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installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
I have a couple of older VHFs that I'd like to keep as backups and was
wondering if anyone has replaced the batteries in the packs themselves. I have disassembled the packs but see that the batteries require soldering small metallic strips in a certain configuration to provide proper voltage, etc. My question: HOW to properly solder the new batteries, hopefully easily :-) Appreciatively, Courtney |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
"Courtney Thomas" wrote in
nk.net: I have a couple of older VHFs that I'd like to keep as backups and was wondering if anyone has replaced the batteries in the packs themselves. I have disassembled the packs but see that the batteries require soldering small metallic strips in a certain configuration to provide proper voltage, etc. My question: HOW to properly solder the new batteries, hopefully easily :-) Just take the battery packs to any Batteries Plus Store (www.batteriesplus.com) or ship it in if there's no store near you. Tell them you want them to install the biggest capacity Nickel-Metal Hydride, NOT NI-CD, cells they have. Since your cheaply made little Chinese NiCD battery pack was made, long strides have been made in the battery biz. Current AA sized Ni-Mh cells are 2300 maH (2.3 ampere-hour) and will produce nearly enough current to crank a truck. Look on the battery packs at the labels and you'll see it's, probably, a 700 maH NiCd pack from the Chinese slavers....whatever was as cheap as they could get it to maximize profits. Your new 2.3AH same-sized beast will take 4 times as long to charge on the chinzy Chinese battery charger the walkie came with.....but that's not an issue because it will RUN over 3 times as long as it did the day you bought it before you have to charge it again. Ni-Mh also has NO MEMORY problem, so you can use it and drop it back in the charger, no matter what its state of charge is. Don't leave it in the charger over a week...(c; Cheap chargers are NOT automatic shutoff like your cellphone. When the battery pack gets quite warm to the touch, it's fully charged. The 2.3A recycled beast is about half the cost of another chinzy Chinese cheapie from Standard or Icom or Waste Marine, etc..... As to doing it yourself, forget it. You cannot solder to the cells. You need a special little spot welder to weld the interconnecting straps on the cells. Batteries Plus has one in every store. He touches the strap to the cell, pushes up on it to make contact with the spot welder, there's a little spark as the pulse from the welder makes a perfect weld to the cell, which never even gets warm in the process. There'll be two welds about 1/2" apart on the strap so it can't rotate. It'll take a good set of pliers to pull them off and even then it rips the metal of the strap because the weld is stronger than the strap.... |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
Don't solder! First it is very hard to get the chromed battery terminals to
wet out and second the heat can ruin the battery. Battery packs are welded using discharge type spot welders. You could make a welder based on a stack of electrolytic caps but it would cost more than just taking your pack to Batteries Plus. As Larry said, NiMh batteries have amazing capacity and no memory. They also maintain a more constant voltage until close to discharged BUT they also have a much higher self discharge rate. Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that vs. a fairly level .4% for NiCads. If you plan to use your handheld VHF frequently and at 5W get NiMh and just put it in the charger stand every night. If it will be stored for a couple of weeks between uses get Ni-Cads. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Courtney Thomas" wrote in message nk.net... I have a couple of older VHFs that I'd like to keep as backups and was wondering if anyone has replaced the batteries in the packs themselves. I have disassembled the packs but see that the batteries require soldering small metallic strips in a certain configuration to provide proper voltage, etc. My question: HOW to properly solder the new batteries, hopefully easily :-) Appreciatively, Courtney |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
"Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395
@dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
I have one of those fancy Maha C777+ chargers that charge, discharge and
monitor mAh in, mAh out, voltage and charging time so I have been playing with several different brands of batteries. I use the Maha Powerex 2500s which are the latest version of the highest rated Ni-Mh double A's. Definitely an improvement over a lot of the older models. They have a first 24 hour self discharge rate of about 5% but even Maha says they should not be expected to hold a usable charge longer than about 30 days. The Energizer (Sanyo) Ni-Mh double As are among the worst loosing up to around 25% in the first day. One other thing I have found. You can't get a new Ni-Mh to accept a full charge until it has been cycled 4 or 5 times. If you charge them then use them until the voltage starts to drop and recharge several times you get 20 to 25% more capacity. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry" wrote in message ... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395 @dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
"Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:rXiPg.49461$ok5.21130@dukeread01... I have one of those fancy Maha C777+ chargers that charge, discharge and monitor mAh in, mAh out, voltage and charging time so I have been playing with several different brands of batteries. I use the Maha Powerex 2500s which are the latest version of the highest rated Ni-Mh double A's. Definitely an improvement over a lot of the older models. They have a first 24 hour self discharge rate of about 5% but even Maha says they should not be expected to hold a usable charge longer than about 30 days. The Energizer (Sanyo) Ni-Mh double As are among the worst loosing up to around 25% in the first day. One other thing I have found. You can't get a new Ni-Mh to accept a full charge until it has been cycled 4 or 5 times. If you charge them then use them until the voltage starts to drop and recharge several times you get 20 to 25% more capacity. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry" wrote in message ... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395 @dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. I have two comments on this discussion: 1. Batteries Plus probably uses crappy Chinese batteries like everyone else. If you buy your own batteries from a place like Batteries America you can get high quality Sanyo batteries and other good makes. 2. I have successfully soldered the flat metal tabs on these batteries without any problem. I had no trouble getting solder to wet the tabs. I line up the batteries in the proper series orientation and then bend one tab back onto the battery so that the tab from the next battery lies over it. I then tin both surfaces and then overlap them. Now applying some heat to the outer tab melts the solder on both tabs and connects them. Taping the batteries together beforehand helps keep things aligned. |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
Larry wrote: . . . you can use it and drop it back in the charger, no matter what its state of charge is. Larry, will the fact that the charger was designed for NiCads be a problem? If it's a "trickle" charger, will it fully charge NiMH batteries, just take longer? |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
"Mark" wrote in news:1158636694.029797.229090
@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com: Larry, will the fact that the charger was designed for NiCads be a problem? If it's a "trickle" charger, will it fully charge NiMH batteries, just take longer? No problem at all. Even the simplest NiCD charger will charge them fine. Being much larger, they charge at a slower-than-design rate, which makes their charging even less destructive than normal. I have an old Yaesu FT- 727 ham walkie with a rebuilt Ni-Mh battery pack that's one of the first NiMh batteries I ever saw. It charges and runs great! -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
Where do you get the flat metal tabs and what kind of solder/gun/etc/ do you
use, please ? Thank you, Courtney "Gordon Wedman" wrote in message news:uCzPg.20189$bf5.5278@edtnps90... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:rXiPg.49461$ok5.21130@dukeread01... I have one of those fancy Maha C777+ chargers that charge, discharge and monitor mAh in, mAh out, voltage and charging time so I have been playing with several different brands of batteries. I use the Maha Powerex 2500s which are the latest version of the highest rated Ni-Mh double A's. Definitely an improvement over a lot of the older models. They have a first 24 hour self discharge rate of about 5% but even Maha says they should not be expected to hold a usable charge longer than about 30 days. The Energizer (Sanyo) Ni-Mh double As are among the worst loosing up to around 25% in the first day. One other thing I have found. You can't get a new Ni-Mh to accept a full charge until it has been cycled 4 or 5 times. If you charge them then use them until the voltage starts to drop and recharge several times you get 20 to 25% more capacity. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry" wrote in message ... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395 @dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. I have two comments on this discussion: 1. Batteries Plus probably uses crappy Chinese batteries like everyone else. If you buy your own batteries from a place like Batteries America you can get high quality Sanyo batteries and other good makes. 2. I have successfully soldered the flat metal tabs on these batteries without any problem. I had no trouble getting solder to wet the tabs. I line up the batteries in the proper series orientation and then bend one tab back onto the battery so that the tab from the next battery lies over it. I then tin both surfaces and then overlap them. Now applying some heat to the outer tab melts the solder on both tabs and connects them. Taping the batteries together beforehand helps keep things aligned. |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
What was your procedure and what materials did you use to solder, please ?
Thanks, Courtney "ray lunder" wrote in message ... I soldered some flat tops using that braided ground strap you can get at rat shack etc. I cleaned the tops with alcohol first and tinned both parts. They're supposed to be welded but I've done so many foolish things in my life. p.s. I've been looking for Samsung ICR18650-24 batteries for about 5 years now so if anyone knows how to get 16 of these weird 3.7V dogs please let me know. Best of luck. On Sun, 17 Sep 2006 13:33:53 GMT, "Courtney Thomas" wrote: I have a couple of older VHFs that I'd like to keep as backups and was wondering if anyone has replaced the batteries in the packs themselves. I have disassembled the packs but see that the batteries require soldering small metallic strips in a certain configuration to provide proper voltage, etc. My question: HOW to properly solder the new batteries, hopefully easily :-) Appreciatively, Courtney |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
Courtney Thomas inscribed in red ink for all to know:
Where do you get the flat metal tabs and what kind of solder/gun/etc/ do you use, please ? Thank you, Courtney "Gordon Wedman" wrote in message news:uCzPg.20189$bf5.5278@edtnps90... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:rXiPg.49461$ok5.21130@dukeread01... I have one of those fancy Maha C777+ chargers that charge, discharge and monitor mAh in, mAh out, voltage and charging time so I have been playing with several different brands of batteries. I use the Maha Powerex 2500s which are the latest version of the highest rated Ni-Mh double A's. Definitely an improvement over a lot of the older models. They have a first 24 hour self discharge rate of about 5% but even Maha says they should not be expected to hold a usable charge longer than about 30 days. The Energizer (Sanyo) Ni-Mh double As are among the worst loosing up to around 25% in the first day. One other thing I have found. You can't get a new Ni-Mh to accept a full charge until it has been cycled 4 or 5 times. If you charge them then use them until the voltage starts to drop and recharge several times you get 20 to 25% more capacity. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry" wrote in message ... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395 @dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. I have two comments on this discussion: 1. Batteries Plus probably uses crappy Chinese batteries like everyone else. If you buy your own batteries from a place like Batteries America you can get high quality Sanyo batteries and other good makes. 2. I have successfully soldered the flat metal tabs on these batteries without any problem. I had no trouble getting solder to wet the tabs. I line up the batteries in the proper series orientation and then bend one tab back onto the battery so that the tab from the next battery lies over it. I then tin both surfaces and then overlap them. Now applying some heat to the outer tab melts the solder on both tabs and connects them. Taping the batteries together beforehand helps keep things aligned. Courtney, You can buy the batteries with the tabs already welded on, usually for the same price as the plain ones. But the tabbed ones. As the poster above said, the tabs are easy to solder, and when done reasonably quickly, do not harm the battery when soldering. You should use "electronics" solder when doing the work - that is, rosin core. Do NOT use acid core solder, unless you want corrosion in your battery pack downstream. I use my regular soldering iron - a small cheap one designed for electronics and /or electrical work - I've had it for years - it probably came from Radio Shack. Don't get the smallest one - it will take some heat to get the tabs up to temperature. Using too small an iron will tempt you to hold it in contact with the tabs for a long time, trying to get them hot enough. This WILL cause damage to the battery by heat conduction down the tab. bob s/v Eolian Seattle |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message hlink.net... Where do you get the flat metal tabs and what kind of solder/gun/etc/ do you use, please ? Thank you, Courtney "Gordon Wedman" wrote in message news:uCzPg.20189$bf5.5278@edtnps90... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:rXiPg.49461$ok5.21130@dukeread01... I have one of those fancy Maha C777+ chargers that charge, discharge and monitor mAh in, mAh out, voltage and charging time so I have been playing with several different brands of batteries. I use the Maha Powerex 2500s which are the latest version of the highest rated Ni-Mh double A's. Definitely an improvement over a lot of the older models. They have a first 24 hour self discharge rate of about 5% but even Maha says they should not be expected to hold a usable charge longer than about 30 days. The Energizer (Sanyo) Ni-Mh double As are among the worst loosing up to around 25% in the first day. One other thing I have found. You can't get a new Ni-Mh to accept a full charge until it has been cycled 4 or 5 times. If you charge them then use them until the voltage starts to drop and recharge several times you get 20 to 25% more capacity. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry" wrote in message ... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395 @dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. I have two comments on this discussion: 1. Batteries Plus probably uses crappy Chinese batteries like everyone else. If you buy your own batteries from a place like Batteries America you can get high quality Sanyo batteries and other good makes. 2. I have successfully soldered the flat metal tabs on these batteries without any problem. I had no trouble getting solder to wet the tabs. I line up the batteries in the proper series orientation and then bend one tab back onto the battery so that the tab from the next battery lies over it. I then tin both surfaces and then overlap them. Now applying some heat to the outer tab melts the solder on both tabs and connects them. Taping the batteries together beforehand helps keep things aligned. Courtenay Ray and Bob have pretty much answered your questions. You can buy the batteries with the flat tabs or without from many sources. I've bought them on eBay (cheap Chinese) and from Batteries America (Sanyo). By electronics solder from Radio Shack or perhaps order some from the battery source, eg. Mouser Electronics. I use a 140 watt Weller soldering gun. As Ray and Bob have said, you want lots of heat so that you do not have to hold the soldering gun/iron on the tabs for too long. With the soldering gun I can press the two tinned tabs together, melt the solder in between and then release the trigger. This lets everything cool down and set while I'm still pushing it together. You need a clean tip when doing this or you will have the soldering gun tip soldered to the top tab. Just wipe it clean beforehand with a rag. If you've not done much soldering before you can practice on scrap wire. |
installing new batteries in VHF battery packs ?
Gordon Wedman wrote:
"Courtney Thomas" wrote in message hlink.net... Where do you get the flat metal tabs and what kind of solder/gun/etc/ do you use, please ? Thank you, Courtney "Gordon Wedman" wrote in message news:uCzPg.20189$bf5.5278@edtnps90... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message news:rXiPg.49461$ok5.21130@dukeread01... I have one of those fancy Maha C777+ chargers that charge, discharge and monitor mAh in, mAh out, voltage and charging time so I have been playing with several different brands of batteries. I use the Maha Powerex 2500s which are the latest version of the highest rated Ni-Mh double A's. Definitely an improvement over a lot of the older models. They have a first 24 hour self discharge rate of about 5% but even Maha says they should not be expected to hold a usable charge longer than about 30 days. The Energizer (Sanyo) Ni-Mh double As are among the worst loosing up to around 25% in the first day. One other thing I have found. You can't get a new Ni-Mh to accept a full charge until it has been cycled 4 or 5 times. If you charge them then use them until the voltage starts to drop and recharge several times you get 20 to 25% more capacity. -- Glenn Ashmore I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com "Larry" wrote in message 3... "Glenn Ashmore" wrote in news:Q3fPg.49456$ok5.43395 @dukeread01: Up to 10% in the first 24 hours and 1 or 2% per day after that Hmm....I wonder if that is still true on the new Ni-Mh batteries. I just turned on a little flashlight I keep in my desk. It's got two Tokima 2200 maH Ni-Mh batteries I can't remember when I charged, but it has to be 8-9 months ago. The bulb, not LED, in the little flashlight is just as bright as it ever is. I'm going to leave it on to see how long it will be until it's dead. 230maH in the first day? Wow, that's a lot of loss... These batteries should have self-discharged long ago, by now. -- There's amazing intelligence in the Universe. You can tell because none of them ever called Earth. I have two comments on this discussion: 1. Batteries Plus probably uses crappy Chinese batteries like everyone else. If you buy your own batteries from a place like Batteries America you can get high quality Sanyo batteries and other good makes. 2. I have successfully soldered the flat metal tabs on these batteries without any problem. I had no trouble getting solder to wet the tabs. I line up the batteries in the proper series orientation and then bend one tab back onto the battery so that the tab from the next battery lies over it. I then tin both surfaces and then overlap them. Now applying some heat to the outer tab melts the solder on both tabs and connects them. Taping the batteries together beforehand helps keep things aligned. Courtenay Ray and Bob have pretty much answered your questions. You can buy the batteries with the flat tabs or without from many sources. I've bought them on eBay (cheap Chinese) and from Batteries America (Sanyo). By electronics solder from Radio Shack or perhaps order some from the battery source, eg. Mouser Electronics. I use a 140 watt Weller soldering gun. As Ray and Bob have said, you want lots of heat so that you do not have to hold the soldering gun/iron on the tabs for too long. With the soldering gun I can press the two tinned tabs together, melt the solder in between and then release the trigger. This lets everything cool down and set while I'm still pushing it together. You need a clean tip when doing this or you will have the soldering gun tip soldered to the top tab. Just wipe it clean beforehand with a rag. If you've not done much soldering before you can practice on scrap wire. Y'all also might want to look for something called "eutectic solder"; it's 63% tin/37% lead, as opposed to the usual 60/40. Melts at a lower temperature, and is slightly easier to work with. Radio Shack *used* to carry it, but who knows these days? Any good electronics outfit will have it. DT |
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