"Skip Gundlach" wrote in message
oups.com...
August 21 - All at Sea


Skip, there is nothing inherently wrong with sailing in foul weather --
provided, of course, that you and your crew are up to it. But from your
report, Lydia is NOT up to it, at least not yet. Please don't repeat this.
You don't have to be ANYWHERE at any particular time. And there is
absolutely no "shame" in turning around and heading back to port if
conditions deteriorate unexpectedly.

"Those who fight and run away, live to fight another day."

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 12:48:25 -0500, "KLC Lewis"
wrote:


"Skip Gundlach" wrote in message
roups.com...
August 21 - All at Sea


Skip, there is nothing inherently wrong with sailing in foul weather --
provided, of course, that you and your crew are up to it. But from your
report, Lydia is NOT up to it, at least not yet. Please don't repeat this.
You don't have to be ANYWHERE at any particular time. And there is
absolutely no "shame" in turning around and heading back to port if
conditions deteriorate unexpectedly.

"Those who fight and run away, live to fight another day."

I'm getting a bit confused here. It didn't seem that Skip was putting
himself in danger, given the weather reports. Lydia's seasickness
is another issue, and I have no idea how that gets sorted out.
Skip has indicated he doesn't care too much for the crowded IC, and
likes to do some sailing offshore, and plain likes to sail.
I don't think all cruisers power all the time, and never venture
offshore.
There's a lot of talk of fatigue and multiple watchkeepers, yet
singlehanders seem to sail overnighters all the time.
Having no experience in this myself, or the waters Skip is in, I'd
like to know what's the big deal.
It just seems that if you wait for flat calm seas, you'll never be
sailing.

--Vic

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
I'm getting a bit confused here. It didn't seem that Skip was putting
himself in danger, given the weather reports. Lydia's seasickness
is another issue, and I have no idea how that gets sorted out.
Skip has indicated he doesn't care too much for the crowded IC, and
likes to do some sailing offshore, and plain likes to sail.
I don't think all cruisers power all the time, and never venture
offshore.
There's a lot of talk of fatigue and multiple watchkeepers, yet
singlehanders seem to sail overnighters all the time.
Having no experience in this myself, or the waters Skip is in, I'd
like to know what's the big deal.
It just seems that if you wait for flat calm seas, you'll never be
sailing.

--Vic

Perhaps not, but the conditions were very similar to those in which the
Flying Pig had her first serious encounter with the hard and unforgiving.

Lin and Larry Pardey's early voyages had Lin seasick often -- but I don't
know that Skip is the sailor that Larry was at that time. I do know,
however, that Skip and Lydia are at least 30 years older. My impression is
that Skip keeps getting "gottagetthereitis" -- an often fatal ailment.

It is reasonable to deliberately go out in conditions that will test the
crew, gradually increasing one's experience with handling those conditions.
But I think it should be done in small bites. And the crew has to be up for
it.

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 13:26:52 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

It just seems that if you wait for flat calm seas, you'll never be
sailing.

Really? No wind, no sailing?

Casady

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 13:26:52 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

There's a lot of talk of fatigue and multiple watchkeepers, yet
singlehanders seem to sail overnighters all the time.

Only when well offshore, inshore they have to stay awake, frequently
exceeding their endurance limits. I was reminded of that yesterday as
we cruised past Pt Judith lighthouse in Rhode Island. Sometime back a
young lady singlehander successfully sailed her 30 something boat all
the way across the Atlantic up to that point. After being awake for
over 2 days due to bad weather and heavy shipping traffic, she mistook
Pt Judith light for the old Brenton Reef tower, and parked her boat on
the beach just down the shore.

The waters in question where Skip is now are very congested with
*large* commercial shipping and also a wide assortment of fishing
vessels. You can not safely sleep, even for 15 minutes.

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:04:28 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 13:26:52 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

There's a lot of talk of fatigue and multiple watchkeepers, yet
singlehanders seem to sail overnighters all the time.

Only when well offshore, inshore they have to stay awake, frequently
exceeding their endurance limits. I was reminded of that yesterday as
we cruised past Pt Judith lighthouse in Rhode Island. Sometime back a
young lady singlehander successfully sailed her 30 something boat all
the way across the Atlantic up to that point. After being awake for
over 2 days due to bad weather and heavy shipping traffic, she mistook
Pt Judith light for the old Brenton Reef tower, and parked her boat on
the beach just down the shore.

The waters in question where Skip is now are very congested with
*large* commercial shipping and also a wide assortment of fishing
vessels. You can not safely sleep, even for 15 minutes.

Thanks for shedding some light on what Skip was encountering.
I do still suspect he'll have a different take on it, but we'll see.
It's my "impression" that he learned a lot from the Keys grounding,
and is putting some thought into his course.
You mentioned the Chesapeake Bay course to NYC, and the first thing
I thought of when Skip went offshore is that at least he didn't have
to constantly watch the sounder. He did mention avoiding shoals.
Does Chesapeake Bay present a special challenge for a boat of his
draft? It may be he wanted a good sail without those concerns.
Not knowing these routes and I'm all ears.

--Vic

Vic Smith wrote:

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:04:28 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 13:26:52 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

There's a lot of talk of fatigue and multiple watchkeepers, yet
singlehanders seem to sail overnighters all the time.

Only when well offshore, inshore they have to stay awake, frequently
exceeding their endurance limits. I was reminded of that yesterday as
we cruised past Pt Judith lighthouse in Rhode Island. Sometime back a
young lady singlehander successfully sailed her 30 something boat all
the way across the Atlantic up to that point. After being awake for
over 2 days due to bad weather and heavy shipping traffic, she mistook
Pt Judith light for the old Brenton Reef tower, and parked her boat on
the beach just down the shore.

The waters in question where Skip is now are very congested with
*large* commercial shipping and also a wide assortment of fishing
vessels. You can not safely sleep, even for 15 minutes.

Thanks for shedding some light on what Skip was encountering.
I do still suspect he'll have a different take on it, but we'll see.
It's my "impression" that he learned a lot from the Keys grounding,
and is putting some thought into his course.

That was my idea too. I didn't think that the bad weather started
until he was off Ocean City.

You mentioned the Chesapeake Bay course to NYC, and the first thing
I thought of when Skip went offshore is that at least he didn't have
to constantly watch the sounder. He did mention avoiding shoals.
Does Chesapeake Bay present a special challenge for a boat of his
draft? It may be he wanted a good sail without those concerns.
Not knowing these routes and I'm all ears.

The Chesapeake IMHO is one of the best places to sail. We have a
friend with a boat like ours that has a 6'6" draft and he has no
problem sailing in the Chesapeake (and neither do we). After all,
freighters and tugs transit the Bay all the time. Anchoring close to
shore might be difficult for a deeper draft craft, but anchoring
farther away from shore means that you have less insects (usually).

Another problem in the Bay is crab pots - usually if you see crab pots
that will alert you to the fact that the water is getting shallow
there (and this also holds in much of the rest of the ICW)

BUT -- all the weather problems that Skip had, he would still have had
in the Chesapeake. And he would still have had the freighters etc,
and in addition would have had to do the Delaware Canal at the other
end of the Bay and the trip would undoubtedly have taken longer.

He can do the Chesapeake on the way back south.

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:32:49 -0400, Rosalie B.
wrote:



The Chesapeake IMHO is one of the best places to sail. We have a
friend with a boat like ours that has a 6'6" draft and he has no
problem sailing in the Chesapeake (and neither do we). After all,
freighters and tugs transit the Bay all the time. Anchoring close to
shore might be difficult for a deeper draft craft, but anchoring
farther away from shore means that you have less insects (usually).

I've always wanted to visit there, and hear some of those Virginia
Yankees talking too. There was an old Virginia Yankee tending
lockers in Norfolk whose voice was like music to my ears.
Chesapeake Bay is on my short list of places to devote some time to.

Another problem in the Bay is crab pots - usually if you see crab pots
that will alert you to the fact that the water is getting shallow
there (and this also holds in much of the rest of the ICW)

I've been hearing a lot about props fouling because of crabpots.

BUT -- all the weather problems that Skip had, he would still have had
in the Chesapeake. And he would still have had the freighters etc,
and in addition would have had to do the Delaware Canal at the other
end of the Bay and the trip would undoubtedly have taken longer.

I'm starting to think my solution to shoals, freighters and crabpots
is a shallow draft boat with all of its own compromises.

--Vic

Vic Smith wrote in
:

I've been hearing a lot about props fouling because of crabpots.


http://www.quickutter.com/

Looks like a good idea....for crabbers...(c;

Larry
--

On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 15:22:56 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

Does Chesapeake Bay present a special challenge for a boat of his
draft? It may be he wanted a good sail without those concerns.
Not knowing these routes and I'm all ears.

No. Some of the rivers and bays off of the Chesapeake are shallow but
the central portion is mostly deep water and very well marked. There
are many good deep water harbors.

If you are interested in learning more about east coast cruising I'd
recommend downloading the free NOAA charts along with a chart viewer.
I have spent endless hours in the off season "cruising" on computer
charts and planning the next trip. For me, there's always a next
trip...

You can also download the coast pilots for free which have a wealth of
detailed information. The Atlantic coast waterway guides are another
good source, along with the "Skipper Bob" books.