Finally used the RF
 

I finally managed to get out by myself to try out the new CDI roller
furling on my 28' S2. Why didn't ppl tell me how much easier it would
make sailing? (Oh, many ppl did, but being something of a
luddite....). It was great, furled and unfurled at least 6 times just
cuz it was so easy. With a hank on jib, after I put it away, I would
not get it back out for any reason cuz of the hassle, now, no problem.
Its great. NOW, I want Lazy Jacks.

Finally used the RF
 

Wait until you sail on a boat with roller furling masts.......Totally
spoiled....Lazy jacks like hell....



On 27 Oct 2003 15:44:41 -0800, (Parallax)
wrote:

I finally managed to get out by myself to try out the new CDI roller
furling on my 28' S2. Why didn't ppl tell me how much easier it would
make sailing? (Oh, many ppl did, but being something of a
luddite....). It was great, furled and unfurled at least 6 times just
cuz it was so easy. With a hank on jib, after I put it away, I would
not get it back out for any reason cuz of the hassle, now, no problem.
Its great. NOW, I want Lazy Jacks.


Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

Finally used the RF
 

Finally used the RF
 

Lazy jacks are great for large mains -- they were an essential part of
being able to handle Swee****er short handed, but her main is 750 sq
ft.

On a 28' boat, though, I might pass.
1) They interfere with the sail cover. Either the cover has to be cut
around them or you have to pull them down to the gooseneck before
putting on the cover.
2) If you have battens, you have to be very careful hoisting the sail,
else the battens get caught under a lazy jack. Although you routinely
head upwind before hoisting, with lazy jacks you have to do it with
considerably more precision.
3) If you rig them with blocks up the mast, then the portion going up
the mast will slap in the wind. If you rig them deadended on the upper
mast, then the block under the boom will catch the sail.

Jim Woodward
www.mvFintry.com

(Parallax) wrote in message . com...
I finally managed to get out by myself to try out the new CDI roller
furling on my 28' S2. Why didn't ppl tell me how much easier it would
make sailing? (Oh, many ppl did, but being something of a
luddite....). It was great, furled and unfurled at least 6 times just
cuz it was so easy. With a hank on jib, after I put it away, I would
not get it back out for any reason cuz of the hassle, now, no problem.
Its great. NOW, I want Lazy Jacks.

Finally used the RF
 

x-no-archive:yes (Parallax) wrote:

(Larry W4CSC) wrote in message ...
Wait until you sail on a boat with roller furling masts.......Totally
spoiled....Lazy jacks like hell....



On 27 Oct 2003 15:44:41 -0800, (Parallax)
wrote:

I finally managed to get out by myself to try out the new CDI roller
furling on my 28' S2. Why didn't ppl tell me how much easier it would
make sailing? (Oh, many ppl did, but being something of a
luddite....). It was great, furled and unfurled at least 6 times just
cuz it was so easy. With a hank on jib, after I put it away, I would
not get it back out for any reason cuz of the hassle, now, no problem.
Its great. NOW, I want Lazy Jacks.


Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

I dunno, not being able to fix things easily worries me. I spose
thats why I also drive an old truck with 300,000 miles on it.

We have a roller furling jib, a roller furling staysail and a behind
the mast roller furling main. Totally accessible to be fixed.
Unfortunately, I don't think they make them anymore. You might look
at the boom furling ones though.


grandma Rosalie

Finally used the RF
 

On 28 Oct 2003 05:09:51 -0800, (Parallax)
wrote:

I dunno, not being able to fix things easily worries me. I spose
thats why I also drive an old truck with 300,000 miles on it.

What's to fix? Lionheart has a hollow mast with a huge slot cut in
the back of it where the sail comes out. The end of the sail is
pulled out on the huge hollow boom by a "car" that rides on rollers
pulled by a line that wraps around a pulley built into the end outer
end of the boom, an outhaul, which loops back around inside the boom
to the mast so you can pull on it while uncranking the furler.

The furler is a long 2" diameter stainless steel rod running on roller
bearings top and bottom, the bottom a thrust bearing holding up the
vertical load. It's driven by a right-angle bevel gear to a shaft
that comes out the forward side of the mast through another hollow
top-to-bottom hole full of cables. You insert a winch handle into the
handy fitting and either furl or unfurl after pulling a locking pin
out of its hole. This lets you furl it up and sail with any amount of
sail you're comfortable with in heavier weather. The long rod has a
slot cut in it, top to bottom for the sail to slide up into pulled
along by another "car" that is the uphaul, another line over the top.

I probably wouldn't survive it's "breakage". The mast is HUGE and has
SIX shrouds holding it up.....

You don't even have to turn into the wind to furl it......



Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

Finally used the RF
 

Finally used the RF
 

On 28 Oct 2003 06:20:26 -0800, (Jim Woodward)
wrote:

Lazy jacks are great for large mains -- they were an essential part of
being able to handle Swee****er short handed, but her main is 750 sq
ft.

On a 28' boat, though, I might pass.
1) They interfere with the sail cover. Either the cover has to be cut
around them or you have to pull them down to the gooseneck before
putting on the cover.
2) If you have battens, you have to be very careful hoisting the sail,
else the battens get caught under a lazy jack. Although you routinely
head upwind before hoisting, with lazy jacks you have to do it with
considerably more precision.
3) If you rig them with blocks up the mast, then the portion going up
the mast will slap in the wind. If you rig them deadended on the upper
mast, then the block under the boom will catch the sail.

I agree with Jim on this one. Our main is 47 foot hoist by 15 foot. It
has slugs so it doesn't all come out of the mast when it drops.

I bought a Harken lazy-jack kit when we bought th eboat in 1989, but
have never installed it. Using them on other boats in the mid 30-foot
range is a PITA to me. We normally sail as a couple, so my wife keeps
the boat into the wind while I take the main down or hoist.

We changed to hank-on jibs about 5 years ago and love it this way.

Getting the main up single-handed is a hassle compared with double
handing. I normally hump the halyard by the mast, and my wife at the
wheel gathers the line through the clutch.



I have a new autopilot that might be able to keep the boat into the
wind, but won't be able to try until spring.

Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a

"Religious wisdom is to wisdom as military music is to music."

Finally used the RF
 

Finally used the RF
 

Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:

I bought a Harken lazy-jack kit when we bought th eboat in 1989, but
have never installed it. Using them on other boats in the mid 30-foot
range is a PITA to me. We normally sail as a couple, so my wife keeps
the boat into the wind while I take the main down or hoist.

We changed to hank-on jibs about 5 years ago and love it this way.


Many people *enjoy* testing their ability to endure pain and misery. I
did too - a long time ago. I still "test" because my boat came hank on
without lazyjacks. I too spend mucho time forward with my child bride
steering into the wind - which is, by definition, *always* blowing a
gale or shifting constantly or both. If it weren't I wouldn't need to
adjust the sails. But I can no longer imagine LIKEING it when (not if)
the half-flaked sail catches an errant breeze and heads over the side
blinding the tillerman, let alone depending on the autotiller that can't
see wind shifts. IMHO that's *almost* as much fun as loosing a good fist
fight. The only reason I don't have lazyjacks and a RF genoa 'rat now'
is the yardbirds can't get off their lazy's to install them. Hopefully
by xmas ....

Finally used the RF
 

Vito wrote in message ...
Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:

I bought a Harken lazy-jack kit when we bought th eboat in 1989, but
have never installed it. Using them on other boats in the mid 30-foot
range is a PITA to me. We normally sail as a couple, so my wife keeps
the boat into the wind while I take the main down or hoist.

We changed to hank-on jibs about 5 years ago and love it this way.


Many people *enjoy* testing their ability to endure pain and misery. I
did too - a long time ago. I still "test" because my boat came hank on
without lazyjacks. I too spend mucho time forward with my child bride
steering into the wind - which is, by definition, *always* blowing a
gale or shifting constantly or both. If it weren't I wouldn't need to
adjust the sails. But I can no longer imagine LIKEING it when (not if)
the half-flaked sail catches an errant breeze and heads over the side
blinding the tillerman, let alone depending on the autotiller that can't
see wind shifts. IMHO that's *almost* as much fun as loosing a good fist
fight. The only reason I don't have lazyjacks and a RF genoa 'rat now'
is the yardbirds can't get off their lazy's to install them. Hopefully
by xmas ....

I installed my own RF and am glad I did, Took me three tries to get
it right. Now I know some of the possible ways it can be screwed up
and how to fix them.

NOW, about lazy jacks on a 28' boat. Some ppl say they are a pain and
some ppl say they are great. SO, how do you keep the main from
blinding the helmsman when it has been pulled down and not yet flaked
on the boom?

Finally used the RF
 

Parallax wrote:

NOW, about lazy jacks on a 28' boat. Some ppl say they are a pain and
some ppl say they are great. SO, how do you keep the main from
blinding the helmsman when it has been pulled down and not yet flaked
on the boom?



When in a hurry, I carry the gaskets over my shoulder, drop the sail and
quickly tie up any old way. Might take a minute in adverse conditions,
but the bulk of the sail is tamed within 5-10 seconds of the drop. We
flake the sail properly once things have quieted down.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Finally used the RF
 

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 01:16:48 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:

Parallax wrote:

NOW, about lazy jacks on a 28' boat. Some ppl say they are a pain and
some ppl say they are great. SO, how do you keep the main from
blinding the helmsman when it has been pulled down and not yet flaked
on the boom?



When in a hurry, I carry the gaskets over my shoulder, drop the sail and
quickly tie up any old way. Might take a minute in adverse conditions,
but the bulk of the sail is tamed within 5-10 seconds of the drop. We
flake the sail properly once things have quieted down.


I do the same. It isn't a problem.



Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a

"Religious wisdom is to wisdom as military music is to music."

Finally used the RF
 

Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:

Jere Lull wrote:


When in a hurry, I carry the gaskets over my shoulder, drop the sail and
quickly tie up any old way. Might take a minute in adverse conditions,
but the bulk of the sail is tamed within 5-10 seconds of the drop. We
flake the sail properly once things have quieted down.

I do the same. It isn't a problem.

Obviously fair weather sailors.

Finally used the RF
 

Vito wrote:

Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:


Jere Lull wrote:

When in a hurry, I carry the gaskets over my shoulder, drop the sail and
quickly tie up any old way. Might take a minute in adverse conditions,
but the bulk of the sail is tamed within 5-10 seconds of the drop. We
flake the sail properly once things have quieted down.


I do the same. It isn't a problem.



Obviously fair weather sailors.


I would LOVE to be a fair weather sailor, but we do entirely too many
marginal days and go too far on those days to dodge the weather bullet
every time. We are away from the dock 70-80 days out of our 6 month
season and I still work M-F. I'm pretty good about choosing destinations
based on the expected weather, but as a optimist, we have to reef down
or haul down a few times each season.

My definition of a cruiser includes *never* pushing the weather window:
If it don't look just right for the transit, cruisers don't move.

Still, we know we can can enter our marina under sail with 30+ knots
behind us forcing a couple of crash jibes to get through the breakwaters
-- because we've done it. When we have had to do it without *any* power,
it was no big thing because we'd practiced it so many times with the
engine ticking over just in case.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Finally used the RF
 

On Fri, 31 Oct 2003 02:05:32 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:

Vito wrote:

Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:


Jere Lull wrote:

When in a hurry, I carry the gaskets over my shoulder, drop the sail and
quickly tie up any old way. Might take a minute in adverse conditions,
but the bulk of the sail is tamed within 5-10 seconds of the drop. We
flake the sail properly once things have quieted down.


I do the same. It isn't a problem.



Obviously fair weather sailors.


Silly remark, and incorrect in my case also. As I get older, I try
more to be a fair-weather sailor but it doesn't really work all the
time.

I have been through the reefing routine, but with the sail-shape
control we have I just take down the main when it gets too strong. By
that time the #3 is entirely adequate.



I would LOVE to be a fair weather sailor, but we do entirely too many
marginal days and go too far on those days to dodge the weather bullet
every time. We are away from the dock 70-80 days out of our 6 month
season and I still work M-F. I'm pretty good about choosing destinations
based on the expected weather, but as a optimist, we have to reef down
or haul down a few times each season.



Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a

"Religious wisdom is to wisdom as military music is to music."

Finally used the RF
 

Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:

On Fri, 31 Oct 2003 02:05:32 GMT, Jere Lull wrote:

Vito wrote:

Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:


Jere Lull wrote:

When in a hurry, I carry the gaskets over my shoulder, drop the sail and
quickly tie up any old way. Might take a minute in adverse conditions,
but the bulk of the sail is tamed within 5-10 seconds of the drop. We
flake the sail properly once things have quieted down.


I do the same. It isn't a problem.



Obviously fair weather sailors.


Silly remark, ...

You're right. Please consider the season (Halloween) and accept my
apology.

But I'm still holding out for a roller furled genoa and lazy jacks on a
full battened main - the latter 'cuz I'll never afford a rollre furling
mast.

Finally used the RF
 

The whole question of furling depends on intent, age and aptitude. My
30 year old racer-cruiser has beefy rigging, hank-on everything, and
non-tailing Barlow winches. And a tiller...I love it. I point high,
tack rapidly, and have plenty to keep me busy on Lake Ontario.

The boat's used as a cruiser, but I sail her like I race...as crew on
other people's boats...cheaper that way.

If I had a 40 footer, and was passagemaking, I would have a COMPLETELY
different viewpoint, but for now, I like the simplicity and
performance of hank-on. In fact, I just bought a couple of one-season,
tape luff Kevlar sails for a ridiculously low price, and I am having
them converted to hank ons for a main and a smallish No. 1 (they are
off a fairly similar boat and will only cost a couple of hundred to
recut. If I get three or four seasons out of them, I will have done
very well.

SO to each his or her own. Talk to me in ten or twenty years (I'm
42)...I'm sure I will be a FURLING PURIST by then...G

R..

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 14:33:00 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:

x-no-archive:yes (Parallax) wrote:

(Larry W4CSC) wrote in message ...
Wait until you sail on a boat with roller furling masts.......Totally
spoiled....Lazy jacks like hell....



On 27 Oct 2003 15:44:41 -0800, (Parallax)
wrote:

I finally managed to get out by myself to try out the new CDI roller
furling on my 28' S2. Why didn't ppl tell me how much easier it would
make sailing? (Oh, many ppl did, but being something of a
luddite....). It was great, furled and unfurled at least 6 times just
cuz it was so easy. With a hank on jib, after I put it away, I would
not get it back out for any reason cuz of the hassle, now, no problem.
Its great. NOW, I want Lazy Jacks.


Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

I dunno, not being able to fix things easily worries me. I spose
thats why I also drive an old truck with 300,000 miles on it.

We have a roller furling jib, a roller furling staysail and a behind
the mast roller furling main. Totally accessible to be fixed.
Unfortunately, I don't think they make them anymore. You might look
at the boom furling ones though.


grandma Rosalie

Finally used the RF
 

The whole question of furling depends on intent, age and aptitude. My
30 year old racer-cruiser has beefy rigging, hank-on everything, and
non-tailing Barlow winches. And a tiller...I love it. I point high,
tack rapidly, and have plenty to keep me busy on Lake Ontario.

The boat's used as a cruiser, but I sail her like I race...as crew on
other people's boats...cheaper that way.

If I had a 40 footer, and was passagemaking, I would have a COMPLETELY
different viewpoint, but for now, I like the simplicity and
performance of hank-on. In fact, I just bought a couple of one-season,
tape luff Kevlar sails for a ridiculously low price, and I am having
them converted to hank ons for a main and a smallish No. 1 (they are
off a fairly similar boat and will only cost a couple of hundred to
recut. If I get three or four seasons out of them, I will have done
very well.

SO to each his or her own. Talk to me in ten or twenty years (I'm
42)...I'm sure I will be a FURLING PURIST by then...G

R..

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 14:33:00 GMT, Rosalie B.
wrote:

x-no-archive:yes (Parallax) wrote:

(Larry W4CSC) wrote in message ...
Wait until you sail on a boat with roller furling masts.......Totally
spoiled....Lazy jacks like hell....



On 27 Oct 2003 15:44:41 -0800, (Parallax)
wrote:

I finally managed to get out by myself to try out the new CDI roller
furling on my 28' S2. Why didn't ppl tell me how much easier it would
make sailing? (Oh, many ppl did, but being something of a
luddite....). It was great, furled and unfurled at least 6 times just
cuz it was so easy. With a hank on jib, after I put it away, I would
not get it back out for any reason cuz of the hassle, now, no problem.
Its great. NOW, I want Lazy Jacks.


Larry W4CSC

"Very funny, Scotty! Now, BEAM ME MY CLOTHES! KIRK OUT!"

I dunno, not being able to fix things easily worries me. I spose
thats why I also drive an old truck with 300,000 miles on it.

We have a roller furling jib, a roller furling staysail and a behind
the mast roller furling main. Totally accessible to be fixed.
Unfortunately, I don't think they make them anymore. You might look
at the boom furling ones though.


grandma Rosalie

Finally used the RF
 

On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 09:55:06 -0500, Vito wrote:


Many people *enjoy* testing their ability to endure pain and misery. I
did too - a long time ago. I still "test" because my boat came hank on
without lazyjacks. I too spend mucho time forward with my child bride
steering into the wind - which is, by definition, *always* blowing a
gale or shifting constantly or both.

Oh, you have a child bride too? G Mine is 29...no kid, but
considerably more agile than me and fearless on the foredeck. Being a
wiry 105 pounds and five feet tall, she has a little more trouble
dousing the genoa than I do, but she is far less likely to go over the
side, being a lot closer to the deck than I am in the first place.
Besides, I can luff the main better...G

R.

Finally used the RF
 

On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 09:55:06 -0500, Vito wrote:


Many people *enjoy* testing their ability to endure pain and misery. I
did too - a long time ago. I still "test" because my boat came hank on
without lazyjacks. I too spend mucho time forward with my child bride
steering into the wind - which is, by definition, *always* blowing a
gale or shifting constantly or both.

Oh, you have a child bride too? G Mine is 29...no kid, but
considerably more agile than me and fearless on the foredeck. Being a
wiry 105 pounds and five feet tall, she has a little more trouble
dousing the genoa than I do, but she is far less likely to go over the
side, being a lot closer to the deck than I am in the first place.
Besides, I can luff the main better...G

R.