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LED Interference
Good info on the retroactive part. You can't do that for FCC.
FWIW the CFR is he http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text...6:1.0.1.3.17.2 or http://tinyurl.com/ypv4ld. A mariner can not certify a light as USCG approved at any time but a non USCG approved light may be in compliance with COLREGS. -- Tom. |
LED Interference
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LED Interference
On Tue, 1 Apr 2008 06:08:14 -0400, in message
"Roger Long" wrote: wrote The USCG doesn't test devices and approve them. They publish standards, and a laboratory tests your product and charges you a fee to attest that it meets the standards. If you have an unapproved device and it becomes an issue in court, you can still retroactively have the device examined and declared compliant. Yes, but in the US legal system, the issue is not whether you are right or wrong but whether you can afford to prove it. When that guy who Teeboned you on the port side claims it was because he couldn't see your red nav light, how much do you think it's going to cost to prove it's compliance with his lawyer obstructing, questioning, and protesting every step of the process? One morning last summer, just towards dawn, I was very puzzled by a green light that seemed to moving in the wrong direction. As it got a little lighter I could make out the hull and passed fairly close astern, giving way as a port tack boat should. I was able to read the name off the transom and radioed to ask why they were showing green on the port side... Attention to detail is important ;-) Ryk |
LED Interference
In article ,
"Roger Long" wrote: I'm thinking the Aqua Signal stern lights might actually make good spreader lights. You may want to have a look at these: http://www.hellamarine.com/ specifically deck light http://www.hellamarine.com/?a=3&t=3&...D=690&pcid=170 navigation lights http://www.hellamarine.com/default.a...tory&newsID=41 HTH Marc -- remove bye and from mercial to get valid e-mail http://www.heusser.com |
LED Interference
On Apr 1, 12:26 am, wrote:
Nowhere in that link is there anything that says I can't declare my lights to be USCG compliant. I'm not sure how constructive this is, but I'm trying to make the distinction between USCG approved (which involves a lab test and a submission to the CG and is done by OEMs or importers) and COLREGS legal which means it meets rule 22. It is easy to install a USCG approved light in a non COLREGS compliant way (I see it all the time). Too, USCG approval is not a requirement under COLREGS as such. As I said right from the start of this I don't know what the implications for any given boater might be for carrying non USCG approved lights. I suspect the most common problem might be convincing a surveyor to pass an unstamped light. In any event, since the OP was looking to change the bulb in his lamp I wanted him to be aware that doing so will invalidate the USCG approval of the lamp. I presume he is sailing on an uninspected vessel so it may well be perfectly legal for him to go with LED bulbs but he might be unhappy if his surveyor insists that he remove them in order to get insurance. --Tom. |
LED Interference
wrote in message
... On Apr 1, 12:26 am, wrote: Nowhere in that link is there anything that says I can't declare my lights to be USCG compliant. I'm not sure how constructive this is, but I'm trying to make the distinction between USCG approved (which involves a lab test and a submission to the CG and is done by OEMs or importers) and COLREGS legal which means it meets rule 22. It is easy to install a USCG approved light in a non COLREGS compliant way (I see it all the time). Too, USCG approval is not a requirement under COLREGS as such. As I said right from the start of this I don't know what the implications for any given boater might be for carrying non USCG approved lights. I suspect the most common problem might be convincing a surveyor to pass an unstamped light. In any event, since the OP was looking to change the bulb in his lamp I wanted him to be aware that doing so will invalidate the USCG approval of the lamp. I presume he is sailing on an uninspected vessel so it may well be perfectly legal for him to go with LED bulbs but he might be unhappy if his surveyor insists that he remove them in order to get insurance. --Tom. I would be kind of amazed if a surveyor did anything more than flip the lights switches on and off. No way s/he could tell if a bulb was approved or not without physically inspecting it.. certainly no way during the day. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
LED Interference
On Apr 1, 8:07 am, "Capt. JG" wrote:
No way s/he could tell if a bulb was approved or not without physically inspecting it.. certainly no way during the day. A cluster of LEDs inside a normally incandescent lamp might be a clue. -- Tom. |
LED Interference
wrote in message
... On Apr 1, 8:07 am, "Capt. JG" wrote: No way s/he could tell if a bulb was approved or not without physically inspecting it.. certainly no way during the day. A cluster of LEDs inside a normally incandescent lamp might be a clue. -- Tom. Might be, might not be... at the masthead? without taking off the lens on the bowlights? And, then s/he would have to know if the particular fixture is USCG approved. Without a close inspection, that might not be so easy. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
LED Interference
On Apr 1, 8:45 am, "Capt. JG" wrote:
Might be, might not be... at the masthead? without taking off the lens on the bowlights? And, then s/he would have to know if the particular fixture is USCG approved. Without a close inspection, that might not be so easy. Unless the lenses on your lights are badly fogged you can see the bulbs through them clearly in the day in the lit and unlit states. LED clusters also have distinctive bright spots when lit. I don't have a clue if any particular surveyor would refuse to pass leds in an incandescent lamp but if he doesn't even notice them he's incompetent. Since the surveyor is not going to be able to insure that the lamps are compliant with 22 by testing he could reasonably insist on a USCG approved fixture. The CFR is specific: fixtures are approved with the supplied bulb only. Putting in a different kind of bulb makes them not USCG approved (that's different from not legal as running lights under COLREGS). AFIK, the whole point of having USCG approved fixtures is so end users and interested parties can be assured that a lamp meets Annex I without testing the color, luminosity and so on. As soon as you modify the lamp all bets are off. There aren't all that many USCG approved fixtures out there. Surveyors will be familiar with the common ones and should closely inspect any they don't recognize. -- Tom. |
LED Interference
wrote in message
... On Apr 1, 8:45 am, "Capt. JG" wrote: Might be, might not be... at the masthead? without taking off the lens on the bowlights? And, then s/he would have to know if the particular fixture is USCG approved. Without a close inspection, that might not be so easy. Unless the lenses on your lights are badly fogged you can see the bulbs through them clearly in the day in the lit and unlit states. LED clusters also have distinctive bright spots when lit. I don't have a clue if any particular surveyor would refuse to pass leds in an incandescent lamp but if he doesn't even notice them he's incompetent. Since the surveyor is not going to be able to insure that the lamps are compliant with 22 by testing he could reasonably insist on a USCG approved fixture. The CFR is specific: fixtures are approved with the supplied bulb only. Putting in a different kind of bulb makes them not USCG approved (that's different from not legal as running lights under COLREGS). AFIK, the whole point of having USCG approved fixtures is so end users and interested parties can be assured that a lamp meets Annex I without testing the color, luminosity and so on. As soon as you modify the lamp all bets are off. There aren't all that many USCG approved fixtures out there. Surveyors will be familiar with the common ones and should closely inspect any they don't recognize. -- Tom. Hmm.. well, I can't tell during the day when the bowlight is unlit, as least I don't recall being able to tell. I looked at the hi-res images of the following, but next time I'm at the boat, I'll look again. Isn't the point whether or not the lights are visible from the prescribed distance? And, this would be at night of course. So, it seems to me that if you're involved in a collision at night, and you could show that no matter what you had was in fact visible, does the CG care that they're "approved?" I don't know the answer... just wondering. http://picasaweb.google.com/SailNOW....49198843692818 http://picasaweb.google.com/SailNOW....18970863861506 -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
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