Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Fri, 14 Dec 2007 23:43:01 -0800, ray lunder
wrote:

Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what?

You need to form a corporation in a tax friendly country and register
the boat to the company. You will be required to obtain cruising
permits to use the boat in the US, follow all US regulations
pertaining to foreign registry yachts, as well as paying fees to
maintain your offshore entity. The break even point is somewhere
north of $1M for most boats.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Delaware Corp.


"ray lunder" wrote in message
...
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

As I understand it, even if you have out of state registration, if you stay
in specific waters longer than (30-90 days), you will be required to pay the
state duties. Typically the harbor masters continually watch for this kind
of use abuse. This is true even if you have foreign registration. Even
worse, with foreign registration, you will be required to exit the country
and make to a foreign port after typically 90 days. If you find a way around
these rules, please let us know. I'm in the same boat. (So to speak)
Steve

"ray lunder" wrote in message
...
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

This may not help you, but it may help others.

Here in the northeast, I live in MA (5% sales tax). I purchased a
boat from a dealer in CT (6%). I keep the boat in RI (NO SALES TAX on
boat purchases).

After extensively researching the legal twists to be sure that my plan
was sound, I formed a personal corporation in Delaware. This costs me
about $150 each year for corporation tax and a registration fee.

My dealer wrote the bill of sale to my Delaware corporation and filed
the necessary forms with CT to exempt me from paying sales tax. This
required that the boat be delivered to me outside of CT, so the
delivery was done 15nm away from the dealer in RI.

Now my own state, MA, would want to be paid the sales tax on this boat
that I bought in another state (CT) just because they feel deserving I
guess. Since I keep the vessel in RI, they can't collect. However if
I were to spend 60 days or more in MA waters, they would demand
payment. The same is true for CT- if I were to spend more than 60
days, CT would want to be paid. I think the number is 60 days, but it
might be 90- I'm not completely sure.

Now RI knows where their bread is buttered. RI does have a sales tax
of 6%, but they exempt this tax on all boat sales. This includes all
equipment, outboards, etc. purchased with the boat. I think the only
requirement is that the boat be kept in RI waters for 2 years.

Now RI isn't dumb. They have created a tax-friendly environment where
boaters get a break on a purchase but then pay taxes directly or
indirectly on boating supplies, meals in restaurants, and in general
contribute to the economic health of the state. Well, it works. I've
kept my boat in RI for 10 years, and have no intention of ever moving
to one of the money grubbing states.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Steve ,, take Portsmouth, NH. One side of the river is NH, the other is
Maine.

So,, you get in the boat and go 100 yards ..

That takes care of the "stay in specific waters" problem.

PS.. just one more reason to leave the USA. The country I once knew ..? It
does not exist.

In my humble, dumb, simple, opinion..

The USA can kiss my oversized, ASS.

Hear that George .. Go F..k yourself ,, you phony.


And take the fat lesbian, Hilary with you..

And all the other morons who are standing on street corners trying to get my
vote.

I am wearing out my middle finger telling the likes of Edwards, Obama, the
right wing, the left wing, the nut cases ..


Remember that song.. Take this jog and shove it..

Well, that is what I say to the USA..

Take this Country and Shove It.

==========================
"Steve Lusardi" wrote in message
...
As I understand it, even if you have out of state registration, if you
stay in specific waters longer than (30-90 days), you will be required to
pay the state duties. Typically the harbor masters continually watch for
this kind of use abuse. This is true even if you have foreign
registration. Even worse, with foreign registration, you will be required
to exit the country and make to a foreign port after typically 90 days. If
you find a way around these rules, please let us know. I'm in the same
boat. (So to speak)
Steve

"ray lunder" wrote in message
...
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

ray lunder wrote:
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

I just went through this in Pt Angeles Wa. They determined the value
by going to Yachtworld and Boattrader and based the value on the lowest
price they could find for the same boat and comparable year.
As for who checks the boats in the marina, here, the state has people
who walk the marinas looking at the boats for stickers. They don't do it
often in Pt Angeles as witnessed by the number of boats with tags 2 or 3
years out of date.
Gordon

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

The USA can kiss my oversized, ASS.

Hear that George .. Go F..k yourself ,, you phony.


And take the fat lesbian, Hilary with you..

And all the other morons who are standing on street corners trying to get my
vote.

I am wearing out my middle finger telling the likes of Edwards, Obama, the
right wing, the left wing, the nut cases ..


What I don't understand is why anyone would vote for anyone from the
present congress. This is a despised do nothing group on both sides and
if you're running for prez, it must be you think you are the creme de la
creme when it comes to leadership. But if you can't lead in congress,
how can you lead the country?
G
I know, I know!

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

"ray lunder" wrote
Something tells me rich people don't pay this.

Not until they get caught, anyway:

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/...revenue12.html
Ken Williams, former CEO of the software company Sierra On-Line, said he has
no idea how the Department of Revenue caught him when he moored his
unregistered 62-foot yacht at his waterfront home in Mercer Island for a
year in 1998.

"They nabbed me," he said, adding that he was willing to pay the $130,000 in
past-due sales taxes immediately.

He was philosophical about it, saying, "There's got to be schools and a lot
of things. Government can't run without something." After paying, he took
his yacht the Sans Souci -- which is French for "carefree" -- to Europe for
a visit and later sold it. Now living in West Seattle, Williams intends to
buy another boat and this time he said he will pay the tax right away.

Use taxes also apply to out-of-state boat owners who stay in Washington too
long, over a six-month limit for a visitor's permit.

Silicon Valley financial executive James Heffernan got caught with a 58-foot
yacht he has since sold, lingering too long in Roche Harbor in 1999, he
said. His boat the Andiamo -- which is Italian for "get going" -- didn't get
going soon enough to avoid the tax, he said. He was less than a month over
the six-month visitors' limit and had to pay a tax of a little less than
$100,000. He figures agents were walking the docks.

"They caught me. I was wrong and frankly, you don't have too much defense
for ignorance," he said. Fortunately for the state, Williams and Heffernan
paid promptly. Several cases on file with the state board of tax appeals
show that collections can take years. The most notorious case in recent
years was the saga of tax cheater Michael Albert Price.

Price, now 59, bought a 53-foot yacht in February 1990 and claimed it was a
charter boat, avoiding state sales tax. But revenue agents discovered he was
far too frequently using the boat himself, not strictly chartering it.
Price, the owner of a large Tacoma equipment leasing company, was assessed a
tax of $24,600, with interest, in March 1992. He took seven years to pay,
filing lengthy appeals before the Department of Revenue's Interpretation and
Appeals Division and then the state Board of Tax appeals, according to court
documents.

A month after he paid, revenue agents discovered he'd already bought a
73-foot yacht that he called Price's Waterhouse. Once again, he cheated on
his taxes. Court documents show that he filed false papers to support his
assertion that he'd bought the vessel for $690,000 when in fact the price
was $3.2 million.

This time he faced criminal charges. It took another two years before the
executive pleaded guilty in King County Superior Court to tax evasion,
agreeing to pay $442,661 in restitution, including taxes, penalties and
interest.

He couldn't be reached for comment.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

ray lunder wrote:
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Not sure what you'd do in WA, but in San Diego, and often in LA, big
buck boat buyers take possession of the boat in Ensenada Mexico. They
keep it there in a marina for 91 days, then sail/motor it home. Avoids
the 8% sales tax. CA still hits you for the 1% annual property tax,
however, and they have a special crew wandering marina docks checking
for boats not on the property tax list. BTDT. Lot of hassle, but when
you're talking $10-20K sales tax (no, not on *my* boat :-) people seem
to think its worth it.

I bought my boat used in Arizona where there's no sales tax on resales
by private owners. I moved it to San Diego in under 90 days, and a year
later got a sales tax bill from CA. Charming chaps that they are, if
you don't have a notarized bill of sale (which I didn't feel the need
for at the time since the boat is documented), they determine the value
for which you're taxed.

Keith Hughes

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Dec 14, 11:43 pm, ray lunder wrote:
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Ya, you Washingtonians are always bragging about your no personal
income tax then turn around and whine bout all the other taxes ie
$2000 to register your new car every year! Down here in Oregon, land
of the NO sales tax, I was paying bout $35 every two years for my
state boat registry. It went up bout when Bush got in office. Now I
pay bout $125every two years.

I bought my boat in Port Townsend, WA. then brought it down to Oregon.
No Wasington Sales Tax if left the state with in ?? days.

I have a nice little room to rent down here if ya want to be an
Oregonian? BUt yad have to get a OR drivers licence to make your
citizenship all leagal. But then yould have to pay Oregon State
Personal income tax along with the IRS Fed cut too.
Living in Oregaon It not a bad deal if your poor and live on mega
yacht...........
By-the-book-Bob

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Looks like a lot of people here ought to become Libertarians, or at
least Republicans. In this great country we can change the laws. We
don't need to break them.

Stephen

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Dec 15, 11:18 am, Stephen Trapani
wrote:
Looks like a lot of people here ought to become Libertarians, or at
least Republicans. In this great country we can change the laws. We
don't need to break them.

Stephen


Replikan???!?! No way............ Born in Oregon and got ggparents
burried 1886 in Oregon. Got a moutain, a lake, and a street named
after the family. Confirmed Democrate and wish Oregon would get a
sales tax. Then give residence a sales tax rebate come April 15th
Maybe Oregon would finaly get all thoes visitors to pay for some of
the services they use with out paying sales tax...... If we had too
many Republicans here it would be like Idaho................ Uh, I
just dont want to go there. Idaho is wrong on too many levels.
bob

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Subject

Establish a permanent residence in a non tax state.

Nevada and Wyoming come to mind.

Lew

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Bob wrote:
On Dec 15, 11:18 am, Stephen Trapani
wrote:
Looks like a lot of people here ought to become Libertarians, or at
least Republicans. In this great country we can change the laws. We
don't need to break them.

Stephen


Replikan???!?! No way............ Born in Oregon and got ggparents
burried 1886 in Oregon. Got a moutain, a lake, and a street named
after the family. Confirmed Democrate and wish Oregon would get a
sales tax. Then give residence a sales tax rebate come April 15th
Maybe Oregon would finaly get all thoes visitors to pay for some of
the services they use with out paying sales tax...... If we had too
many Republicans here it would be like Idaho................ Uh, I
just dont want to go there. Idaho is wrong on too many levels.
bob

If you are a democrat and want to pay more taxes then you are in the
right party for your beliefs.

Stephen

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Dec 15, 2:09 pm, Stephen Trapani wrote:

If you are a democrat and want to pay more taxes then you are in the
right party for your beliefs.



Na, I think you missed the finer points of my minor rant. I want a
State Sales Tax, just dont want residents to pay it. I want all the
visitors to pay it ("use fee"). Then at the end of the year get a
state tax refund for all the sales tax i payed. But this is sorta way
off topic and rather regional, I applogize.

But evading state sales tax on boats using oregon and other states is
a pretty old story. One of the previous owners of my boat did that....
the owner lived in CA, owned/ran a sailing magizine business located
about Latitude 38 in CA. I found a few old Oregon boat registrations
in the crap still on board. Couldnt figure out how a guy could be a
resident/business owner in CA and have a boat registered in
OR...!?!?! Im sure it was all leagal ;)

Bob

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Bob wrote:
On Dec 15, 2:09 pm, Stephen Trapani wrote:

If you are a democrat and want to pay more taxes then you are in the
right party for your beliefs.



Na, I think you missed the finer points of my minor rant. I want a
State Sales Tax, just dont want residents to pay it. I want all the
visitors to pay it ("use fee"). Then at the end of the year get a
state tax refund for all the sales tax i payed. But this is sorta way
off topic and rather regional, I applogize.

If I understand you correctly, you want someone else to pay taxes but
you yourself don't want to pay them. In this case you definitely
shouldn't be a democrat. It's hypocritical isn't it?

Ironically your theory of having out of staters pay your state's
expenses displays the inherent unfairness of mandatory tax policies.
Instead of voluntarily giving to the poor, tax and spenders are forever
looking for ways to steal from someone else to "help the poor."

Stephen

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Nope... It's called a sales and USE tax for a reason... if you use your
boat in a state that has a sales tax btu you bought it in one without OR
with a smaller one.. most have the ablility to tax you on the diff.

Florida is the worst... if you come to a boat show, you have 2 weeks
after the last work is done to get her out of FL. If you move here
from SC you pay the full tax...

Lew Hodgett wrote:
Subject

Establish a permanent residence in a non tax state.

Nevada and Wyoming come to mind.

Lew

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Nope... It's called a sales and USE tax for a reason... if you use your
boat in a state that has a sales tax btu you bought it in one without OR
with a smaller one.. most have the ablility to tax you on the diff.

Florida is the worst... if you come to a boat show, you have 2 weeks
after the last work is done to get her out of FL. If you move here
from SC you pay the full tax...

Lew Hodgett wrote:

Subject

Establish a permanent residence in a non tax state.

Nevada and Wyoming come to mind.

Lew

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

Ray, just go ahead and pay it. Maybe the rich people don't (but see some of
the stories "Ernest scribbler " has to tell), but think about what they pay
their attorneys. You're talking about a 120K boat, and you're quibbling
about 8? Come on. Show some class here.

Reminds me of those people who buy a new Porsche and then park it half a
mile away at the back of the parking lot so it won't get a scratch on it. If
I could afford to buy a new Porsche, I'd park it wherever I bloody well
pleased and if it got a scratch on it I'd trade it in on a new one.

All that aside, I was in Ensenada, Baja California, a few years back with my
own boat, and I stayed in a new and very nice marina that the locals called
the "Ninety-day yacht club". It was full of brand new boats, that looked to
me like they'd never been out of their slips. Apparently, for California
anyway, if you (1) take delivery of the yacht outside of US territorial
waters, and (2) actually USE the boat someplace outside US territorial
waters during a period of ninety days following the purchase, you can then
"import" it into the US without having to pay state sales tax (in
California, anyway).

A friend of mine tried to do this, staying at that exact marina, but somehow
he screwed up on some tiny detail and ended up having to pay the tax. All
the effort (and expense!) he went to, to try to scam his way out of the tax,
ended up being wasted, and he almost certainly ended up on some sort of tax
"watch list".

Tom Dacon
S/V Bettina
Port Townsend, WA


"ray lunder" wrote in message
...
Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Sat, 15 Dec 2007 22:41:30 -0500, Ed wrote:

Nope... It's called a sales and USE tax for a reason... if you use your
boat in a state that has a sales tax btu you bought it in one without OR
with a smaller one.. most have the ablility to tax you on the diff.

Florida is the worst... if you come to a boat show, you have 2 weeks
after the last work is done to get her out of FL. If you move here
from SC you pay the full tax...

No experience, but I've read on a boat forum (Carolina Skiff) that if
you have the seller invoice the outboard motor separately, when you
drag it all down to Florida you only pay tax on the boat, and maybe
the trailer. With some of the outboards costing 10k plus, that saves
a chunk of change.

--Vic

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

"Ed" wrote:

Nope... It's called a sales and USE tax for a reason... if you use your
boat in a state that has a sales tax btu you bought it in one without OR
with a smaller one.. most have the ablility to tax you on the diff.

Don't think the boat will ever get to Nevada or Wyoming.

Lew

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

"Ed" wrote in message ...
Nope... It's called a sales and USE tax for a reason... if you use your
boat in a state that has a sales tax btu you bought it in one without OR
with a smaller one.. most have the ablility to tax you on the diff.

Florida is the worst... if you come to a boat show, you have 2 weeks after
the last work is done to get her out of FL. If you move here from SC you
pay the full tax...

Are you sure? I bought a boat in Florida and I had 90 days to get her
shipped before sales tax was going to be charged..

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Fri, 14 Dec 2007 23:43:01 -0800, ray lunder
wrote:

Ahoy, I live in Washington state and am thinking about my first "real"
boat- a blue water cruiser in the $30k-$120k. When I buy a car I pay
something like 8% or if it's a gift or a damaged vehicle or you phoney
up the bill of sale you still pay some arbitrary made up blue book
value the state institutes and which is not insignificant. On a $100k
boat this is $8000. Something tells me rich people don't pay this. So
what's the scam? Foreign registry or forming your own corporation or
what? Sorry to be so clueless. Thanks for your time.

Ask any yacht brokerage in Portland how to do it. They specialise in
sales to WA residents,


Ironhorse, AH#130, HSB#96, SENS BS#187
2001 Ultraclassic with Sidecar
96 Custom bucket of bolts (gone but not forgotten)

Republicans think every day is 4th of July
Democrats think every day is April 15th
Ronald Reagan

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Sat, 15 Dec 2007 12:23:44 -0500, Gogarty wrote:

There is a Canadian boat in our marina in New York that has never registered
locally. Never goes to Canada either. Been there for years. What's amusing is
the marina is city owned and operated.

I bet the taxes are higher in Canada, and the enforcement stricter, which
is why the boat has been sitting in NY.

Matt O.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

PS.. just one more reason to leave the USA. The country I once knew ..?
It
does not exist.

And I'm sure plenty of people would be glad to see you leave.

But given your laziness that won't happen, and we'll be stuck seeing your
lame-ass posts in the newsgroups.

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

On Sat, 15 Dec 2007 14:58:13 GMT, Rich wrote:

This may not help you, but it may help others.

Here in the northeast, I live in MA (5% sales tax). I purchased a
boat from a dealer in CT (6%). I keep the boat in RI (NO SALES TAX on
boat purchases).

...

In the course of your research, did you look into how NH taxes boats?
Also, did you look at how used boat sales are taxed in the NE states?
Thanks in advance for any info.
Chuck Cox
SynchroSystems - embedded computer design - http://synchro.com

my email is politician-proof, just remove the PORK

Buying a boat without sales tax?
 

No chuck, I didn't. I was only interested in MA, CT, and RI.
Sorry....

Rich

On Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:05:16 -0500, Chuck Cox
wrote:

On Sat, 15 Dec 2007 14:58:13 GMT, Rich wrote:

This may not help you, but it may help others.

Here in the northeast, I live in MA (5% sales tax). I purchased a
boat from a dealer in CT (6%). I keep the boat in RI (NO SALES TAX on
boat purchases).

...

In the course of your research, did you look into how NH taxes boats?
Also, did you look at how used boat sales are taxed in the NE states?
Thanks in advance for any info.
Chuck Cox
SynchroSystems - embedded computer design - http://synchro.com

my email is politician-proof, just remove the PORK