Wind generators
I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices
seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. |
Wind generators
In "Nigel" writes:
I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. I have experience with Aerogen wind generator. Reliable and QUIET. If you like beating into the wind, you will be happy as you produce the current you need. On the run, you are not as well off. - Lauri Tarkkonen |
Wind generators
On Tue, 4 May 2004 13:49:54 +0100, Nigel wrote:
I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. I have a Rutland 913 in use since 1996. It's quiet, does not interfere with HF radio reception ,it puts out about what the spec.s claim, which is not much. The tail on the unit is completly worthless. Underway or even sometimes at anchor it will spin drunkenly about. I made a new tail fin about 2.5 times the size of the original. The new tail keeps it charging in everything but light downwind conditions. After about 5 years in the Florida sun the plastic housing got yellow and brittle and the blades began showing fibers as the outer plastic powdered away. A couple of coats of epoxy paint seems to have stopped that process. If I was buying a new unit now I would look at the KISS. Everyone I talk to who has one seems happy with it. Russ Barron -- Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ |
Wind generators
I realize that Windbugger is a US based unit, however I am extremely happy
with mine. This is my second season of living aboard with wind and solar power. Last night it was charging between 15-20 amps in gusts of 25 knots. Normally it charges around 5-10 in just the moderate breeze in my anchorage. I can just barely hear the 'swish' of the 3 blade prop. Hardly noticeable until it reaches higher RPM, went the overspeed break starts regulating. Nothing objectionable, just a reminder that the wind is over 25-30 knots. I have been maintaining an 800 amp/hr battery bank with the wind gen as primary source and two 55 watt solar panels. My electrical load is presently, 2000watt inverter (for micro wave, toaster oven, tools, etc), 12 vdc frig., TV, VCR and lighting. Anyway, if you have chance to pick up a used WindBugger, it would be well worth considering. Steve s/v Good Intentions |
Wind generators
I'd go with a KISS. Quiet and generates more power than any other using.
Doug s/v Callista "Nigel" wrote in message .. . I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. |
Wind generators
I have used the Rutland 910. I vowed never to use it again after a solo
transatlantic. The noise resonating through the hull was awful but it did the job. After trying to use only solar power for a few years i will resurrect the wind gen but try to insulate the pole from the boat with rubber bushings. Lauri Tarkkonen wrote: In "Nigel" writes: I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. |
Wind generators
"Nigel" wrote in message .. . I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. I've a Rutland 500 - it has a rim around the fins so you don't lose anything if you go too close, but that's the only good thing I can say about it. Very little power output and the bearings give up too easily. Alisdair |
Wind generators
Another vote for a KISS. While not as popular as say, the Air Marine,
they are indeed the quietest. Although here in American Samoa, the Air Marine units do have value. My anchored neighbors (one to the east and one to the west) are each to windward and leeward of me, depending upon summer or winter conditions. Their Air Marine windmills are my "early warning device", for as soon as a gust hits 32 to 34 knots, their units "depower", and the resulting turbine-like WHINE is loud enough to wake me out of a sound sleep and give me 1 second or 2 notice to "hang on".. Note that my neighbors are about 70 meters distance... Note that you may want to also order an extra diode/rectifier kit when you order the unit. Mine was bad out of the box, and (due to mail schedules here) I have been waiting 3 weeks for a replacement. |
Wind generators
"mitch" wrote in message m... Another vote for a KISS. While not as popular as say, the Air Marine, they are indeed the quietest. The KISS generates about twice the power as an Air Marine as well. Although here in American Samoa, the Air Marine units do have value. My anchored neighbors (one to the east and one to the west) are each to windward and leeward of me, depending upon summer or winter conditions. Their Air Marine windmills are my "early warning device", for as soon as a gust hits 32 to 34 knots, their units "depower", and the resulting turbine-like WHINE is loud enough to wake me out of a sound sleep and give me 1 second or 2 notice to "hang on".. Note that my neighbors are about 70 meters distance... Even in a reasonable wind they are annoying. The new units are quieter, but nowhere as quiet as the KISS. Note that you may want to also order an extra diode/rectifier kit when you order the unit. Mine was bad out of the box, and (due to mail schedules here) I have been waiting 3 weeks for a replacement. Nice thing about the KISS is that the diode pack is an off-the-shelf Motorola unit that can be bought at most any auto parts store. |
Wind generators
The following is a log from 3/13/2004 regarding a failure that I had
with my KISS wind generator. While I own one, and generally think that they're very good, they do have definate problems. -- Geoff ***************************** I just experienced a failure of my KISS wind generator of a nature that I've been worried about for quite some time. The KISS generator has a thermal breaker on each of the 3 outputs of the generator. These open when the generator is getting too hot by generating too much power. This sounds OK in principle, but the problem is that when the breakers open, the blades freewheel at a very high rate of speed. The power curves that KISS supplies shows the generator producing 18 A at 20 Kts and 25 A at 25 Kts. However, there's nothing in their literature which shows the maximum sustainable power output. A switch, located between the generator wiring and the connections to the battery provides a method of feathering the generator by shorting the outputs to ground or each other. In winds of less than 25 kts this typically causes the blades to spin at a very slow rate of speed. However, once the thermal breakers have tripped, this switch does nothing. To me this is a serious design flaw. The system should feather itself instead of letting the blades freewheel. I first noticed this on the trip from FL to Guatemala last summer. I had just installed it and was quite surprised when it wouldn't feather in a squall that blew through. I contacted the US KISS distributor about this, and their response was that I should take a boat hook and use it to pull the generator sideways into the wind via a string that goes from the tail of the generator to the support pole. Yeah, that's a great concept until you're at sea with the boat pitching all over the place and probably a lot of other things going wrong at the same time. Today we've been at anchor at Lighthouse Reef in Belize with a cold front blowing through. The winds have been in the 15 to 25 kt range all day. This morning the breakers tripped twice when the winds gusted over 30 for brief periods of time. Each time I was able to grab the string and swing it around to feather it. This afternoon the winds have been in the 15-20 kt range and the breakers have tripped twice. We were only generating about 17 amps sustained when this happened. The second time I was pulling the generator around when the string got caught in a blade and yanked the boat hook into the tail, snapping it off. I suppose that this is a lot better than having the boat hook strike a spinning blade and potentially impale me, but I'm not happy at all. While in general I am happy with the KISS generator's simplicity, I think that this is a serious design problem which poses a substantial safety risk. If you're thinking about getting one, consider this fact before buying. |
Wind generators
I'll have to look into this further. The few times my thermal
switches have activated, they have served to stall the blades rather than to let them freewheel as I recall. But if I recall correctly, pulling the mill out of the wind with a string has been a standard technique for many products for a long time. Doug s/v Callista "Geoffrey W. Schultz" wrote in message 9.17... The following is a log from 3/13/2004 regarding a failure that I had with my KISS wind generator. While I own one, and generally think that they're very good, they do have definate problems. -- Geoff ***************************** I just experienced a failure of my KISS wind generator of a nature that I've been worried about for quite some time. The KISS generator has a thermal breaker on each of the 3 outputs of the generator. These open when the generator is getting too hot by generating too much power. This sounds OK in principle, but the problem is that when the breakers open, the blades freewheel at a very high rate of speed. The power curves that KISS supplies shows the generator producing 18 A at 20 Kts and 25 A at 25 Kts. However, there's nothing in their literature which shows the maximum sustainable power output. A switch, located between the generator wiring and the connections to the battery provides a method of feathering the generator by shorting the outputs to ground or each other. In winds of less than 25 kts this typically causes the blades to spin at a very slow rate of speed. However, once the thermal breakers have tripped, this switch does nothing. To me this is a serious design flaw. The system should feather itself instead of letting the blades freewheel. I first noticed this on the trip from FL to Guatemala last summer. I had just installed it and was quite surprised when it wouldn't feather in a squall that blew through. I contacted the US KISS distributor about this, and their response was that I should take a boat hook and use it to pull the generator sideways into the wind via a string that goes from the tail of the generator to the support pole. Yeah, that's a great concept until you're at sea with the boat pitching all over the place and probably a lot of other things going wrong at the same time. Today we've been at anchor at Lighthouse Reef in Belize with a cold front blowing through. The winds have been in the 15 to 25 kt range all day. This morning the breakers tripped twice when the winds gusted over 30 for brief periods of time. Each time I was able to grab the string and swing it around to feather it. This afternoon the winds have been in the 15-20 kt range and the breakers have tripped twice. We were only generating about 17 amps sustained when this happened. The second time I was pulling the generator around when the string got caught in a blade and yanked the boat hook into the tail, snapping it off. I suppose that this is a lot better than having the boat hook strike a spinning blade and potentially impale me, but I'm not happy at all. While in general I am happy with the KISS generator's simplicity, I think that this is a serious design problem which poses a substantial safety risk. If you're thinking about getting one, consider this fact before buying. |
Wind generators
On Wed, 5 May 2004 00:04:44 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
vaguely proposed a theory .......and in reply I say!: uncap my header address to reply via email I am not up with this from a boat point of view, but I would have thought that either angling the tail if the mill so that it self-slowed as the breeze became stronger, or using the tail to brake the blades, would have been simple enough. It's been done on pump mills for a long time. Another opion would be _literally_ feathering the the blades, so that they are not spinning, if the heat cutout cuts in? I can see why the heat cutout needs to let the genset open and allow freewheel, rather than close and stop it. Short circuit generates large currents and little roatation for cooling, and could make things worse. I'll have to look into this further. The few times my thermal switches have activated, they have served to stall the blades rather than to let them freewheel as I recall. But if I recall correctly, pulling the mill out of the wind with a string has been a standard technique for many products for a long time. Doug s/v Callista "Geoffrey W. Schultz" wrote in message 99.17... The following is a log from 3/13/2004 regarding a failure that I had with my KISS wind generator. While I own one, and generally think that they're very good, they do have definate problems. -- Geoff ***************************** I just experienced a failure of my KISS wind generator of a nature that I've been worried about for quite some time. The KISS generator has a thermal breaker on each of the 3 outputs of the generator. These open when the generator is getting too hot by generating too much power. This sounds OK in principle, but the problem is that when the breakers open, the blades freewheel at a very high rate of speed. The power curves that KISS supplies shows the generator producing 18 A at 20 Kts and 25 A at 25 Kts. However, there's nothing in their literature which shows the maximum sustainable power output. A switch, located between the generator wiring and the connections to the battery provides a method of feathering the generator by shorting the outputs to ground or each other. In winds of less than 25 kts this typically causes the blades to spin at a very slow rate of speed. However, once the thermal breakers have tripped, this switch does nothing. To me this is a serious design flaw. The system should feather itself instead of letting the blades freewheel. I first noticed this on the trip from FL to Guatemala last summer. I had just installed it and was quite surprised when it wouldn't feather in a squall that blew through. I contacted the US KISS distributor about this, and their response was that I should take a boat hook and use it to pull the generator sideways into the wind via a string that goes from the tail of the generator to the support pole. Yeah, that's a great concept until you're at sea with the boat pitching all over the place and probably a lot of other things going wrong at the same time. Today we've been at anchor at Lighthouse Reef in Belize with a cold front blowing through. The winds have been in the 15 to 25 kt range all day. This morning the breakers tripped twice when the winds gusted over 30 for brief periods of time. Each time I was able to grab the string and swing it around to feather it. This afternoon the winds have been in the 15-20 kt range and the breakers have tripped twice. We were only generating about 17 amps sustained when this happened. The second time I was pulling the generator around when the string got caught in a blade and yanked the boat hook into the tail, snapping it off. I suppose that this is a lot better than having the boat hook strike a spinning blade and potentially impale me, but I'm not happy at all. While in general I am happy with the KISS generator's simplicity, I think that this is a serious design problem which poses a substantial safety risk. If you're thinking about getting one, consider this fact before buying. ************************************************** ***** Sometimes in a workplace you find snot on the wall of the toilet cubicles. You feel "What sort of twisted child would do this?"....the internet seems full of them. It's very sad |
Wind generators
Comments below.
Doug s/v Callista "Old Nick" wrote in message ... On Wed, 5 May 2004 00:04:44 -0400, "Doug Dotson" vaguely proposed a theory ......and in reply I say!: uncap my header address to reply via email I am not up with this from a boat point of view, but I would have thought that either angling the tail if the mill so that it self-slowed as the breeze became stronger, or using the tail to brake the blades, would have been simple enough. It's been done on pump mills for a long time. That is true. But you are correct that it hasn't been offered for marine units. Several units for teresteral use have this feature. Bergey, African Windpower, etc. Another opion would be _literally_ feathering the the blades, so that they are not spinning, if the heat cutout cuts in? Feathering in the sense of varying blade pitch is expensive and mechanically intensive. Ie expensive! I can see why the heat cutout needs to let the genset open and allow freewheel, rather than close and stop it. Short circuit generates large currents and little roatation for cooling, and could make things worse. Not really if it is done right. Letting the mill freewheel is the worse possible scenario in terms of danger to the crew and destroying the mill. The high currents can be handled and since the time to slow the mill is fairly short, thermal issues are not extreme. I'll have to look into this further. The few times my thermal switches have activated, they have served to stall the blades rather than to let them freewheel as I recall. But if I recall correctly, pulling the mill out of the wind with a string has been a standard technique for many products for a long time. Doug s/v Callista "Geoffrey W. Schultz" wrote in message 99.17... The following is a log from 3/13/2004 regarding a failure that I had with my KISS wind generator. While I own one, and generally think that they're very good, they do have definate problems. -- Geoff ***************************** I just experienced a failure of my KISS wind generator of a nature that I've been worried about for quite some time. The KISS generator has a thermal breaker on each of the 3 outputs of the generator. These open when the generator is getting too hot by generating too much power. This sounds OK in principle, but the problem is that when the breakers open, the blades freewheel at a very high rate of speed. The power curves that KISS supplies shows the generator producing 18 A at 20 Kts and 25 A at 25 Kts. However, there's nothing in their literature which shows the maximum sustainable power output. A switch, located between the generator wiring and the connections to the battery provides a method of feathering the generator by shorting the outputs to ground or each other. In winds of less than 25 kts this typically causes the blades to spin at a very slow rate of speed. However, once the thermal breakers have tripped, this switch does nothing. To me this is a serious design flaw. The system should feather itself instead of letting the blades freewheel. I first noticed this on the trip from FL to Guatemala last summer. I had just installed it and was quite surprised when it wouldn't feather in a squall that blew through. I contacted the US KISS distributor about this, and their response was that I should take a boat hook and use it to pull the generator sideways into the wind via a string that goes from the tail of the generator to the support pole. Yeah, that's a great concept until you're at sea with the boat pitching all over the place and probably a lot of other things going wrong at the same time. Today we've been at anchor at Lighthouse Reef in Belize with a cold front blowing through. The winds have been in the 15 to 25 kt range all day. This morning the breakers tripped twice when the winds gusted over 30 for brief periods of time. Each time I was able to grab the string and swing it around to feather it. This afternoon the winds have been in the 15-20 kt range and the breakers have tripped twice. We were only generating about 17 amps sustained when this happened. The second time I was pulling the generator around when the string got caught in a blade and yanked the boat hook into the tail, snapping it off. I suppose that this is a lot better than having the boat hook strike a spinning blade and potentially impale me, but I'm not happy at all. While in general I am happy with the KISS generator's simplicity, I think that this is a serious design problem which poses a substantial safety risk. If you're thinking about getting one, consider this fact before buying. ************************************************** ***** Sometimes in a workplace you find snot on the wall of the toilet cubicles. You feel "What sort of twisted child would do this?"....the internet seems full of them. It's very sad |
Wind generators
On Tue, 4 May 2004 13:49:54 +0100, "Nigel"
wrote: I'm looking at buying a wind and or towed generator for my boat, the choices seem to be Aerogen, Ampair, Duogen or Rutland, does anybody have any expirience with any of these, or any recomendation for other makes, I'm based in the UK. I have recently bought a second hand aerogen 4, been running it now for around a month. My only comment would be why I did not get one sooner, my batteries (250AH) have never been in such good condition. I can run high current items like the laptop or heater without the worry of running the batteries down. The fridge can be left on, which is brilliant. But, we have had some good winds over April, over the more stable summer months it may not be as pretty a picture, but so far I can not complain. I don't even notice the generator is there most of the time, the only tell tail is during the day with some odd shadows or catching the movement in the corner of my eye, I can not hear it at all. Jools http://www.topcatsail.co.uk |
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