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Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Feb 21, 6:46*pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote: : Whered ya learn dat stuff???? : Rhetor Bob University of Missouri School of Journalism circa 1969. *One chooses, then one does. Wilbur Hubbard Your accademic preperation is obvious! Its a difficult task to integrate persuasive patterns in a casual conversation. Good on for you !! Bob |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
I started a thread in alt sailing asa but thought it might get a more measured response here. So this is my question. Joe and his Red Cloud v. Skip and his Pig Which do you think is or will make the BEST captain??? Bob |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
"Bob" wrote in message
... I started a thread in alt sailing asa but thought it might get a more measured response here. So this is my question. Joe and his Red Cloud v. Skip and his Pig Which do you think is or will make the BEST captain??? Bob There's no way to compare the two... both are/were out there doing it. Both learn from their mistakes and are honest about their experiences. I am limited to the SF bay and environs most of the time, due to work. I envy them both. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
Capt. JG wrote:
"Bob" wrote in message ... I started a thread in alt sailing asa but thought it might get a more measured response here. So this is my question. Joe and his Red Cloud v. Skip and his Pig Which do you think is or will make the BEST captain??? Bob There's no way to compare the two... both are/were out there doing it. Both learn from their mistakes and are honest about their experiences. I am limited to the SF bay and environs most of the time, due to work. I envy them both. I'll agree with all of that. I admire both and am grateful that they are willing to talk about these things in public. Guts. |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On 2008-02-22 12:28:24 -0500, Bob said:
So this is my question. Joe and his Red Cloud v. Skip and his Pig Which do you think is or will make the BEST captain??? Oh, GAWD, they are so different. But they are out there and doing it. They're better captains than many/most on this list. And I include myself in "many/most", since Pat and I are primarily weekend warriors. -- Jere Lull Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
Jere Lull wrote:
But they are out there and doing it. They're better captains than many/most on this list. What I don't understand is why a small number of posters in this NG feel a need to fling mud at Joe. DSK |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Feb 22, 10:52 pm, wrote:
Jere Lull wrote: But they are out there and doing it. They're better captains than many/most on this list. What I don't understand is why a small number of posters in this NG feel a need to fling mud at Joe. DSK Hi, Doug, and group, I literally laughed out loud at that. Joe's a latecomer. I'm considering losing weight, encasing the mud I've accumulated over the years in epoxy, wriggling out of the resultant shell, and putting it overboard for a mooring :{)) **** (well, mud, if you prefer), folks were taking potshots at me from the time we even started exploring the concept of a boat, as Jere and Rosalie will recall, nearly, or over, I'm not positive which, 10 years ago. That's partly where the boat name came from - at every stage, it was, "Yeah, right, you'll never (insert define, find, buy, refit, sail, cruise, repair, passagemake) any boat!" :{)) It was bad enough that I had the temerity, in one of my more depressed moments, having just fulfilled one of those requirements, to cut and paste one of the prior feces-laden posts and gave a raspberry :{)) Today, I usually don't bother pointing out the obvious, other than to pull Wilbur's chain occasionally. As I used to say in another group, long ago, y'all have fun; I'm accustomed to the flames and have a crispy crust, so don't notice more of them. Once in a while, I invite my fellow roastees up on the barbie with me :{)) Today, it's going to be another hot one in the Miami area, so I'll dive my hull after we get the holding tank emptied, in prep for our passage to Fernandina Beach, where we'll put the boat on the ground for a while. The hot will allow me to come up cold but feel good in the sun... L8R Skip Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog "You are never given a wish without also being given the power to make it come true. You may have to work for it however." (and) "There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in its hands. You seek problems because you need their gifts." (Richard Bach, in The Reluctant Messiah) |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Feb 23, 4:30*am, Skip Gundlach wrote:
Hi Skip, My vote is that you are the better captain simply because you seem to be a person who ****s up.... evaluates... and moves on. But most important acknoldges the fact you dont know it all and seeks information. In joes case he belives himself an"experinced captain" and becomes defensive when questioned. On the other hand you do not. While you lack experince that is easy to aqire. In joes case he has expience but can not seek alterniatives... hes a one act pony. You take me as a "life long learner" a prerequist for future sucess. Keep on taking these ICW voyages and when you can do that blind folded with no crew.... then it youll be ready for step two... coast wise voyages... steps three and four are best consider much later. Bob |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Feb 24, 8:05 am, wrote:
On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 17:47:58 -0800 (PST), Bob wrote: On Feb 23, 4:30 am, Skip Gundlach wrote: Getting a twofer here, thanks to SD's top posting saving me the effort of combining them: ' Skip has a habit of ignoring advice and repeating mistakes. He recently mentioned that once again, he left Lydia on watch and she became distracted and forgot her duties. The first time she did that, they wrecked the boat. This time she was so busy chatting she forgot to keep track of where she was and overshot her destination by quite a bit. Fortunately this time, there were no rocks involved. I wonder how many other times she has "wandered" while left on watch. She may be a brilliant and capable person in other regards, but it does not seem she has the neccessary focus needed to stand a watch on a sailboat by herself. How many times must she prove this for Skip to "get it" and do whatever he has to do to address the problem? And, you, apparently, have a habit of seeking out any potential negative. If you've read the entire series, you see - and yet choose to impute that dereliction of duty reigned - that the assembled were not asleep at the wheel, but actively engaged in enjoying a marvelous sail, and electing to go beyond the prior shift's (which would include me) unilateral decision for a turning point. If I'd been awake and at the helm at the time, I too might have been reluctant to give up on the sailing quite so quickly. NOAA has let us down so often that I tend to grab whatever opportunities present themselves, such as our intentional overshoot of the Miami channel on the way back in from Rodriguez, just as a case in point. In joes case he belives himself an"experinced captain" and becomes defensive when questioned. On the other hand you do not. While you lack experince that is easy to aqire. In joes case he has expience but can not seek alterniatives... hes a one act pony. You take me as a "life long learner" a prerequist for future sucess. Keep on taking these ICW voyages and when you can do that blind folded with no crew.... then it youll be ready for step two... coast wise voyages... steps three and four are best consider much later. Bob Eek! Our initial leg, ~700 miles, back in July, and the various multi- hundred mile "coastwise voyages" legs later, and our upcoming 300 mile leg offshore/coastal, just before a some thousand-plus (FL-Maine) leg when we set out, obviously are ill-advised, as I am reluctant to go anywhere blindfolded, being so dependent on eyeball V1.0 and chart Vx.? along with, in weather suited to it, double computer backups :{)) - so I'll never get the requisite experience to proceed :{)) Meanwhile, as above to all those so inclined, I'm diving again today and expect the mud and slime will brush right off. Oh. Yes, the hull, too :{)) - except for the bottom of the keel, already polished from our bumping a few times on the way back from our holding tank pumping and fuel tank filling yesterday as the tide was nearly out. L8R Love from Skip the ****up and Lydia the inattentive :{)) Morgan 461 #2 SV Flying Pig KI4MPC See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery ! Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog "You are never given a wish without also being given the power to make it come true. You may have to work for it however." (and) "There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in its hands. You seek problems because you need their gifts." (Richard Bach, in The Reluctant Messiah) |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 07:13:08 -0800 (PST), Skip Gundlach
wrote: Meanwhile, as above to all those so inclined, I'm diving again today and expect the mud and slime will brush right off. Oh. Yes, the hull, too :{)) - except for the bottom of the keel, already polished from our bumping a few times on the way back from our holding tank pumping and fuel tank filling yesterday as the tide was nearly out. For whatever strange reasons the mind has, the above was evocative of your progress since the St. Pete prep days on the hard. Sweating of full of doubts. That seems like yesterday, and here you are today, casually and confidently diving to inspect your vessel. Good God man, you have changed! As an aside, I wonder how many here do frequent inspections of the hull. I suspect most don't see it except at haul outs. --Vic |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
Vic Smith wrote:
On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 07:13:08 -0800 (PST), Skip Gundlach wrote: Meanwhile, as above to all those so inclined, I'm diving again today and expect the mud and slime will brush right off. Oh. Yes, the hull, too :{)) - except for the bottom of the keel, already polished from our bumping a few times on the way back from our holding tank pumping and fuel tank filling yesterday as the tide was nearly out. For whatever strange reasons the mind has, the above was evocative of your progress since the St. Pete prep days on the hard. Sweating of full of doubts. That seems like yesterday, and here you are today, casually and confidently diving to inspect your vessel. Good God man, you have changed! As an aside, I wonder how many here do frequent inspections of the hull. I suspect most don't see it except at haul outs. I've done it several times, but not often in the Chesapeake because most places I couldn't see anything.. Once in the fall when the water in the river was pretty clear and it wasn't too cold and it was sunny, we went and anchored over a sand bottom (reflects light) and I went down and scraped the barnacles off the prop, and I've also been down at in Indian Creek (Virginia) to see why the depth sounder wasn't working (turned out to be a combination of barnacles and a bad connection inside the boat). Come to think of it I've also gone down briefly in other rivers or coves - but not in the Bay itself. And I've been in the water with a snorkel at Sombrero Key, Key West and the Dry Tortugas in order to see how the bottom, prop and zincs were faring. And of course sometimes I've gone down to see what the anchor was doing. Bob has scrubbed stuff off the waterline from the dinghy sometimes. |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 09:55:32 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote: As an aside, I wonder how many here do frequent inspections of the hull. I suspect most don't see it except at haul outs. And you would be wrong. Even trawler folk get their bottoms cleaned regularly and their zincs inspected / changed - either by themselves or a professional diver. |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On 2008-02-24 19:51:18 -0500, Wayne.B said:
On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 09:55:32 -0600, Vic Smith wrote: As an aside, I wonder how many here do frequent inspections of the hull. I suspect most don't see it except at haul outs. And you would be wrong. Even trawler folk get their bottoms cleaned regularly and their zincs inspected / changed - either by themselves or a professional diver. "*might* be wrong" would be a proper statement. I'm pretty obsessive about some things, but on the Chesapeake, diving on the hull is a lost cause; the water's too dark. I feel around and sometimes scrape the prop & shaft, but know I won't be able to inspect anything under the waterline by eyeball. -- Jere Lull Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 05:23:56 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:
"*might* be wrong" would be a proper statement. I'm pretty obsessive about some things, but on the Chesapeake, diving on the hull is a lost cause; the water's too dark. I feel around and sometimes scrape the prop & shaft, but know I won't be able to inspect anything under the waterline by eyeball. The serious racers out of Annapolis must find some way to keep their bottoms spotlessly clean. I guarantee it. You just can not race competetively with *any* marine growth on the bottom or foils. |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
Wayne.B wrote:
On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 05:23:56 GMT, Jere Lull wrote: "*might* be wrong" would be a proper statement. I'm pretty obsessive about some things, but on the Chesapeake, diving on the hull is a lost cause; the water's too dark. I feel around and sometimes scrape the prop & shaft, but know I won't be able to inspect anything under the waterline by eyeball. The serious racers out of Annapolis must find some way to keep their bottoms spotlessly clean. I guarantee it. You just can not race competetively with *any* marine growth on the bottom or foils. IN the Chesapeake in the summer - no chance. In the fresh water tributaries - depends. If you have a time when there's not a lot of sediment coming down the river (so no recent hard rains upstream) AND you have good sunlight reflecting off a sand bottom, then there's pretty good visibility. Otherwise - you need to know Braille. Also you need to wear a dive skin or the like because of jellyfish. Serious racers depends on the size of the boat I guess. Most boats I've seen racing on inland waters look to me to be trailerable size. |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
Rosalie B. wrote:
Also you need to wear a dive skin or the like because of jellyfish. How far north on the Bay are people seeing nettles just now (I mean in season, of course)? Used to be that in the northern Bay we could swim and not worry. I plan to hang out on the Bay a bit this summer and want to get an idea of the problem. Reason I mention this is that we are seeing nettles in Barnegat that we once never even had to think about. -- Good luck and good sailing. s/v Kerry Deare of Barnegat http://home.comcast.net/~kerrydeare |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On 2008-02-25 11:23:51 -0500, "Armond Perretta"
said: Rosalie B. wrote: Also you need to wear a dive skin or the like because of jellyfish. How far north on the Bay are people seeing nettles just now (I mean in season, of course)? Used to be that in the northern Bay we could swim and not worry. I plan to hang out on the Bay a bit this summer and want to get an idea of the problem. Reason I mention this is that we are seeing nettles in Barnegat that we once never even had to think about. I encountered a swarm of them in Nabb's Creek (just south of Baltimore) a few years ago. I wasn't wearing my glasses when I went for a swim, and didn't even SEE them until I had already dived (Dove?) into the water in the midst of them! I had one miserable time afterward! Ruby |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
Ruby Vee wrote:
On 2008-02-25 11:23:51 -0500, "Armond Perretta" said: Rosalie B. wrote: Also you need to wear a dive skin or the like because of jellyfish. How far north on the Bay are people seeing nettles just now (I mean in season, of course)? Used to be that in the northern Bay we could swim and not worry. I plan to hang out on the Bay a bit this summer and want to get an idea of the problem. Reason I mention this is that we are seeing nettles in Barnegat that we once never even had to think about. I encountered a swarm of them in Nabb's Creek (just south of Baltimore) a few years ago. I wasn't wearing my glasses when I went for a swim, and didn't even SEE them until I had already dived (Dove?) into the water in the midst of them! I had one miserable time afterward! I don't know how far north, but we see them basically year round in our marina off the Potomac. |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On 2008-02-25 11:23:51 -0500, "Armond Perretta"
said: Rosalie B. wrote: Also you need to wear a dive skin or the like because of jellyfish. How far north on the Bay are people seeing nettles just now (I mean in season, of course)? Used to be that in the northern Bay we could swim and not worry. I plan to hang out on the Bay a bit this summer and want to get an idea of the problem. Reason I mention this is that we are seeing nettles in Barnegat that we once never even had to think about. They fairly regularly get up to the Wye by mid-June, Chester River by July/August. One year saw a mess on the Bush River (above Poole's Island). Also saw a mating pair or two of the mantas or rays (Bull-nose?) on the Bush that weekend. Somewhere around the web is a nettle predictor for the Bay that's not too far off. I just sent off a message to the list I believe found it for me. As I recall, there's a fairly narrow range of temperature and salinity they prefer so some times the mid-Bay has more than the southern Bay. -- Jere Lull Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:10:49 -0500, Rosalie B.
wrote: Most boats I've seen racing on inland waters look to me to be trailerable size. The class A scows are 38 ft long, but narrow. Casady |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
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Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 16:19:59 -0500, Rosalie B.
wrote: (Richard Casady) wrote: On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:10:49 -0500, Rosalie B. wrote: Most boats I've seen racing on inland waters look to me to be trailerable size. The class A scows are 38 ft long, but narrow. One example doesn't invalidate the premise which is that most inland water racing sailboats are small enough to be taken out of the water to have their bottoms cleaned. My point was all, not just most ,inland racers,even the biggest A scows can easily hauled out. Little winch on a trailer. I didn.t make myself clear. A scows are trailered to whatever lake has the races that weekend. They put the rig up and down every weekend the boat is used. Casady |
Skip v. Joe: Who is the best captain?
(Richard Casady) wrote:
On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 16:19:59 -0500, Rosalie B. wrote: (Richard Casady) wrote: On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:10:49 -0500, Rosalie B. wrote: Most boats I've seen racing on inland waters look to me to be trailerable size. The class A scows are 38 ft long, but narrow. One example doesn't invalidate the premise which is that most inland water racing sailboats are small enough to be taken out of the water to have their bottoms cleaned. My point was all, not just most ,inland racers,even the biggest A scows can easily hauled out. Little winch on a trailer. I didn.t make myself clear. A scows are trailered to whatever lake has the races that weekend. They put the rig up and down every weekend the boat is used. OK - I thought you meant the opposite. I don't think this is true of all race boats - we have the Governor's Cup which goes from Annapolis (the current capitol of MD) to St. Mary's City which was the former capitol. It's a fairly long race down the Chesapeake, and around into the Potomac and up the St. Mary's River - starts Friday night, and the boats have to be finished by Saturday morning. So there are some pretty big boats involved. But it's not a one class race. Probably some non-trailerable types in there. grandma Rosalie S/V RosalieAnn, Leonardtown, MD CSY 44 WO #156 http://home.mindspring.com/~gmbeasley/id1.html |
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