Rich Hampel wrote:

The use of a centrifuge on the small volume boat tankage .... borders
on ludicrous.

your opinion is not universal. Besides, we were writing
about FUEL POLISHING ... an activity normally performed
alongside a dock at rather extended intervals.

Centrifuges are extreme high maintenance rotating and
power consuming equipment

Just because you don't like them ... and you have a peculiar
vision of "extreme" maintenance.

and do NOT effect total removal/separation of
emulsions. If you have enough power to run a centrifuge, then I
suggest that you rip out the fossil fuel engine and simply replace with
an electric motor for propulsion.

A rather extremist position. There are plenty of boats under
75 feet that use a centrifuge to handle fuel separation
tasks. Why do you think Alfa Laval build one the size of a
gallon milk jug? Your personal view and experience does not
define the marine industry in the 21st century.

Do you also use a nephalometer to
arrive at when the centrifugation is complete?

Once through will do.

As an aside .... a water emulsion will enhance the combustion
efficiency by increase of the apparent cetane number of the fuel, or
the octane number in a gasoline engine.

Water does not increase the cetane number ... do you know
what that means anyway?

Water serves to reduce the temperature of combustion and
thereby reduce the formation of oxides of nitrogen in a diesel.

Its the FREE water thats the
'problem' as simply 'slugs' of free water simply do not burn.

Got that one wrong too. There are several techniques
available in large diesels that layer the fuel and water
injected, and another that injects water first then fuel.

Let's stick to filtration and fuel polishing. If you want to
have a snit go chat with K over on rec. boats.

Rick

"Rick" wrote in message
k.net...
Rich Hampel wrote:

The use of a centrifuge on the small volume boat tankage .... borders
on ludicrous.

your opinion is not universal. Besides, we were writing
about FUEL POLISHING ... an activity normally performed
alongside a dock at rather extended intervals.

Actually, we are talking about permanently installed polishing systems
that run for extended periods of time. In general, they run the entire time
the engine iss running and also when the boat is sitting at anchor or at a
dock they run for several hours per week.

Centrifuges are extreme high maintenance rotating and
power consuming equipment

Just because you don't like them ... and you have a peculiar
vision of "extreme" maintenance.

Not practical for the type of system we are talking about here.

and do NOT effect total removal/separation of
emulsions. If you have enough power to run a centrifuge, then I
suggest that you rip out the fossil fuel engine and simply replace with
an electric motor for propulsion.

A rather extremist position. There are plenty of boats under
75 feet that use a centrifuge to handle fuel separation
tasks. Why do you think Alfa Laval build one the size of a
gallon milk jug? Your personal view and experience does not
define the marine industry in the 21st century.

Do you also use a nephalometer to
arrive at when the centrifugation is complete?

Once through will do.

As an aside .... a water emulsion will enhance the combustion
efficiency by increase of the apparent cetane number of the fuel, or
the octane number in a gasoline engine.

Water does not increase the cetane number ... do you know
what that means anyway?

Water serves to reduce the temperature of combustion and
thereby reduce the formation of oxides of nitrogen in a diesel.

Its the FREE water thats the
'problem' as simply 'slugs' of free water simply do not burn.

Got that one wrong too. There are several techniques
available in large diesels that layer the fuel and water
injected, and another that injects water first then fuel.

Let's stick to filtration and fuel polishing. If you want to
have a snit go chat with K over on rec. boats.

Rick

Doug Dotson wrote:

Actually, we are talking about permanently installed polishing systems
that run for extended periods of time. In general, they run the entire time
the engine iss running and also when the boat is sitting at anchor or at a
dock they run for several hours per week.

OK, in that case I would look very closely at the Alfa Laval
unit. It is very small, 110VAC low power. No filter beats a
centrifuge for use like that.

If I really wanted to do it right I would put one on the
lube oil as well.

Rick

Changing the oil every 100 hours isn't much of a chore. My engine
only holds 2 gallons. 110VAC polishing systems would be a pain
when at ancor or under sail. Can't justify running the genset for
hours on end. A nice 12VDC pump drawing just a few amps
can be supported easier on PV and wind.\\

Doug
s/v Callista

"Rick" wrote in message
.net...
Doug Dotson wrote:

Actually, we are talking about permanently installed polishing systems
that run for extended periods of time. In general, they run the entire
time
the engine iss running and also when the boat is sitting at anchor or at
a
dock they run for several hours per week.

OK, in that case I would look very closely at the Alfa Laval
unit. It is very small, 110VAC low power. No filter beats a
centrifuge for use like that.

If I really wanted to do it right I would put one on the
lube oil as well.

Rick

Changing the oil every 100 hours isn't much of a chore. My engine
only holds 2 gallons. 110VAC polishing systems would be a pain
when at ancor or under sail. Can't justify running the genset for
hours on end. A nice 12VDC pump drawing just a few amps
can be supported easier on PV and wind.\\

Doug
s/v Callista

"Rick" wrote in message
.net...
Doug Dotson wrote:

Actually, we are talking about permanently installed polishing systems
that run for extended periods of time. In general, they run the entire
time
the engine iss running and also when the boat is sitting at anchor or at
a
dock they run for several hours per week.

OK, in that case I would look very closely at the Alfa Laval
unit. It is very small, 110VAC low power. No filter beats a
centrifuge for use like that.

If I really wanted to do it right I would put one on the
lube oil as well.

Rick

Doug Dotson wrote:

Actually, we are talking about permanently installed polishing systems
that run for extended periods of time. In general, they run the entire time
the engine iss running and also when the boat is sitting at anchor or at a
dock they run for several hours per week.

OK, in that case I would look very closely at the Alfa Laval
unit. It is very small, 110VAC low power. No filter beats a
centrifuge for use like that.

If I really wanted to do it right I would put one on the
lube oil as well.

Rick

"Rick" wrote in message
k.net...
Rich Hampel wrote:

The use of a centrifuge on the small volume boat tankage .... borders
on ludicrous.

your opinion is not universal. Besides, we were writing
about FUEL POLISHING ... an activity normally performed
alongside a dock at rather extended intervals.

Actually, we are talking about permanently installed polishing systems
that run for extended periods of time. In general, they run the entire time
the engine iss running and also when the boat is sitting at anchor or at a
dock they run for several hours per week.

Centrifuges are extreme high maintenance rotating and
power consuming equipment

Just because you don't like them ... and you have a peculiar
vision of "extreme" maintenance.

Not practical for the type of system we are talking about here.

and do NOT effect total removal/separation of
emulsions. If you have enough power to run a centrifuge, then I
suggest that you rip out the fossil fuel engine and simply replace with
an electric motor for propulsion.

A rather extremist position. There are plenty of boats under
75 feet that use a centrifuge to handle fuel separation
tasks. Why do you think Alfa Laval build one the size of a
gallon milk jug? Your personal view and experience does not
define the marine industry in the 21st century.

Do you also use a nephalometer to
arrive at when the centrifugation is complete?

Once through will do.

As an aside .... a water emulsion will enhance the combustion
efficiency by increase of the apparent cetane number of the fuel, or
the octane number in a gasoline engine.

Water does not increase the cetane number ... do you know
what that means anyway?

Water serves to reduce the temperature of combustion and
thereby reduce the formation of oxides of nitrogen in a diesel.

Its the FREE water thats the
'problem' as simply 'slugs' of free water simply do not burn.

Got that one wrong too. There are several techniques
available in large diesels that layer the fuel and water
injected, and another that injects water first then fuel.

Let's stick to filtration and fuel polishing. If you want to
have a snit go chat with K over on rec. boats.

Rick

Ask the centrifuge manufacturer whats the reduction efficiency (per
minute) vs. a dead end filter at 98-100% efficiency.
On a per gram basis what is the cost (including initial capital cost)
be tween filtration and centrifugation?
Ask the centrifuge manufacturer how long the electric cord needs to be
when you're out at sea.
Ask what the rebuild charge is for the disks when they become
misaligned or wear out.... ditto seals.
Ask when do you shut down the centifuge when you know that the particle
distribution is what you want to obtain .... with out accessory
instrumentation and the knowledge of it proper usage. Do you have ANY
idea?

Now Mr. Know it ALL - go to the Alpha Laval site and look at the
recommendations carefully .... and see the differences listed there for
the selection criteria between filtration and centrifugation ..... wow!
whaddaya know the centrifuge recommendationis for 10% solids and above.


Tell me this ONE answer..... how long do you have to centrifuge fuel
oil to get to 2uM particle levels? If you cant answer this, then you
have NO idea of the purpose of a centrifuge, the reduction possible,
nor the applicability.



In article t, Rick
wrote:

Rich Hampel wrote:

The use of a centrifuge on the small volume boat tankage .... borders
on ludicrous.

your opinion is not universal. Besides, we were writing
about FUEL POLISHING ... an activity normally performed
alongside a dock at rather extended intervals.

Centrifuges are extreme high maintenance rotating and
power consuming equipment

Just because you don't like them ... and you have a peculiar
vision of "extreme" maintenance.

and do NOT effect total removal/separation of
emulsions. If you have enough power to run a centrifuge, then I
suggest that you rip out the fossil fuel engine and simply replace with
an electric motor for propulsion.

A rather extremist position. There are plenty of boats under
75 feet that use a centrifuge to handle fuel separation
tasks. Why do you think Alfa Laval build one the size of a
gallon milk jug? Your personal view and experience does not
define the marine industry in the 21st century.

Do you also use a nephalometer to
arrive at when the centrifugation is complete?

Once through will do.

As an aside .... a water emulsion will enhance the combustion
efficiency by increase of the apparent cetane number of the fuel, or
the octane number in a gasoline engine.

Water does not increase the cetane number ... do you know
what that means anyway?

Water serves to reduce the temperature of combustion and
thereby reduce the formation of oxides of nitrogen in a diesel.

Its the FREE water thats the
'problem' as simply 'slugs' of free water simply do not burn.

Got that one wrong too. There are several techniques
available in large diesels that layer the fuel and water
injected, and another that injects water first then fuel.

Let's stick to filtration and fuel polishing. If you want to
have a snit go chat with K over on rec. boats.

Rick

Rich Hampel wrote, all offended and whiny:

Ask the centrifuge manufacturer whats the reduction efficiency (per
minute) vs. a dead end filter at 98-100% efficiency.
On a per gram basis what is the cost (including initial capital cost)
be tween filtration and centrifugation?
Ask the centrifuge manufacturer how long the electric cord needs to be
when you're out at sea.
Ask what the rebuild charge is for the disks when they become
misaligned or wear out.... ditto seals.
Ask when do you shut down the centifuge when you know that the particle
distribution is what you want to obtain .... with out accessory
instrumentation and the knowledge of it proper usage. Do you have ANY
idea?

Yeah, I use them all the time. They work very well.

Now Mr. Know it ALL - go to the Alpha Laval site and look at the
recommendations carefully .... and see the differences listed there for
the selection criteria between filtration and centrifugation ..... wow!
whaddaya know the centrifuge recommendationis for 10% solids and above.

Tell me this ONE answer..... how long do you have to centrifuge fuel
oil to get to 2uM particle levels? If you cant answer this, then you
have NO idea of the purpose of a centrifuge, the reduction possible,
nor the applicability.

I take it you don't like centrifuges. It also sounds like
you have never seen or used one.

Methinks you protest too much ... what is your problem anyway?

Rick

Rich Hampel wrote, all offended and whiny:

Ask the centrifuge manufacturer whats the reduction efficiency (per
minute) vs. a dead end filter at 98-100% efficiency.
On a per gram basis what is the cost (including initial capital cost)
be tween filtration and centrifugation?
Ask the centrifuge manufacturer how long the electric cord needs to be
when you're out at sea.
Ask what the rebuild charge is for the disks when they become
misaligned or wear out.... ditto seals.
Ask when do you shut down the centifuge when you know that the particle
distribution is what you want to obtain .... with out accessory
instrumentation and the knowledge of it proper usage. Do you have ANY
idea?

Yeah, I use them all the time. They work very well.

Now Mr. Know it ALL - go to the Alpha Laval site and look at the
recommendations carefully .... and see the differences listed there for
the selection criteria between filtration and centrifugation ..... wow!
whaddaya know the centrifuge recommendationis for 10% solids and above.

Tell me this ONE answer..... how long do you have to centrifuge fuel
oil to get to 2uM particle levels? If you cant answer this, then you
have NO idea of the purpose of a centrifuge, the reduction possible,
nor the applicability.

I take it you don't like centrifuges. It also sounds like
you have never seen or used one.

Methinks you protest too much ... what is your problem anyway?

Rick