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Marine electronics training
Is there anywhere that has a good marine electronics training program ,
preferably in S Florida that covers the following type of topics Dealing with NMEA strings- I/O setups, hardware, software settings Integrating components from different manufacturers. Setting up repeaters and autopilots Servicing and setting up Radars. "Networking" everything together. I've taken AYBC electrical and NMEA installer certification courses and I'm studying for my GROL and radar endorsement but would like to take a hands on seminar type marine electronics tech course that goes into more depth than a users course. Thanks Dennis |
Marine electronics training
Mcfatter use to have a program but I think it was discontinued, they where
looking into starting it back up. Try NMEA.org and call them to see if they have sponsored another one, otherwise start with a company and learn from the techs. No school like going to a boat and figuring it out yourself. BC |
Marine electronics training
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Marine electronics training
Bruce in Alaska wrote:
These was a course being taught up in Seattle, at one of the Maritime Schools for Marine Electronics Techs. When I lived in that area I did Guest Lectures there. Was on the northeast side of the Ballard Bridge. That program is no longer available but the school offers much more nowadays. http://www.seattlecentral.org/maritime/prog.php I teach the steam classes and have taught the basic marine electricity class in the past. The best education in this field is by DOING, under the supervision of an "Old Time Marine Electronics Tech" who has been in the business for more than 15 years. That just doesn't seem to happen anymore. Rare is the company that will invest in an apprenticeship program of any sort. We used to carry two electricians on ships but the second electrician is a thing of the past now. On those ships which carry an electronics officer that berth is usually filled by a former radio operator. Some of the union schools are excellent but are not available to entry level personnel. My union offers several courses with intensive practical lab and lecture classes which include CET certification but they total many months of classes and are only available to members who already hold unlimited CG licenses and have an academic or practical background in the subject. I wonder where the next generation of techs with a real marine background will come from. I am very curious about what ABYC is selling (for a very high price) when a "graduate" says: "I've taken AYBC electrical and NMEA installer certification courses ... but would like to take a hands on seminar type marine electronics tech course that goes into more depth than a users course." What is that "certification" worth when the holder of the certificate calls the training a "users course"? Rick |
Marine electronics training
"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
... Dennis, I'm very curious about your NMEA course. How do they tell you to hook up non-compliant devices that have one wire for NMEA output and one wire for NMEA input to the balanced NMEA (+) and (-) network? Did anyone talk about why some manufacturers cheap-out like this? I added a page to my website, which explains exactly this: http://www.shipmodul.com/en/connections.html Meindert |
Marine electronics training
Subject: Marine electronics training
From: (Larry W4CSC) Dennis, I'm very curious about your NMEA course. How do they tell you to hook up non-compliant devices that have one wire for NMEA output and one wire for NMEA input to the balanced NMEA (+) and (-) network? Did anyone talk about why some manufacturers cheap-out like this? It was pretty much hardware oriented, wiring, cables, transducers, and mounting. It was the installer certification. Interfacing data outputs wasn't covered. They have a technician certification test that covers what I'm interested in learning but no course for it. I agree that the best place to learn it is on the job but there are few openings for entry level techs. Most companies want to hire someone with 5 yrs experience that has done their mistakes and training at another company. There was a vocational school that started a program down here, McFatter, but they don't have the program anymore. It had an internship with a company as you were training. Dennis |
Marine electronics training
Thanks for the reply. I was wondering how they handled the unstandard
NMEA mess the manufacturers have gotten us all into. An installer course without the interfacing doesn't seem to fulfill a job requirement except cable puller. I got my on-the-job training at: USN Amex Systems Tracor Applied Sciences, Electronic Systems Division EIL Instruments Charleston Naval Shipyard They even paid me!....(c; Wasn't much simple NMEA.....though. On 26 Nov 2003 21:08:04 GMT, pamdump (Den73740) wrote: Subject: Marine electronics training From: (Larry W4CSC) Dennis, I'm very curious about your NMEA course. How do they tell you to hook up non-compliant devices that have one wire for NMEA output and one wire for NMEA input to the balanced NMEA (+) and (-) network? Did anyone talk about why some manufacturers cheap-out like this? It was pretty much hardware oriented, wiring, cables, transducers, and mounting. It was the installer certification. Interfacing data outputs wasn't covered. They have a technician certification test that covers what I'm interested in learning but no course for it. I agree that the best place to learn it is on the job but there are few openings for entry level techs. Most companies want to hire someone with 5 yrs experience that has done their mistakes and training at another company. There was a vocational school that started a program down here, McFatter, but they don't have the program anymore. It had an internship with a company as you were training. Dennis Larry W4CSC NNNN |
Marine electronics training
Subject: Marine electronics training
From: (Larry W4CSC) I got my on-the-job training at: USN Amex Systems Tracor Applied Sciences, Electronic Systems Division EIL Instruments Charleston Naval Shipyard They even paid me!....(c; I learned a lot working for NOAA, I was an oceanographic tech for 25 years and spent a lot of time hooking up instruments to a shipboard scientific computer system that started out with DEC/VAX and over the years evolved into Win 2000. There was a lot of trial and error. I was hoping there was some school that could give me a good background in setting up and interfacing all these different manufacturers of boating electronics equipment, satellite gear setup, and GMDSS maintainer. I'm still getting paid, just not as much :} Dennis |
Marine electronics training
On 27 Nov 2003 03:10:51 GMT, pamdump (Den73740)
wrote: I learned a lot working for NOAA, I was an oceanographic tech for 25 years and spent a lot of time hooking up instruments to a shipboard scientific computer system that started out with DEC/VAX and over the years evolved into Win 2000. There was a lot of trial and error. Great job. While I worked for Tracor, the marine division brought their SEACON sea construction barge into St Julien's Creek Annex, the old Navy ammo dump, in Norfolk. Electronics Systems Division installed an extensive alarm system for fire/flood/intrusion aboard her, even with a 250W paging transmitter with antenna atop the mast to alarm crew that was ashore in Diego Garcia resort island she was headed for. Your DEC/VAX reminded me of her station keeping system which had a PDP-8 mini tending 4 sonar pingers shot into the bottom over her work site. It was tape programmed, as I remembered. The barge had the queerest propulsion system I ever saw consisting of three diesel engines driving hydraulic pumps which, in turn, drove "egg beaters" that rotated, two under her stern and one under her bow to keep her going up to 6 knots in ANY direction. Most impressive when we took her out for a little sea trial/company party before she left. Wonder where she is now?....(c; I was hoping there was some school that could give me a good background in setting up and interfacing all these different manufacturers of boating electronics equipment, satellite gear setup, and GMDSS maintainer. I got an FCC 1st Phone with RADAR endorsement way back when you had to WRITE the test to the satisfaction of the FCC engineer giving it to you. The last one is still in its nice frame over my desk. The GROL, a meaningless piece of paper they give away to almost anyone capable of memorizing the test questions they also give away, is stashed in a drawer to hide it. I took the GMDSS operator and GMDSS maintainer tests this year. I found the tests, as with all new FCC tests, a simple matter of rote memorizing stupid questions about subjects and regulations you would LOOK UP, not memorize, in the real world. It's almost as if they're afraid not enough poorly educated public school students, unskilled in math and science today, couldn't pass them. So, they make it a terms and symantics test..... I passed so now I can work on the same marine crap I've been working on but now with GMDSS aboard. A volunteer examiner, who used to be one of the most illegal CBers in South Carolina, administered the test. You can download the test question bank from the FCC website: http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/dm.html That'll hook you to the maintainer's license. Click on the operator's license on the left panel to go over there. Good luck with the tests. It's not rocket science. I'm still getting paid, just not as much :} I get paid, occasionally, doing mostly installations and networking it all together after someone has screwed it all up. For my boater friends, of course, I don't. I get to go to sea with them.....which, to me, is worth far more. I've just helped an English friend restore and fit out an '85 Amel Sharki 41 ketch with all the electronic toys. Plans are to leave in March for the Bahamas and stay, arriving in Daytona Beach for the race from there to Charleston, our home port, on May 25th. Then, we plan on doing the Charleston to Bermuda race. From Bermuda, things get a little muddy. He just retired from a very profitable job where he still is depended on for consulting work. He keeps talking about sailing from Bermuda to England and home over the Summer before returning to Charleston in the Fall. I may just close my business if that happens. I'm semi-retired, myself, but not financially secure like he is. We've really enjoyed working together on "Lionheart" since last August.....(c; He refers to me as his "Chief Engineer".... Larry W4CSC NNNN |
Marine electronics training
Larry:
I've watched your posts for awhile now and suspected that you had a story to tell. Thanks for the background candor. We now know who to bug :) Dan "Larry W4CSC" wrote in message ... On 27 Nov 2003 03:10:51 GMT, pamdump (Den73740) wrote: I learned a lot working for NOAA, I was an oceanographic tech for 25 years and spent a lot of time hooking up instruments to a shipboard scientific computer system that started out with DEC/VAX and over the years evolved into Win 2000. There was a lot of trial and error. Great job. While I worked for Tracor, the marine division brought their SEACON sea construction barge into St Julien's Creek Annex, the old Navy ammo dump, in Norfolk. Electronics Systems Division installed an extensive alarm system for fire/flood/intrusion aboard her, even with a 250W paging transmitter with antenna atop the mast to alarm crew that was ashore in Diego Garcia resort island she was headed for. Your DEC/VAX reminded me of her station keeping system which had a PDP-8 mini tending 4 sonar pingers shot into the bottom over her work site. It was tape programmed, as I remembered. The barge had the queerest propulsion system I ever saw consisting of three diesel engines driving hydraulic pumps which, in turn, drove "egg beaters" that rotated, two under her stern and one under her bow to keep her going up to 6 knots in ANY direction. Most impressive when we took her out for a little sea trial/company party before she left. Wonder where she is now?....(c; I was hoping there was some school that could give me a good background in setting up and interfacing all these different manufacturers of boating electronics equipment, satellite gear setup, and GMDSS maintainer. I got an FCC 1st Phone with RADAR endorsement way back when you had to WRITE the test to the satisfaction of the FCC engineer giving it to you. The last one is still in its nice frame over my desk. The GROL, a meaningless piece of paper they give away to almost anyone capable of memorizing the test questions they also give away, is stashed in a drawer to hide it. I took the GMDSS operator and GMDSS maintainer tests this year. I found the tests, as with all new FCC tests, a simple matter of rote memorizing stupid questions about subjects and regulations you would LOOK UP, not memorize, in the real world. It's almost as if they're afraid not enough poorly educated public school students, unskilled in math and science today, couldn't pass them. So, they make it a terms and symantics test..... I passed so now I can work on the same marine crap I've been working on but now with GMDSS aboard. A volunteer examiner, who used to be one of the most illegal CBers in South Carolina, administered the test. You can download the test question bank from the FCC website: http://wireless.fcc.gov/commoperators/dm.html That'll hook you to the maintainer's license. Click on the operator's license on the left panel to go over there. Good luck with the tests. It's not rocket science. I'm still getting paid, just not as much :} I get paid, occasionally, doing mostly installations and networking it all together after someone has screwed it all up. For my boater friends, of course, I don't. I get to go to sea with them.....which, to me, is worth far more. I've just helped an English friend restore and fit out an '85 Amel Sharki 41 ketch with all the electronic toys. Plans are to leave in March for the Bahamas and stay, arriving in Daytona Beach for the race from there to Charleston, our home port, on May 25th. Then, we plan on doing the Charleston to Bermuda race. From Bermuda, things get a little muddy. He just retired from a very profitable job where he still is depended on for consulting work. He keeps talking about sailing from Bermuda to England and home over the Summer before returning to Charleston in the Fall. I may just close my business if that happens. I'm semi-retired, myself, but not financially secure like he is. We've really enjoyed working together on "Lionheart" since last August.....(c; He refers to me as his "Chief Engineer".... Larry W4CSC NNNN |
Marine electronics training
Larry W4CSC wrote:
Your DEC/VAX reminded me of her station keeping system which had a PDP-8 mini tending 4 sonar pingers shot into the bottom over her work site. It was tape programmed, as I remembered. Instant flashback! In the late 70's we used a PDP-8 for submersible tracking by laying an acoustic transponder array, calibrating its position in UTM's and then tracking another acoustic transponder mounted on the vehicle. The runs were recorded in real time on a pen plotter. The PDP was tape programmed. Remember the nightmare of dropping a roll on the deck? We used to make corrections and enter new parameters by using the front panel switches which took hours sometimes. Incredibly primitive by today's standards but that system replaced a Decca unit, Omega, a surveyor and hours of post processing. Rick |
Marine electronics training
On Thu, 27 Nov 2003 17:08:42 GMT, Rick
wrote: Larry W4CSC wrote: Your DEC/VAX reminded me of her station keeping system which had a PDP-8 mini tending 4 sonar pingers shot into the bottom over her work site. It was tape programmed, as I remembered. Instant flashback! In the late 70's we used a PDP-8 for submersible tracking by laying an acoustic transponder array, calibrating its position in UTM's and then tracking another acoustic transponder mounted on the vehicle. The runs were recorded in real time on a pen plotter. That's about how SEACON station keeping worked. When the current dragged the barge off the center of the pinger, the sensor array noticed the pinger drifting and the PDP-8 moved the constantly-running propulsion controls so it would remain over the target pinger until its battery went dead, when they shot down another pinger. The barge had a huge crane on an elevated track along port and starboard gunwales that went from the stern to the stack, even over this big "garage" with an aft-facing rollup door. The deck inside the garage and aft towards the stern could be removed by the crane so divers and equipment could be lowered straight down into the abyss, keeping the waves off it and allowing large loads to be lowered from the deck without listing the barge. It was a beautiful arrangement. Her only problem was she went 6 knots, in any direction, but only 6 knots wide open. They towed her to her work location with a long line and seagoing tugboat so she'd arrive before everyone on board retired...(c; It's quite a sight to see her turn perfectly on her central vertical axis, without the current pulling her away in the process. The old PDP-8 did a good job, I suppose. That was about 1980ish. Wonder where she is now? The PDP was tape programmed. Remember the nightmare of dropping a roll on the deck? We used to make corrections and enter new parameters by using the front panel switches which took hours sometimes. Incredibly primitive by today's standards but that system replaced a Decca unit, Omega, a surveyor and hours of post processing. Rick Larry W4CSC NNNN |
Marine electronics training
Larry W4CSC wrote:
It's quite a sight to see her turn perfectly on her central vertical axis, without the current pulling her away in the process. The old PDP-8 did a good job, I suppose. Spent quite a bit of time on a dynamically positioned drillship in the Med and West Africa and off Labrador. It used a Honeywell DP system to maintain position over a wellhead more than 5000 feet below. The system used acoustic transponders and a "riser angle" input to control the ships screws and 4 retractable thrusters and could maintain position within about a 50 feet circle in Winter open ocean conditions between Labrador and Greenland. It was an amazing system for its time. The DP operator could bypass the computers and use a joystick and a polar display to move the ship manually. This was used whenever we reentered the drill hole during initial drilling ops. I was a submersible pilot we and would sit on the bottom (down to 5800 feet) and visually direct the DP operator to move Xx feet XXX degrees and then DROP when the drill bit was located above the guidebase. Rick |
Marine electronics training
There's some amazing technology out there. Thanks for the post!
On Sat, 29 Nov 2003 04:15:38 GMT, Rick wrote: Larry W4CSC wrote: It's quite a sight to see her turn perfectly on her central vertical axis, without the current pulling her away in the process. The old PDP-8 did a good job, I suppose. Spent quite a bit of time on a dynamically positioned drillship in the Med and West Africa and off Labrador. It used a Honeywell DP system to maintain position over a wellhead more than 5000 feet below. The system used acoustic transponders and a "riser angle" input to control the ships screws and 4 retractable thrusters and could maintain position within about a 50 feet circle in Winter open ocean conditions between Labrador and Greenland. It was an amazing system for its time. The DP operator could bypass the computers and use a joystick and a polar display to move the ship manually. This was used whenever we reentered the drill hole during initial drilling ops. I was a submersible pilot we and would sit on the bottom (down to 5800 feet) and visually direct the DP operator to move Xx feet XXX degrees and then DROP when the drill bit was located above the guidebase. Rick Larry W4CSC NNNN |
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