Solar Panels
 

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

Solar Panels
 

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 +0000, Hmseconomy wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about .4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Now, since a solar panel only puts out anything about 50% of the time (assume
full sun all day) you would need an 800mA panel. But a "1 Amp" panel only puts
out close to 1 amp in full sun when the sun's directly perpendicular to the
cell, I'd put it a 60-70% "fudge factor" (more if you live in a cloudy area).
This means you need about a 1.3A panel per battery.

Note that most of these "trickle charge" solar panels only put out 200mA or so.

Also, a diode is so that the battery doesn't "backfeed" the panel, not to
prevent overcharging.

Based on this, I'd say you'd be safe with a 2A panel, paralleled to both
batteries (assuming there's no load on the batteries). I've used a 2A panel on
one 4D battery over the summer, and it seemed to work well. I doubt one of these
"trickle charge" panels would be useful for the long term.

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Solar Panels
 

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 +0000, Hmseconomy wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about .4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Now, since a solar panel only puts out anything about 50% of the time (assume
full sun all day) you would need an 800mA panel. But a "1 Amp" panel only puts
out close to 1 amp in full sun when the sun's directly perpendicular to the
cell, I'd put it a 60-70% "fudge factor" (more if you live in a cloudy area).
This means you need about a 1.3A panel per battery.

Note that most of these "trickle charge" solar panels only put out 200mA or so.

Also, a diode is so that the battery doesn't "backfeed" the panel, not to
prevent overcharging.

Based on this, I'd say you'd be safe with a 2A panel, paralleled to both
batteries (assuming there's no load on the batteries). I've used a 2A panel on
one 4D battery over the summer, and it seemed to work well. I doubt one of these
"trickle charge" panels would be useful for the long term.

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Solar Panels
 

I don't know where your numbers come from - the OP didn't mention a battery
size.

But more importantly, your number of 80 AmpHours for 3 months implies about 1 AH
per day, This cold be handled by a 5 Watt panel such as this one featured on
the Boat/US site. It has a built in diode.

http://www.boatus-store.com/webapp/w...roductId=56290

Since the winter sun is not very strong, and the sky might be cloudy, this might
be on the small size for a larger bank, so you would be well advised to visit
monthly to make sure they are staying charged.

You might consider getting a "full size panel" and a regulator. These will
collect enough light even through shrink wrap to keep a large bank charged, and
will be useful in the summer.

"Lloyd Sumpter" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 +0000, Hmseconomy wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge
two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need
a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?).
Any
advice would be appreciated.

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about
..4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Now, since a solar panel only puts out anything about 50% of the time (assume
full sun all day) you would need an 800mA panel. But a "1 Amp" panel only puts
out close to 1 amp in full sun when the sun's directly perpendicular to the
cell, I'd put it a 60-70% "fudge factor" (more if you live in a cloudy area).
This means you need about a 1.3A panel per battery.

Note that most of these "trickle charge" solar panels only put out 200mA or
so.

Also, a diode is so that the battery doesn't "backfeed" the panel, not to
prevent overcharging.

Based on this, I'd say you'd be safe with a 2A panel, paralleled to both
batteries (assuming there's no load on the batteries). I've used a 2A panel on
one 4D battery over the summer, and it seemed to work well. I doubt one of
these
"trickle charge" panels would be useful for the long term.

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Solar Panels
 

I don't know where your numbers come from - the OP didn't mention a battery
size.

But more importantly, your number of 80 AmpHours for 3 months implies about 1 AH
per day, This cold be handled by a 5 Watt panel such as this one featured on
the Boat/US site. It has a built in diode.

http://www.boatus-store.com/webapp/w...roductId=56290

Since the winter sun is not very strong, and the sky might be cloudy, this might
be on the small size for a larger bank, so you would be well advised to visit
monthly to make sure they are staying charged.

You might consider getting a "full size panel" and a regulator. These will
collect enough light even through shrink wrap to keep a large bank charged, and
will be useful in the summer.

"Lloyd Sumpter" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 +0000, Hmseconomy wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge
two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need
a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?).
Any
advice would be appreciated.

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about
..4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Now, since a solar panel only puts out anything about 50% of the time (assume
full sun all day) you would need an 800mA panel. But a "1 Amp" panel only puts
out close to 1 amp in full sun when the sun's directly perpendicular to the
cell, I'd put it a 60-70% "fudge factor" (more if you live in a cloudy area).
This means you need about a 1.3A panel per battery.

Note that most of these "trickle charge" solar panels only put out 200mA or
so.

Also, a diode is so that the battery doesn't "backfeed" the panel, not to
prevent overcharging.

Based on this, I'd say you'd be safe with a 2A panel, paralleled to both
batteries (assuming there's no load on the batteries). I've used a 2A panel on
one 4D battery over the summer, and it seemed to work well. I doubt one of
these
"trickle charge" panels would be useful for the long term.

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Solar Panels
 

Lloyd Sumpter wrote:

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about .4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Lloyd, sorry to have to point it out, but there's an error in your statement. .4 amps continuously is .4 x 24 hours/day = 9.6 AH per day.

Taking your assumption of having to produce 80 AH during a three month period and assumming that the panel is only charging an average of 8 hours per day, you'd only need to develope 55ma (.055 amps) from the solar panel to maintain the charge.
(80 AH / 182 days / 8 hours per day = .055 Amps)
--
Dan Best - (707) 431-1662, Healdsburg, CA 95448
B-2/75 1977-1979
Tayana 37 #192, "Tricia Jean" http://rangerbest.home.comcast.net/TriciaJean.JPG

Solar Panels
 

Lloyd Sumpter wrote:

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about .4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Lloyd, sorry to have to point it out, but there's an error in your statement. .4 amps continuously is .4 x 24 hours/day = 9.6 AH per day.

Taking your assumption of having to produce 80 AH during a three month period and assumming that the panel is only charging an average of 8 hours per day, you'd only need to develope 55ma (.055 amps) from the solar panel to maintain the charge.
(80 AH / 182 days / 8 hours per day = .055 Amps)
--
Dan Best - (707) 431-1662, Healdsburg, CA 95448
B-2/75 1977-1979
Tayana 37 #192, "Tricia Jean" http://rangerbest.home.comcast.net/TriciaJean.JPG

Solar Panels
 

Lloyd's estimate started out strong, with an estimate of 0.4 amp hours
of trickle per day.
But that means 0.4 amps for ONE hour per day

So a 1/8 amp panel at 14 volts (for 3 or 4 hours per day)
would do the job for each battery.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 08:41:51 -0800, "Lloyd Sumpter"
wrote:

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 +0000, Hmseconomy wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about .4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Now, since a solar panel only puts out anything about 50% of the time (assume
full sun all day) you would need an 800mA panel. But a "1 Amp" panel only puts
out close to 1 amp in full sun when the sun's directly perpendicular to the
cell, I'd put it a 60-70% "fudge factor" (more if you live in a cloudy area).
This means you need about a 1.3A panel per battery.

Note that most of these "trickle charge" solar panels only put out 200mA or so.

Also, a diode is so that the battery doesn't "backfeed" the panel, not to
prevent overcharging.

Based on this, I'd say you'd be safe with a 2A panel, paralleled to both
batteries (assuming there's no load on the batteries). I've used a 2A panel on
one 4D battery over the summer, and it seemed to work well. I doubt one of these
"trickle charge" panels would be useful for the long term.

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Solar Panels
 

Lloyd's estimate started out strong, with an estimate of 0.4 amp hours
of trickle per day.
But that means 0.4 amps for ONE hour per day

So a 1/8 amp panel at 14 volts (for 3 or 4 hours per day)
would do the job for each battery.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 08:41:51 -0800, "Lloyd Sumpter"
wrote:

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 +0000, Hmseconomy wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up? Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time? What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about .4
AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Now, since a solar panel only puts out anything about 50% of the time (assume
full sun all day) you would need an 800mA panel. But a "1 Amp" panel only puts
out close to 1 amp in full sun when the sun's directly perpendicular to the
cell, I'd put it a 60-70% "fudge factor" (more if you live in a cloudy area).
This means you need about a 1.3A panel per battery.

Note that most of these "trickle charge" solar panels only put out 200mA or so.

Also, a diode is so that the battery doesn't "backfeed" the panel, not to
prevent overcharging.

Based on this, I'd say you'd be safe with a 2A panel, paralleled to both
batteries (assuming there's no load on the batteries). I've used a 2A panel on
one 4D battery over the summer, and it seemed to work well. I doubt one of these
"trickle charge" panels would be useful for the long term.

Lloyd Sumpter
"Far Cove" Catalina 36

Solar Panels
 

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 19:53:54 +0000, Daniel E. Best wrote:



Lloyd Sumpter wrote:

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about
.4 AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Lloyd, sorry to have to point it out, but there's an error in your statement.
.4 amps continuously is .4 x 24 hours/day = 9.6 AH per day.


Oops - I stand corrected! Chalk it up to not enough coffee.

Lloyd

Solar Panels
 

On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 19:53:54 +0000, Daniel E. Best wrote:



Lloyd Sumpter wrote:

I'll start with an assumption that may be wrong, but...Assume a battery loses
50% of its charge in 3 months, and it's about 80AH. That means it loses about
.4 AH per day. So it needs about .4 amps CONTINUOUSLY to keep it charged.

Lloyd, sorry to have to point it out, but there's an error in your statement.
.4 amps continuously is .4 x 24 hours/day = 9.6 AH per day.


Oops - I stand corrected! Chalk it up to not enough coffee.

Lloyd

Solar Panels
 

On 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 GMT, (Hmseconomy) wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up?

That depends on the size of the marine batteries, the amp-hour rating,
as well as the type of "marine battery"...i.e. starting or deep
cycle.... you have.

Good batteries don't need something to "keep them up", except
occasional use....run the boat.

Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time?

Yes, if you use a battery isolator. Lionheart has an isolator between
house and starting battery banks fed from the Windcharger/solar panel
and shaft alternator. The weaker battery has lower voltage and will
get more current through the series diode. The diodes in the
isolator, however, will keep the batteries from discharging each other
at night.

What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

The series diode in a solar system has nothing to do with protecting
against overcharging. When a solar panel is in the dark, it is NOT an
open circuit. When its charging voltage drops below the battery
voltage connected to it, the battery shoves current through the
darkened solar panel, discharging the battery in the process. The
series diode prevents this.

There IS a charge limiter you can buy to prevent the solar panel from
overcharging (percolating) your battery. It's called a "charge
limiter" or "charge regulator" and is sold by solar companies.


Larry W4CSC

NNNN

Solar Panels
 

On 23 Nov 2003 16:06:53 GMT, (Hmseconomy) wrote:

What's the minimum amps/volts output needed to trickle charge two marine
batteries to keep them up?

That depends on the size of the marine batteries, the amp-hour rating,
as well as the type of "marine battery"...i.e. starting or deep
cycle.... you have.

Good batteries don't need something to "keep them up", except
occasional use....run the boat.

Can a single small trickle charge panel charge two
batteries at the same time?

Yes, if you use a battery isolator. Lionheart has an isolator between
house and starting battery banks fed from the Windcharger/solar panel
and shaft alternator. The weaker battery has lower voltage and will
get more current through the series diode. The diodes in the
isolator, however, will keep the batteries from discharging each other
at night.

What's the recommended connection method? Need a
diode to protect against overcharging (even with a minimum output panel?). Any
advice would be appreciated.

The series diode in a solar system has nothing to do with protecting
against overcharging. When a solar panel is in the dark, it is NOT an
open circuit. When its charging voltage drops below the battery
voltage connected to it, the battery shoves current through the
darkened solar panel, discharging the battery in the process. The
series diode prevents this.

There IS a charge limiter you can buy to prevent the solar panel from
overcharging (percolating) your battery. It's called a "charge
limiter" or "charge regulator" and is sold by solar companies.


Larry W4CSC

NNNN

Solar Panels
 

This cold be handled by a 5 Watt panel such as this one featured on
the Boat/US site. It has a built in diode. BRBR


Thanks to you all for the info on solar panels. BTW, I just bought the 5 watt
panel suggested by jeff. As it turns out, this panel is on sale thru the
BoatUS website for $20 off the list price. A bargain. Thanks again.

Solar Panels
 

This cold be handled by a 5 Watt panel such as this one featured on
the Boat/US site. It has a built in diode. BRBR


Thanks to you all for the info on solar panels. BTW, I just bought the 5 watt
panel suggested by jeff. As it turns out, this panel is on sale thru the
BoatUS website for $20 off the list price. A bargain. Thanks again.