|
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
Hello! This is related to a discussion over at:
http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=19458 We are trying to figure out some requirements for a "Multi Purpose Onboard Computer System". QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? (Let's say for a passage, or your typical cruising area)?? How large a hard drive do you feel you need to be "comfortable" for charts and your other uses?? Thanks! Please answer here or at the discussion thread on BoatDesign.net __________________ Regards, Terry King ...On the South China Sea, in Shekou |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Oct 9, 8:24 am, " wrote:
Hello! This is related to a discussion over at:http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=19458 We are trying to figure out some requirements for a "Multi Purpose Onboard Computer System". QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? 110 in the shade, so humid that plastic rots. Get a laptop that meets military standard 810F at the least. If you are smart get proper paper charts and toss the computor. That or have a genset and climate control (AC) below. QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? (Let's say for a passage, or your typical cruising area)?? How large a hard drive do you feel you need to be "comfortable" for charts and your other uses?? Go to a digital chart provider and see how big the charts are , and you will have a better answer. In general the bigger the better, you may also consider getting an external hard drive and store nothing but charts on it. Joe Thanks! Please answer here or at the discussion thread on BoatDesign.net __________________ Regards, Terry King ...On the South China Sea, in Shekou |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:24:44 -0700, "
wrote: QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? I think I would have a solar powered fans, like my kid brother's Audi. The sunnier it gets the better it works.[and it is needed more] He says it keeps the car 40 or 50 degrees cooler. You can lock it up properly without cooking the interior. Casady |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:24:44 -0700, "
wrote: QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? (Let's say for a passage, or your typical cruising area)?? How large a hard drive do you feel you need to be "comfortable" for charts and your other uses?? It was less than a hundred bucks for a hard drive the size of a paperback book, that plugged into the USB port and holds 80 gig. I wouldn't mind knowing just what it takes. Casady |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
I have all the US charts from Florida to Maine, New Brunswick and Nova
Scotia, and larger charts of the rest of the US and possessions around the world. 3,088 files that take 2.2 GB. Ansley Sawyer SV Pacem |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 07:20:07 -0700, Mark Borgerson
wrote: You might also consider a couple of 8GB USB flash drives as backup. Flash memory may better accomodate the shock and vibration of a boat under way. When not in use, you can remove them and store them in a plastic bag with some dessicant. Mark Borgerson I lforgot about a memory stick in a shirt pocket I left out for washing. My wife recovered the memory stick in three pieces: two covers and a little card and chip. I stuck them back together. It worked. You could be right about USB flash robustness! Brian W |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
" wrote in
oups.com: QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? 80-110F, hotter if you don't put up a tarp to keep the plastic roof in the shade! I've seen them 130F at the dock with all the ports open in the hot sun, easily. That's why most boats the live here, in Charleston, SC USA, have air conditioning. QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? (Let's say for a passage, or your typical cruising area)?? How large a hard drive do you feel you need to be "comfortable" for charts and your other uses?? The best answer for you is "as large as you can find". Hard drives are getting SO cheap! Recently, one of our local Best Buy stores was selling a 160GB external USB hard drive that self- powers right out of the USB port, made by Western Digital in China for $US72...within the last week! New laptop drives can be had that hold 250GB, now. You can never have enough hard drive space ESPECIALLY as they are now so cheap. For reference, in the 1980's I paid $US2,499 for a 33 MEGAbyte, not GIgabyte, hard drive for the old IBM-PCXT. (.033 GB) That was the biggest drive available at the time! You can always leave excess storage blank.....You cannot stretch small storage into bigger storage. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
|
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:24:44 -0700, "
wrote: Hello! This is related to a discussion over at: http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=19458 We are trying to figure out some requirements for a "Multi Purpose Onboard Computer System". QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? (Let's say for a passage, or your typical cruising area)?? How large a hard drive do you feel you need to be "comfortable" for charts and your other uses?? Thanks! Please answer here or at the discussion thread on BoatDesign.net __________________ Regards, Terry King ...On the South China Sea, in Shekou I currently have a DELL Inspiron 6000 on board that I have used for the past 2 years. The computer was purchased with a 50 Gig hard disk as standard equipment. A set of world c-maps takes up 1.33 Gigs. When at anchor for any extended period or in a marina we use a canopy over both the foredeck and areas aft of the mast and I would estimate that temperature inside the boat seldom reach 100 degrees F. about 8 degrees N. As an aside, nearly all cruising boats that I meet have a laptop aboard. Bruce in Bangkok (brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom) |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
In rec.boats.cruising Brian Whatcott wrote:
:On Tue, 9 Oct 2007 07:20:07 -0700, Mark Borgerson wrote: :You might also consider a couple of 8GB USB flash drives as backup. :Flash memory may better accomodate the shock and vibration of :a boat under way. When not in use, you can remove them and store :them in a plastic bag with some dessicant. : : :Mark Borgerson :I lforgot about a memory stick in a shirt pocket I left out for :washing. :My wife recovered the memory stick in three pieces: two covers :and a little card and chip. I stuck them back together. It worked. :You could be right about USB flash robustness! Flash is pretty resistant to temperature and most other environmental factors, short of being hit with a hammer. Salt water might cause corrosion to the connections to the support circuitry, though. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
THANKS! For the replies; I'll summarize some of this over in the
BoatDesign.net discussion. - Salt air, Humidity - Plans now are 12 watt system board in sealed/gasketed aluminum box. Anti-corrosion insert, humidity control insert. Heat transfer to 2 square feet or so of box surface to cabin air. Need a maximum inside-cabin temperature to do the numbers. - The 2.2 Gb and 3088 files is great data.. thanks! This fits with my experience, no problem for 60 Gb 1.8" notebook type drive using 1 watt. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Oct 9, 3:24 am, " wrote:
.... QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? Worst case, say Kanton in the summer, I've seen high 90's inside the pilot house. That isn't normal. We typically see mid to upper 80's inside in the summer in the high tropics (eg. Hawaii or New Cal) and upper 80's to low 90's in summer on the equator. QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? Transis and C-Map cover the whole world in vector on 2 CDs or one DVD. Let me add, just by the way, that I don't think there is any noticeable difference between MTBF for laptops used on cruising boats and laptops used on land. I wonder if you're stressing more than you have to over all this... -- Tom. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
As an aside, nearly all cruising boats that I meet have a laptop
aboard. Bear in mind that with a video output to a monitor and a wireless keyboard/mouse (or even wired) you get the advantages of the laptop (power management, size) while still being able to use it as a normal PC. When you go with a built-in system you're painting yourself into a corner. Getting parts is bad enough in the islands, getting parts for specialized or industrial stuff will be even worse. Chart plotter and most general purpose use doesn't really require much computational horsepower. It's often more economical to just buy TWO low-end laptops; keeping one as a spare. Set one of them up, clone the drive onto the other one and stow it safely away. Rotate it out now and then to make sure the spare still works OK. -Bill Kearney |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising
Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? I write this from my sailboat in Puerto Vallarta, MX, where we have been all summer and the average temp is mid 90's every day. My perspective is that every boat down here which has people on it right now, has air conditioning. So my current interior temp is 74 degrees. In December it will cool down into the 70's here, many boats and people will come who don't have ac, but the temp is still in the 70's. As someone mentioned above, the hottest time is when you are underway, running your engine because there is no breeze (most of the time here). But most of that heat goes right up the companion way. Most people here have normal laptops, and they all work fine. I agree that unless you are taking yours out into the cockpit where rain/salt/ sun can get to it, you should have no additional issues. -Mark http://GoReads.com |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Oct 9, 8:24 am, " wrote:
Hello! This is related to a discussion over at:http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/showthread.php?t=19458 We are trying to figure out some requirements for a "Multi Purpose Onboard Computer System". QUESTION1: How HOT does it really get INSIDE the cabin of a Cruising Boat, in the Tropics? What's the typical you've experienced? What's the worst-case?? QUESTION2: If you use computer-based charts on a laptop or other onboard computer, how much Harddrive space do your charts take up?? (Let's say for a passage, or your typical cruising area)?? How large a hard drive do you feel you need to be "comfortable" for charts and your other uses?? Thanks! Please answer here or at the discussion thread on BoatDesign.net __________________ Regards, Terry King ...On the South China Sea, in Shekou My experience on a boat in the tropics is simply that it does not get any hotter than summer at home without air-conditioning. Actually, in most cases, not uncomfortable at all. As for the computer, any laptop is more than able to handle it. Unless you get a laptop manufactured to military specs (Panasonic Toughbook $$$), figure on replacing it every few years (but then you'd probably replace it every few years anyway!) Keep all your charts and other important programs on disk and keep a system recovery/backup disk as well. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
Keep all your charts and other important programs on disk
and keep a system recovery/backup disk as well. Most folks probably know this, but just in case ... The "system recovery" disks that come with most notebook computers today (on a CD or in a hidden partition of the hard drive) wipe out all your data, along with any programs you installed after you got the machine. They are designed to do that, in order to return your machine to the way it came to you from the manufacturer. What you really want is a utility that will restore your system after a crash to the way it was the day before the crash. Two that do that are Norton Ghost (good but a bit awkward to use) from Symantec.com, and Acronis True Image, much more user-friendly, from Acronis.com. Both retail for under $50, and are often discounted. I use Acronis, and make weekly compressed backups of my C: drive onto external hard drives. I've used it to restore onto a new, bare hard drive after a disk crash. The entire process took less than 20 minutes and gave me a computer that was identical to the pre-crash system. Given the importance of a navigation computer to a cruiser, it makes sense to have a current "image backup" of the hard drive that can be used to quickly restore the computer so all applications, charts, etc., are immediately available. Oh yeah -- and test the backups! (g) Alex |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On 2007-10-15 20:19:47 -0400, "Alex"
said: Given the importance of a navigation computer to a cruiser, it makes sense to have a current "image backup" of the hard drive that can be used to quickly restore the computer so all applications, charts, etc., are immediately available. Oh yeah -- and test the backups! (g) Even better, "mirror" the internal drive so you can BOOT from the backup! And do it periodically, spot-checking recent files and programs. Our Mac will synchronize the external to match the 30 gigs of internal data in about half an hour. I expect Windows will do about the same thing. Then put the backup in a electronically and magnetically shielded, water-tight, air-tight container. (says one who lost almost all of 20 years' files despite a image drive and incremental backups. All failed in the same week -- a friend's power surges took out two of them as I tried to get his back up.) -- Jere Lull Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
"Jere Lull" wrote in message news:2007101522343316807-jerelull@maccom... On 2007-10-15 20:19:47 -0400, "Alex" said: Given the importance of a navigation computer to a cruiser, it makes sense to have a current "image backup" of the hard drive that can be used to quickly restore the computer so all applications, charts, etc., are immediately available. Oh yeah -- and test the backups! (g) Even better, "mirror" the internal drive so you can BOOT from the backup! And do it periodically, spot-checking recent files and programs. Our Mac will synchronize the external to match the 30 gigs of internal data in about half an hour. I expect Windows will do about the same thing. To my knowledge, a Windows PC won't boot from an external hard drive. It will boot from an internal CD or DVD, but I don't think it will recognize a USB or FireWire remote drive. I believe a Mac will boot from an external drive, further proof that Macs are for wimps and people who want to get work done, while Windows machines are for us macho geeks who enjoy pointless, frustrating challenges. (g) With a Windows system, one could create a bootable external drive with the intention of swapping it for the internal drive in the event of a failure. In a desktop machine it's relatively easy to pop the cables and install a mirrored hard drive, making that the boot drive. But in a laptop, at sea in the cabin of a pitching boat, that kind of surgery could be a bit dicey. Alex |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On Tue, 16 Oct 2007 06:05:28 +0000, Alex wrote:
To my knowledge, a Windows PC won't boot from an external hard drive. It will boot from an internal CD or DVD, but I don't think it will recognize a USB or FireWire remote drive. I believe a Mac will boot from an external drive, further proof that Macs are for wimps and people who want to get work done, while Windows machines are for us macho geeks who enjoy pointless, frustrating challenges. (g) Seeing that you enjoy frustrating challenges, you *might* be able to boot Windows from an external drive using Grub, or a Super Grub disk. While I don't have much use for Windows, grub will allow chainloading, allowing you to move Windows bootloader from the MBR to another partition, or even another hard drive. Hey, it might be a frustrating challenge, or it might work. :-) Some information on how other OSs do it: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BootFromUSB http://users.bigpond.net.au/hermanzo...bDiskPage.html |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
On 2007-10-16 02:05:28 -0400, "Alex"
said: To my knowledge, a Windows PC won't boot from an external hard drive. It will boot from an internal CD or DVD, but I don't think it will recognize a USB or FireWire remote drive. You've got to be kidding! I've been booting Macs from external drives from the early SCSI days, easily 15 years. Just hold down the "Option" key to get all the possible options, including net-boot. I thought Windoze had mostly caught up on trivial little things like that. Truth be told, I know I can net-boot my work PC, so expect there's some arcane set of keystrokes you can press as it flicks through DOS to boot up on an external drive. Sounds like Windows users should make a bootable DVD with their backup/mirror software installed so they can at least reformat and restore to the internal (new or replacement). AGAIN, test periodically to ensure it works. I believe a Mac will boot from an external drive, further proof that Macs are for wimps and people who want to get work done, while Windows machines are for us macho geeks who enjoy pointless, frustrating challenges. (g) Hey, them'd be fighting words except it's the exact truth. If my workplace were on Macs, I probably would no longer have a job. Windows should keep me busy until I decide to retire, because just about every time we get an OS upgrade, I get a flurry of things to do. If the switch to XP is any indication, the switch to Vista should keep me well-paid for 2-3 years. ;-) -- Jere Lull Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
In rec.boats.cruising Jere Lull wrote:
:On 2007-10-16 02:05:28 -0400, "Alex" said: : To my knowledge, a Windows PC won't boot from an external hard drive. : It will boot from an internal CD or DVD, but I don't think it will : recognize a USB or FireWire remote drive. :You've got to be kidding! I've been booting Macs from external drives :from the early SCSI days, easily 15 years. Just hold down the "Option" :key to get all the possible options, including net-boot. I thought :Windoze had mostly caught up on trivial little things like that. It's a limitation of the BIOS. If the BIOS properly enumerates USB disks, windows will boot from them. Many don't, though things have gotten better. I haven't tried in ages, though. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
You can boot Windows from a USB drive, whether external hard drive or
flash drive. Maybe not on one with a 6 year old BIOS. But all 3 of my computers will accept a USB drive for boot. |
Questions for Cruisers Onboard Computers
You can boot Windows from a USB drive, whether external hard drive or
flash drive. And there are also adapters that will let you plug a flash drive into an IDE port. Just plug the adapter into the motherboard's IDE port and then a flash drive into the adapter. The computer sees it as just another drive. Granted, the OS won't generally see it as removable so it's not a typical way to use a flash memory card. But it's a great way to add a no-moving-parts drive to a system that doesn't otherwise directly support that sort of media. You can also use those IBM/Hitachi CF-card MicroDrive cards if you want actual rotating memory (as 'unmanaged' flash has it's share of long term read/write issues). |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:01 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2014 BoatBanter.com