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Question concerning boating and lightning...
OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in
a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim
wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? Lightning is incredibly powerful and unpredictable. In all honesty there is *no* safe place on a small boat. The only obvious advice is to try and avoid the storm and get off the water, additionally, stay away from metal objects or any other electrical conductor. I've taken one really near miss in a 50 ft sailboat as well as being in an airplane that took a direct hit. Both times it felt like the world was coming to an end. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim
wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? Not much you can do about it other than try to stay at the lowest point in the boat, duck and cover. I supposed you could install a grounding system on the cuddy, but a really effective ground system would include straight wire runs and a through hull ground plate. There really isn't much you can do. The NFPA and NASD recommend the following: Stay in the center of the cabin if the boat is so designed. If no enclosure (cabin) is available, stay low in the boat. Don't be a "stand-up human" lightning mast! Keep arms and legs in the boat. Do not dangle them in the water. Discontinue fishing, water skiing, scuba diving, swimming or other water activities when there is lightning or even when weather conditions look threatening. The first lightning strike can be a mile or more in front of an approaching thunderstorm cloud. Disconnect and do not use or touch the major electronic equipment, including the radio, throughout the duration of the storm. Lower, remove or tie down the radio antenna and other protruding devices if they are not part of the lightning protection system. To the degree possible, avoid making contact with any portion of the boat connected to the lightning protection system. Never be in contact with two components connected to the system at the same time. Example: The gear levers and spotlight handle are both connected to the system. Should you have a hand on both when lightning strikes, the possibility of electrical current passing through your body from hand to hand is great. The path of the electrical current would be directly through your heart--a very deadly path! It would be desirable to have individuals aboard who are competent in cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR) and first aid. Many individuals struck by lightning or exposed to excessive electrical current can be saved with prompt and proper artificial respiration and/or CPR. There is no danger in touching persons after they have been struck by lightning. If a boat has been, or is suspected of having been, struck by lightning, check out the electrical system and the compasses to insure that no damage has occurred. http://www.cdc.gov/nasd/docs/d000001...7/d000007.html Having had radio towers, I can tell you pretty much flat out that there's not much you can do about lightning strikes - I went for years without getting a direct hit on the towers, then in one year, I was hit six/seven times and at least twice, three times a year up until the time I took them down. You can protect your equipment using gas discharge devices and direct, heavy ground straps, but other than that, forgitaboutit. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 02:01:07 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote: I've taken one really near miss in a 50 ft sailboat as well as being in an airplane that took a direct hit. Both times it felt like the world was coming to an end. My house took a hit on a lightning rod six feet from where I was sitting. Not all that loud. Lightning bolts vary in power. Casady |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 06:14:45 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote: I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? Not much you can do about it other than try to stay at the lowest point in the boat, duck and cover. I have an aluminum cuddy. Better than a glass bow rider, at least. Casady |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim
wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? Pretty much what everybody else said. I once posted a link Still have it http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/pdffiles/SG/SG07100.pdf Mostly about sailboats, if I recall, but there should be an interesting part there about a "cone of protection." Not to be confused with the Cone of Silence. Here's something else you don't want to hear. Lightening strikes in fresh water are MUCH more intense than those on salt. Don't know or can't remember why. Ain't a scientist. Staying away from that stuff is the best bet. --Vic |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
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Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 1:50*am, wrote:
On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 12:13*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50*am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. All of this should give me a "cone of protection". I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): I run like hell back toward shore. Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. IF necessary, I anchor. I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
Frogwatch wrote:
On Jun 3, 12:13 pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50 am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. All of this should give me a "cone of protection". I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): I run like hell back toward shore. Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. IF necessary, I anchor. I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. Nice to hear from you again, Dr. Emmett Brown. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 2:39*pm, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 12:13 pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50 am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. *Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. *Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. *Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. *Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. *if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. *Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. *All of this should give me a "cone of protection". *I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): *I run like hell back toward shore. *Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. *IF necessary, I anchor. *I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. *Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. *Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. *The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. *Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. *This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. Nice to hear from you again, Dr. Emmett Brown. Hi Harry. I seem to have the craziest experiences involving lightning so I take it very seriously. Here in Tallahassee, Thunderstorms have interrupted work here twice today already. I do not let the machinists go near the machines during storms and I get away from the computers and other equipment. At least once a week our electron microscopes crash due to lightning in summer. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
Frogwatch wrote:
On Jun 3, 2:39 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 12:13 pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50 am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. All of this should give me a "cone of protection". I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): I run like hell back toward shore. Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. IF necessary, I anchor. I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. Nice to hear from you again, Dr. Emmett Brown. Hi Harry. I seem to have the craziest experiences involving lightning so I take it very seriously. Here in Tallahassee, Thunderstorms have interrupted work here twice today already. I do not let the machinists go near the machines during storms and I get away from the computers and other equipment. At least once a week our electron microscopes crash due to lightning in summer. I'm not arguing with you. Despite what you may think, I really enjoy many of your posts, even if for reasons that might not occur to you. :) I consider you the annointed Rube Goldberg of rec.boats. Remember, *I* was the one who banged you over the head the hardest and the most often regarding what I thought would be your final voyage in your small boat. If I didn't care, I would have joined the "oh, go ahead and do it" chorus. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 2:52*pm, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 2:39 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 12:13 pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50 am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. *Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. *Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. *Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. *Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. *if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. *Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. *All of this should give me a "cone of protection". *I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): *I run like hell back toward shore. *Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. *IF necessary, I anchor. *I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. *Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. *Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. *The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. *Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. *This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. Nice to hear from you again, Dr. Emmett Brown. Hi Harry. *I seem to have the craziest experiences involving lightning so I take it very seriously. *Here in Tallahassee, Thunderstorms have interrupted work here twice today already. *I do not let the machinists go near the machines during storms and I get away from the computers and other equipment. *At least once a week our electron microscopes crash due to lightning in summer. I'm not arguing with you. Despite what you may think, I really enjoy many of your posts, even if for reasons that might not occur to you. :) I consider you the annointed Rube Goldberg of rec.boats. Remember, *I* was the one who banged you over the head the hardest and the most often regarding what I thought would be your final voyage in your small boat. If I didn't care, I would have joined the "oh, go ahead and do it" chorus. Harry, I did not think you were arguing. I still wish I'd done that trip but you were probably right. Now, my 23 yr old daughter and her bf want to sail the 28' sailboat to the Bahamas from here. They are both OK sailors but not much cruising experience so they want me to go part way. If it was earlier in the year, Id say "yes" but in summer, I do not want to go. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 2:45*pm, Frogwatch wrote:
On Jun 3, 2:39*pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 12:13 pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50 am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. *Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. *Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. *Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. *Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. *if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. *Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. *All of this should give me a "cone of protection". *I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): *I run like hell back toward shore. *Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. *IF necessary, I anchor. *I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. *Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. *Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. *The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. *Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. *This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. Nice to hear from you again, Dr. Emmett Brown. Hi Harry. *I seem to have the craziest experiences involving lightning so I take it very seriously. *Here in Tallahassee, Thunderstorms have interrupted work here twice today already. *I do not let the machinists go near the machines during storms and I get away from the computers and other equipment. *At least once a week our electron microscopes crash due to lightning in summer.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I lived right in the middle of "lighting alley" for many years. I have seen some things! There was a two lane highway coming back from Tampa that I used a lot just because I liked being out in the swamp, and was quite deserted most of the time. It was late one summer evening, coming back from Tampa and I thought I'd go down that swamp road to get home, maybe stop at the river to see if anybody was night fishing. A thunderstorm came with violent wind. I thought it would blow my little car into the swamp. Then the lighting. There were so many strikes that it was bouncing off of the road in front of me. I got home okay, except for a change of clothes was needed! The next day I told someone about it, and we decided to go see if there was any evidence of such. When we got to the area where I was, there were marks in the pavement where lighting had hit. You could also go out in the fields after a good one and find where the lighting had hit the ground and turned the sand into glass. Wasn't pretty glass, but it was glass. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
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Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 3:07*pm, wrote:
On Jun 3, 2:45*pm, Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 2:39*pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 12:13 pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 1:50 am, wrote: On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? We have thunderstorms all the time and most of us in open boats worry about getting hit by lightning but I haven't really heard any stories about it happening. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds and try to see them coming in time to get to a safe place to wait it out. If you do get caught in it get as low in the boat as possible and away from the T top. Sailboat guys probably have tips about grounding since that mast is a pretty attractive target. The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... If you only went out when there was a rising barometer you wouldn't get away from the dock around here in the summer. One thought about "blue sky" lightning, be sure to look up! There are lots of times here in the sub-tropics where there will be blue sky and sunshine all around and if you looked straight up you would see a big white puffy cloud. It might be a tower 15,000 feet tall. Radar can be deceiving too. Until it starts raining, these clouds don't really look that bad on radar. That can be a pretty sudden occurrence. These are the kind of storms Florida is famous for where one guy can get an inch of rain in 15 minutes and the guy on the block over doesn't get a drop. Having had waaaaay too much experience with lightning, I tend to obsess over it. *Living in N. Florida and being both a sailor and powerboater I have developed strategies for both. *Your best strategy is avoidance of thunderstorms. If you cannot avoid them, here is what I do: Sailboat. *Disconnect VHF and GPS from power AND antennas so they will work after a strike. *Get passengers below decks so the wet decks and hull can form a "Faraday Cage" for them and minimize effects on them. Make sure nobody goes near metal stuff including the sink or the mast on a keel stepped mast boat. I drop my sails long before the storm hits and have my engine running and attempt to power into the wind. *if it gets too strong I turn and run with the wind. *Make sure everything is bonded to the engine shaft and hope the prop will dissipate a strike. I'd rather be at anchor during such a storm and I have a 2' x2' copper sheet soldered and clamped to a 00 guage tinned copper braided cable that clips to the mast as high as I can reach with another lead going to the shroud at the edge of the deck. *All of this should give me a "cone of protection". *I crouch as low as possible. Powerboat (outboard): *I run like hell back toward shore. *Beach the boat if necessary because I want trees near shore to offer a better strike path than me, but stay on the boat. *IF necessary, I anchor. *I also have a length of OO tinned braided cable I attach to my danforth anchor that I drop overboard with anchor line attached so it hangs in the water (Yes, I carry two anchors on my 20' boat) so the anchors area will dissipate the current of a strike. *Lower the VHF antenna and disconnect the VHF from power and antenna. *Crouch low in boat under RAISED bimini. *The bimini is grounded and helps form a Faraday cage. *Do not touch the wheel or throttle unless necessary. Stand one one foot or keep feet together, SERIOUSLY. *This avoids current using your torso as a conduction path from one place on the hull to another, your body is a better conductor than the wet fiberglass. Nice to hear from you again, Dr. Emmett Brown. Hi Harry. *I seem to have the craziest experiences involving lightning so I take it very seriously. *Here in Tallahassee, Thunderstorms have interrupted work here twice today already. *I do not let the machinists go near the machines during storms and I get away from the computers and other equipment. *At least once a week our electron microscopes crash due to lightning in summer.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I lived right in the middle of "lighting alley" for many years. I have seen some things! There was a two lane highway coming back from Tampa that I used a lot just because I liked being out in the swamp, and was quite deserted most of the time. It was late one summer evening, coming back from Tampa and I thought I'd go down that swamp road to get home, maybe stop at the river to see if anybody was night fishing. A thunderstorm came with violent wind. I thought it would blow my little car into the swamp. Then the lighting. There were so many strikes that it was bouncing off of the road in front of me. I got home okay, except for a change of clothes was needed! The next day I told someone about it, and we decided to go see if there was any evidence of such. When we got to the area where I was, there were marks in the pavement where lighting had hit. You could also go out in the fields after a good one and find where the lighting had hit the ground and turned the sand into glass. Wasn't pretty glass, but it was glass. How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
Frogwatch wrote:
How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 3:58*pm, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? *Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ My older sister and her hubby have about 5 acres adjacent to Point Lookout, I have never been there but some day I'll take the Tolman up there cuz they do have a dock |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
Frogwatch wrote:
On Jun 3, 3:58 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ My older sister and her hubby have about 5 acres adjacent to Point Lookout, I have never been there but some day I'll take the Tolman up there cuz they do have a dock Perfect area for your boat...you can cruise the Potomac to Washington, D.C., and beyond, and explore the Chesapeake Bay area, too. There's some nice homes near the point itself, but, quite literally, there's very little else out there. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ You union folks do live pretty high off the hawg. Don't you? |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 21:12:38 -0700 (PDT), Tim
wrote: OK, hypothetical, but my quesiton is how do you handle being caught in a lightening storm in a boat. I have two fiberglass boats an 18' and a 23'. 18 has an enclosed bow, and the 23 a small cuddie. basicly a bigger enclosed bow. Where I boat is Lake Carlyle, and it's about 10 mi. long and about 3 mi. wide. Now 'pop-up' showers arn't uncommon this time of year, but sometimes that little sprinkle can turn into a lightening storm while the boater is unawares. So while being caught in the rain. the bilge [s] are on, and you're headed in. the baot is wet.. you're wet. what is the concern about lightening? I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? I put on the life vests, put my antenna down with the radio off, say a few prayers, wish I didn't have to pee so bad, and head for home - at a slow pace 'cause I can't see over the waves. -- John H "The problem with Socialism is that you eventually run out of other people’s money." --Margaret Thatcher |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 15:58:19 -0400, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ I heard about a training program SIU has for new merchant sailors, leading to the CG license and....work. There was a discussion about it on the cruising group. Sounded like a neat program for youngsters. No cost and free room and board, I think. Quasi-military in that respect. Used to be you had to get "sponsored" by a ship company, or have military experience to get the license. But U.S. Merchant Marine is just a wisp of what it once was. Globalism. --Vic |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 18:58:47 -0400, Gene
wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 06:03:43 -0500, Richard Casady wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 06:14:45 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock wrote: I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? Not much you can do about it other than try to stay at the lowest point in the boat, duck and cover. I have an aluminum cuddy. Better than a glass bow rider, at least. Casady Bull****. Apparently, you have never seen (or had to repair) an aluminum aircraft hit by lightning.... I was in one that got hit by lightning - a stretched DC-8. The static discharge sticks on the wings were glowing with green plasma for about two minutes after the strike. :) |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 17:47:40 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 15:58:19 -0400, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ I heard about a training program SIU has for new merchant sailors, leading to the CG license and....work. There was a discussion about it on the cruising group. Sounded like a neat program for youngsters. No cost and free room and board, I think. Quasi-military in that respect. Used to be you had to get "sponsored" by a ship company, or have military experience to get the license. But U.S. Merchant Marine is just a wisp of what it once was. Globalism. Actually one of the few Unions that actually does something for it's membership other than try to scam more money out of ownership for "job banks" and such. Their training program is first rate - equal to the various merchant marine academies. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 7:07*pm, Wizard of Woodstock wrote:
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 17:47:40 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 15:58:19 -0400, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? *Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ I heard about a training program SIU has for new merchant sailors, leading to the CG license and....work. There was a discussion about it on the cruising group. Sounded like a neat program for youngsters. No cost and free room and board, I think. Quasi-military in that respect. Used to be you had to get "sponsored" by a ship company, or have military experience to get the license. But U.S. Merchant Marine is just a wisp of what it once was. Globalism. Actually one of the few Unions that actually does something for it's membership other than try to scam more money out of ownership for "job banks" and such. Their training program is first rate - equal to the various merchant marine academies. Last year, I stopped using computer during a storm even though we have a surge protector. FLASH-Bang and a huge spark jumps from the computer housing to the grounded outlet, HUH? made no sense to me but it cured me of wanting to use computer during storms. Two yrs ago, came into work in morn to find whole place filled with vacuum pump smoke and a whole leg of the 3 phase burned out. A computer was fried and we had to run a new ground by drilling thru the concrete and pounding it down 20' Two weeks ago, one electron microscope died one night. Apparently a strike fried a whole board of old 7400 and 7420 chips (electronic guys will be able to tell the rough era of said scope from that) Everybody in my neighborhood is on wells cuz we have no city water. The wells with downhole pumps are always getting struck. My neighbor has a well that is underground with nothing showing above (tank is inside his garage) and it has been struck 4X. mine only once in 20 yrs, across the street twice. A guy at work had his house hit last year when it came in on a natural gas line. Fried most of his electrical system. I could go on and on and on..........I have also been up close and personal with lightning 4 times although I really try to avoid it. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch
wrote: Last year, I stopped using computer during a storm even though we have a surge protector. FLASH-Bang and a huge spark jumps from the computer housing to the grounded outlet, HUH? made no sense to me but it cured me of wanting to use computer during storms. Two yrs ago, came into work in morn to find whole place filled with vacuum pump smoke and a whole leg of the 3 phase burned out. A computer was fried and we had to run a new ground by drilling thru the concrete and pounding it down 20' Two weeks ago, one electron microscope died one night. Apparently a strike fried a whole board of old 7400 and 7420 chips (electronic guys will be able to tell the rough era of said scope from that) Everybody in my neighborhood is on wells cuz we have no city water. The wells with downhole pumps are always getting struck. My neighbor has a well that is underground with nothing showing above (tank is inside his garage) and it has been struck 4X. mine only once in 20 yrs, across the street twice. A guy at work had his house hit last year when it came in on a natural gas line. Fried most of his electrical system. I could go on and on and on..........I have also been up close and personal with lightning 4 times although I really try to avoid it. You know, if you're really concerned about a piece of gear, the best option is to unplug it when there's lightning activity. A hit on your building wiring can fry everything in the building. Doesn't even have to be on as the current jumps any switch. And I've heard that surge protectors are useless for lightning. They just can't handle the truth. I still pull the plug on my pet computer when an intense storm comes by. --Vic |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
Wizard of Woodstock wrote:
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 17:47:40 -0500, Vic Smith wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 15:58:19 -0400, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ I heard about a training program SIU has for new merchant sailors, leading to the CG license and....work. There was a discussion about it on the cruising group. Sounded like a neat program for youngsters. No cost and free room and board, I think. Quasi-military in that respect. Used to be you had to get "sponsored" by a ship company, or have military experience to get the license. But U.S. Merchant Marine is just a wisp of what it once was. Globalism. Actually one of the few Unions that actually does something for it's membership You are clueless... |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 19:07:55 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote: Actually one of the few Unions that actually does something for it's membership other than try to scam more money out of ownership for "job banks" and such. Only union that didn't get me back 20 times any dues was the Steelworkers. They were sweethearts with U.S. Steel. UAW, SIU and Teamsters dues - smallest paycheck deduction by far. Didn't have any choice but to be in the union anyway - unless I wanted to work at a non-union shop for half the wages. Economically, that would have been very stupid. But there's always plenty of applicants for stupid, so don't worry. Their training program is first rate - equal to the various merchant marine academies. They had no such program when I got my license. Probably a way to stay alive. I really don't get, since there's probably 1/100 of the need for U.S. crew now than when I worked. Might be getting fed by the feds to keep a skeleton merchant capability for nat security reasons. --Vic |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 16:58:33 -0400, HK wrote:
Frogwatch wrote: On Jun 3, 3:58 pm, HK wrote: Frogwatch wrote: How's the fishin Harry? Do you live anywhere near Point Lookout? For this area, the fishing is average. In comparison to everywhere in Florida I have fished, that would translate to slower than slow. We're north of Point Lookout, about an hour or so by car, depending on traffic. I've driven there by car once, just to enjoy the vistas, and have turned the corner, so to speak, on boats about a half-dozen times. If I am driving down that way, it's most likely to attend something or other at the Seafarers facility at Piney Point. A number of unions hold social functions there. http://www.seafarers.org/phc/PhotoGallery/facilities/ My older sister and her hubby have about 5 acres adjacent to Point Lookout, I have never been there but some day I'll take the Tolman up there cuz they do have a dock Perfect area for your boat...you can cruise the Potomac to Washington, D.C., and beyond, and explore the Chesapeake Bay area, too. There's some nice homes near the point itself, but, quite literally, there's very little else out there. You won't cruise much 'beyond' Washington D.C., unless your boat is impervious to rocks. But, the Potomac is a beautiful river for cruising. -- John H "The problem with Socialism is that you eventually run out of other people’s money." --Margaret Thatcher |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 21:37:13 -0400, Gene
wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 19:05:48 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 18:58:47 -0400, Gene wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 06:03:43 -0500, Richard Casady wrote: On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 06:14:45 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock wrote: I'm thinking at least sit still and everybody head under the enclosures. until at least the lightning quits. What say ye? Not much you can do about it other than try to stay at the lowest point in the boat, duck and cover. I have an aluminum cuddy. Better than a glass bow rider, at least. Casady Bull****. Apparently, you have never seen (or had to repair) an aluminum aircraft hit by lightning.... I was in one that got hit by lightning - a stretched DC-8. The static discharge sticks on the wings were glowing with green plasma for about two minutes after the strike. :) I have pictures that I show students..... huge fricking holes in the side of the A/C..... minor compared to the ecological disaster perpetrated on the FO's seat................. ROTFL!!! I'll tell you, it's interesting when it happens. The guy sitting next to me on the way back was a chopper pilot and when it happened, he thought it wasn't a direct hit - he thought we got passed by and were in the plasma cone rather than the direct path on a cloud-to-cloud strike. The reason he thought so was there weren't any holes anywhere on the wings or cabin. :) When I had my towers, I went through a whole bunch of gas discharge connectors one summer and finally had New England Tower come over and completely redo the ground system - buried a lot of #10 copper wire in a grid, staked with 8 foot ground rods and each leg of each tower was hard bonded to the grid. That helped a lot - the number of strikes the following year went down significantly. Don't ask me why. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Thu, 04 Jun 2009 06:29:27 -0400, Wizard of Woodstock
wrote: When I had my towers, I went through a whole bunch of gas discharge connectors one summer and finally had New England Tower come over and completely redo the ground system - buried a lot of #10 copper wire in a grid, staked with 8 foot ground rods and each leg of each tower was hard bonded to the grid. That helped a lot - the number of strikes the following year went down significantly. Don't ask me why. I believe there's a theory that a good grounding system will bleed off accumulated charge before the voltage gets high enough to initiate a leader stroke. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 3, 8:56*pm, wrote:
On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Last year, I stopped using computer during a storm even though we have a surge protector. *FLASH-Bang and a huge spark jumps from the computer housing to the grounded outlet, HUH? *made no sense to me but it cured me of wanting to use computer during storms. Beef up your point of entry surge protection and make sure the cable and telephone company are bonding to your electrical service ground electrode system. When I was working for IBM (Ft Myers) we designed protective systems for our customers who were not willing to stop working just because it was raining outside. We went from a half dozen lightning damage calls a day to less than 3 a summer. Grounding, bonding and surge protection is the difference. Take a look at the products at: http://www.deltala.com/products.htm We use them to protect the building at work (an electronics design, manufacturing and software house), and a lot of us have used them to protect our houses and wells. Reasonably priced, easy to install, and they work. Like others have pointed out, nearly nothing can protect you from a direct hit. I have been to the top of a mountain in northern California, where there was a three story fire watch building with a bunch of radio equipment and a microwave shot back down to the valley. The top the building was pretty much wrapped with metal fencing that was all bonded together, with wires running down all four corners. These wires continued out from the building and into a big grounding scheme that covered a large area. The idea is that not if, but *when* the building was struck, everything in the building rose up to the same potential, and then bled off into the mountain. It's the difference in potential (voltage) that kills equipment. Oh yeah, this thing was manned during the summer. Wow!! |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 4, 9:18*am, wrote:
On Jun 3, 8:56*pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Last year, I stopped using computer during a storm even though we have a surge protector. *FLASH-Bang and a huge spark jumps from the computer housing to the grounded outlet, HUH? *made no sense to me but it cured me of wanting to use computer during storms. Beef up your point of entry surge protection and make sure the cable and telephone company are bonding to your electrical service ground electrode system. When I was working for IBM (Ft Myers) we designed protective systems for our customers who were not willing to stop working just because it was raining outside. We went from a half dozen lightning damage calls a day to less than 3 a summer. Grounding, bonding and surge protection is the difference. Take a look at the products at:http://www.deltala.com/products.htm We use them to protect the building at work (an electronics design, manufacturing and software house), and a lot of us have used them to protect our houses and wells. *Reasonably priced, easy to install, and they work. Like others have pointed out, nearly nothing can protect you from a direct hit. I have been to the top of a mountain in northern California, where there was a three story fire watch building with a bunch of radio equipment and a microwave shot back down to the valley. *The top the building was pretty much wrapped with metal fencing that was all bonded together, with wires running down all four corners. *These wires continued out from the building and into a big grounding scheme that covered a large area. *The idea is that not if, but *when* the building was struck, everything in the building rose up to the same potential, and then bled off into the mountain. *It's the difference in potential (voltage) that kills equipment. Oh yeah, this thing was manned during the summer. *Wow!!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Yeah, but thunder storms aren't common there. My wife and in-laws are from the bay area, and they go for years sometimes without a thunderstorm. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 4, 9:23*am, wrote:
On Jun 4, 9:18*am, wrote: On Jun 3, 8:56*pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Last year, I stopped using computer during a storm even though we have a surge protector. *FLASH-Bang and a huge spark jumps from the computer housing to the grounded outlet, HUH? *made no sense to me but it cured me of wanting to use computer during storms. Beef up your point of entry surge protection and make sure the cable and telephone company are bonding to your electrical service ground electrode system. When I was working for IBM (Ft Myers) we designed protective systems for our customers who were not willing to stop working just because it was raining outside. We went from a half dozen lightning damage calls a day to less than 3 a summer. Grounding, bonding and surge protection is the difference. Take a look at the products at:http://www.deltala.com/products.htm We use them to protect the building at work (an electronics design, manufacturing and software house), and a lot of us have used them to protect our houses and wells. *Reasonably priced, easy to install, and they work. Like others have pointed out, nearly nothing can protect you from a direct hit. I have been to the top of a mountain in northern California, where there was a three story fire watch building with a bunch of radio equipment and a microwave shot back down to the valley. *The top the building was pretty much wrapped with metal fencing that was all bonded together, with wires running down all four corners. *These wires continued out from the building and into a big grounding scheme that covered a large area. *The idea is that not if, but *when* the building was struck, everything in the building rose up to the same potential, and then bled off into the mountain. *It's the difference in potential (voltage) that kills equipment. Oh yeah, this thing was manned during the summer. *Wow!!- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Yeah, but thunder storms aren't common there. My wife and in-laws are from the bay area, and they go for years sometimes without a thunderstorm. That may be true in the bay area, but the guys that worked there (this was state forestry) said that they took hits several times a year. Oh, and this was northeastern. I flew into Reno and drove an hour or so. |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 4, 10:28*am, wrote:
On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 06:18:59 -0700 (PDT), wrote: On Jun 3, 8:56*pm, wrote: On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 16:22:57 -0700 (PDT), Frogwatch wrote: Last year, I stopped using computer during a storm even though we have a surge protector. *FLASH-Bang and a huge spark jumps from the computer housing to the grounded outlet, HUH? *made no sense to me but it cured me of wanting to use computer during storms. Beef up your point of entry surge protection and make sure the cable and telephone company are bonding to your electrical service ground electrode system. When I was working for IBM (Ft Myers) we designed protective systems for our customers who were not willing to stop working just because it was raining outside. We went from a half dozen lightning damage calls a day to less than 3 a summer. Grounding, bonding and surge protection is the difference. Take a look at the products at: http://www.deltala.com/products.htm We use them to protect the building at work (an electronics design, manufacturing and software house), and a lot of us have used them to protect our houses and wells. *Reasonably priced, easy to install, and they work. Like others have pointed out, nearly nothing can protect you from a direct hit. I have been to the top of a mountain in northern California, where there was a three story fire watch building with a bunch of radio equipment and a microwave shot back down to the valley. *The top the building was pretty much wrapped with metal fencing that was all bonded together, with wires running down all four corners. *These wires continued out from the building and into a big grounding scheme that covered a large area. *The idea is that not if, but *when* the building was struck, everything in the building rose up to the same potential, and then bled off into the mountain. *It's the difference in potential (voltage) that kills equipment. Oh yeah, this thing was manned during the summer. *Wow!! The lightning rod on the mast with my weather station has been hit at least twice that I know of and the only thing I lost was the serial port in the PC it is connected to. I was in the driveway once when it hit, very exciting.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I want to get a semi-decent weather station. Any recommendations? |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 05:07:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
The real trick is to be able to read the clouds Or buy a hand held Barometer...... $900 for a radar. Casady |
Question concerning boating and lightning...
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Question concerning boating and lightning...
On Jun 5, 12:14*pm, wrote:
On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 07:45:44 -0700 (PDT), wrote: The lightning rod on the mast with my weather station has been hit at least twice that I know of and the only thing I lost was the serial port in the PC it is connected to. I was in the driveway once when it hit, very exciting.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I want to get a semi-decent weather station. Any recommendations? I have a LaCrosse 2310 and it is a fairly good consumer grade unit but no match for a "real" one My wind speed sensor is currently on the blink. I replaced the little propeller unit with no joy.http://esteroriverheights.com/esteroweather.jpg Thanks, I'll check it out! Radio Shack has some fair ones, but for stuff like that, they're usually priced pretty high. |
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