. Do you know if it has been
re-powered? How many hours are on it?

Same with the outdrive. They need maintenance and rebuilds from
time to time.

Engine and outdrive rebuilds/replacements aren't cheap.

Boats are money pits to begin with. Older ones with lots of
hours on them are even more so. Don't ask how I know.

Only other comment is that a Bayliner of that vintage isn't worth
much.

Actually I was asking if Mercury had built or acquired OMC. I think
what the owner was referring to was that both his boats had 350
Chevys. One is a OMC and the other is a Mercuiser. I also know
that B.O.A.T means break out another thousand or Boat is a hole in
the water surrounded by fiberglas. We're looking for a cabin
cruiser that will fill our requirements and not brake the bank. A
little work is ok. I've pass up several that need engines and major
work. I'm looking for a happy medium and it's out there somewhere.
I'm not in a major hurry.



The GM 350 is a very popular marine engine found in many boats of
that size regardless of who manufactures the drive system.

Based on past experience though, I'd never even consider on that has
a carburetor. Fuel injection is the only way to go. If that is the
original engine, most likely it has a carburetor. Just my opinion
based on experience.

My comment on engine hours still stands. Good engine but like all,
it eventually needs a rebuild or replacement. You really don't want
to find out while cruising with the family 5 or 10 miles offshore.

One of my first boats that I bought back in mid 1990's was a 27' 1982
Century Express Cruiser. The engine had just been replaced with a
rebuilt GM 350 and it had an Alpha One (Mercury) outdrive.

Despite the rebuild, the engine was always problematic, mostly
involving the Rochester "QuadraBog" 4 barrel carburetor. Despite
several attempts at cleaning and rebuilds, it never ran right for
very long.

Then the rebuilt engine starting ****ing water out of one side. One
of the plugs they use when casting rotted completely through. These
things are usually discovered while underway.

Then the Alpha drive started leaking with the oil becoming mixed with
water. Rebuild time.

Then the hydraulic lines that raise and lower the drive started
leaking. If the engine's carburetor happened to be cooperating, I'd
get the boat up on plane, trim the drive but it would slowly start to
lower again due to the leak resulting in some scary and dangerous bow
steering.

Didn't have it too long. Gave it to my brother. If it happened to
start, he'd just putt-putt around the harbor with it. Most of the
time it sat at his slip as a floating bar.

Tim wrote:

James, I'm liking your approach to this and it sounds more
encouraging that you're up for the task and not a novice.

Again the OMC and the Mercruiser are the same engines that you'd find
in a comparable 3/4 ton Chevy pickup with the exception of a
different cam shaft, steel stead of cast iron crankshaft. The freeze
plugs are a non corrosive metal due to usually a raw water
application as well as the water pump. The diffrence between an auto
and a marine pump is the boat pump has special sealed bearings and
usually powder coated inside to prevent water damage to the bearings
and also prevent rust corrosion. The alternators and starters have
spark resistant shielding as well. If a guy is handy with tools you
shouldn't have any problem with maintainance. If you decide to
persue. this project. It'd be worth getting a mercruiser shop
manual. The book is extremely thourough and great to have around. You
can get a complete shop manual for 20 -30 bucks on eBay. Keep us
informed. Btw there's a lot of great archives in rec boats that a
person can look up as well.

This particular boat has a closed cooling system (fresh water). Our
sailboat was raw water kind of pita to winterize but I just pumped Rv
anti-freeze through it. I had a '67 3/4 ton Chevy 4X4 with a 327 in it
that I rebuilt ran good. Then I got an '81 Chevy 1 ton with a 454 now I
have a Superduty 7.3L which gets a whole lot better mileage.Jim

On 11/5/2014 7:08 PM, James wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 11/5/2014 10:56 AM, James wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 11/4/2014 5:35 PM, James wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a
350 Chevy OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has
the same engine in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser
engine. I don't know if he's referring to the fact that they're
both 350 Chevy's or Mercury built the OMC also. I haven't gone
to see the boat yet. The picture of the engine shows that it's
definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim


If you are asking for general opinions on the boat, here's mine:

That's a pretty old boat. A lot depends on how it was maintained,
how many hours are on the engine, the condition of just about
everything, and on and on and on.

IIRC a marine gas engine, well maintained is good for about
1,000 to 1,500 hours of operation before a rebuild or repower
typically becomes necessary. Do you know if it has been
re-powered? How many hours are on it?

Same with the outdrive. They need maintenance and rebuilds from
time to time.

Engine and outdrive rebuilds/replacements aren't cheap.

Boats are money pits to begin with. Older ones with lots of
hours on them are even more so. Don't ask how I know.

Only other comment is that a Bayliner of that vintage isn't worth
much.

Actually I was asking if Mercury had built or acquired OMC. I think
what the owner was referring to was that both his boats had 350
Chevys. One is a OMC and the other is a Mercuiser. I also know
that B.O.A.T means break out another thousand or Boat is a hole in
the water surrounded by fiberglas. We're looking for a cabin
cruiser that will fill our requirements and not brake the bank. A
little work is ok. I've pass up several that need engines and major
work. I'm looking for a happy medium and it's out there somewhere.
I'm not in a major hurry.



The GM 350 is a very popular marine engine found in many boats of
that size regardless of who manufactures the drive system.

Based on past experience though, I'd never even consider on that has
a carburetor. Fuel injection is the only way to go. If that is the
original engine, most likely it has a carburetor. Just my opinion
based on experience.

My comment on engine hours still stands. Good engine but like all,
it eventually needs a rebuild or replacement. You really don't want
to find out while cruising with the family 5 or 10 miles offshore.

One of my first boats that I bought back in mid 1990's was a 27' 1982
Century Express Cruiser. The engine had just been replaced with a
rebuilt GM 350 and it had an Alpha One (Mercury) outdrive.

Despite the rebuild, the engine was always problematic, mostly
involving the Rochester "QuadraBog" 4 barrel carburetor. Despite
several attempts at cleaning and rebuilds, it never ran right for
very long.

Then the rebuilt engine starting ****ing water out of one side. One
of the plugs they use when casting rotted completely through. These
things are usually discovered while underway.

Then the Alpha drive started leaking with the oil becoming mixed with
water. Rebuild time.

Then the hydraulic lines that raise and lower the drive started
leaking. If the engine's carburetor happened to be cooperating, I'd
get the boat up on plane, trim the drive but it would slowly start to
lower again due to the leak resulting in some scary and dangerous bow
steering.

Didn't have it too long. Gave it to my brother. If it happened to
start, he'd just putt-putt around the harbor with it. Most of the
time it sat at his slip as a floating bar.

I'm with you on Quadjet. Won't even make a good anchor. I used Holleys
on my Chevy trucks except for the last one whiich was a 454 when I used
an Edelbrok.That's mostly why I have a Ford diesel now about 3 times
the milege. Jim


Heh. The problem with boats is you get two-foot-itis every year or two.
One benefit though is that at some point your boat gets big enough to
warrant diesel power. It's hard to go back to gas after that.

On 11/5/2014 7:16 PM, James wrote:
Tim wrote:

James, I'm liking your approach to this and it sounds more
encouraging that you're up for the task and not a novice.

Again the OMC and the Mercruiser are the same engines that you'd find
in a comparable 3/4 ton Chevy pickup with the exception of a
different cam shaft, steel stead of cast iron crankshaft. The freeze
plugs are a non corrosive metal due to usually a raw water
application as well as the water pump. The diffrence between an auto
and a marine pump is the boat pump has special sealed bearings and
usually powder coated inside to prevent water damage to the bearings
and also prevent rust corrosion. The alternators and starters have
spark resistant shielding as well. If a guy is handy with tools you
shouldn't have any problem with maintainance. If you decide to
persue. this project. It'd be worth getting a mercruiser shop
manual. The book is extremely thourough and great to have around. You
can get a complete shop manual for 20 -30 bucks on eBay. Keep us
informed. Btw there's a lot of great archives in rec boats that a
person can look up as well.

This particular boat has a closed cooling system (fresh water). Our
sailboat was raw water kind of pita to winterize but I just pumped Rv
anti-freeze through it. I had a '67 3/4 ton Chevy 4X4 with a 327 in it
that I rebuilt ran good. Then I got an '81 Chevy 1 ton with a 454 now I
have a Superduty 7.3L which gets a whole lot better mileage.Jim



Too bad Ford could not have kept using the 7.3L diesel. It's
replacement (the 6.0L) was terrible in terms of reliability. I had a
2005 F-350 with the 6.0L and the high pressure pump failed twice leaving
me stranded while traveling, once in Georgia and then a few months later
in Virginia. Then, the turbo failed. All of this happened within the
first 11,000 miles. I took it back to the dealer and told them I didn't
want it. Don't know much about the latest Ford 6.7L diesel.

I like Ford trucks but had bad experiences with that engine.

On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 16:35:34 -0600, "James"
wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a 350 Chevy
OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has the same engine
in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser engine. I don't know
if he's referring to the fact that they're both 350 Chevy's or Mercury
built the OMC also. I haven't gone to see the boat yet. The picture of
the engine shows that it's definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim

===

It's important to understand that boats that age develop issues other
than the engine and outdrive. Frequent failure points are rot in the
transom, cockpit floors and stringers. Any one of those problems
puts the boat into the negative value category meaning that it is more
expensive to fix than the boat is worth. The electrical system is
another area that is frequently deteriorated beyond repair. Spending
a few hundred bucks for a good surveyor can be the best investment you
ever make.

On 11/5/2014 9:40 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 16:35:34 -0600, "James"
wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a 350 Chevy
OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has the same engine
in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser engine. I don't know
if he's referring to the fact that they're both 350 Chevy's or Mercury
built the OMC also. I haven't gone to see the boat yet. The picture of
the engine shows that it's definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim

===

It's important to understand that boats that age develop issues other
than the engine and outdrive. Frequent failure points are rot in the
transom, cockpit floors and stringers. Any one of those problems
puts the boat into the negative value category meaning that it is more
expensive to fix than the boat is worth. The electrical system is
another area that is frequently deteriorated beyond repair. Spending
a few hundred bucks for a good surveyor can be the best investment you
ever make.



Oh yeah. Rot. That '82 Century I owned had rotted stringers running
port to starboard just forward of the engine. I put some pressure
treated "sister" stringers attached to the solid sections on each end of
the rotted ones and then soaked the rotted sections with anti-freeze.

Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 16:35:34 -0600, "James"
wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a 350 Chevy
OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has the same engine
in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser engine. I don't know
if he's referring to the fact that they're both 350 Chevy's or Mercury
built the OMC also. I haven't gone to see the boat yet. The picture of
the engine shows that it's definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim

===

It's important to understand that boats that age develop issues other
than the engine and outdrive. Frequent failure points are rot in the
transom, cockpit floors and stringers. Any one of those problems
puts the boat into the negative value category meaning that it is more
expensive to fix than the boat is worth. The electrical system is
another area that is frequently deteriorated beyond repair. Spending
a few hundred bucks for a good surveyor can be the best investment you
ever make.

Some boats worth more as scrap. Needed some lead for crab pot weights.
Local Craigslist ad for lead. Guy delivered as he was coming to town. Has
a ranch in the Livermore hills, and scraps out old boats. He had just done
an Islander 35? And had a 5500 pound lead keel. Costs $100 a ton to get
rid of the left overs at the Cogeneration plant.

Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 11/5/2014 7:16 PM, James wrote:
Tim wrote:

James, I'm liking your approach to this and it sounds more
encouraging that you're up for the task and not a novice.

Again the OMC and the Mercruiser are the same engines that you'd
find in a comparable 3/4 ton Chevy pickup with the exception of a
different cam shaft, steel stead of cast iron crankshaft. The
freeze plugs are a non corrosive metal due to usually a raw water
application as well as the water pump. The diffrence between an
auto and a marine pump is the boat pump has special sealed
bearings and usually powder coated inside to prevent water damage
to the bearings and also prevent rust corrosion. The alternators
and starters have spark resistant shielding as well. If a guy is
handy with tools you shouldn't have any problem with
maintainance. If you decide to persue. this project. It'd be
worth getting a mercruiser shop manual. The book is extremely
thourough and great to have around. You can get a complete shop
manual for 20 -30 bucks on eBay. Keep us informed. Btw there's a
lot of great archives in rec boats that a person can look up as
well.

This particular boat has a closed cooling system (fresh water). Our
sailboat was raw water kind of pita to winterize but I just pumped
Rv anti-freeze through it. I had a '67 3/4 ton Chevy 4X4 with a 327
in it that I rebuilt ran good. Then I got an '81 Chevy 1 ton with a
454 now I have a Superduty 7.3L which gets a whole lot better
mileage.Jim



Too bad Ford could not have kept using the 7.3L diesel. It's
replacement (the 6.0L) was terrible in terms of reliability. I had a
2005 F-350 with the 6.0L and the high pressure pump failed twice
leaving me stranded while traveling, once in Georgia and then a few
months later in Virginia. Then, the turbo failed. All of this
happened within the first 11,000 miles. I took it back to the dealer
and told them I didn't want it. Don't know much about the latest
Ford 6.7L diesel.

I like Ford trucks but had bad experiences with that engine.

The new 6.7L seems to be a good engine. Built by Ford in Brazil I
believe. Haven't heard any big complaints yet.

Wayne.B wrote:

On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 16:35:34 -0600, "James"
wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a 350
Chevy OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has the
same engine in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser
engine. I don't know if he's referring to the fact that they're
both 350 Chevy's or Mercury built the OMC also. I haven't gone to
see the boat yet. The picture of the engine shows that it's
definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim

===

It's important to understand that boats that age develop issues other
than the engine and outdrive. Frequent failure points are rot in the
transom, cockpit floors and stringers. Any one of those problems
puts the boat into the negative value category meaning that it is more
expensive to fix than the boat is worth. The electrical system is
another area that is frequently deteriorated beyond repair. Spending
a few hundred bucks for a good surveyor can be the best investment you
ever make.

Ya, I'm familiar with rot. Our sailboat was '75 and it had a little
rot. I've worked with Fiberglas, electrical, carpentry and I'm a
certified welder both structural steel and aluminium. My fishing
partner has an Alumaweld jet boat and I build things for it all the
time.

Mr. Luddite wrote:

On 11/5/2014 9:40 PM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 04 Nov 2014 16:35:34 -0600, "James"
wrote:

Hi Group, I'm presently looking at a 1977 28' Bayliner with a 350
Chevy OMC engine and Volvo 270 drive. The owner says he has the
same engine in his tournament ski boat which is a Mercruiser
engine. I don't know if he's referring to the fact that they're
both 350 Chevy's or Mercury built the OMC also. I haven't gone to
see the boat yet. The picture of the engine shows that it's
definitly a Chevy and OMC. Jim

===

It's important to understand that boats that age develop issues
other than the engine and outdrive. Frequent failure points are
rot in the transom, cockpit floors and stringers. Any one of
those problems puts the boat into the negative value category
meaning that it is more expensive to fix than the boat is worth.
The electrical system is another area that is frequently
deteriorated beyond repair. Spending a few hundred bucks for a
good surveyor can be the best investment you ever make.



Oh yeah. Rot. That '82 Century I owned had rotted stringers running
port to starboard just forward of the engine. I put some pressure
treated "sister" stringers attached to the solid sections on each end
of the rotted ones and then soaked the rotted sections with
anti-freeze.

I've fixed rotted stringers in our pickup campers with System 3 Fixrot.
Great stuff makes rotted eood really strong.