AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

On May 23, 6:35 pm, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 23 May 2007 09:46:15 -0700, navti wrote:



AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat

I just bought 2 AGM 110AH leisure batteries

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...sspagename=STR...

They just got here and they are both completely flat,

The dealer said that was normal and i should trickle charge them for
24 hours,

He said they had been on the shelf for 8 months,

Shouldnt he have been charging them during that time ?
Shouldnt they be kept in storage at 50 per cent charge ?

Any feedback greatly appreciated.

AGM batteries have a very low self-discharge rate. About 1% per month.
What you have does not sound right to me. 8 months on the shelf should
not have left the batteries totally flat. The batteries may still work
and take a charge, but their capacity and service life have been
affected. Personally, I'd be asking for a refund. I would not accept a
replacement, because at this point, what's to stop the dealer from
charging up another set of flat batteries and sending them as
replacements. They will arrive seeming good, but they will be the same
as what you have. He's already lied to you about this being "normal".
It isn't.

CWM

thanks

the batteries read 10.5 v and 11.5 v respectively

is there any way to tell how old they are ?

could i contact the manufacturer with the serial numbers ?

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"navti" wrote in message
ups.com...
On May 23, 6:35 pm, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 23 May 2007 09:46:15 -0700, navti wrote:



AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat

I just bought 2 AGM 110AH leisure batteries

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...sspagename=STR...

They just got here and they are both completely flat,

The dealer said that was normal and i should trickle charge them for
24 hours,

He said they had been on the shelf for 8 months,

Shouldnt he have been charging them during that time ?
Shouldnt they be kept in storage at 50 per cent charge ?

Any feedback greatly appreciated.

AGM batteries have a very low self-discharge rate. About 1% per
month.
What you have does not sound right to me. 8 months on the shelf
should
not have left the batteries totally flat. The batteries may still
work
and take a charge, but their capacity and service life have been
affected. Personally, I'd be asking for a refund. I would not accept
a
replacement, because at this point, what's to stop the dealer from
charging up another set of flat batteries and sending them as
replacements. They will arrive seeming good, but they will be the
same
as what you have. He's already lied to you about this being "normal".
It isn't.

CWM

thanks

the batteries read 10.5 v and 11.5 v respectively

is there any way to tell how old they are ?

could i contact the manufacturer with the serial numbers ?



I bet I know what happened. Some ignorant battery sellers just add acid
and never give the battery an initial charge. They suffer from this old
wives tale that batteries are "dry charged." There is no such thing as
dry charged. Any lead-acid battery needs to have electrolyte added then
it needs to sit for about half an hour then it needs to be topped off to
the upper limit line. Then it needs to be placed on a charger that runs
at 1/10th the amp hour rating and it needs to sit there and charge for
24 hours min.

If a battery never gets this proper initial charge it will never perform
up to its specs and it will have a shorter working life.

Send the damned things back and stop payment. Hopefully you used a
credit card.

Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

the latest is both batteries are now sitting at 11.66 V
after 6hrs trickle charge.

what voltage should they go to when they are fully charged (assuming
they arent totally dead ) ?

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

On May 24, 11:36 am, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 24 May 2007 01:09:19 -0700, navti wrote:

the latest is both batteries are now sitting at 11.66 V
after 6hrs trickle charge.

what voltage should they go to when they are fully charged (assuming
they arent totally dead ) ?

Even if they take a full charge and reach the correct voltage, they have lost
capacity. They are probably now 30 amp hour batteries, rather than the 110 you
paid for. They are damaged.


they were manufactured in November 2003 according to the distributor
(serial K3 )

according to the dealer i bought them from they have never been used
since then

he reckons once they are fully charged up they will be ok

this is doing my head in,

can anyone give me instructions on how to test his claim

1) charge them for 24 hrs and get them as close to 13v as they will go

2) let them settle for 24 hours

3) test voltage again

4) do a load test

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"navti" wrote in message
oups.com...
On May 24, 11:36 am, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 24 May 2007 01:09:19 -0700, navti wrote:

the latest is both batteries are now sitting at 11.66 V
after 6hrs trickle charge.

what voltage should they go to when they are fully charged (assuming
they arent totally dead ) ?

Even if they take a full charge and reach the correct voltage, they have
lost
capacity. They are probably now 30 amp hour batteries, rather than the
110 you
paid for. They are damaged.


they were manufactured in November 2003 according to the distributor
(serial K3 )

according to the dealer i bought them from they have never been used
since then

he reckons once they are fully charged up they will be ok

this is doing my head in,

can anyone give me instructions on how to test his claim

1) charge them for 24 hrs and get them as close to 13v as they will go

2) let them settle for 24 hours

3) test voltage again

4) do a load test



You bought batteries that have layed around for 4 years?? I have to
assume you rec'd a 'big' discount.
At this point I'd call the manufacturer and talk to their technical dept.

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

On May 24, 1:31 pm, "Don White" wrote:
"navti" wrote in message

oups.com...



On May 24, 11:36 am, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 24 May 2007 01:09:19 -0700, navti wrote:

the latest is both batteries are now sitting at 11.66 V
after 6hrs trickle charge.

what voltage should they go to when they are fully charged (assuming
they arent totally dead ) ?

Even if they take a full charge and reach the correct voltage, they have
lost
capacity. They are probably now 30 amp hour batteries, rather than the
110 you
paid for. They are damaged.

they were manufactured in November 2003 according to the distributor
(serial K3 )

according to the dealer i bought them from they have never been used
since then

he reckons once they are fully charged up they will be ok

this is doing my head in,

can anyone give me instructions on how to test his claim

1) charge them for 24 hrs and get them as close to 13v as they will go

2) let them settle for 24 hours

3) test voltage again

4) do a load test

You bought batteries that have layed around for 4 years?? I have to
assume you rec'd a 'big' discount.
At this point I'd call the manufacturer and talk to their technical dept.

The guy who sold me them told me they were BRAND NEW.

Turns out they were 3 and a half years old.

They were cheap : 30 GB pounds each.

When he said the were new he meant they had never been used.

If they have never been used will they not still work OK ?

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On 24 May 2007 05:39:06 -0700, navti wrote:

On May 24, 1:31 pm, "Don White" wrote:
"navti" wrote in message

oups.com...



On May 24, 11:36 am, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 24 May 2007 01:09:19 -0700, navti wrote:

the latest is both batteries are now sitting at 11.66 V
after 6hrs trickle charge.

what voltage should they go to when they are fully charged
(assuming
they arent totally dead ) ?

Even if they take a full charge and reach the correct voltage,
they have
lost
capacity. They are probably now 30 amp hour batteries, rather
than the
110 you
paid for. They are damaged.

they were manufactured in November 2003 according to the
distributor
(serial K3 )

according to the dealer i bought them from they have never been
used
since then

he reckons once they are fully charged up they will be ok

this is doing my head in,

can anyone give me instructions on how to test his claim

1) charge them for 24 hrs and get them as close to 13v as they
will go

2) let them settle for 24 hours

3) test voltage again

4) do a load test

You bought batteries that have layed around for 4 years?? I have
to
assume you rec'd a 'big' discount.
At this point I'd call the manufacturer and talk to their technical
dept.

The guy who sold me them told me they were BRAND NEW.

Turns out they were 3 and a half years old.

They were cheap : 30 GB pounds each.

When he said the were new he meant they had never been used.

If they have never been used will they not still work OK ?

NO! Get a grip and deal with the fact that you've been ripped off.
Stop hemming and hawing, and deal with it.

The dealer is a plain thief. He has lied to you several times now, and
openly contradicted himself about the age. If you paid with a credit
card, you should be contacting your bank by phone ASAP (like before
you reply to any more posts) for instructions on how to file a formal
STOP PAYMENT complaint in writing. The batteries are JUNK. It's not in
any way a question - they are old, useless, damaged batteries.

CWM


Probably but not necessarily. And for your information AGM batteries are
lead/acid batteries and need to be charged just like any other lead/acid
battery once the electrolyte is added. AGM stands for absorbed glass
mat. What does it absorb? It absorbs the electrolyte meaning it is held
in a mat and does not just slosh around like in a flooded lead/acid
battery. So get a clue, you fool. Navti MAY have gotten ripped off but
not necessarily. I understand AGM batteries are not so prone to
sulfation as flooded batteries so they could still be OK after a good
long slow charge. I think Navti is on the right track slowly charging
them up. If they go to 12.5 volts in two or three days and can pass a
load test then he might be OK. Now, go **** yourself you little wuss.

Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
The batteries are 4 years old, and have been allowed to sit in a
discharged state. ALL lead Acid batteries have a shelf life. AGM's if
maintained, have a longer shelf life than wet cells. You can't turn
back the clock. The batteries have used up 4 years of thier potential
lifespan, and have further been hurt by sitting discharged. Any
battery manufacturer will tell you exactly the same thing.

If they were initially charged correctly and have just been sitting
slowly discharging, they could still be OK. Instead of maybe having 500
charge cycles remaining maybe they will have 499 charge cycles
remaining. The lifespan of batteries is measured more in discharge
cycles than years.


Well, duh! And in the case of AGM's the electrolyte is added at the
factory. Wet Cell Batteries are usually shipped dry and then filled
and charged at the time of purchase. They start to age as soon as you
fill them. Mass Merchants such as Walmart, pre-fill Wet Cell batteries
before putting them out for sale. That's really not the best way to do
it.

But, did the factory go through the proper initial charge sequence?
Maybe or maybe not. The best way to do it is as I stated. Add the
electrolyte yourself and charge it correctly yourself. Then put it to
work immediately.

You seem to be the fool, here Neal. Unlike you, I own a boat. And my
boat has AGM batteries.

OK, if you insist on calling a MacGregor26M a boat. Many people would
say otherwise.


He bought and paid for new batteries. He received old defective junk.
There is absolutely NO possibility of these batteries performing the
same as a truly new battery that has been treated proerly. ZERO
Possibility..

Reading comprehension is not your strong suit. He bought and paid for
unused batteries - not new batteries. Read his posts again, you wuss.
Granted the batteries are old and they won't perform as well as new ones
but they still might represent a decent value provided they charge up
and hold a charge and pass a load test. Again, it the cycling of the
batteries more than the age that matters.
test then he might be OK.

Until they die completely in 2 months or maybe a little longer. BY
then he will have no recourse and will be buying new batteries again.

Not your problem, you ******. Let him worry about that.

Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...

That's what I'm doing. I'm suggesting to him that he stop fooling
around and get his money back while he still has a chance. I bought my
own batteries direct from the national distributor, and not by
mailorder or from a store where they might have sat wasting away for
months or years before I bought them. I bought them from the same
distributor that supplies them to West Marine, Defender and all the
other retail marine stores. Nobody rotates battery stock faster than
these guys. Nobody. My batteries were manufactured less than a month
before I got them.

CWM

If your smart like me you'll never BUY another battery. That's dumb. . .

I've got a better system than you have. I used to buy my batteries from
K-Mart so I could take advantage of their warranty but then they
shortened up the free-replacement warranty. So now I buy them from
Advance Auto where they have a year to three year replacement warranty
and pro-rated up to five years on their premium batteries. So I buy the
premium three-year batteries and at about two or two and a half years I
dump the acid out of one cell and put water back in instead of acid.
Then I take it back and say it has a dead cell. They test it and put it
on their fast charger and the cell stays dead so they give me a free
replacement new battery. I haven't bought batteries in over fifteen
years now.

K-Mart is good for free printer cartridges though. Every time you need
new ink cartriges visit K-Mart and buy a new printer that has the same
ink cartriges. Carefully open the package and remove the new cartridges.
Install your empties in the new printer. Package it back up and return
it telling them it wouldn't install and work on your computer. Tell them
you have an old Apple laptop. They'll give you a full refund without
knowing the thing has empty ink cartriges in it. Then they'll sell it
some loser who doesn't check the box carefully enough to realize it's
been opened. Bwahahahahahhahahahaha!


Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 May 2007 13:20:14 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
. ..

That's what I'm doing. I'm suggesting to him that he stop fooling
around and get his money back while he still has a chance. I bought
my
own batteries direct from the national distributor, and not by
mailorder or from a store where they might have sat wasting away for
months or years before I bought them. I bought them from the same
distributor that supplies them to West Marine, Defender and all the
other retail marine stores. Nobody rotates battery stock faster than
these guys. Nobody. My batteries were manufactured less than a month
before I got them.

CWM

If your smart like me you'll never BUY another battery. That's dumb. .
.

I've got a better system than you have. I used to buy my batteries
from
K-Mart so I could take advantage of their warranty but then they
shortened up the free-replacement warranty. So now I buy them from
Advance Auto where they have a year to three year replacement warranty
and pro-rated up to five years on their premium batteries. So I buy
the
premium three-year batteries and at about two or two and a half years
I
dump the acid out of one cell and put water back in instead of acid.
Then I take it back and say it has a dead cell. They test it and put
it
on their fast charger and the cell stays dead so they give me a free
replacement new battery. I haven't bought batteries in over fifteen
years now.

K-Mart is good for free printer cartridges though. Every time you need
new ink cartriges visit K-Mart and buy a new printer that has the same
ink cartriges. Carefully open the package and remove the new
cartridges.
Install your empties in the new printer. Package it back up and return
it telling them it wouldn't install and work on your computer. Tell
them
you have an old Apple laptop. They'll give you a full refund without
knowing the thing has empty ink cartriges in it. Then they'll sell it
some loser who doesn't check the box carefully enough to realize it's
been opened. Bwahahahahahhahahahaha!


Wilbur Hubbard

Homeless Dumpster Divers come up with some rather inventive ways to
squeak by. The ones with no character, or honor will even do things
that are outright dishonest

I can remember you posting about this K-Mart battery scam as Captain
Neal, many times.

CWM

I got the idea from the Good Captain... He da MAN.

Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 May 2007 13:41:09 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
I got the idea from the Good Captain... He da MAN.

Wilbur Hubbard

You da Capt. Neal. You also da Ellen MacArthur.

CWM

Ya, he got the idea from Capt. Neal...over 15 years ago. rofl

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 May 2007 13:20:14 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
. ..

That's what I'm doing. I'm suggesting to him that he stop fooling
around and get his money back while he still has a chance. I bought my
own batteries direct from the national distributor, and not by
mailorder or from a store where they might have sat wasting away for
months or years before I bought them. I bought them from the same
distributor that supplies them to West Marine, Defender and all the
other retail marine stores. Nobody rotates battery stock faster than
these guys. Nobody. My batteries were manufactured less than a month
before I got them.

CWM

If your smart like me you'll never BUY another battery. That's dumb. . .

I've got a better system than you have. I used to buy my batteries from
K-Mart so I could take advantage of their warranty but then they
shortened up the free-replacement warranty. So now I buy them from
Advance Auto where they have a year to three year replacement warranty
and pro-rated up to five years on their premium batteries. So I buy the
premium three-year batteries and at about two or two and a half years I
dump the acid out of one cell and put water back in instead of acid.
Then I take it back and say it has a dead cell. They test it and put it
on their fast charger and the cell stays dead so they give me a free
replacement new battery. I haven't bought batteries in over fifteen
years now.

K-Mart is good for free printer cartridges though. Every time you need
new ink cartriges visit K-Mart and buy a new printer that has the same
ink cartriges. Carefully open the package and remove the new cartridges.
Install your empties in the new printer. Package it back up and return
it telling them it wouldn't install and work on your computer. Tell them
you have an old Apple laptop. They'll give you a full refund without
knowing the thing has empty ink cartriges in it. Then they'll sell it
some loser who doesn't check the box carefully enough to realize it's
been opened. Bwahahahahahhahahahaha!


Wilbur Hubbard

Homeless Dumpster Divers come up with some rather inventive ways to
squeak by. The ones with no character, or honor will even do things
that are outright dishonest

I can remember you posting about this K-Mart battery scam as Captain
Neal, many times.

CWM


Neal is a thief and a liar. What do you expect?


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

show me a male who doesnt find teenage girls attractive and ill show
you either a liar , a eunuch or a homoseuxual.

but what does that have to do with my batteries ?

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"navti" wrote in message
ps.com...

show me a male who doesnt find teenage girls attractive and ill show
you either a liar , a eunuch or a homoseuxual.

The latter would be Capt. JG, the first would be Dave and the middle
will be Charlie. Bwahahahahahhahahahahahhahahah!

but what does that have to do with my batteries ?

These ******s are just here to see themselves in print. They have little
desire to help. They would rather just laud their own delusional
superiority and brag about their own supposed superior choices in life.
They are clueless dolts with no life and no charity and no wisdom. Do
like I do, use them as a source of humor. Suffer their disruption and
pray for their eventual salvation.

Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

* navti wrote, On 5/24/2007 8:39 AM:

The guy who sold me them told me they were BRAND NEW.

Turns out they were 3 and a half years old.

They were cheap : 30 GB pounds each.

When he said the were new he meant they had never been used.

If they have never been used will they not still work OK ?


I'll toss in my two cents ...

The seller was dishonest when claiming they were "new." Assuming you
want quality batteries, you should make every effort to return them.

If you find you're stuck with them, the first step is to charge them
and do a load test. They will probably charge up and appear to be
functioning, but with a serious load, they will show a diminished
capacity. It may only be down to 80%, which wouldn't be too bad,
given the price, or they might be at 20%.

If they are greatly diminished, it may be possible to resurrect them
with equalizing. Contrary to general "wisdom" it is possible to
equalize AGM's, but it requires the proper parameters and a good
charger that can be adjusted. You should call the manufacturer - the
first person you talk to will probably say its impossible, but you may
get someone to give you a safe procedure.

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 May 2007 18:21:53 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"navti" wrote in message
oups.com...

show me a male who doesnt find teenage girls attractive and ill show
you either a liar , a eunuch or a homoseuxual.

The latter would be Capt. JG, the first would be Dave and the middle
will be Charlie. Bwahahahahahhahahahahahhahahah!

but what does that have to do with my batteries ?

These ******s are just here to see themselves in print. They have
little
desire to help. They would rather just laud their own delusional
superiority and brag about their own supposed superior choices in
life.
They are clueless dolts with no life and no charity and no wisdom. Do
like I do, use them as a source of humor. Suffer their disruption and
pray for their eventual salvation.

Wilbur Hubbard

Newsgroups: alt.sailing.asa
From: "Capt. Neal®"
Date: 1999/12/12
Subject: P30 Lowrider


Correction. Those were not electric shocks that made
Bobsprit's boat bounce up and down. They were hydraulic
jackstands.

I think you also need a lesson about flat-chested women.
Flat chested women are, almost without exception, better
lovers. They have had to develop certain skills below the
waistline in order to compensate for their small mammaries.
They know what it takes to please a man because of it. I
don't know about you but I have never had a pair of
mammaries, regardless of how big they were, give me what an
educated vagina can.

There is yet another reason why every man should learn to
love flat-chested women . . . many young women do not grow
them until they are 12 or 13. Would you honestly rule them
out because of it?

Respectfully,
Capt. Neal
~~~~~~~~~~~~~



Huh? What's something Capt. Neal wrote go to do with me? And, besides,
the man has a point. If you had a flat-chested 13-year-old daughter
would you not love her until she developed breasts?

Further proof that Bitty Bill is a wack job, nutcase loser. I issue you
this challenge Bitty Bill. Prove I'm Capt. Neal. Put up or shut up. You
ignorant putz!

Wilbur Hubbard

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 May 2007 20:55:29 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
. ..
On Thu, 24 May 2007 18:21:53 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"navti" wrote in message
groups.com...

show me a male who doesnt find teenage girls attractive and ill
show
you either a liar , a eunuch or a homoseuxual.

The latter would be Capt. JG, the first would be Dave and the middle
will be Charlie. Bwahahahahahhahahahahahhahahah!

but what does that have to do with my batteries ?

These ******s are just here to see themselves in print. They have
little
desire to help. They would rather just laud their own delusional
superiority and brag about their own supposed superior choices in
life.
They are clueless dolts with no life and no charity and no wisdom.
Do
like I do, use them as a source of humor. Suffer their disruption
and
pray for their eventual salvation.

Wilbur Hubbard

Newsgroups: alt.sailing.asa
From: "Capt. Neal®"
Date: 1999/12/12
Subject: P30 Lowrider


Correction. Those were not electric shocks that made
Bobsprit's boat bounce up and down. They were hydraulic
jackstands.

I think you also need a lesson about flat-chested women.
Flat chested women are, almost without exception, better
lovers. They have had to develop certain skills below the
waistline in order to compensate for their small mammaries.
They know what it takes to please a man because of it. I
don't know about you but I have never had a pair of
mammaries, regardless of how big they were, give me what an
educated vagina can.

There is yet another reason why every man should learn to
love flat-chested women . . . many young women do not grow
them until they are 12 or 13. Would you honestly rule them
out because of it?

Respectfully,
Capt. Neal
~~~~~~~~~~~~~



Huh? What's something Capt. Neal wrote go to do with me? And, besides,
the man has a point. If you had a flat-chested 13-year-old daughter
would you not love her until she developed breasts?

Further proof that Bitty Bill is a wack job, nutcase loser. I issue
you
this challenge Bitty Bill. Prove I'm Capt. Neal. Put up or shut up.
You
ignorant putz!

Wilbur Hubbard

You have already proved many times that you are Capt. Neal. Nobody has
any
question whatsoever about that.

Thanks for the Captain Neal seal of approval, by calling me a "putz".
That seals
it!

CWM

You're entirely too easy. Bwahahahahahahahahaha!

Respectfully,
Capt. Wilbur Hubbard
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

AGM Leisure battery 110AH arrived flat
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
And now the question is: did Binary Bill change his stripes when he
became
Charlie Morgan.

Once a skunk always a skunk. I know one thing. That is he failed to get
his scent gland removed. Phewwwweeeeeeeeee!

Wilbur Hubbard