On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:01:36 -0500, gfretwell wrote:


I never understood how the VW escaped the wrath of Nader when he was
trashing the Corvair. They both had the same problem. (tucking the real
axle and flipping over).

It's interesting to note, only one chapter in Nader's book was about the
Corvair. Nader was trashing the entire automotive industry, and
rightfully so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 11:37:56 -0600, thunder
wrote:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:01:36 -0500, gfretwell wrote:


I never understood how the VW escaped the wrath of Nader when he was
trashing the Corvair. They both had the same problem. (tucking the real
axle and flipping over).

It's interesting to note, only one chapter in Nader's book was about the
Corvair. Nader was trashing the entire automotive industry, and
rightfully so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

That still doesn't address the question about why Nader singled out
the Corvair when he talked about the dangers of swing axle suspension.
The VW was famous for flipping

Yeah but...with the rounded roof it could keep on rolling instead of
pancaking.

Don White wrote:
wrote in message
...

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 11:37:56 -0600,
wrote:


On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:01:36 -0500, gfretwell wrote:



I never understood how the VW escaped the wrath of Nader when he was
trashing the Corvair. They both had the same problem. (tucking the real
axle and flipping over).

It's interesting to note, only one chapter in Nader's book was about the
Corvair. Nader was trashing the entire automotive industry, and
rightfully so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

That still doesn't address the question about why Nader singled out
the Corvair when he talked about the dangers of swing axle suspension.
The VW was famous for flipping

Yeah but...with the rounded roof it could keep on rolling instead of
pancaking.



You really should avoid the "Yeah but" responses. You aren't smart
enough to engage in any sort of debate. You will killfile and run, as
always.

Rob

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:59:08 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 11:37:56 -0600, thunder
wrote:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:01:36 -0500, gfretwell wrote:


I never understood how the VW escaped the wrath of Nader when he was
trashing the Corvair. They both had the same problem. (tucking the real
axle and flipping over).

It's interesting to note, only one chapter in Nader's book was about the
Corvair. Nader was trashing the entire automotive industry, and
rightfully so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

That still doesn't address the question about why Nader singled out
the Corvair when he talked about the dangers of swing axle suspension.
The VW was famous for flipping

The Corvair had some other problem with the rear suspension geometry,
as I recall. It would break loose and switch ends easily if I recall.
Bugs didn't do that. Think they fixed the Corvair by the 2nd or 3rd
model year, but it's hazy.
GM has always been a good target. Still is.
The big boy.
Whatever the faults of the Bug, I never felt it was a bad driver.
Tracked well, braked decently. I never got aggressive with it.
How could you? Did feel it was a little top-heavy in cornering,
so I never pushed it hard cornering.
Found mine on the lawn one morning. Hit and run. Fender was bent,
but that was it. Just got knocked over the curb and deposited on the
lawn. Didn't see it happen, so maybe it rolled a few times. hehe.
Somebody mentioned bringing back the original Bug, but I don't know if
it could pass emission standards now.

--Vic

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 20:49:33 -0600, Vic Smith wrote:


The Corvair had some other problem with the rear suspension geometry, as
I recall. It would break loose and switch ends easily if I recall. Bugs
didn't do that. Think they fixed the Corvair by the 2nd or 3rd model
year, but it's hazy.

Tire pressures were critical. There was a 10# differential between front
and rear, and the tire pressures were outside the manufacturer's
recommended tolerances. Additionally, the front tires were overloaded if
there were two or more passengers on board.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 20:49:33 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:59:08 -0500, wrote:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 11:37:56 -0600, thunder
wrote:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 12:01:36 -0500, gfretwell wrote:


I never understood how the VW escaped the wrath of Nader when he was
trashing the Corvair. They both had the same problem. (tucking the
real
axle and flipping over).

It's interesting to note, only one chapter in Nader's book was about the
Corvair. Nader was trashing the entire automotive industry, and
rightfully so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unsafe_at_Any_Speed

That still doesn't address the question about why Nader singled out
the Corvair when he talked about the dangers of swing axle suspension.
The VW was famous for flipping

The Corvair had some other problem with the rear suspension geometry,
as I recall. It would break loose and switch ends easily if I recall.
Bugs didn't do that.
I think they called it trailing oversteer, at a certain point the
understeer they build into most cars switches to oversteer as the rear
tires lose traction and they both had the problem.

Think they fixed the Corvair by the 2nd or 3rd
model year, but it's hazy.
GM has always been a good target. Still is.
The big boy.
Whatever the faults of the Bug, I never felt it was a bad driver.
Tracked well, braked decently. I never got aggressive with it.
How could you? Did feel it was a little top-heavy in cornering,
so I never pushed it hard cornering.
That is why you never saw the problem. Most beetle drivers in those
days were more conservative. I did know a guy in high school who
rolled one but he thought he had an MG ;-)

Found mine on the lawn one morning. Hit and run. Fender was bent,
but that was it. Just got knocked over the curb and deposited on the
lawn. Didn't see it happen, so maybe it rolled a few times. hehe.
Somebody mentioned bringing back the original Bug, but I don't know if
it could pass emission standards now.

... crash tests, interior passenger protection, handling problems and
a bunch of other issues
They were still selling them in Mexico until pretty recently tho.
You just couldn't import one.

--Vic


Actually I think the VW rolled before it could switch ends. The Corvair was
a lot less top heavy than a bug.

On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:15:11 -0500, wrote:

They were still selling them in Mexico until pretty recently tho.

They have (or had) a large assembly plant in Mexico and the bugs were
all over the place last time I was there, by far the most common
vehicle on the road in Mexico City 10 years ago.

wrote:
On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:09:34 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:15:11 -0500, wrote:

They were still selling them in Mexico until pretty recently tho.
They have (or had) a large assembly plant in Mexico and the bugs were
all over the place last time I was there, by far the most common
vehicle on the road in Mexico City 10 years ago.

We were in a VW cab the last time I was in the Yucatan


We rented a Golf or something like it, to drive from Cancun to Mérida to
Tulum and about a zillion points in between. I think we spent a total of
four hours in Cancun, and most of that was at the airport. Took a day
trip by ferry to Isla Mujeres, rented motor scooters. I understand that
little island is now also overdeveloped.

On Dec 6, 1:24*pm, "H the K (I post with a Mac)"
wrote:
wrote:
On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:09:34 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:15:11 -0500, wrote:

They were still selling them in Mexico until pretty recently tho.
They have (or had) a large assembly plant in Mexico and the bugs were
all over the place last time I was there, by far the most common
vehicle on the road in Mexico City 10 years ago.

We were in a VW cab the last time I was in the Yucatan

We rented a Golf or something like it, to drive from Cancun to Mérida to
Tulum and about a zillion points in between. I think we spent a total of
four hours in Cancun, and most of that was at the airport. Took a day
trip by ferry to Isla Mujeres, rented motor scooters. I understand that
little island is now also overdeveloped.

Yeah, sure everyone here believes you.....NOT.

wrote:
On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 13:24:59 -0500, "H the K (I post with a Mac)"
wrote:

wrote:
On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:09:34 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:15:11 -0500, wrote:

They were still selling them in Mexico until pretty recently tho.
They have (or had) a large assembly plant in Mexico and the bugs were
all over the place last time I was there, by far the most common
vehicle on the road in Mexico City 10 years ago.
We were in a VW cab the last time I was in the Yucatan

We rented a Golf or something like it, to drive from Cancun to Mérida to
Tulum and about a zillion points in between. I think we spent a total of
four hours in Cancun, and most of that was at the airport. Took a day
trip by ferry to Isla Mujeres, rented motor scooters. I understand that
little island is now also overdeveloped.

That was a pretty round about trip. Talum is just south of Cancun,
Mérida is on the other side of the Yucatan

That is where we went through Mexican customs, then we got back on the
plane and flew to Cancun.
It was funny because they didn't turn off the engines on the plane.
I could imagine the pilot (in a Cheech Marin accent) saying "hey man,
don't shut off the motor, I got a bad battery"

The drive-around trip was a oneymoon trip...two weeks in Mexico. I had
been to Cancun 20 years earlier, when there were only a couple of new
hotels. On the second trip, we realized we had made the right decision
by limiting our time in Cancun.

Mérida was well-worth a two day stopover.