|
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, August 14, 1999 12:00:00 AM UTC-7, JamesGang wrote:
Some of the older merc magnums had them. They used to be more common in small blocks but truth is that any small block with less than 400hp doesn't need 4 bolt mains. And my own truck gas engine experience has been that you'll see 50 thrown rods and broken pistons for every broken crank or main cap. I agree with the rest of the post though. You're better off with the 350 than the 305. john sipkens wrote: I have never seen a 4 bolt main yet in common marine engine, OMC, Mrec, Volvo? -- Lifespeed wrote in message ... In a *quality* marine engine, they use a steel crank, 4-bolt main caps, and forged pistons. This is not to say that you will find these desirable items in every marine/auto engine. The head gaskets are more corrosion resistant also. None of the differences are critical, if you don't use the engine hard, or run in salt water. If you do either, then you want the sturdier components. 350 to 305? Didn't you notice you're going the wrong direction? No, you won't notice any improvement in fuel economy. I'll give you one guess what you *will* notice, tho. FWIW, the "targetmaster" is the el cheapo GM replacement. I wouldn't buy one. * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! Agreed. I have a 305 in my '77 Marquis. It's turning into a nice boat, that is, when i get the interior finished. But if I have problems with the stock 305, I'll put a 350 in it's place. A lot better power per fuel usage. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On 3/28/2014 10:38 PM, Tim wrote:
On Saturday, August 14, 1999 12:00:00 AM UTC-7, JamesGang wrote: Some of the older merc magnums had them. They used to be more common in small blocks but truth is that any small block with less than 400hp doesn't need 4 bolt mains. And my own truck gas engine experience has been that you'll see 50 thrown rods and broken pistons for every broken crank or main cap. I agree with the rest of the post though. You're better off with the 350 than the 305. john sipkens wrote: I have never seen a 4 bolt main yet in common marine engine, OMC, Mrec, Volvo? -- Lifespeed wrote in message ... In a *quality* marine engine, they use a steel crank, 4-bolt main caps, and forged pistons. This is not to say that you will find these desirable items in every marine/auto engine. The head gaskets are more corrosion resistant also. None of the differences are critical, if you don't use the engine hard, or run in salt water. If you do either, then you want the sturdier components. 350 to 305? Didn't you notice you're going the wrong direction? No, you won't notice any improvement in fuel economy. I'll give you one guess what you *will* notice, tho. FWIW, the "targetmaster" is the el cheapo GM replacement. I wouldn't buy one. * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! Agreed. I have a 305 in my '77 Marquis. It's turning into a nice boat, that is, when i get the interior finished. But if I have problems with the stock 305, I'll put a 350 in it's place. A lot better power per fuel usage. Just curious Tim ... where are you reading these posts? You just replied to a post that was made on August 14, 1999. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:02:26 AM UTC-7, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/28/2014 10:38 PM, Tim wrote: On Saturday, August 14, 1999 12:00:00 AM UTC-7, JamesGang wrote: Some of the older merc magnums had them. They used to be more common in small blocks but truth is that any small block with less than 400hp doesn't need 4 bolt mains. And my own truck gas engine experience has been that you'll see 50 thrown rods and broken pistons for every broken crank or main cap. I agree with the rest of the post though. You're better off with the 350 than the 305. john sipkens wrote: I have never seen a 4 bolt main yet in common marine engine, OMC, Mrec, Volvo? -- Lifespeed wrote in message ... In a *quality* marine engine, they use a steel crank, 4-bolt main caps, and forged pistons. This is not to say that you will find these desirable items in every marine/auto engine. The head gaskets are more corrosion resistant also. None of the differences are critical, if you don't use the engine hard, or run in salt water. If you do either, then you want the sturdier components. 350 to 305? Didn't you notice you're going the wrong direction? No, you won't notice any improvement in fuel economy. I'll give you one guess what you *will* notice, tho. FWIW, the "targetmaster" is the el cheapo GM replacement. I wouldn't buy one. * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! Agreed. I have a 305 in my '77 Marquis. It's turning into a nice boat, that is, when i get the interior finished. But if I have problems with the stock 305, I'll put a 350 in it's place. A lot better power per fuel usage. Just curious Tim ... where are you reading these posts? You just replied to a post that was made on August 14, 1999. Well Rich, this is a boating group isn't it? I Especially this year, when I'm gonna start working on finishing my boat and planning trips I'm doing a lot of research. And I find old threads that have some good advice. People who never post in here do the same. That's how I got onto rec.boats many years ago, by doing a google search on a boating question. So, that's what I do. BTW- I made up my mind that I won't be evolved with political/religious threads any more. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:56:20 AM UTC-7, wrote:
I imagine he is just trying to stir up some actual boating content. It is a shame he has to dig that deep to find it. I am not sure we still have any I/O guys here tho. Personally I think they are "trailer boat only" in most applications. I am not sure I want to keep rubber parts below the water line on a boat that stays in the water around here. Hey, these ancient posts have a wealth of info. and I'm enjoying them . Greg, I could switch over to outboards, I've had a few of those too. ?;^ ) |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
|
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On 3/29/14, 6:17 AM, Tim wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:56:20 AM UTC-7, wrote: I imagine he is just trying to stir up some actual boating content. It is a shame he has to dig that deep to find it. I am not sure we still have any I/O guys here tho. Personally I think they are "trailer boat only" in most applications. I am not sure I want to keep rubber parts below the water line on a boat that stays in the water around here. Hey, these ancient posts have a wealth of info. and I'm enjoying them . Greg, I could switch over to outboards, I've had a few of those too. ?;^ ) The antique outboard site is still alive and well: http://www.aomci.org/ I still have a place in my heart for a mid 1950s Evinrude Lightwin or Ducktwin. Here's a page on reviving a long out of service outboard: http://forums.iboats.com/engine-freq...oy-158086.html |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 19:38:45 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote:
On Saturday, August 14, 1999 12:00:00 AM UTC-7, JamesGang wrote: Some of the older merc magnums had them. They used to be more common in small blocks but truth is that any small block with less than 400hp doesn't need 4 bolt mains. And my own truck gas engine experience has been that you'll see 50 thrown rods and broken pistons for every broken crank or main cap. I agree with the rest of the post though. You're better off with the 350 than the 305. john sipkens wrote: I have never seen a 4 bolt main yet in common marine engine, OMC, Mrec, Volvo? -- Lifespeed wrote in message ... In a *quality* marine engine, they use a steel crank, 4-bolt main caps, and forged pistons. This is not to say that you will find these desirable items in every marine/auto engine. The head gaskets are more corrosion resistant also. None of the differences are critical, if you don't use the engine hard, or run in salt water. If you do either, then you want the sturdier components. 350 to 305? Didn't you notice you're going the wrong direction? No, you won't notice any improvement in fuel economy. I'll give you one guess what you *will* notice, tho. FWIW, the "targetmaster" is the el cheapo GM replacement. I wouldn't buy one. * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! Agreed. I have a 305 in my '77 Marquis. It's turning into a nice boat, that is, when i get the interior finished. But if I have problems with the stock 305, I'll put a 350 in it's place. A lot better power per fuel usage. The 350 did a good job of pushing that 21' Proline across the water! My SIL had a v6 in his Chapparal 24'er, and it pushed that boat nicely also. Might be something to consider if you don't need a lot of speed. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 03:12:39 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:02:26 AM UTC-7, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 3/28/2014 10:38 PM, Tim wrote: On Saturday, August 14, 1999 12:00:00 AM UTC-7, JamesGang wrote: Some of the older merc magnums had them. They used to be more common in small blocks but truth is that any small block with less than 400hp doesn't need 4 bolt mains. And my own truck gas engine experience has been that you'll see 50 thrown rods and broken pistons for every broken crank or main cap. I agree with the rest of the post though. You're better off with the 350 than the 305. john sipkens wrote: I have never seen a 4 bolt main yet in common marine engine, OMC, Mrec, Volvo? -- Lifespeed wrote in message ... In a *quality* marine engine, they use a steel crank, 4-bolt main caps, and forged pistons. This is not to say that you will find these desirable items in every marine/auto engine. The head gaskets are more corrosion resistant also. None of the differences are critical, if you don't use the engine hard, or run in salt water. If you do either, then you want the sturdier components. 350 to 305? Didn't you notice you're going the wrong direction? No, you won't notice any improvement in fuel economy. I'll give you one guess what you *will* notice, tho. FWIW, the "targetmaster" is the el cheapo GM replacement. I wouldn't buy one. * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! Agreed. I have a 305 in my '77 Marquis. It's turning into a nice boat, that is, when i get the interior finished. But if I have problems with the stock 305, I'll put a 350 in it's place. A lot better power per fuel usage. Just curious Tim ... where are you reading these posts? You just replied to a post that was made on August 14, 1999. Well Rich, this is a boating group isn't it? I Especially this year, when I'm gonna start working on finishing my boat and planning trips I'm doing a lot of research. And I find old threads that have some good advice. People who never post in here do the same. That's how I got onto rec.boats many years ago, by doing a google search on a boating question. So, that's what I do. BTW- I made up my mind that I won't be evolved with political/religious threads any more. That's an absolutely SPECTACULAR idea! I think you should also consider finishing and planning trips on those two Moto Guzzis of yours! And, if you want to talk about them, that would be great also! The big question is whether I should hang the Winchester http://www.winchesterguns.com/produc...asp?mid=534199 or get one of these to hang in the trailer. http://www.mauser.org/german-k98-mauser-rifle/ |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 6:58:46 AM UTC-7, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 19:38:45 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: The 350 did a good job of pushing that 21' Proline across the water! My SIL had a v6 in his Chapparal 24'er, and it pushed that boat nicely also. Might be something to consider if you don't need a lot of speed. The GM v-6 is a great and durable engine, that packs a good punch with 'reasonable' economy. the bad part about swapping from a small-block to the v-8 is that the exhaust manifolds are different, (for obvious reasons), where small v8's would likely interchange. Plus, small v's are in plentiful supply. Otherwise... |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 9:27:01 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 03:17:19 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:56:20 AM UTC-7, wrote: I imagine he is just trying to stir up some actual boating content. It is a shame he has to dig that deep to find it. I am not sure we still have any I/O guys here tho. Personally I think they are "trailer boat only" in most applications. I am not sure I want to keep rubber parts below the water line on a boat that stays in the water around here. Hey, these ancient posts have a wealth of info. and I'm enjoying them . Greg, I could switch over to outboards, I've had a few of those too. ?;^ ) Now that the 4 strokes are getting better, there is very little advantage to an I/O. My mother's family all ran "Bay Built" work boats with inboards and I thought an I/O was the best of both worlds until I got down here. The ones I was familiar with on the Chesapeake were still trailer boats. Down here the only I/Os you see are "go fasts" with big block V-8s that seldom get wet. I know exactly what you're saying Greg. But unless you have a sail boat, and like to pay slip rents, around here, trailer boating rules. Mercruiser alpha 1's are easy to come by due to long term use. I mean' it's kinda hard to improve a hammer. And I/0 engines are something that most parts you can get through NAPA. Like carb kits, solenoids, belts etc. I wouldn't use an automotive water pump, though... |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 7:11:57 AM UTC-7, John H. wrote:
The big question is whether I should hang the Winchester http://www.winchesterguns.com/produc...asp?mid=534199 or get one of these to hang in the trailer. http://www.mauser.org/german-k98-mauser-rifle/ You got an 8mm Mauser? |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:53:15 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 7:11:57 AM UTC-7, John H. wrote: The big question is whether I should hang the Winchester http://www.winchesterguns.com/produc...asp?mid=534199 or get one of these to hang in the trailer. http://www.mauser.org/german-k98-mauser-rifle/ You got an 8mm Mauser? No. I'm just looking. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 10:19:51 AM UTC-7,
What's a "carb kit"? a 'carb kit' is one of those things full of gaskets, springs and a lot of stuff you don't need. But the gaskets are helpful on reassembly, after taking the carburator apart to clean it all out,becausse after letting it sit for a couple years and corrode the insides. Of course you knew that... ?;^ ) I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. They can be as of reason previously stated. I know EFI is a great thing which made carburation obsolete, but unless you already have a late model boat that the engine is factory equipped with the EFI, a change over is quite expensive. A 'carb kit' is a whole lot cheaper... On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. Oh that's true Greg. No argument from me, But here I/O's are plentiful and easy to work on and are still extremely popular. Especially since both my brothers have Alpha drives it's great to have a line of spare parts. Over the past few years, I've bought 4 scrap boats and stripped them down for parts. The engines were junk (poor winterizing, but the Alpha outdrives were good. Got a couple stainless props and one had a new Gimbal bearing previously installed the year before. Trailers too. Got all for about the price of a reman lower end. So I'm gonna be in the I/O business for quire a while. If you want a boutique manufacturer, there is Seven Marine, putting a Northstar Cadillac engine in an outboard. (557HP and looking at something over 600 from what I hear) I've seen pics, and read specs of those. http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/te...-7-marine.html But an asking price of approx. $75,000.00 a copy, is just a tad bit out of my price league... Woah! |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 10:44:31 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 10:19:51 AM UTC-7, What's a "carb kit"? a 'carb kit' is one of those things full of gaskets, springs and a lot of stuff you don't need. But the gaskets are helpful on reassembly, after taking the carburator apart to clean it all out,becausse after letting it sit for a couple years and corrode the insides. Of course you knew that... ?;^ ) I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. They can be as of reason previously stated. I know EFI is a great thing which made carburation obsolete, but unless you already have a late model boat that the engine is factory equipped with the EFI, a change over is quite expensive. A 'carb kit' is a whole lot cheaper... On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. Oh that's true Greg. No argument from me, But here I/O's are plentiful and easy to work on and are still extremely popular. Especially since both my brothers have Alpha drives it's great to have a line of spare parts. Over the past few years, I've bought 4 scrap boats and stripped them down for parts. The engines were junk (poor winterizing, but the Alpha outdrives were good. Got a couple stainless props and one had a new Gimbal bearing previously installed the year before. Trailers too. Got all for about the price of a reman lower end. So I'm gonna be in the I/O business for quire a while. I'm jealous 'cause you've got a place to store all that stuff you've picked up! |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
|
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 14:12:38 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: Unless things have changed in the last few years I can think of one significant advantage of an I/O. What's the price of a 200-300hp four stroke outboard compared to the cost of an I/O setup? Not that I like I/Os, but they are cheaper. Or used to be. === It's difficult to evaluate the cost unless you are rebuilding or repowering. My runabout mechanic says that he can get remaunfactured Chevy blocks for about $3k with about that much additional in labor for the swap out. That's a lot cheaper than a new outboard of that size. Mine would probably be a tad more since I've got the 6.2L EFI rated at 325 hp (basically a Corvette engine). |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 12:37:13 PM UTC-7, wrote:
I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Yep! |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
I believe the 6.2s are common in chevy trucks these days. I'd guess you boat probably has more in common with them than the vette. The vette version starts at 430hp.
|
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 15:37:13 -0400, wrote:
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:29:03 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:19:51 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: Now that the 4 strokes are getting better, there is very little advantage to an I/O. My mother's family all ran "Bay Built" work boats with inboards and I thought an I/O was the best of both worlds until I got down here. The ones I was familiar with on the Chesapeake were still trailer boats. Down here the only I/Os you see are "go fasts" with big block V-8s that seldom get wet. I know exactly what you're saying Greg. But unless you have a sail boat, and like to pay slip rents, around here, trailer boating rules. Mercruiser alpha 1's are easy to come by due to long term use. I mean' it's kinda hard to improve a hammer. And I/0 engines are something that most parts you can get through NAPA. Like carb kits, solenoids, belts etc. I wouldn't use an automotive water pump, though... What's a "carb kit"? I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. If you want a boutique manufacturer, there is Seven Marine, putting a Northstar Cadillac engine in an outboard. (557HP and looking at something over 600 from what I hear) This is what I'd call a 'carb kit', although it's not for a V6. http://www.harpermoto.com/carburettor-gasket-kit.html For when it's cold, rainy, and you're looking for something to do. I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Guzzi carbs aren't near as complicated as a 2 or 4 barrel auto carb. I tried to rebuild one of those 4 barrels when I was about 19. Got it back on the car, had a friend hit the starter, and gas came flowing out the top of the carb. I never tried again until I got a Moto Guzzi. They're pretty easy to work on. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:35:32 PM UTC-7, John H. wrote:
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 15:37:13 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:29:03 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:19:51 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: Now that the 4 strokes are getting better, there is very little advantage to an I/O. My mother's family all ran "Bay Built" work boats with inboards and I thought an I/O was the best of both worlds until I got down here. The ones I was familiar with on the Chesapeake were still trailer boats. Down here the only I/Os you see are "go fasts" with big block V-8s that seldom get wet. I know exactly what you're saying Greg. But unless you have a sail boat, and like to pay slip rents, around here, trailer boating rules. Mercruiser alpha 1's are easy to come by due to long term use. I mean' it's kinda hard to improve a hammer. And I/0 engines are something that most parts you can get through NAPA. Like carb kits, solenoids, belts etc. I wouldn't use an automotive water pump, though... What's a "carb kit"? I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. If you want a boutique manufacturer, there is Seven Marine, putting a Northstar Cadillac engine in an outboard. (557HP and looking at something over 600 from what I hear) This is what I'd call a 'carb kit', although it's not for a V6. http://www.harpermoto.com/carburettor-gasket-kit.html For when it's cold, rainy, and you're looking for something to do. I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Guzzi carbs aren't near as complicated as a 2 or 4 barrel auto carb. I tried to rebuild one of those 4 barrels when I was about 19. Got it back on the car, had a friend hit the starter, and gas came flowing out the top of the carb. I never tried again until I got a Moto Guzzi. They're pretty easy to work on. DeLorto's are much simpler than automotive, even those like mine with the square slides. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 18:59:15 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 1:35:32 PM UTC-7, John H. wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 15:37:13 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:29:03 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:19:51 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: Now that the 4 strokes are getting better, there is very little advantage to an I/O. My mother's family all ran "Bay Built" work boats with inboards and I thought an I/O was the best of both worlds until I got down here. The ones I was familiar with on the Chesapeake were still trailer boats. Down here the only I/Os you see are "go fasts" with big block V-8s that seldom get wet. I know exactly what you're saying Greg. But unless you have a sail boat, and like to pay slip rents, around here, trailer boating rules. Mercruiser alpha 1's are easy to come by due to long term use. I mean' it's kinda hard to improve a hammer. And I/0 engines are something that most parts you can get through NAPA. Like carb kits, solenoids, belts etc. I wouldn't use an automotive water pump, though... What's a "carb kit"? I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. If you want a boutique manufacturer, there is Seven Marine, putting a Northstar Cadillac engine in an outboard. (557HP and looking at something over 600 from what I hear) This is what I'd call a 'carb kit', although it's not for a V6. http://www.harpermoto.com/carburettor-gasket-kit.html For when it's cold, rainy, and you're looking for something to do. I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Guzzi carbs aren't near as complicated as a 2 or 4 barrel auto carb. I tried to rebuild one of those 4 barrels when I was about 19. Got it back on the car, had a friend hit the starter, and gas came flowing out the top of the carb. I never tried again until I got a Moto Guzzi. They're pretty easy to work on. DeLorto's are much simpler than automotive, even those like mine with the square slides. The square slides are what was on the 850T. Now I've got the round 30mm PHF's. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 4:35:32 PM UTC-4, John H. wrote:
On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 15:37:13 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:29:03 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:19:51 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: Now that the 4 strokes are getting better, there is very little advantage to an I/O. My mother's family all ran "Bay Built" work boats with inboards and I thought an I/O was the best of both worlds until I got down here. The ones I was familiar with on the Chesapeake were still trailer boats. Down here the only I/Os you see are "go fasts" with big block V-8s that seldom get wet. I know exactly what you're saying Greg. But unless you have a sail boat, and like to pay slip rents, around here, trailer boating rules. Mercruiser alpha 1's are easy to come by due to long term use. I mean' it's kinda hard to improve a hammer. And I/0 engines are something that most parts you can get through NAPA. Like carb kits, solenoids, belts etc. I wouldn't use an automotive water pump, though... What's a "carb kit"? I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. If you want a boutique manufacturer, there is Seven Marine, putting a Northstar Cadillac engine in an outboard. (557HP and looking at something over 600 from what I hear) This is what I'd call a 'carb kit', although it's not for a V6. http://www.harpermoto.com/carburettor-gasket-kit.html For when it's cold, rainy, and you're looking for something to do. I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Guzzi carbs aren't near as complicated as a 2 or 4 barrel auto carb. I tried to rebuild one of those 4 barrels when I was about 19. Got it back on the car, had a friend hit the starter, and gas came flowing out the top of the carb. I never tried again until I got a Moto Guzzi. They're pretty easy to work on. Ease of servicing is what is best about the conventional holley 2 and 4 barrels. Most of the passages are located in the metering blocks. Unfortunately they perform best at wot. Otherwise gas "mileage" is fairly poor. The constant velocity motorcycle carbs always seemed to me as some of the more well designed carbs. Being constant velocity they do not need any enrichment circuits so besides the main jet generally only have one idle fuel passage. Some have a second fuel passage serving in place of a choke. In the do anything sort of day dreams I've often thought it would be interesting to attach 8 of them to a v8. They are often in banks of 4 already for inline 4 motorcycles. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:03:33 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 4:35:32 PM UTC-4, John H. wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 15:37:13 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:29:03 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 13:19:51 -0400, wrote: On Sat, 29 Mar 2014 09:51:20 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: Now that the 4 strokes are getting better, there is very little advantage to an I/O. My mother's family all ran "Bay Built" work boats with inboards and I thought an I/O was the best of both worlds until I got down here. The ones I was familiar with on the Chesapeake were still trailer boats. Down here the only I/Os you see are "go fasts" with big block V-8s that seldom get wet. I know exactly what you're saying Greg. But unless you have a sail boat, and like to pay slip rents, around here, trailer boating rules. Mercruiser alpha 1's are easy to come by due to long term use. I mean' it's kinda hard to improve a hammer. And I/0 engines are something that most parts you can get through NAPA. Like carb kits, solenoids, belts etc. I wouldn't use an automotive water pump, though... What's a "carb kit"? I haven't had anything bigger than a lawn mower with a carb in 15 years. These days those tune up parts are not really that important. On a 4 stroke outboard the maintenance is mostly oil changes. You still have thermostats, impellers and anodes in your stern drive. Those are the other common maintenance parts. If you are running in salt water you will need fresh water cooling so you will be adding the heat exchanger parts to your maintenance schedule, along with all of those rubber parts that keep your boat from sinking. I think the advent of EFI 4 strokes pushed outboards past the I/O and you can get 350HP in an outboard. I hear rumors a 400 is in the works from the majors. If you want a boutique manufacturer, there is Seven Marine, putting a Northstar Cadillac engine in an outboard. (557HP and looking at something over 600 from what I hear) This is what I'd call a 'carb kit', although it's not for a V6. http://www.harpermoto.com/carburettor-gasket-kit.html For when it's cold, rainy, and you're looking for something to do. I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Guzzi carbs aren't near as complicated as a 2 or 4 barrel auto carb. I tried to rebuild one of those 4 barrels when I was about 19. Got it back on the car, had a friend hit the starter, and gas came flowing out the top of the carb. I never tried again until I got a Moto Guzzi. They're pretty easy to work on. Ease of servicing is what is best about the conventional holley 2 and 4 barrels. Most of the passages are located in the metering blocks. Unfortunately they perform best at wot. Otherwise gas "mileage" is fairly poor. The constant velocity motorcycle carbs always seemed to me as some of the more well designed carbs. Being constant velocity they do not need any enrichment circuits so besides the main jet generally only have one idle fuel passage. Some have a second fuel passage serving in place of a choke. In the do anything sort of day dreams I've often thought it would be interesting to attach 8 of them to a v8. They are often in banks of 4 already for inline 4 motorcycles. Makes me think of the two SU carbs on a '67 MGBGT I owned for a few years. Synchronizing the carbs was almost a biweekly chore. I can imagine what a pain taking care of eight of them would be like. I went to sync the two on my motorcycle the other day, using CarbStix. No problem finding the CarbStix, but somewhere along the way I lost the adapters to screw into the intake manifolds. After a lot of searching, I came across these. http://www.rakuten.com/prod/motion-p...252034410.html Good idea. Put 'em in and forget 'em. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
Tim wrote:
On Saturday, March 29, 2014 12:37:13 PM UTC-7, wrote: I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Yep! You do not want a hot tank on aluminum. Use Chem-dip or another aluminum cleaner. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 09:52:14 -0500, Califbill wrote:
Tim wrote: On Saturday, March 29, 2014 12:37:13 PM UTC-7, wrote: I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Yep! You do not want a hot tank on aluminum. Use Chem-dip or another aluminum cleaner. I've been using Gumout Carb cleaner for years on my aluminum motorcycle carbs and never had a problem. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
|
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On 3/30/2014 11:20 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:03:33 -0700 (PDT), wrote: I've often thought it would be interesting to attach 8 of them to a v8. === Only an old time Italian Ferrari mechanic could keep them all in sync and the linkage would drive you nutz. :-) Back in my classic car collecting days I had a 1965 Pontiac Catalina 2+2 with the 421ci engine. It had the "tri-power" setup (three, two barrel carbs) with what they used to call "progressive linkage". Despite the best efforts by me and a mechanically inclined friend we could never get it to run right throughout it's RPM range under load. Ended up replacing the carbs and manifold with a single, 4 barrel setup and it went like a raped ape. That was a powerful car. 4 speed manual, on the floor. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 11:36:24 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 3/30/2014 11:20 AM, Wayne.B wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:03:33 -0700 (PDT), wrote: I've often thought it would be interesting to attach 8 of them to a v8. === Only an old time Italian Ferrari mechanic could keep them all in sync and the linkage would drive you nutz. :-) Back in my classic car collecting days I had a 1965 Pontiac Catalina 2+2 with the 421ci engine. It had the "tri-power" setup (three, two barrel carbs) with what they used to call "progressive linkage". Despite the best efforts by me and a mechanically inclined friend we could never get it to run right throughout it's RPM range under load. Ended up replacing the carbs and manifold with a single, 4 barrel setup and it went like a raped ape. That was a powerful car. 4 speed manual, on the floor. 'Three deuces' was the rage for a bit - a short bit. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:14:20 -0400, wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 11:54:41 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 11:36:24 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 3/30/2014 11:20 AM, Wayne.B wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:03:33 -0700 (PDT), wrote: I've often thought it would be interesting to attach 8 of them to a v8. === Only an old time Italian Ferrari mechanic could keep them all in sync and the linkage would drive you nutz. :-) Back in my classic car collecting days I had a 1965 Pontiac Catalina 2+2 with the 421ci engine. It had the "tri-power" setup (three, two barrel carbs) with what they used to call "progressive linkage". Despite the best efforts by me and a mechanically inclined friend we could never get it to run right throughout it's RPM range under load. Ended up replacing the carbs and manifold with a single, 4 barrel setup and it went like a raped ape. That was a powerful car. 4 speed manual, on the floor. 'Three deuces' was the rage for a bit - a short bit. EFI made the whole archaic carburetor technology obsolete. The power we are getting out of small blocks puts my old 327s to shame and reliability is magnitudes better. They are getting much more HP per Cu/In at the wheel than they used to get at the crank. I wouldn't be surprised to see EFI weed eaters and lawn mowers in the next few years. The microprocessor would cost less than a buck. The enclosure and connectors will be more of the price than the chip. The only trick I see is how you power the chip and injectors until you get it going. If this is an electric start lawn tractor, that is not an issue. If the manufactures could develop some type of standard, it seems a rechargeable battery, such as a LiPo, could provide the energy. Or, a plug in to a cigarette lighter, just to get the chain saw, mower, weed eater, whatever, started. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 7:03:33 AM UTC-7, wrote:
Ease of servicing is what is best about the conventional holley 2 and 4 barrels. Most of the passages are located in the metering blocks. Unfortunately they perform best at wot. Otherwise gas "mileage" is fairly poor. Unfortunately, there's a lot of people on the lakes I boat, that think that's the only way to run. WOT! |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 7:52:14 AM UTC-7, Califbill wrote:
You do not want a hot tank on aluminum. Use Chem-dip or another aluminum cleaner. Well, on something like that, I actually use a dedicated carburetor cleaner. But don't do it that often so.... |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 9:14:20 AM UTC-7, wrote:
per Cu/In at the wheel than they used to get at the crank. I wouldn't be surprised to see EFI weed eaters and lawn mowers in the next few years. The microprocessor would cost less than a buck. The enclosure and connectors will be more of the price than the chip. The only trick I see is how you power the chip and injectors until you get it going. If this is an electric start lawn tractor, that is not an issue. They're already out... http://www.kohlerengines.com/differe...ctionworks.htm |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 7:03:33 AM UTC-7, wrote:
Hey, good to see you back. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 13:21:27 -0400, wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 10:00:48 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: On Sunday, March 30, 2014 9:14:20 AM UTC-7, wrote: per Cu/In at the wheel than they used to get at the crank. I wouldn't be surprised to see EFI weed eaters and lawn mowers in the next few years. The microprocessor would cost less than a buck. The enclosure and connectors will be more of the price than the chip. The only trick I see is how you power the chip and injectors until you get it going. If this is an electric start lawn tractor, that is not an issue. They're already out... http://www.kohlerengines.com/differe...ctionworks.htm Those are on the high end of "small engines" but that is what I am talking about. But the EFI ones are not in the chain saw/mower/weedeater size. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On 3/30/2014 1:14 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:37:34 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:14:20 -0400, wrote: EFI made the whole archaic carburetor technology obsolete. The power we are getting out of small blocks puts my old 327s to shame and reliability is magnitudes better. They are getting much more HP per Cu/In at the wheel than they used to get at the crank. I wouldn't be surprised to see EFI weed eaters and lawn mowers in the next few years. The microprocessor would cost less than a buck. The enclosure and connectors will be more of the price than the chip. The only trick I see is how you power the chip and injectors until you get it going. If this is an electric start lawn tractor, that is not an issue. If the manufactures could develop some type of standard, it seems a rechargeable battery, such as a LiPo, could provide the energy. Or, a plug in to a cigarette lighter, just to get the chain saw, mower, weed eater, whatever, started. Actually you could probably do it with a capacitor, like the old Triumph trick. Then you don't have the battery problem at all. Yank the cord a few times with the ignition off to charge the cap, turn it on yank and go. "Super" and "Ultra" capacitors are becoming more common in many low current applications and can replace a battery in many cases. I first learned about them when a company up here in MA started making under saddle acoustic guitar pickups using a Super Capacitor instead of the traditional 9 volt battery to power the pickup's pre-amplifier (located in the guitar). The pickup is supplied with a small AC adaptor that has a standard, 1/4" guitar plug on it's output. You simply plug the plug into the guitar's output jack, plug the AC power supply into the wall, wait for 60 seconds and remove. The Super capacitor typically powers the preamp for about 40 hours of continuous play. When discharged, you just repeat the process. I had guitars that I initially charged and two months later they still played fine without a recharge. I think some of the crank type flashlights also use Super Capacitors. Again, how long it takes before a recharge is required depends on the current draw. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On 3/30/2014 9:21 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 14:53:54 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 3/30/2014 1:14 PM, wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:37:34 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:14:20 -0400, wrote: EFI made the whole archaic carburetor technology obsolete. The power we are getting out of small blocks puts my old 327s to shame and reliability is magnitudes better. They are getting much more HP per Cu/In at the wheel than they used to get at the crank. I wouldn't be surprised to see EFI weed eaters and lawn mowers in the next few years. The microprocessor would cost less than a buck. The enclosure and connectors will be more of the price than the chip. The only trick I see is how you power the chip and injectors until you get it going. If this is an electric start lawn tractor, that is not an issue. If the manufactures could develop some type of standard, it seems a rechargeable battery, such as a LiPo, could provide the energy. Or, a plug in to a cigarette lighter, just to get the chain saw, mower, weed eater, whatever, started. Actually you could probably do it with a capacitor, like the old Triumph trick. Then you don't have the battery problem at all. Yank the cord a few times with the ignition off to charge the cap, turn it on yank and go. "Super" and "Ultra" capacitors are becoming more common in many low current applications and can replace a battery in many cases. I first learned about them when a company up here in MA started making under saddle acoustic guitar pickups using a Super Capacitor instead of the traditional 9 volt battery to power the pickup's pre-amplifier (located in the guitar). The pickup is supplied with a small AC adaptor that has a standard, 1/4" guitar plug on it's output. You simply plug the plug into the guitar's output jack, plug the AC power supply into the wall, wait for 60 seconds and remove. The Super capacitor typically powers the preamp for about 40 hours of continuous play. When discharged, you just repeat the process. I had guitars that I initially charged and two months later they still played fine without a recharge. I think some of the crank type flashlights also use Super Capacitors. Again, how long it takes before a recharge is required depends on the current draw. I doubt the super caps would have the current to fire injectors. They are really meant for long term, low current loads. In this case you need something that gives you a high current, short duration shot and only has to hold the charge for a few seconds to start it. Once it is going that is more like milliseconds. You would not need much of a charging coil in the stator to keep things going. Gee. Diesels got along fine without electricity for years. Fuel + Air = Runs (assuming you can turn them over with a crank) |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
wrote:
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 09:52:14 -0500, Califbill wrote: Tim wrote: On Saturday, March 29, 2014 12:37:13 PM UTC-7, wrote: I have gone out of my way to forget carb kits. It is like painting. I know how to do it but I hate it. If you don't have access to a hot tank, "rebuilding" carbs can be a frustrating exercise. There always seems to be one passage you don't get completely clean and that is usually the one that caused the problem in the first place. Yep! You do not want a hot tank on aluminum. Use Chem-dip or another aluminum cleaner. I am not sure what they had in the tank but they called it a hot tank and a carb came out looking brand new., Hot tanks where they cleaned blocks would eat aluminum. Made nice bubbles in the tank. The engine block tanks used Caustic Soda. |
I/O Conversion/350 to 305
On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 21:27:29 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 3/30/2014 9:21 PM, wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 14:53:54 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 3/30/2014 1:14 PM, wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:37:34 -0400, Poquito Loco wrote: On Sun, 30 Mar 2014 12:14:20 -0400, wrote: EFI made the whole archaic carburetor technology obsolete. The power we are getting out of small blocks puts my old 327s to shame and reliability is magnitudes better. They are getting much more HP per Cu/In at the wheel than they used to get at the crank. I wouldn't be surprised to see EFI weed eaters and lawn mowers in the next few years. The microprocessor would cost less than a buck. The enclosure and connectors will be more of the price than the chip. The only trick I see is how you power the chip and injectors until you get it going. If this is an electric start lawn tractor, that is not an issue. If the manufactures could develop some type of standard, it seems a rechargeable battery, such as a LiPo, could provide the energy. Or, a plug in to a cigarette lighter, just to get the chain saw, mower, weed eater, whatever, started. Actually you could probably do it with a capacitor, like the old Triumph trick. Then you don't have the battery problem at all. Yank the cord a few times with the ignition off to charge the cap, turn it on yank and go. "Super" and "Ultra" capacitors are becoming more common in many low current applications and can replace a battery in many cases. I first learned about them when a company up here in MA started making under saddle acoustic guitar pickups using a Super Capacitor instead of the traditional 9 volt battery to power the pickup's pre-amplifier (located in the guitar). The pickup is supplied with a small AC adaptor that has a standard, 1/4" guitar plug on it's output. You simply plug the plug into the guitar's output jack, plug the AC power supply into the wall, wait for 60 seconds and remove. The Super capacitor typically powers the preamp for about 40 hours of continuous play. When discharged, you just repeat the process. I had guitars that I initially charged and two months later they still played fine without a recharge. I think some of the crank type flashlights also use Super Capacitors. Again, how long it takes before a recharge is required depends on the current draw. I doubt the super caps would have the current to fire injectors. They are really meant for long term, low current loads. In this case you need something that gives you a high current, short duration shot and only has to hold the charge for a few seconds to start it. Once it is going that is more like milliseconds. You would not need much of a charging coil in the stator to keep things going. Gee. Diesels got along fine without electricity for years. Fuel + Air = Runs (assuming you can turn them over with a crank) We had a gas pony engine to start the diesel on the Cat on the farm. That worked, if you could get the pony started. That was the 'crank'! Like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrt06cdkpk8 |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:01 AM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 BoatBanter.com