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Alternate heat source question
We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget
Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
I would even be wimpy in 40 degrees with wind. Not all of us are easily
inspired by sailing in that type of weather. |
Alternate heat source question
He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. That's what small power boats have. If you can find a stove you can live with, there is an old trick for heating when at the dock. Put stove on low heat, invert a traditional terra cotta ceramic plant pot and put it over the burner. It will heat up and radiate nicely. Henry. |
Alternate heat source question
May be share a sleepingbag and bottle of port ;-)
-- c ya Wim www.cruising.ca/thousand/f-index.html "Weathered Rose" wrote in message nk.net... : I would even be wimpy in 40 degrees with wind. Not all of us are easily : inspired by sailing in that type of weather. : : |
Alternate heat source question
Henry:
We heard about that approach too. We subsequently heard that the potential for carbon monoxide and other nasty gases is too likely. It would be fine with the companion way open so it remains an option... As far as the 40 degree temps: it keeps most of the Stink potters in their slips and we then have the Sound to ourselves. It really is fantastic sailing and doesn't get that cold very often. It's usually a balmy 50 or so :) Dan "Henry" wrote in message news:_DhNb.96816$ts4.41405@pd7tw3no... He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. That's what small power boats have. If you can find a stove you can live with, there is an old trick for heating when at the dock. Put stove on low heat, invert a traditional terra cotta ceramic plant pot and put it over the burner. It will heat up and radiate nicely. Henry. |
Alternate heat source question
"DB" wrote in message ... Henry: We heard about that approach too. We subsequently heard that the potential for carbon monoxide and other nasty gases is too likely. It would be fine with the companion way open so it remains an option... Were does the CO ( & other nasty gases ) come from in what is hot water radiator? Only possible source I can think of is exhaust from the engine but we are all risk limited exposure to this when motoring. As far as the 40 degree temps: it keeps most of the Stink potters in their slips and we then have the Sound to ourselves. It really is fantastic sailing and doesn't get that cold very often. It's usually a balmy 50 or so :) Dan JohnE |
Alternate heat source question
"DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan Neat idea. All I do is remove the engine covers and let it radiate into the cabin area. However, I do a VERY LITTLE boat. 18ft over the deck! JohnE |
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John:
I was referring to the "Flower Pot" cover over the propane burner producing CO2. The hot water radiator would potentially avoid this problem and that's why I'm exploring it. We just lost a boating couple up here who turned on a propane heater and went to sleep on the boat. They never woke up and I don't want join them just yet. Dan "John.E" wrote in message ... "DB" wrote in message ... Henry: We heard about that approach too. We subsequently heard that the potential for carbon monoxide and other nasty gases is too likely. It would be fine with the companion way open so it remains an option... Were does the CO ( & other nasty gases ) come from in what is hot water radiator? Only possible source I can think of is exhaust from the engine but we are all risk limited exposure to this when motoring. As far as the 40 degree temps: it keeps most of the Stink potters in their slips and we then have the Sound to ourselves. It really is fantastic sailing and doesn't get that cold very often. It's usually a balmy 50 or so :) Dan JohnE |
Alternate heat source question
"DB" wrote in message ... John: I was referring to the "Flower Pot" cover over the propane burner producing CO2. The hot water radiator would potentially avoid this problem and that's why I'm exploring it. We just lost a boating couple up here who turned on a propane heater and went to sleep on the boat. They never woke up and I don't want join them just yet. Dan I have to apologise as I missread the thread and was querying why an hot water system would generate CO. I am sorry to hear about your loss Dan. JohnE |
Alternate heat source question
We have one of these - it only works while the engine is running. While
there is some hot water still in the system after you shut down the engine, it is not circulating so the water in the system cools very rapidly and is of little use on a sailing boat. Cheers "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
Paddy:
"tis as I suspected it might be. Thanks. Dan "Paddy Malone" wrote in message ... We have one of these - it only works while the engine is running. While there is some hot water still in the system after you shut down the engine, it is not circulating so the water in the system cools very rapidly and is of little use on a sailing boat. Cheers "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
Dan--
Right off the bat let me say yes, you have to be sensible using the heating system on my boat, a Westsail 32. It is a kerosene radiant heater. Yes, in a tightly enclosed space it can be dangerous, even lethal. So the trick is to make sure the heated space--the boat's cabin--is NOT tightly enclosed. Typically we leave the hatch open, the butterfly hatch cracked, and the forward hatch ajar, so there is plenty of air circulation. The capacity of the heater is far more than adequate for the boat, so we can afford to "waste" some heat with the circulating air. In fact, once the boat is warmed up, we have to turn the heater off and on at intervals, to avoid getting too hot in the cabin--and it's off at least half the time. Works for us. Has for 10 years. In short, you use the heater exactly the way its instruction manual says, and according to all the warnings on the unit--with plenty of ventilation. We ALWAYS turn the heater off before hitting the sack, of course. And that clay flower pot on the cookstove burner is a good trick, too--for a quick warmup. Same caveats about ventilation apply. Great sailing in the winter, all right--we sail from Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island. DON'T give that up! Cheers, fair winds, and toasty toes to you, Dick Behan "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
Dick:
Thanks for you insights. If we didn't love our Islander so much, a Westy was our other choice. We cruised into Fisherman Bay just last year. We draw nearly six feet so the entrance there has a pucker factor to it. :-) Do you know the brand name of your kerosene heater? I've been in West Marine, Fisheries Supply, Home Depot and a few others looking for a small footprint kerosene heater. No joy yet. Dan "R.W. Behan" wrote in message ... Dan-- Right off the bat let me say yes, you have to be sensible using the heating system on my boat, a Westsail 32. It is a kerosene radiant heater. Yes, in a tightly enclosed space it can be dangerous, even lethal. So the trick is to make sure the heated space--the boat's cabin--is NOT tightly enclosed. Typically we leave the hatch open, the butterfly hatch cracked, and the forward hatch ajar, so there is plenty of air circulation. The capacity of the heater is far more than adequate for the boat, so we can afford to "waste" some heat with the circulating air. In fact, once the boat is warmed up, we have to turn the heater off and on at intervals, to avoid getting too hot in the cabin--and it's off at least half the time. Works for us. Has for 10 years. In short, you use the heater exactly the way its instruction manual says, and according to all the warnings on the unit--with plenty of ventilation. We ALWAYS turn the heater off before hitting the sack, of course. And that clay flower pot on the cookstove burner is a good trick, too--for a quick warmup. Same caveats about ventilation apply. Great sailing in the winter, all right--we sail from Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island. DON'T give that up! Cheers, fair winds, and toasty toes to you, Dick Behan "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
Dick:
Thanks for you insights. If we didn't love our Islander so much, a Westy was our other choice. We cruised in and out of Fisherman Bay just last year. We draw nearly six feet so the entrance there has somewhat of a pucker factor to it. :-) Do you know the brand name of your kerosene heater? I've been in West Marine, Fisheries Supply, Home Depot and a few others looking for a small footprint kerosene heater. No joy yet. Dan "R.W. Behan" wrote in message ... Dan-- Right off the bat let me say yes, you have to be sensible using the heating system on my boat, a Westsail 32. It is a kerosene radiant heater. Yes, in a tightly enclosed space it can be dangerous, even lethal. So the trick is to make sure the heated space--the boat's cabin--is NOT tightly enclosed. Typically we leave the hatch open, the butterfly hatch cracked, and the forward hatch ajar, so there is plenty of air circulation. The capacity of the heater is far more than adequate for the boat, so we can afford to "waste" some heat with the circulating air. In fact, once the boat is warmed up, we have to turn the heater off and on at intervals, to avoid getting too hot in the cabin--and it's off at least half the time. Works for us. Has for 10 years. In short, you use the heater exactly the way its instruction manual says, and according to all the warnings on the unit--with plenty of ventilation. We ALWAYS turn the heater off before hitting the sack, of course. And that clay flower pot on the cookstove burner is a good trick, too--for a quick warmup. Same caveats about ventilation apply. Great sailing in the winter, all right--we sail from Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island. DON'T give that up! Cheers, fair winds, and toasty toes to you, Dick Behan "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
Dick:
Thanks for you insights. If we didn't love our Islander so much, a Westy was our other choice. We cruised in and out of Fisherman Bay just last year. We draw nearly six feet so the entrance there has somewhat of a pucker factor to it. :-) Do you know the brand name of your kerosene heater? I've been in West Marine, Fisheries Supply, Home Depot and a few others looking for a small footprint kerosene heater. No joy yet. Dan "R.W. Behan" wrote in message ... Dan-- Right off the bat let me say yes, you have to be sensible using the heating system on my boat, a Westsail 32. It is a kerosene radiant heater. Yes, in a tightly enclosed space it can be dangerous, even lethal. So the trick is to make sure the heated space--the boat's cabin--is NOT tightly enclosed. Typically we leave the hatch open, the butterfly hatch cracked, and the forward hatch ajar, so there is plenty of air circulation. The capacity of the heater is far more than adequate for the boat, so we can afford to "waste" some heat with the circulating air. In fact, once the boat is warmed up, we have to turn the heater off and on at intervals, to avoid getting too hot in the cabin--and it's off at least half the time. Works for us. Has for 10 years. In short, you use the heater exactly the way its instruction manual says, and according to all the warnings on the unit--with plenty of ventilation. We ALWAYS turn the heater off before hitting the sack, of course. And that clay flower pot on the cookstove burner is a good trick, too--for a quick warmup. Same caveats about ventilation apply. Great sailing in the winter, all right--we sail from Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island. DON'T give that up! Cheers, fair winds, and toasty toes to you, Dick Behan "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
Dick:
Thanks for you insights. If we didn't love our Islander so much, a Westy was our other choice. We cruised in and out of Fisherman Bay just last year. We draw nearly six feet so the entrance there has somewhat of a pucker factor to it. :-) Do you know the brand name of your kerosene heater? I've been in West Marine, Fisheries Supply, Home Depot and a few others looking for a small footprint kerosene heater. No joy yet. Dan "R.W. Behan" wrote in message ... Dan-- Right off the bat let me say yes, you have to be sensible using the heating system on my boat, a Westsail 32. It is a kerosene radiant heater. Yes, in a tightly enclosed space it can be dangerous, even lethal. So the trick is to make sure the heated space--the boat's cabin--is NOT tightly enclosed. Typically we leave the hatch open, the butterfly hatch cracked, and the forward hatch ajar, so there is plenty of air circulation. The capacity of the heater is far more than adequate for the boat, so we can afford to "waste" some heat with the circulating air. In fact, once the boat is warmed up, we have to turn the heater off and on at intervals, to avoid getting too hot in the cabin--and it's off at least half the time. Works for us. Has for 10 years. In short, you use the heater exactly the way its instruction manual says, and according to all the warnings on the unit--with plenty of ventilation. We ALWAYS turn the heater off before hitting the sack, of course. And that clay flower pot on the cookstove burner is a good trick, too--for a quick warmup. Same caveats about ventilation apply. Great sailing in the winter, all right--we sail from Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island. DON'T give that up! Cheers, fair winds, and toasty toes to you, Dick Behan "DB" wrote in message ... We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan |
Alternate heat source question
DB wrote: We have a 30' Islander sailboat that we sail all year round in the Puget Sound. I'm fine with the weather in the right clothes while my wimpy wife doesn't like sailing in 40 degrees. Our bulkhead doesn't have room for a Force 10 type diesel heater. We've used an alcohol stove (wet heat), a portable propane heater (toxic) and the propane stove oven (costly.) I was just about out of ideas that would keep my best sailing buddy warm. Then, a buddy of mine was out with me for the last three days and he came up with an idea. He suggested that I pick up a car/truck heater and plumb it into the hot water heater system. It would provide heat while we're under way and allow us to go below and warm up once in a while. Has anyone else installed a system like this and did it work? Dan After a little thought and reading the replies, It ocurred to me that no one had suggested a small tent heater. You still need to read the instructions air supply. A small vent to supply combustion air and a small vent for exhaust is required. External combustion devices could provide hor water for your truck heater, for instance, a campstove full of coiled soft copper tube inside the stove with the lid down, out on deck, with rubber hoses and a small circulation pump? As fas as 'alternate' energy sources goes, how about a similar idea using a wood burner out on deck, with a hot water coil? Or a stovepipe wrappped in copper tube with a fire log inside? You can stop a firelog by stopping the air supply. Now as far as electric heat is concerned, wouldn't it be nice if we could get sails that were solar cells, or solid wing foils with solar cells? We could use the juice to make hydrogen, and use that to inflate a para wing sail. Smaller cells could pump up H2 during the week, when most boats are parked. The H2 might come to be a useful way to store energy without heavy batteries. This raises a question: if you run an electrolysis cell, how does the pressure in a close system affect the production of gases? In such a system, would you need to contain the O2 in a seperate tank from the H2? How do the pressures go, if the system is let go on running? Would there be more H2, more H2 pressure, and an imbalance of water heights in the collector tubes around the electrodes? Would simply venting a little O2 restore the levels? -- Terry K - My email address is MY PROPERTY, and is protected by copyright legislation. Permission to reproduce it is specifically denied for mass mailing and unrequested solicitations. Spamspoof salad by spamchock TM - SofDevCo ® |
Alternate heat source question
Consider this...the coolant temp on an automobile gas engine reached 200+
degrees. Run your water heater that high and it will most likely blow up, not to mention scald you the first time you even attempt to use it. If a water heater produces 140F degree water, I doubt you will get more than a few degrees rise in temperature at 40 degrees ambient temps using an automotive style heater core. Hoping to be on the water soon...Dennis |
Alternate heat source question
"DDeanFountain" wrote ...... If a water heater produces 140F degree water, I doubt you will get more than a few degrees rise in temperature ... using an automotive style heater core. This is true, but the rise may still be worthwhile if one keeps it cheap and simple. One could get a small car radiator or heater core and plumb it in series with the water coming out of the motor going into the exhaust. It won't do much because the water is only about 120 - 140 degrees but it's cheap, simple safe, and should make a small cabin more comfortable - at least while motoring. OTOH using water from a water heater is a waste. Whatever heated that water would be better used to heat the cabin. A small propane heater heats my whole house. It is so efficient that one can *almost* hold one's hand on the metal chimney because the hot burned gasses spend so much time giving up their heat in a metal labyrinth before exiting. A 1/10 scale model would be perfect for a boat. I'm surprised nobody makes one ... or do they? The propane "furnace" in my motor home is little more than a foot square, sits in a compartment that is outside the cabin for safety, and provides forced air heat. One could mount one in a sail locker or a detachable "deck house" like they do carry-on AC units. A little ingenuity ..... |
Alternate heat source question
Probably a Shipmate brand, like the one I just removed from my boat.
It's not really needed given our location, but I can appreciate where you're coming from. We just moved down from Sammamish, where we lived for the past two years. We sure do miss cruising in the Sound. Regards, Louis s/v Synergy Westsail 32 #679 Miami, FL "DB" wrote in message ... Dick: Thanks for you insights. If we didn't love our Islander so much, a Westy was our other choice. We cruised in and out of Fisherman Bay just last year. We draw nearly six feet so the entrance there has somewhat of a pucker factor to it. :-) Do you know the brand name of your kerosene heater? I've been in West Marine, Fisheries Supply, Home Depot and a few others looking for a small footprint kerosene heater. No joy yet. Dan |
Alternate heat source question
FYI
I have a Coronado 25 and I looked at Mr. Heater "Portable Buddy" @ www.wheretofindbuddy.com Runs on the same tank as my gas grill, that would no be being used at 40 deg anyway. I would need to see an ice breaker to get out any time soon, It's cold here in Baltimore.......... Blue Skies, JRS "Vito" wrote in message ... "DDeanFountain" wrote ...... If a water heater produces 140F degree water, I doubt you will get more than a few degrees rise in temperature ... using an automotive style heater core. This is true, but the rise may still be worthwhile if one keeps it cheap and simple. One could get a small car radiator or heater core and plumb it in series with the water coming out of the motor going into the exhaust. It won't do much because the water is only about 120 - 140 degrees but it's cheap, simple safe, and should make a small cabin more comfortable - at least while motoring. OTOH using water from a water heater is a waste. Whatever heated that water would be better used to heat the cabin. A small propane heater heats my whole house. It is so efficient that one can *almost* hold one's hand on the metal chimney because the hot burned gasses spend so much time giving up their heat in a metal labyrinth before exiting. A 1/10 scale model would be perfect for a boat. I'm surprised nobody makes one ... or do they? The propane "furnace" in my motor home is little more than a foot square, sits in a compartment that is outside the cabin for safety, and provides forced air heat. One could mount one in a sail locker or a detachable "deck house" like they do carry-on AC units. A little ingenuity ..... |
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