Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Hi,
I currently own a Westsail 32 and have been doing alot on it to improve it
and getting it ready for cruising. Recently, I read a kind of 'rave' article
about
the Ranger 33 in Latitude 38. That's a free sail mag here in the Bay Area of
San Francisco. Then, I went on www.yachtworld.com to see what the prices
were for these boats. I was amazed at how cheap they are. At least compared
to Westsails.
I know they are different types of boats, etc. The westsail is a heavy
displacement double-ender.
What I was thinking was getting out of the Westsail and into a Ranger
that was well-equipped, had a recent paint, and newer motor. The Westsail
I own needs new standing rigging, mast restepping with new paint and
reinforcement beam in the cabin. The engine is old.
What would I be giving up? I paid $37,000 for the westsail 32 and have
put in about $10,000 so far. The Ranger 33's I saw were going for about
16-22 grand, and some of them seem to be in good shape and well-maintained.
I would like to cruise and live-aboard in the future.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Like most situations, this is entirely dependent on what you intend to
do. A buddy of mine owned a Ranger 33 and loved it, but curiously
moved to a 40' steel ketch after a year. He lived aboard the Ranger
and found it simply too confining. He's 6'3", so that may have been
the issue.

The Ranger is a great coastal/lake boat. Fast and points higher than a
Wetsnail. I own a Viking 33, a similar if slightly "racier" boat of
the same era.

I would no doubt love a Ranger 33, but would I take one world
cruising? No. Too tender, not enough stowage, and just not bulletproof
enough for me to consider taking offshore. Great weekender, however,
club racers, and coastal/Great Lakes boats. They are older boats,
however, and usually need work if they've seen hard action.

Westsail 32s, however, can and do regularly go around the world. Not
overly quickly, mind you, but frequently single-handedly. Along with
Contessas, Bristol Cutters, steel full keelers and a few other
sea-tested designs, the Westsail 32 is proven. Newer, faster fin
keelers might be better overall, but they cost half a million bucks,
don't they?

Check out Ferenc Mate's books on how to creatively retrofit Westsails
and similar designs.

By the way, the sailboat in "The Perfect Storm" was a Westsail 32. In
real life, the real boat ended up on a Maryland beach, was hauled off
by the owner and some volunteers, and, cosmetic damage aside, sailed
off with little problems. It's been sold and continues to sail today.

I don't think anyone's going to say that about a Ranger 33 (or my
boat, either), because Ranger 33s might survive The Perfect Storm, but
their crews probably wouldn't.

My .02

R.

On 07 Aug 2003 23:04:00 GMT, (MLapla4120) wrote:

Hi,
I currently own a Westsail 32 and have been doing alot on it to improve it
and getting it ready for cruising. Recently, I read a kind of 'rave' article
about
the Ranger 33 in Latitude 38. That's a free sail mag here in the Bay Area of
San Francisco. Then, I went on www.yachtworld.com to see what the prices
were for these boats. I was amazed at how cheap they are. At least compared
to Westsails.
I know they are different types of boats, etc. The westsail is a heavy
displacement double-ender.
What I was thinking was getting out of the Westsail and into a Ranger
that was well-equipped, had a recent paint, and newer motor. The Westsail
I own needs new standing rigging, mast restepping with new paint and
reinforcement beam in the cabin. The engine is old.
What would I be giving up? I paid $37,000 for the westsail 32 and have
put in about $10,000 so far. The Ranger 33's I saw were going for about
16-22 grand, and some of them seem to be in good shape and well-maintained.
I would like to cruise and live-aboard in the future.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

I totally agree. It is apples and oranges. Get the Ranger if you want to
race around the buoys.

I had a friend who had a beautiful Westsail 32 for years. He is in his
seventies and just sold it. Still looks new.

Believe it or not, he won a few PHRF cruising races.

Bill
wrote in message
...

Like most situations, this is entirely dependent on what you intend to
do. A buddy of mine owned a Ranger 33 and loved it, but curiously
moved to a 40' steel ketch after a year. He lived aboard the Ranger
and found it simply too confining. He's 6'3", so that may have been
the issue.

The Ranger is a great coastal/lake boat. Fast and points higher than a
Wetsnail. I own a Viking 33, a similar if slightly "racier" boat of
the same era.

I would no doubt love a Ranger 33, but would I take one world
cruising? No. Too tender, not enough stowage, and just not bulletproof
enough for me to consider taking offshore. Great weekender, however,
club racers, and coastal/Great Lakes boats. They are older boats,
however, and usually need work if they've seen hard action.

Westsail 32s, however, can and do regularly go around the world. Not
overly quickly, mind you, but frequently single-handedly. Along with
Contessas, Bristol Cutters, steel full keelers and a few other
sea-tested designs, the Westsail 32 is proven. Newer, faster fin
keelers might be better overall, but they cost half a million bucks,
don't they?

Check out Ferenc Mate's books on how to creatively retrofit Westsails
and similar designs.

By the way, the sailboat in "The Perfect Storm" was a Westsail 32. In
real life, the real boat ended up on a Maryland beach, was hauled off
by the owner and some volunteers, and, cosmetic damage aside, sailed
off with little problems. It's been sold and continues to sail today.

I don't think anyone's going to say that about a Ranger 33 (or my
boat, either), because Ranger 33s might survive The Perfect Storm, but
their crews probably wouldn't.

My .02

R.

On 07 Aug 2003 23:04:00 GMT, (MLapla4120) wrote:

Hi,
I currently own a Westsail 32 and have been doing alot on it to improve
it
and getting it ready for cruising. Recently, I read a kind of 'rave'
article
about
the Ranger 33 in Latitude 38. That's a free sail mag here in the Bay Area
of
San Francisco. Then, I went on www.yachtworld.com to see what the prices
were for these boats. I was amazed at how cheap they are. At least
compared
to Westsails.
I know they are different types of boats, etc. The westsail is a
heavy
displacement double-ender.
What I was thinking was getting out of the Westsail and into a Ranger
that was well-equipped, had a recent paint, and newer motor. The
Westsail
I own needs new standing rigging, mast restepping with new paint and
reinforcement beam in the cabin. The engine is old.
What would I be giving up? I paid $37,000 for the westsail 32 and
have
put in about $10,000 so far. The Ranger 33's I saw were going for about
16-22 grand, and some of them seem to be in good shape and
well-maintained.
I would like to cruise and live-aboard in the future.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Thanks, you guys pretty much confirmed
my thoughts. I'll just have to get out the
checkbook for the next couple of years.
I was, however, hoping to be cruising sooner.

Mark

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

On 08 Aug 2003 22:51:47 GMT, (MLapla4120) wrote:

Thanks, you guys pretty much confirmed
my thoughts. I'll just have to get out the
checkbook for the next couple of years.
I was, however, hoping to be cruising sooner.

Mark

Yes, but you'll be cruising better. Seriously, check out Ferenc Mate's
old books. He owned an owner-finished Westsail 32 for years and if you
can stand his snotty, superior tone (I find him a hilarious writer and
typically Hungarian), you'll find a huge number of improvement project
ideas field-tested on Westsail 32s.

Try the omnibus edition of "The Finely Fitted Yacht". Laughs and solid
ideas galore.

R.

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

I have and read "From a Bare Hull. :)

It was okay. Currently, I'm redoing
the forward cabin. I've taken out the
wood and old insulation. I'm down to
bare hull and what shows is the cloth
used in the fiberglass. My plan is
to roll on West System 403, then sand
it down and apply a coat of slightly off
white paint. After that, I'm going to use
velcro to attach closed cell cushions
of half inch thickness (blue). It should
look nice and be low-maintainence.
Another advantage is easy to clean, soft
enough to prevent bruising and easy access to through bolts.
For the ceiling, half inch white starboard
with the occasional teak strip.
Mark

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Other options should be found.


"MLapla4120" wrote in message
...
I have and read "From a Bare Hull. :)

It was okay. Currently, I'm redoing
the forward cabin. I've taken out the
wood and old insulation. I'm down to
bare hull and what shows is the cloth
used in the fiberglass. My plan is
to roll on West System 403, then sand
it down and apply a coat of slightly off
white paint. After that, I'm going to use
velcro to attach closed cell cushions
of half inch thickness (blue). It should
look nice and be low-maintainence.
Another advantage is easy to clean, soft
enough to prevent bruising and easy access to through bolts.
For the ceiling, half inch white starboard
with the occasional teak strip.
Mark

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Subject

You have got to be kidding or you need a better source of dope.


Excuse me, what aspect of my post led you to insinuate that I use dope?

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Should you not be able to afford a Westsail or Ranger what would be the next
best pre owned boat for blue water.
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
link.net...
Subject

You have got to be kidding or you need a better source of dope.


--
Lew

S/A: Challenge, The Bullet Proof Boat, (Under Construction in the
Southland)
Visit: http://home.earthlink.net/~lewhodgett for Pictures

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

"Denis Marier" wrote:
Should you not be able to afford a Westsail or Ranger what would be the next
best pre owned boat for blue water.

Rangers ain't exactly expensive. Just how low a price range are we
talking about?

Frank (In the interest of full disclosure, I didn't participate in the
basic thread here 'cause I wouldn't own a Westsail at any price; so my
opinion is infinitely biased in favor of Ranger in this comparison.)

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Thanks for the reply. I will see on the internet where I can look at a
ranger 33 and identify its selling price.
"Frank and Ronnie Maier" wrote in message
om...
"Denis Marier" wrote:
Should you not be able to afford a Westsail or Ranger what would be the
next
best pre owned boat for blue water.

Rangers ain't exactly expensive. Just how low a price range are we
talking about?

Frank (In the interest of full disclosure, I didn't participate in the
basic thread here 'cause I wouldn't own a Westsail at any price; so my
opinion is infinitely biased in favor of Ranger in this comparison.)

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

I just finished looking at the Ranger 33 evaluation in the Practical Sailors
and it corroborate your statement.
It is a good coastal sailboat. As with the Westsail32 it is more suited for
blue water cruising. However, getting into the Mistake Cove or Cow Yard
(Maine Coast) in dense fog with a full keel boat could be disastrous in
avoiding the rocky entrance. My friend's full keel sailboat landed on the
rocks with a punched hole in her hull taking on water. He tried to avoid
the rocks but the boat did not turned in time. On the Maine or Nova Scotia
coasts when you land on the rocks in dense fog the Coast Guard are not close
by you are on your own. Many time. I have avoided rocks with the quick
response of the fin keel on my boat. At time, I still have bad dreams about
it.
"DSK" wrote in message
...
"Denis Marier" wrote:
Should you not be able to afford a Westsail or Ranger what would be
the next
best pre owned boat for blue water.

Hmm.. by "blue water" are you talking about some kind of cleaning product?
If
you're talking about ocean passagemaking, Rangers are not particularly
good boats
for that specific task. But they could do it, if other factors make the
Ranger a
strong choice.




Frank and Ronnie Maier wrote:
Rangers ain't exactly expensive. Just how low a price range are we
talking about?

Right. For some reason, Rangers have really been beaten down on the
market... IMHo
they are no worse, and some ways much better, than the 'average'
production boat
of their era. In all they're not particularly well built boats.



Frank (In the interest of full disclosure, I didn't participate in the
basic thread here 'cause I wouldn't own a Westsail at any price; so my
opinion is infinitely biased in favor of Ranger in this comparison.)

I dunno, there's a pretty long list of boats I wouldn't take if they paid
me, but
Westsails make that cut ;)

FWIW YachtWorld.Com for-sale listings have a LONG list of boats ~ 32' that
would
be pretty good choices for cruising at $15K. Certainly most of them need
at least
some upgrading, but what they would mostly need in order to be offshore
capable is
a good skipper.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

x-no-archive:yes "Denis Marier" wrote:

I just finished looking at the Ranger 33 evaluation in the Practical Sailors
and it corroborate your statement.
It is a good coastal sailboat. As with the Westsail32 it is more suited for
blue water cruising. However, getting into the Mistake Cove or Cow Yard
(Maine Coast) in dense fog with a full keel boat could be disastrous in
avoiding the rocky entrance. My friend's full keel sailboat landed on the
rocks with a punched hole in her hull taking on water. He tried to avoid
the rocks but the boat did not turned in time. On the Maine or Nova Scotia
coasts when you land on the rocks in dense fog the Coast Guard are not close
by you are on your own. Many time. I have avoided rocks with the quick
response of the fin keel on my boat. At time, I still have bad dreams about
it.

But if he is talking about blue water or offshore cruising then he
wouldn't be going into Cow Yard in a dense fog if he was sensible.
(and neither would your friend). The kind of boat that is suitable
for that place isn't necessarily exactly the same kind of boat that is
suitable for BW work.

I know that fin keel boats react differently than full keel or
modified full keel boats, but I think there are places where a fin
keel would be a disadvantage just as there are places where a full
keel wouldn't work as well.

In any case, the most important part of the equation is the judgement
and experience of the skipper with the boat that he's skippering in
the place that he's doing it. You rely on the maneuverability of your
boat to get you out of trouble. I would prefer not to get into it in
the first place.


"DSK" wrote in message
...
"Denis Marier" wrote:
Should you not be able to afford a Westsail or Ranger what would be
the next
best pre owned boat for blue water.

Hmm.. by "blue water" are you talking about some kind of cleaning product?
If
you're talking about ocean passagemaking, Rangers are not particularly
good boats
for that specific task. But they could do it, if other factors make the
Ranger a
strong choice.




Frank and Ronnie Maier wrote:
Rangers ain't exactly expensive. Just how low a price range are we
talking about?

Right. For some reason, Rangers have really been beaten down on the
market... IMHo
they are no worse, and some ways much better, than the 'average'
production boat
of their era. In all they're not particularly well built boats.



Frank (In the interest of full disclosure, I didn't participate in the
basic thread here 'cause I wouldn't own a Westsail at any price; so my
opinion is infinitely biased in favor of Ranger in this comparison.)

I dunno, there's a pretty long list of boats I wouldn't take if they paid
me, but
Westsails make that cut ;)

FWIW YachtWorld.Com for-sale listings have a LONG list of boats ~ 32' that
would
be pretty good choices for cruising at $15K. Certainly most of them need
at least
some upgrading, but what they would mostly need in order to be offshore
capable is
a good skipper.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King





grandma Rosalie

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

Denis Marier wrote:

I just finished looking at the Ranger 33 evaluation in the Practical Sailors
and it corroborate your statement.
It is a good coastal sailboat.

Actually, I think it's best for weekending (with more elbow room & comfort than
in smaller boats) and club racing, which is what it was actually designed for.
But it's also possible with the right upgrades, the right equipment, and the
right skills, to sail pretty much anywhere on one of these boats. The Ranger 33
would be a better choice for a budget cruiser (assuming one had the bucks & the
skills to upgrade intelligently) than many of the other mass-produced
racer/cruisers of that era.


As with the Westsail32 it is more suited for
blue water cruising. However, getting into the Mistake Cove or Cow Yard
(Maine Coast) in dense fog with a full keel boat could be disastrous in
avoiding the rocky entrance. My friend's full keel sailboat landed on the
rocks with a punched hole in her hull taking on water. He tried to avoid
the rocks but the boat did not turned in time.

Some full keel boats handle better than others. I've sailed a number of full
keelers that could be maneuvered quite smartly, once you got the hang of it.
It's true that they'll never snap around like a fin keeler.


On the Maine or Nova Scotia
coasts when you land on the rocks in dense fog the Coast Guard are not close
by you are on your own. Many time. I have avoided rocks with the quick
response of the fin keel on my boat. At time, I still have bad dreams about
it.

Sailing doesn't give me bad dreams, thank goodness. Only union electricians and
the IRS.....

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Westsail32 vs. Ranger 33 , which would you like to own?
 

On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 13:01:28 -0400, DSK
wrote:



Actually, I think it's best for weekending (with more elbow room & comfort than
in smaller boats) and club racing, which is what it was actually designed for.
But it's also possible with the right upgrades, the right equipment, and the
right skills, to sail pretty much anywhere on one of these boats. The Ranger 33
would be a better choice for a budget cruiser (assuming one had the bucks & the
skills to upgrade intelligently) than many of the other mass-produced
racer/cruisers of that era.

Possibly, although the upgrades (reinforcing bulkheads, installing
handrails, beefing up the dropboards and portlights and deck gear) are
more than most would consider reasonable, and certainly would not
enhance the value of an old boat, only its safety factor.


As with the Westsail32 it is more suited for
blue water cruising. However, getting into the Mistake Cove or Cow Yard
(Maine Coast) in dense fog with a full keel boat could be disastrous in
avoiding the rocky entrance. My friend's full keel sailboat landed on the
rocks with a punched hole in her hull taking on water. He tried to avoid
the rocks but the boat did not turned in time.

Some full keel boats handle better than others. I've sailed a number of full
keelers that could be maneuvered quite smartly, once you got the hang of it.
It's true that they'll never snap around like a fin keeler.

And it's true that you can master techniques such as backing the jib
to conpensate. The flexibility of the skipper and his ability to learn
(and to time events keyed to the boat) are usually more important than
the boat's characteristics itself.


R.