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Heat exchanger for a boat?
On Thu, 29 Jan 2009 21:54:02 -0500, "Eisboch"
wrote: wrote in message ... On Jan 29, 8:24 pm, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... If you have a small cabin on a boat can you get a small heat exchanger that heats in winter and cools in summer that runs on 12 volts? What kind of system would you use? No. Eisboch So how do they air condition boats and campers? My smart ass answer was because you said "runs on 12 volts". You would have to have a battery bank the size of the boat to have enough amp capacity to run a heater or air conditioner for very long. A small AC unit will draw roughly 8 amps at 120 volts, so figure more than 10 times that using a 12 volt compressor (if they made one) or running it from a 12vdc to 120vac inverter. Generating enough heat BTU's would be a similar current draw. 12 volts is simply unrealistic. Air conditioners on boats or campers run from either 120 volts and in rare cases, 220 volts. The power is supplied from a genset or shore power. Campers usually have either a heat strip in the AC unit and/or propane heating systems. Propane heat and maybe something like this for 12V A/C. http://www.arcticbreeze-truckac.com/...eezeintro.html But you're still going to need a genset for the A/C unless you have 120v service and an inverter. Might be better/cheaper then to go with cheap 120v home window unit. Larry has recommended these kind of setups and you can google his solutions. The Mac 26 forum had a number of guys installing A/C, and they all went the shore power/genset 120v window unit route. See what the ice-fishing guys uses to heat their ice shacks. I know nothing about heat pumps, except the temp differentials often make them non-cost effective. --Vic |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
I hate to be simplistic or take the fun out of anyone's project,
but... In the time it would take to read this thread, you could visit http://www.go2marine.com/category.do?no=14018 Get a professional on the phone and order the right thing. If it were my time and money I'd spend it paying an expert rather than on becoming an expert myself. AsianDoll Since its my school semester break I have been using my free time playing games like a href=http://www.gamestotal.com http://www.gamestotal.com /a a href=http://uc.gamestotal.com http://uc.gamestotal.com /a a href=http://gc.gamestotal.com http://gc.gamestotal.com /a a href=http://3700ad.gamestotal.com http://3700ad.gamestotal.com /a a href=http://manga.gamestotal.com http://manga.gamestotal.com /a |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
On Jan 29, 10:40*pm, wrote:
On Jan 29, 10:08*pm, "Eisboch" wrote: "Jim749293432" wrote in message ... Eisboch wrote: wrote in message ... On Jan 29, 8:24 pm, "Eisboch" wrote: wrote in message ... If you have a small cabin on a boat can you get a small heat exchanger that heats in winter and cools in summer that runs on 12 volts? What kind of system would you use? No. Eisboch So how do they air condition boats and campers? My smart ass answer was because you said "runs on 12 volts". * You would have to have a battery bank the size of the boat to have enough amp capacity to run a heater or air conditioner for very long. *A small AC unit will draw roughly 8 amps at 120 volts, so figure more than 10 times that using a 12 volt compressor (if they made one) or running it from a 12vdc to 120vac inverter. Generating enough heat BTU's would be a similar current draw. * 12 volts is simply unrealistic. Air conditioners on boats or campers run from either 120 volts and in rare cases, 220 volts. The power is supplied from a genset or shore power. Campers usually have either a heat strip in the AC unit and/or propane heating systems. Eisboch Heat pumps too. Forgot that. *Reverse cycle combination AC and Heat. * But not for 12vdc. Eisboch- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Ok, so I need to run a generator, no problem, I have one. What's the best way to go from there? I see a lot of stuff out there on Google, any hints about configurations and brands.. I am much more concerened with cooling than heating. Heating I can figure out later...- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Ok, so I need to run a generator, no problem, I have one. He's going to put the Generator in his rowboat.....lol. |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
"Vic Smith" wrote in message ... wrote in message ... If you have a small cabin on a boat can you get a small heat exchanger that heats in winter and cools in summer that runs on 12 volts? What kind of system would you use? Propane heat and maybe something like this for 12V A/C. http://www.arcticbreeze-truckac.com/...eezeintro.html But you're still going to need a genset for the A/C unless you have 120v service and an inverter. Might be better/cheaper then to go with cheap 120v home window unit. Larry has recommended these kind of setups and you can google his solutions. The Mac 26 forum had a number of guys installing A/C, and they all went the shore power/genset 120v window unit route. See what the ice-fishing guys uses to heat their ice shacks. I know nothing about heat pumps, except the temp differentials often make them non-cost effective. --Vic I installed a residential, 10,000 BTU window AC unit in the rear hatch of the Grand Banks we had. Kept the aft cabin nice and comfortable for sleeping on hot, humid nights. Roughly 200 bucks, including the marine plywood I bought to mount it in. A marine AC unit, mounted in the engine room and ducted to the cabins was quoted at about $6k to $8K by the guys at the marina. For the number of times we needed AC up here, it wasn't worth the expense. Obviously, it was used only when docked and when plugged into shore power, although I could have run it while underway off the generator. My current boat has two reverse cycle AC/heat units. The Navigator had four of them. Marine types exchange using water rather than ambient air and surprisingly, there is still enough heat in the ocean water up here during the winter for them to produce enough heat to keep the boat nice and warm. I usually shut them down and winterized them before the deep cold set in. If I had stayed on the boat all winter, like some others do at our marina, I'd would have used them throughout the entire winter. I know a few people that live on their boats year-round at the marina and they have told me that there is only about a 2 week period in the middle of the winter when they have to supplement the heat pumps with some electric space heaters. Eisboch |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
wrote in message ... I hate to be simplistic or take the fun out of anyone's project, but... In the time it would take to read this thread, you could visit http://www.go2marine.com/category.do?no=14018 Get a professional on the phone and order the right thing. If it were my time and money I'd spend it paying an expert rather than on becoming an expert myself. AsianDoll What "thing"? I didn't see any air-conditioning systems or heaters that run on 12 volts there. Eisboch |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 04:52:40 -0500, "Eisboch"
wrote: My current boat has two reverse cycle AC/heat units. The Navigator had four of them. Marine types exchange using water rather than ambient air and surprisingly, there is still enough heat in the ocean water up here during the winter for them to produce enough heat to keep the boat nice and warm. I usually shut them down and winterized them before the deep cold set in. If I had stayed on the boat all winter, like some others do at our marina, I'd would have used them throughout the entire winter. I know a few people that live on their boats year-round at the marina and they have told me that there is only about a 2 week period in the middle of the winter when they have to supplement the heat pumps with some electric space heaters. Didn't know they were that good. You ever look at the efficiency trade-offs at different temps? Like when it's more efficient to use the space heater, even though the pump can do the job. I wonder if those motel thru-wall units are heat pumps. Had to turn the heat on in one of the motels on the way to Florida last year, and I just assumed it had heat coils. But maybe not. From what I've read it's too cold up here to make heat pumps a frugal investment. --Vic |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
"Vic Smith" wrote in message ... On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 04:52:40 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: My current boat has two reverse cycle AC/heat units. The Navigator had four of them. Marine types exchange using water rather than ambient air and surprisingly, there is still enough heat in the ocean water up here during the winter for them to produce enough heat to keep the boat nice and warm. I usually shut them down and winterized them before the deep cold set in. If I had stayed on the boat all winter, like some others do at our marina, I'd would have used them throughout the entire winter. I know a few people that live on their boats year-round at the marina and they have told me that there is only about a 2 week period in the middle of the winter when they have to supplement the heat pumps with some electric space heaters. Didn't know they were that good. You ever look at the efficiency trade-offs at different temps? Like when it's more efficient to use the space heater, even though the pump can do the job. I wonder if those motel thru-wall units are heat pumps. Had to turn the heat on in one of the motels on the way to Florida last year, and I just assumed it had heat coils. But maybe not. From what I've read it's too cold up here to make heat pumps a frugal investment. --Vic Some of the reverse cycle heat pumps have strip heaters also. I suspect hotel types use strip heaters in the heat mode. One of the units on the Navigator was equipped with heaters. You could program it to run using the compressor in the reverse cycle mode or using the heat strip. The water based systems seem to run pretty well down to water temps of 40 degrees, then start to lose ground if the water temp goes lower. They will still extract heat, but not as efficiently. Obviously, an air exchange system won't work with air temps even higher. Our pool heater has an interlock to prevent it from running if the ambient air temp drops to about 45 degrees or less. If it continued to run, it would simply ice up the evaporator. Eisboch |
Heat exchanger for a boat?
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Heat exchanger for a boat?
On Jan 30, 6:31*am, "Eisboch" wrote:
"Vic Smith" wrote in message ... On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 04:52:40 -0500, "Eisboch" wrote: My current boat has two reverse cycle AC/heat units. * The Navigator had four of them. *Marine types exchange using water rather than ambient air and surprisingly, there is still enough heat in the ocean water up here during the winter for them to produce enough heat to keep the boat nice and warm. I usually shut them down and winterized them before the deep cold set in. |
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