Non-stop battery charging
 

Still finding surprises on a used boat.

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.

Non-stop battery charging
 

Dick,
First thing to do from a safety standpoint is to install an AC circuit
breaker between your shore power input and the inverter.
Second. Have you checked the "charged voltage" setting on the Link 2000
panel? It should be set to 13.5 V (default value). If it is set higher,
the charger might be sensing that the battery is not completely charged
and try to continuously start the charge cycle.
Have you tried setting the Link 2000 to the default settings?
Have you disconnected the phone cable from the inverter and tried to
operate it without the Link 2000?

Kelton
s/v Isle Escape

Dick Locke wrote:
Still finding surprises on a used boat.

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.

Non-stop battery charging
 

Dick,

This is not normal behavior. If the CHARGE LED is off after you
press the CHARGE button. it should never enter charge mode
until it is enabled again. Suggest you contact Xantrex.

Doug

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
Still finding surprises on a used boat.

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.

Non-stop battery charging
 

On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 20:00:51 -0400, Kelton Joyner
wrote:

Dick,
First thing to do from a safety standpoint is to install an AC circuit
breaker between your shore power input and the inverter.
There is one. It's a 220v boat with a 110 stepdown transformer. The
breaker is before the transformer (I assume, but I better check that.)
The 110 from the transformer goes only to the Heart which distributes
110 to various outlets aound the boat. I can't kil the 110 to the
Heart without killing the shore power to the outlets and I want to
keep it on to run an icemaker/freezer/

Second. Have you checked the "charged voltage" setting on the Link 2000
panel? It should be set to 13.5 V (default value). If it is set higher,
the charger might be sensing that the battery is not completely charged
and try to continuously start the charge cycle.

I don't see how to read or set the "charged voltage." BTW, these are
gels. The charging works fine, goes to the third stage and stays there
while I do minor current draw. It does this whether the charger is
ostensibly on or off, though.

Have you tried setting the Link 2000 to the default settings?

I was considering a hard reset but wanted to check first whether this
situation was normal. I have a question in to Heart but no answer
yet.

Have you disconnected the phone cable from the inverter and tried to
operate it without the Link 2000?

The only control on the inverter/charger is an on and off switch. The
manual has reference to a simpler remote panel with dip switches on
the back, but if there is one of these wired in, it's well hidden. I
believe the Link replaces the standard remote panel.

The Heart manual says:
Dip switch 4: On= Disable, charger responds to on-off switch; Off =
Enable,: Charger on when AC is connected (default). The charger is
acting like Dip switch 4 is on, in the default position. Hmm, I wonder
if there are dip switches on the back of the Link control panel.
Another thing to ceck


Kelton
s/v Isle Escape

Dick Locke wrote:
Still finding surprises on a used boat.

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.

Non-stop battery charging
 

Dick,
Yours must be an older unit. I don't have dip switches on the inverter
or Link 2000. There are two buttons and 4 LEDs on the inverter front
panel. One button turns the inverter on/off, the other button turns the
charger on/off. LEDs indicate status.
http://www.xantrex.com/support/docserve.asp?id=431 is the link to the
users manual.


Dick Locke wrote:
On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 20:00:51 -0400, Kelton Joyner
wrote:


Dick,
First thing to do from a safety standpoint is to install an AC circuit
breaker between your shore power input and the inverter.

There is one. It's a 220v boat with a 110 stepdown transformer. The
breaker is before the transformer (I assume, but I better check that.)
The 110 from the transformer goes only to the Heart which distributes
110 to various outlets aound the boat. I can't kil the 110 to the
Heart without killing the shore power to the outlets and I want to
keep it on to run an icemaker/freezer/


Second. Have you checked the "charged voltage" setting on the Link 2000
panel? It should be set to 13.5 V (default value). If it is set higher,
the charger might be sensing that the battery is not completely charged
and try to continuously start the charge cycle.


I don't see how to read or set the "charged voltage." BTW, these are
gels. The charging works fine, goes to the third stage and stays there
while I do minor current draw. It does this whether the charger is
ostensibly on or off, though.


Have you tried setting the Link 2000 to the default settings?


I was considering a hard reset but wanted to check first whether this
situation was normal. I have a question in to Heart but no answer
yet.


Have you disconnected the phone cable from the inverter and tried to
operate it without the Link 2000?


The only control on the inverter/charger is an on and off switch. The
manual has reference to a simpler remote panel with dip switches on
the back, but if there is one of these wired in, it's well hidden. I
believe the Link replaces the standard remote panel.

The Heart manual says:
Dip switch 4: On= Disable, charger responds to on-off switch; Off =
Enable,: Charger on when AC is connected (default). The charger is
acting like Dip switch 4 is on, in the default position. Hmm, I wonder
if there are dip switches on the back of the Link control panel.
Another thing to ceck


Kelton
s/v Isle Escape

Dick Locke wrote:

Still finding surprises on a used boat.

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.

Non-stop battery charging
 

Dick, are the batteries hot or percolating away the electrolyte?

I just installed 700AH of tall golf cart batteries in Lionheart. The
pulse-type automatic cutoff charger has been running full bore for 2
weeks under the load. It would take 70A for 14 hours to charge them
discharged, but this charger is only a tiny 10A "trickle charger" and
we keep turning the lights, radios, etc., on it. I doubt it will ever
switch off. The solar panel adds about 5A for 8 hours on a sunny day
but that's still not much charging power to these monsters.

At 10A there's no gassing at all. I think I heard one of the 6V
beasts laughing at the Guest charger...(c;

If it's not using much water, the battery isn't "hot" (warm is
normal), and there's not a lot of gassing going on.....stop worrying
about it and let it get on with its job.....



Larry W4CSC

3600 planes with transponders are burning 8-10 million
gallons of kerosene per hour over the USA. R-12 car air
conditioners are responsible for the ozone hole, right?

Non-stop battery charging
 

On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 12:17:42 GMT, (Larry W4CSC) wrote:

If it's not using much water, the battery isn't "hot" (warm is
normal), and there's not a lot of gassing going on.....stop worrying
about it and let it get on with its job.....

They are gels, so probably won't outgas. I'll check temp. Somehow,
though, I think a charger that is on without any indicator lights
saying so is going to bite me on the butt sometime.

Non-stop battery charging
 

You haven't mentioned how you know the charger is running - are you seeing a Voltage or a
current flow? Its possible that you're getting a faulty reading from the Link indicating
a small current flow. You might try putting an Ammeter in series with the battery
connection to verify the flow.

FTIW, my Heart charger is "on" 24/7 most of the time - I don't recall every turning it
off. Since my fridge is DC I rely on the charger to keep it running, and as longs as it
doesn't over/under charge the batteries I don't see the problem.



"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 12:17:42 GMT, (Larry W4CSC) wrote:

If it's not using much water, the battery isn't "hot" (warm is
normal), and there's not a lot of gassing going on.....stop worrying
about it and let it get on with its job.....

They are gels, so probably won't outgas. I'll check temp. Somehow,
though, I think a charger that is on without any indicator lights
saying so is going to bite me on the butt sometime.

Non-stop battery charging
 

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.
ANSWER:
When the link 2000 is connected to the Freedom 25 all control over the
invertor is through the link. Refer to the link manual to set the many
functions of the invertor/charger. There are more than 15 functions
that can be set from the link if you want to monitor and protect your
investment. If your link does not have the advanced battery
temperature function set the charge voltage range based on the average
battery box temperature. Once the functions are set the charger can
be left on to maintain the batteries at full charge and unlike most
other chargers the voltage will remain at float state when small loads
are applied. Because this charger can produce over 100 amps I
recommend the power sharing function be set for low output, most boats
can get buy with a 25 amp. charger.

From the author of books on boat refrigeration
http://www.Kollmann-marine.com

Non-stop battery charging
 

On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 16:43:20 -0400, "Jeff Morris"
jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote:

You haven't mentioned how you know the charger is running - are you seeing a Voltage or a
current flow? Its possible that you're getting a faulty reading from the Link indicating
a small current flow. You might try putting an Ammeter in series with the battery
connection to verify the flow.
Voltage...on the boat's master voltmeter.

If I turn off the charger when the batteries are fully charged, first
a relay clicks off and amps drop to zero or go slightly negative.
Within 5 minutes, the relay clicks on again and the voltage climbs to
the gel's accept voltage of 14.4. Amps go up to 5-10 also. After a
while, amps drop off to a mild trickle (.1-.4) and the voltage drops
to 13.6. The relay never clicks off. The indicator lights never go on.

I'm going to do a hard reset next time I'm on the boat, since nobody
said "Hey mine does that too."


FTIW, my Heart charger is "on" 24/7 most of the time - I don't recall every turning it
off. Since my fridge is DC I rely on the charger to keep it running, and as longs as it
doesn't over/under charge the batteries I don't see the problem.

My refrig is AC, and there should be no DC running except for an
occasional bilge pump.



"Dick Locke" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 12:17:42 GMT, (Larry W4CSC) wrote:

If it's not using much water, the battery isn't "hot" (warm is
normal), and there's not a lot of gassing going on.....stop worrying
about it and let it get on with its job.....

They are gels, so probably won't outgas. I'll check temp. Somehow,
though, I think a charger that is on without any indicator lights
saying so is going to bite me on the butt sometime.

Non-stop battery charging
 

Dick,

We have the exact same Heart unit in our marine canvas
bus. It has never acted as you describe. A call to
Xantrex is cheap. They can give you the correct answer
with no doubt rather than the specuations you will get
otherwise.

Doug

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 16:43:20 -0400, "Jeff Morris"
jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote:

You haven't mentioned how you know the charger is running - are you
seeing a Voltage or a
current flow? Its possible that you're getting a faulty reading from the
Link indicating
a small current flow. You might try putting an Ammeter in series with
the battery
connection to verify the flow.
Voltage...on the boat's master voltmeter.

If I turn off the charger when the batteries are fully charged, first
a relay clicks off and amps drop to zero or go slightly negative.
Within 5 minutes, the relay clicks on again and the voltage climbs to
the gel's accept voltage of 14.4. Amps go up to 5-10 also. After a
while, amps drop off to a mild trickle (.1-.4) and the voltage drops
to 13.6. The relay never clicks off. The indicator lights never go on.

I'm going to do a hard reset next time I'm on the boat, since nobody
said "Hey mine does that too."


FTIW, my Heart charger is "on" 24/7 most of the time - I don't recall
every turning it
off. Since my fridge is DC I rely on the charger to keep it running, and
as longs as it
doesn't over/under charge the batteries I don't see the problem.

My refrig is AC, and there should be no DC running except for an
occasional bilge pump.



"Dick Locke" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 09 Oct 2003 12:17:42 GMT, (Larry W4CSC) wrote:

If it's not using much water, the battery isn't "hot" (warm is
normal), and there's not a lot of gassing going on.....stop worrying
about it and let it get on with its job.....

They are gels, so probably won't outgas. I'll check temp. Somehow,
though, I think a charger that is on without any indicator lights
saying so is going to bite me on the butt sometime.

Non-stop battery charging
 

In article , Dick Locke
wrote:
is it possible that the charger/inverter is wired into the inverter
output? I have my unit wired so that the inverter output goes to only
one outlet on the boat. if your interverter is wired to the entire
boats 110v system then it would be possible that the above scenario
could be the culprit.

If so then the batteries via the inverter would be trying to charge
themselves. Hence the increase of voltage.

karlheinz
s/v Evensong

Still finding surprises on a used boat.

It has a Freedom 25 Charger/Inverter, controlled by a Link 2000.

When I turn off the charger using the button on the Link, the charger
only stays off for a few minutes. When the fully charged battery drops
to about 13.6v, the charger switches back on. It's subtle, because the
"charge", "accept" and "float" lights and the "charge" light do not
light. If you're not watching the voltmeter, you won't notice.

Is this the way it's supposed to work? The manuals imply that this is
the default option that can be overridden by DIP switches on a manual
control panel that I think the Link replaced.

The only way I can shut down the charging is to kill the 110 to the
Heart. Unfortunately there is no separate breaker on that line.

Non-stop battery charging
 

On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 21:54:38 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

We have the exact same Heart unit in our marine canvas
bus. It has never acted as you describe. A call to
Xantrex is cheap. They can give you the correct answer
with no doubt rather than the specuations you will get
otherwise.

Doug

OK, I used the 20th century method and spent a half-hour on the phone.

This was a "situation" they corrected with a software revision soon
after they built my unit in 1994. It needs either a new PLCC chip that
Heart doesn't have any more or a new $300 controller board. I've got a
local service guy looking for the chip. He says he can't get the
board.

When inventorying the boat I found two pieces of 2x4 that had written
on them "Do not throw these away. Needed for installing Heart
Interface." If I have to take the unit out, it could get interesting.

Thanks for the theories and advice, everyone.

Non-stop battery charging
 

At least you got the bottom line. Not sure what you mean about the 20th
century method. I didn't think that the Freedom line existed in 1994. I
assumed it is the same unit we have which is only 3 years old.

Doug

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 9 Oct 2003 21:54:38 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

We have the exact same Heart unit in our marine canvas
bus. It has never acted as you describe. A call to
Xantrex is cheap. They can give you the correct answer
with no doubt rather than the specuations you will get
otherwise.

Doug

OK, I used the 20th century method and spent a half-hour on the phone.

This was a "situation" they corrected with a software revision soon
after they built my unit in 1994. It needs either a new PLCC chip that
Heart doesn't have any more or a new $300 controller board. I've got a
local service guy looking for the chip. He says he can't get the
board.

When inventorying the boat I found two pieces of 2x4 that had written
on them "Do not throw these away. Needed for installing Heart
Interface." If I have to take the unit out, it could get interesting.

Thanks for the theories and advice, everyone.

Non-stop battery charging
 

On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 18:16:05 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

Not sure what you mean about the 20th
century method.

I got wrapped up into thinking (this being 21st century and all) that
email and the internet were the way to solve everything....
incidentally I just got a response to my email of a few days ago
saying "try ferrite beads, keep the phone cord away from the unit and
if that doesn't work bring it in for service." Yikes

Non-stop battery charging
 

Dick,

Ferrite beads only make sense if there is some sort of interference
affecting the unit. The phone cord thing is a mystery to me. Neither
of these can explain your problem in my opinion. Ferrite beads have
sort of become like asprin lately. Put on two beads and call me in the
morning :)

Doug

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 10 Oct 2003 18:16:05 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

Not sure what you mean about the 20th
century method.

I got wrapped up into thinking (this being 21st century and all) that
email and the internet were the way to solve everything....
incidentally I just got a response to my email of a few days ago
saying "try ferrite beads, keep the phone cord away from the unit and
if that doesn't work bring it in for service." Yikes