Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine, an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

"sherwindu" wrote in message
...
Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically
this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine,
an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that
with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip
with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to
time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a
tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.

You mean you didn't learn how to do this properly under sail? I'm shocked.
:-)

In any case, practice makes perfect. Make sure you have good fenders. No
specific suggestions that I can think of, since it's really just a matter of
practice.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

That's a difficult situation. What is on the down current side of
your slip? Could you put down some fenders and just lay against it
while you secure lines on the "up current" side? Once you secure the
bow and set a bow spring, you could use prop thrust to push the stern
over.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

sherwindu wrote:

Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine, an 9.9
Yamaha outboard in my case.

Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip with the
current on the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to time it
so that we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?


What is upstream of your slip? Does the boat (presumably a boat in
the adjoining slip) stick out past the last piling?

If not, I think I would have the crew put a midships line on the last
piling (the one fartherest out in the river) on the upstream side and
warp yourself around into the slip. That's basically what we do if
there is a lot of wind on our beam.

Actually, we leave a line on the piling(s) in our home slip so all the
crew person (me) has to do is pick it up with a boat hook and hang on
to it - attaching it to a cleat if it seems like the forces of wind
and water are going to rip it out of my hands. Bob puts a line holder
on the pilings so we can hang the lines up on them as we cast off.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine, an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.


Can you/do you approach into the current? That would keep steering way
on while slowing speed over ground and speed relative to the hard
things you don't want to hit.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

I can line up the boat with the slip, but a strong current will throw my stern down
stream. I can maintain steerage going in, but if I enter too fast I am in danger of
hitting the concrete wall at the front of the slip. These are slips with small metal
piers
pointing into the river. There are two slips between each pier, with a wooden post
at the head of the slip dividing the slip for two boats. I have to avoid hitting the
pier,
the wooden piling, and/or the boat in the downstream side of the slip.

Sherwin D.

Dick Locke wrote:

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine, an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.

Can you/do you approach into the current? That would keep steering way
on while slowing speed over ground and speed relative to the hard
things you don't want to hit.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

"Capt. JG" wrote:

"sherwindu" wrote in message
...
Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically
this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine,
an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that
with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip
with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to
time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a
tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.

You mean you didn't learn how to do this properly under sail? I'm shocked.

You aren't shocked, you are just being a jerk. I mentioned the sailing to
offset
the remark I made to the chap who wanted to single handle his boat and pick
up his bobber in the process, that he shouldn't go out if he could not pick
up a
bobber. As a matter of fact, I had to do some tricky anchoring in the past
when
my engine was out, and had to do it under sail. I did learn how to pick up
a bobber
under sail alone, and it paid off. I'm not recommending it be done when you
have
tricky currents or tight slips to contend with, and a good working engine.
If you
have nothing constructive to say, please don't reply to my emails.


:-)

In any case, practice makes perfect. Make sure you have good fenders. No
specific suggestions that I can think of, since it's really just a matter of
practice.

Sure, and while I practice, put dents into my boat and possibly the one in
the
slip next to mine. I don't think you even have a clue how to handle this
situation,
so pipe down.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

"sherwindu" wrote in message
...


"Capt. JG" wrote:

"sherwindu" wrote in message
...
Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have
a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard.
Theoretically
this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an
engine,
an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so
that
with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip
with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try
to
time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a
tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.

You mean you didn't learn how to do this properly under sail? I'm
shocked.

You aren't shocked, you are just being a jerk. I mentioned the sailing
to
offset
the remark I made to the chap who wanted to single handle his boat and
pick
up his bobber in the process, that he shouldn't go out if he could not
pick
up a
bobber. As a matter of fact, I had to do some tricky anchoring in the
past
when
my engine was out, and had to do it under sail. I did learn how to
pick up
a bobber
under sail alone, and it paid off. I'm not recommending it be done
when you
have
tricky currents or tight slips to contend with, and a good working
engine.
If you
have nothing constructive to say, please don't reply to my emails.


:-)

In any case, practice makes perfect. Make sure you have good fenders. No
specific suggestions that I can think of, since it's really just a matter
of
practice.

Sure, and while I practice, put dents into my boat and possibly the one
in
the
slip next to mine. I don't think you even have a clue how to handle this
situation,
so pipe down.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com


Sher... if I was being a jerk, I wouldn't have included the smilie. You've
got a very thin skin. In any case, keep your fenders handy and keep
practicing.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

sherwindu wrote:

I can line up the boat with the slip, but a strong current will throw my stern down
stream. I can maintain steerage going in, but if I enter too fast I am in danger of
hitting the concrete wall at the front of the slip. These are slips with small metal
piers
pointing into the river. There are two slips between each pier, with a wooden post
at the head of the slip dividing the slip for two boats. I have to avoid hitting the
pier,
the wooden piling, and/or the boat in the downstream side of the slip.

Sherwin D.

I have seen people with crossed lines (i.e. ropes) at the front of a
slip that they are heading into. (assuming this is your slip). They
form an X at the pier end of the slip with the bow of the boat at the
middle of the X at the distance that you want to keep the boat from
the pier.

We also see lines strung between the pilings that delineate the slip
to separate our slip from the next one. Of course they won't help if
you ram them at warp speed, but they should slow you down a bit.
http://home.mindspring.com/~gmbeasley/id1.html

The top picture was taken at low tide (the water went up to the top of
the pilings at high tide and it is still about 18" above the dock)
just after Isabel when the boat in the adjoining slip had been hauled
and shows the lines between the slips.

The second picture shows when we were docked on the other side - you
can see a little of the chafe guards, and there's one of the X lines
at the front of the slip, going like /

We tie fenders to the pier where we normally exit the boat. When we
leave the boat it is crosstied in the slip so that it isn't close to
any edges, but when we want to get on or off, we pull her over to the
pier. The fender in the first picture isn't usually there.

And I repeat that we leave the lines on the pilings and cleats on the
pier so that all we have to do is pick them up, and the chafe guards
are attached to the lines where they go through the hawse holes or
through cleats (on the boat), so that I will know how close to cleat
the line in.

I would also come into the slip against the current.


Dick Locke wrote:

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Unlike the gentleman who wants to single handle a bober pick-up, I have a
question about how to enter a slip with two crewmen aboard. Theoretically this
can be done under sail, but the first approach should be with an engine, an 9.9
Yamaha outboard
in my case. Problem is that our slip is on a bend in the river, so that with a
strong current flowing, we have to come in bow first to the narrow slip with the
current on
the beam. I have tried to come in a bit upstream of the flow and try to time it
so that
we are in line just as we enter. It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Sherwin D.

Can you/do you approach into the current? That would keep steering way
on while slowing speed over ground and speed relative to the hard
things you don't want to hit.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 00:24:46 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

I have to avoid hitting the
pier,
the wooden piling, and/or the boat in the downstream side of the slip.

That is a very common dock layout.

What I have seen many people do, and it seems to work, is to tie a
permanent line between the piling and the sea wall. Keep it fairly
tight and it will give you something to catch your sideways drift
before you hit the boat in the adjacent slip.

Another strategy is to hang a number of fenders on the side with the
adjacent boat and just lay along side while you tie up. Shouldn't be
a problem as long as you are using nice clean fenders of a suitable
size.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 00:24:46 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

I can line up the boat with the slip, but a strong current will throw my stern down
stream. I can maintain steerage going in, but if I enter too fast I am in danger of
hitting the concrete wall at the front of the slip. These are slips with small metal
piers
pointing into the river. There are two slips between each pier, with a wooden post
at the head of the slip dividing the slip for two boats. I have to avoid hitting the
pier,
the wooden piling, and/or the boat in the downstream side of the slip.

Sherwin D.

Yi, that's ugly. I guess you're on the waiting list for a slip on the
downstream side of the slot and the upstream slips are much more
readily available.

If it's a short finger-pier, man, I thought I had it tough with a
downwind double-finger that was 6 inches wider than my boat beam.

What about accepting a clunk as inevitable and hanging a long fender
board overboard and nestling the aft quarter of your boat into the
post and pulling it upstream from the pier?

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Thanks for all the tips. I guess I was looking more for a maneuvering solution using
the engine (both forward and reverse) to offset the current. I'm also going to ask my
neighboring boat owners how they manage to handle the current.

Sherwin D.

Dick Locke wrote:

On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 00:24:46 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

I can line up the boat with the slip, but a strong current will throw my stern down
stream. I can maintain steerage going in, but if I enter too fast I am in danger of
hitting the concrete wall at the front of the slip. These are slips with small metal
piers
pointing into the river. There are two slips between each pier, with a wooden post
at the head of the slip dividing the slip for two boats. I have to avoid hitting the
pier,
the wooden piling, and/or the boat in the downstream side of the slip.

Sherwin D.

Yi, that's ugly. I guess you're on the waiting list for a slip on the
downstream side of the slot and the upstream slips are much more
readily available.

If it's a short finger-pier, man, I thought I had it tough with a
downwind double-finger that was 6 inches wider than my boat beam.

What about accepting a clunk as inevitable and hanging a long fender
board overboard and nestling the aft quarter of your boat into the
post and pulling it upstream from the pier?

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Many boats (not all) will lay to the pier against considerable wind or
current with a judicious application of power and helm against a
springline. With the spring running aft from your midships cleat, a
small amount of power will cause the spring to pull the bow right
against the pier. A bit of rudder (or outboard traverse) will push
the stern in. Of course, the spring should be short enough to keep
the bow from hitting anything else, and it should run aft to the end
of the finger pier, not straight out to the side.

On my boat, I try to cut power and coast into the slip. I either
grap the spring from the dock, or (if away from home) drop a loop on
the dock cleat with about 2/3 of a boat length of slack. When the
spring is secured at both ends, the remaining momentum of the boat
will start it over to the side. I put the engine in gear at idle,
dial in a bit of rudder, and wait for everything to stop moving. It's
just that easy.

Obviously, the critical part is to get the spring on before you are
too far into the slip. But if you aren't going too fast, you have
time to fall back on Plan B. That's why I coast into the slip and add
power only when the spring is fastened.

YMMV - very beamy boats with poor rudder authority might not take well
to this tactic.


__________________________________________________ __________
Glen "Wiley" Wilson usenet1 SPAMNIX at world wide wiley dot com
To reply, lose the capitals and do the obvious.

Take a look at cpRepeater, my NMEA data integrator, repeater, and
logger at http://www.worldwidewiley.com/

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 11:45:06 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Thanks for all the tips. I guess I was looking more for a maneuvering solution using
the engine (both forward and reverse) to offset the current. I'm also going to ask my
neighboring boat owners how they manage to handle the current.

Sherwin D.



Depending on which way your stern walks in reverse (probably not a
strong effect with a small outboard propellor) you might be able to
come in at a fairly good speed, have someone jump off and secure the
bow while you reverse like hell to pull the stern toward the dock.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Dick Locke wrote:



Depending on which way your stern walks in reverse (probably not a
strong effect with a small outboard propellor) you might be able to
come in at a fairly good speed, have someone jump off and secure the
bow while you reverse like hell to pull the stern toward the dock.

That would probably work, but it puts the boat at risk should the engine die at the
wrong time, or you don't apply the reverse at precisely the correct time and power.
The head of the slip is a nice solid cement wall, which I would not like to hit. By the
way, this 9.9 Yamaha has plenty of thrust with a very large prop, so I don't think that
this is any kind of limitation.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Glen \"Wiley\" Wilson wrote:

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Many boats (not all) will lay to the pier against considerable wind or
current with a judicious application of power and helm against a
springline. With the spring running aft from your midships cleat, a
small amount of power will cause the spring to pull the bow right
against the pier. A bit of rudder (or outboard traverse) will push
the stern in. Of course, the spring should be short enough to keep
the bow from hitting anything else, and it should run aft to the end
of the finger pier, not straight out to the side.

On my boat, I try to cut power and coast into the slip. I either
grap the spring from the dock, or (if away from home) drop a loop on
the dock cleat with about 2/3 of a boat length of slack. When the
spring is secured at both ends, the remaining momentum of the boat
will start it over to the side. I put the engine in gear at idle,
dial in a bit of rudder, and wait for everything to stop moving. It's
just that easy.

Obviously, the critical part is to get the spring on before you are
too far into the slip. But if you aren't going too fast, you have
time to fall back on Plan B. That's why I coast into the slip and add
power only when the spring is fastened.

YMMV - very beamy boats with poor rudder authority might not take well
to this tactic.

__________________________________________________ __________
Glen "Wiley" Wilson usenet1 SPAMNIX at world wide wiley dot com
To reply, lose the capitals and do the obvious.

Take a look at cpRepeater, my NMEA data integrator, repeater, and
logger at http://www.worldwidewiley.com/

Glen,

Your recommendations sound like they would be good for securing the boat once
it is in
the slip, not helping to position the boat while it is entering. If there
were no side current,
one would have more time to grab spring lines, etc. However, going in slowly
may find
you being pushed into the next slip before you have time to take corrective
measures.
The slower you enter the slip, the more time the side current has to push the
boat over.
The best thing I can think of is to aim the boat just upstream of the slip,
so that on approach
you are reasonably lined up for entry. The problem then becomes holding
that allignment
as you enter the slip. There are generally two of us aboard, one on the
engine and the other
there to fend off, which doesn't leave much room for error. The reason I am
hanging on to
this slip is that it is reasonably inexpensive and very convenient for
access to my vehicle.

Sherwin

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

In article ,
Dick Locke wrote:
On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 11:45:06 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Thanks for all the tips. I guess I was looking more for a maneuvering solution using
the engine (both forward and reverse) to offset the current. I'm also going to ask my
neighboring boat owners how they manage to handle the current.

Sherwin D.



Depending on which way your stern walks in reverse (probably not a
strong effect with a small outboard propellor) you might be able to
come in at a fairly good speed, have someone jump off and secure the
bow while you reverse like hell to pull the stern toward the dock.

Jumping isn't a good idea. Also, high speed isn't a good idea either
in close quarters.

--
Capt. JG @@
www.sailnow.com

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

sherwindu wrote:
Glen \"Wiley\" Wilson wrote:

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Many boats (not all) will lay to the pier against considerable wind or
current with a judicious application of power and helm against a
springline. With the spring running aft from your midships cleat, a
small amount of power will cause the spring to pull the bow right
against the pier. A bit of rudder (or outboard traverse) will push
the stern in. Of course, the spring should be short enough to keep
the bow from hitting anything else, and it should run aft to the end
of the finger pier, not straight out to the side.

On my boat, I try to cut power and coast into the slip. I either
grap the spring from the dock, or (if away from home) drop a loop on
the dock cleat with about 2/3 of a boat length of slack. When the
spring is secured at both ends, the remaining momentum of the boat
will start it over to the side. I put the engine in gear at idle,
dial in a bit of rudder, and wait for everything to stop moving. It's
just that easy.

Obviously, the critical part is to get the spring on before you are
too far into the slip. But if you aren't going too fast, you have
time to fall back on Plan B. That's why I coast into the slip and add
power only when the spring is fastened.

YMMV - very beamy boats with poor rudder authority might not take well
to this tactic.

__________________________________________________ __________
Glen "Wiley" Wilson usenet1 SPAMNIX at world wide wiley dot com
To reply, lose the capitals and do the obvious.

Take a look at cpRepeater, my NMEA data integrator, repeater, and
logger at http://www.worldwidewiley.com/

Glen,

Your recommendations sound like they would be good for securing the boat once
it is in
the slip, not helping to position the boat while it is entering. If there
were no side current,
one would have more time to grab spring lines, etc. However, going in slowly
may find
you being pushed into the next slip before you have time to take corrective
measures.
The slower you enter the slip, the more time the side current has to push the
boat over.
The best thing I can think of is to aim the boat just upstream of the slip,
so that on approach
you are reasonably lined up for entry. The problem then becomes holding
that allignment
as you enter the slip. There are generally two of us aboard, one on the
engine and the other
there to fend off, which doesn't leave much room for error. The reason I am
hanging on to
this slip is that it is reasonably inexpensive and very convenient for
access to my vehicle.

OK, I'm trying to visualize this - originally I thought it would be
better to come in going upstream which would be the natural way to
approach the slip, against the current so you would have more control.

How about leaving a spring line on the upstream piling, and coming the
other way (going with the current), and putting the side of the boat
next to the pier/dock which has the spring line on it while still
parallel to the current. Have the non-engine person pick up this line
and cleat it down fairly short a bit aft of center and then warp
yourself around this piling into the slip, using the current and the
engine to help you get perpendicular to it.

We have a problem with our boat being a modified full keel, with a lot
of windage and very heavy, so that I can't - by myself- hold the boat
against current or wind if there is any that is significant. Also,
our slip is longer than our boat, so if the boat is nicely in the
slip, we can't reach the last pilings - we have to do that on the way
into the slip. But it doesn't look like you have those problems - so
after you get the boat secured in the middle, you let the current put
the boat parallel to the slip. The stern won't be able to swing too
far because it is cleated down.




grandma Rosalie

S/V RosalieAnn, Leonardtown, MD
CSY 44 WO #156
http://home.mindspring.com/~gmbeasley/id1.html

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

The problem is that there is no one right answer to your problem.
The solution can involve any number of things such as line handling and
engine and rudder usage.
Best bet....... find someone around your dock area who seems to make
his/her approaches with little difficulty (takes some time and observation)
and ask them for advice.
Because your situation involves an off the dock current, for the most part
you will need to use a combination of line handling and engine/rudder
maneuvers to come up with something that works well.
Don't be afraid to use your line from different points on the dock as well
as the boat and be ready to "work" those lines to your advantage.
As for engine and rudder, try maximum rudder and minimum engine first and
then increase or decrease as experience teaches.
As a final thought..... don't forget your anchor...... there may be a
maneuver that could benefit from it's use.


otn


On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 11:45:06 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Thanks for all the tips. I guess I was looking more for a maneuvering
solution using the engine (both forward and reverse) to offset the
current. I'm also going to ask my neighboring boat owners how they
manage to handle the current.

Sherwin D.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

I think Glen has the idea. Mount a line on the piling at the end of
your slip finger, then have your crew stand on the bow. Come in like
you do now but get the bow close enough that the crew member can reach
the line. If they miss the line, no problems as you have not
commited to docking yet. Just back out, and try again until the crew
has the spring line in hand before starting to end the slip.

Once the have it, then you let the bow fall off a bit to line up with
your slip and proceed in. During this time the crew member walks the
line back to a mid-ship cleat and takes one wrap. As you proceed in,
the boat will start to drift down stream. With your crew member
holding the spring line and taking up slack and you giving some
forward power, this will pull your boat back to your side of the
docks. Continue in slowly with the crew member slipping the spring
line through the cleat (this is why they took a turn as opposed to
made it fast) as you proceed in. When you get to where you want, the
crew member makes the spring fast. Leave the motor in forward, and
the action will pin your boat to your upstream finger. Then retrieve
the rest of the lines. After all is set you can cut the power.

If you dont have a piling at the end of your dock, you can tie the
spring line to the dock and affix some stand pipe which would hold the
free end of the spring line ready and at a height that is easy for the
crew member to reach.

This will also work at a visiting dock, but the crew member has to be
good at 'lassoing' a piling or dock cleat :-)

Hope this helps.
-al-


On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 23:22:39 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:



Glen \"Wiley\" Wilson wrote:

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 23:45:20 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

It's a bit tricky, and there is a tendency for
the stern
to swing downstream before we have a chance to get a line to it. Any
suggestions?

Many boats (not all) will lay to the pier against considerable wind or
current with a judicious application of power and helm against a
springline. With the spring running aft from your midships cleat, a
small amount of power will cause the spring to pull the bow right
against the pier. A bit of rudder (or outboard traverse) will push
the stern in. Of course, the spring should be short enough to keep
the bow from hitting anything else, and it should run aft to the end
of the finger pier, not straight out to the side.

On my boat, I try to cut power and coast into the slip. I either
grap the spring from the dock, or (if away from home) drop a loop on
the dock cleat with about 2/3 of a boat length of slack. When the
spring is secured at both ends, the remaining momentum of the boat
will start it over to the side. I put the engine in gear at idle,
dial in a bit of rudder, and wait for everything to stop moving. It's
just that easy.

Obviously, the critical part is to get the spring on before you are
too far into the slip. But if you aren't going too fast, you have
time to fall back on Plan B. That's why I coast into the slip and add
power only when the spring is fastened.

YMMV - very beamy boats with poor rudder authority might not take well
to this tactic.

__________________________________________________ __________
Glen "Wiley" Wilson usenet1 SPAMNIX at world wide wiley dot com
To reply, lose the capitals and do the obvious.

Take a look at cpRepeater, my NMEA data integrator, repeater, and
logger at http://www.worldwidewiley.com/

Glen,

Your recommendations sound like they would be good for securing the boat once
it is in
the slip, not helping to position the boat while it is entering. If there
were no side current,
one would have more time to grab spring lines, etc. However, going in slowly
may find
you being pushed into the next slip before you have time to take corrective
measures.
The slower you enter the slip, the more time the side current has to push the
boat over.
The best thing I can think of is to aim the boat just upstream of the slip,
so that on approach
you are reasonably lined up for entry. The problem then becomes holding
that allignment
as you enter the slip. There are generally two of us aboard, one on the
engine and the other
there to fend off, which doesn't leave much room for error. The reason I am
hanging on to
this slip is that it is reasonably inexpensive and very convenient for
access to my vehicle.

Sherwin

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

"Rosalie B." wrote:

OK, I'm trying to visualize this - originally I thought it would be
better to come in going upstream which would be the natural way to
approach the slip, against the current so you would have more control.

In this case the slip is oriented perpendicular to the current. My approach
to the slip takes me beam to the current.



How about leaving a spring line on the upstream piling,

There is no upstream piling, just the iron jetty protruding into the river.

and coming the
other way (going with the current), and putting the side of the boat
next to the pier/dock which has the spring line on it while still
parallel to the current. Have the non-engine person pick up this line
and cleat it down fairly short a bit aft of center and then warp
yourself around this piling into the slip, using the current and the
engine to help you get perpendicular to it.

There is no time to do all this. The current will have pushed me into the
next slip before I can make use of this spring line. We would have to
enter quickly and that puts us at more risk of hitting the wall at the end
of the slip. Going slowly allows the current time to push us over.



We have a problem with our boat being a modified full keel, with a lot
of windage and very heavy, so that I can't - by myself- hold the boat
against current or wind if there is any that is significant. Also,
our slip is longer than our boat, so if the boat is nicely in the
slip, we can't reach the last pilings - we have to do that on the way
into the slip. But it doesn't look like you have those problems - so
after you get the boat secured in the middle, you let the current put
the boat parallel to the slip. The stern won't be able to swing too
far because it is cleated down.

grandma Rosalie

S/V RosalieAnn, Leonardtown, MD
CSY 44 WO #156
http://home.mindspring.com/~gmbeasley/id1.html

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Al Thomason wrote:

I think Glen has the idea. Mount a line on the piling at the end of
your slip finger, then have your crew stand on the bow. Come in like
you do now but get the bow close enough that the crew member can reach
the line. If they miss the line, no problems as you have not
commited to docking yet. Just back out, and try again until the crew
has the spring line in hand before starting to end the slip.

Sorry, but this sounds too tricky, especially with a current pushing on the boat
all the time.



Once the have it, then you let the bow fall off a bit to line up with
your slip and proceed in. During this time the crew member walks the
line back to a mid-ship cleat and takes one wrap.

While the crew member is walking back, the current has already swept me into
the downstream piling, or worse yet, the boat in the next slip.

As you proceed in,
the boat will start to drift down stream. With your crew member
holding the spring line and taking up slack and you giving some
forward power, this will pull your boat back to your side of the
docks. Continue in slowly with the crew member slipping the spring
line through the cleat (this is why they took a turn as opposed to
made it fast) as you proceed in. When you get to where you want, the
crew member makes the spring fast. Leave the motor in forward, and
the action will pin your boat to your upstream finger. Then retrieve
the rest of the lines. After all is set you can cut the power.

If you dont have a piling at the end of your dock, you can tie the
spring line to the dock and affix some stand pipe which would hold the
free end of the spring line ready and at a height that is easy for the
crew member to reach.

This will also work at a visiting dock, but the crew member has to be
good at 'lassoing' a piling or dock cleat :-)

Hope this helps.

All these things would work if there were no strong current constantly
pushing the boat on the beam. You would then have lots of time and
a forgiveness factor if you mess up.

I think Rosalie might have an idea with these cross ropes to catch the
boat, as it enters the slip.


-al-

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

otnmbrd wrote:

The problem is that there is no one right answer to your problem.

Correct. The few references I have seen to this in magazine articles
and books say this is one of the trickiest kinds of docking maneuvers.


The solution can involve any number of things such as line handling and
engine and rudder usage.
Best bet....... find someone around your dock area who seems to make
his/her approaches with little difficulty (takes some time and observation)
and ask them for advice.

Will definitely do that.


Because your situation involves an off the dock current, for the most part
you will need to use a combination of line handling and engine/rudder
maneuvers to come up with something that works well.

I am not sure about the line handling, as it is very error prone. The engine

and rudder might prove to minimize the problem.


Don't be afraid to use your line from different points on the dock as well
as the boat and be ready to "work" those lines to your advantage.
As for engine and rudder, try maximum rudder and minimum engine first and
then increase or decrease as experience teaches.
As a final thought..... don't forget your anchor...... there may be a
maneuver that could benefit from it's use.

Unless I set an anchor everytime I approach the dock, there is no practical
way to use it to advantage.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Charlie Morgan wrote:



Does the motor mount allow the Yamaha to turn? If so, you may find it useful to
use the motor in reverse to pull the stern towards the dock. If you have a high
thrust model Yamaha, it will do this effectively.

Yes, I can turn the engine 45 degrees to either side of mid-ships. It is the high

thrust Yamaha, but most propellors do not work efficiently in reverse. Never
the less, I think I can overcome the current somewhat with the engine. The
current is not extremely fast (about 2 to 3 knots), but enough to get you into
trouble if you don't line things up properly. Some days the current is way down
and entering the slip is no problem. Somehow the engine has to stop the forward
momentum of the boat, and at the same time keep the stern from swinging down
stream. Maybe pointing the engine at 45 degrees upstream and giving it reverse
power of the right amount and at the right time, would do the trick. I have no
idea
how the power boats with fixed inboards can handle this problem. Most of them
appear too small to have double drive shafts that could be used to turn the boat.

I have searched many books like Chapman and none of them covers a stituation
where you have a forced narrow approach with a current or strong wind on the
beam.
If this were a situation of a dock which is open on one side, it would allow more
maneuvering
room to approach and/or recover.



I also find it useful, when short handed, to put the emphasis on securing the
boat from a midpoint, rather than the ends, initially. I simply have a dockline
with the loop over a cabintop winch, which is not quite the center of the boat,
but close enough. If someone can step off the boat with the other end in their
hand and simple hold their ground with that line,

This slip has a high pier that we access via a boarding ladder, so stepping off
is not that simple.

or tie it off, it will hold
the boat close enough that neither the bow nor stern can get too far away.

Again, I have to have a reasonable way on to enter this slip with the current
flowing. This makes it extremely difficult for someone to grab a piling on the
dock and manage to stop the momentum of the boat.

That
gives the other person time to take care of properly securing the other lines.

CWM



I know all you folks are trying hard to find a solution, and I appreciate the
efforts.
Any of us who have done extensive cruising have encountered docking problems
before. My biggest challenge was taking my boat down the Mississippi River,
which has currents over 6 knots, in places. Somehow I managed to keep from
damaging my boat. There was the time we couldn't tie up at Cape Girardeau, Mo.
on
that trip because when I turned the boat around against the current, my 6 hp Sea
Gull engine could not overcome the current, and we slowly drifted past the town.

Sherwin

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Wed, 05 Jul 2006 00:57:07 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:


Once the have it, then you let the bow fall off a bit to line up with
your slip and proceed in. During this time the crew member walks the
line back to a mid-ship cleat and takes one wrap.

While the crew member is walking back, the current has already swept me into
the downstream piling, or worse yet, the boat in the next slip.

Get some of the heavy rubber strips that are designed for permanent
attachment to a piling. That way you can lay along side it without
damage to your boat. Run a permanent piece of line from the piling to
the seawall. You will then be able to enter the slip and lay against
the piling and rope as you secure your lines to the pier.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

sherwindu wrote:
"Rosalie B." wrote:

OK, I'm trying to visualize this - originally I thought it would be
better to come in going upstream which would be the natural way to
approach the slip, against the current so you would have more control.

In this case the slip is oriented perpendicular to the current. My approach
to the slip takes me beam to the current.

Why? If I am coming up a river, I am parallel to the current. If I
am going down the river, I'm parallel to the current. It is only when
I turn to go into the slip that I am beam to the current. I was
thinking of getting to the area of the slip as part of the approach -
not just the actual turn into the slip.

How about leaving a spring line on the upstream piling,

There is no upstream piling, just the iron jetty protruding into the river.

Are there no line attachments on the jetty? Like cleats or something
of that sort?

and coming the
other way (going with the current), and putting the side of the boat
next to the pier/dock which has the spring line on it while still
parallel to the current. Have the non-engine person pick up this line
and cleat it down fairly short a bit aft of center and then warp
yourself around this piling into the slip, using the current and the
engine to help you get perpendicular to it.

There is no time to do all this. The current will have pushed me into the
next slip before I can make use of this spring line. We would have to
enter quickly and that puts us at more risk of hitting the wall at the end
of the slip. Going slowly allows the current time to push us over.

There is time if you get the line before you do any turning beam to
the current while you are still going with (or against) the current.

We have a problem with our boat being a modified full keel, with a lot
of windage and very heavy, so that I can't - by myself- hold the boat
against current or wind if there is any that is significant. Also,
our slip is longer than our boat, so if the boat is nicely in the
slip, we can't reach the last pilings - we have to do that on the way
into the slip. But it doesn't look like you have those problems - so
after you get the boat secured in the middle, you let the current put
the boat parallel to the slip. The stern won't be able to swing too
far because it is cleated down.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

Why not figure that you are going to hit someplace in the slip no matter
what you do. So just put enough fenders and padding in the slip so no damage
is done. That is what ferry boats do.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
sherwindu wrote:
"Rosalie B." wrote:

OK, I'm trying to visualize this - originally I thought it would be
better to come in going upstream which would be the natural way to
approach the slip, against the current so you would have more control.

In this case the slip is oriented perpendicular to the current. My
approach
to the slip takes me beam to the current.

Why? If I am coming up a river, I am parallel to the current. If I
am going down the river, I'm parallel to the current. It is only when
I turn to go into the slip that I am beam to the current. I was
thinking of getting to the area of the slip as part of the approach -
not just the actual turn into the slip.

How about leaving a spring line on the upstream piling,

There is no upstream piling, just the iron jetty protruding into the
river.

Are there no line attachments on the jetty? Like cleats or something
of that sort?

and coming the
other way (going with the current), and putting the side of the boat
next to the pier/dock which has the spring line on it while still
parallel to the current. Have the non-engine person pick up this line
and cleat it down fairly short a bit aft of center and then warp
yourself around this piling into the slip, using the current and the
engine to help you get perpendicular to it.

There is no time to do all this. The current will have pushed me into
the
next slip before I can make use of this spring line. We would have to
enter quickly and that puts us at more risk of hitting the wall at the
end
of the slip. Going slowly allows the current time to push us over.

There is time if you get the line before you do any turning beam to
the current while you are still going with (or against) the current.

We have a problem with our boat being a modified full keel, with a lot
of windage and very heavy, so that I can't - by myself- hold the boat
against current or wind if there is any that is significant. Also,
our slip is longer than our boat, so if the boat is nicely in the
slip, we can't reach the last pilings - we have to do that on the way
into the slip. But it doesn't look like you have those problems - so
after you get the boat secured in the middle, you let the current put
the boat parallel to the slip. The stern won't be able to swing too
far because it is cleated down.

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

"Richard" wrote in message
...
Why not figure that you are going to hit someplace in the slip no matter
what you do. So just put enough fenders and padding in the slip so no
damage is done. That is what ferry boats do.

That's what I suggested and sherwind said I was a jerk. :-)

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

sherwindu wrote in
:



otnmbrd wrote:


Because your situation involves an off the dock current, for the most
part you will need to use a combination of line handling and
engine/rudder maneuvers to come up with something that works well.

I am not sure about the line handling, as it is very error prone.
The engine

and rudder might prove to minimize the problem.

Actually both are very "error prone". If you are looking for a solely
engine/rudder solution, odds are you won't find one and if you do it will
require you to precisely mimic the same engine/helm commands every time.
Howerver, since we know that every docking is different.............
Like it or not, your best solution will involve linehandling which is just
as much an art as handling the engine rudder controls.
Sorry to say, there is no simple answer to your problem.



Don't be afraid to use your line from different points on the dock as
well as the boat and be ready to "work" those lines to your
advantage. As for engine and rudder, try maximum rudder and minimum
engine first and then increase or decrease as experience teaches.
As a final thought..... don't forget your anchor...... there may be a
maneuver that could benefit from it's use.

Unless I set an anchor everytime I approach the dock, there is no
practical way to use it to advantage.

The use of an anchor, like line handling, requires some good deal of
practice to realize it's advantage (In this case it may well be overkill,
but I mentioned it purely as a possibility).

At any rate, take it slow and easy and keep an open mind to possibilities,
trying different approaches and you might come up with the "one" which
works best for you.

otn

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

"Wayne.B" wrote:



Get some of the heavy rubber strips that are designed for permanent
attachment to a piling. That way you can lay along side it without
damage to your boat. Run a permanent piece of line from the piling to
the seawall. You will then be able to enter the slip and lay against
the piling and rope as you secure your lines to the pier.

Your idea may work. Maybe I was looking for a more elegant solution than
crashing into a piling, padded or not. I have to check with the management of
the marina as to what modifications they will allow me to make.

Sherwin

Approaching a slip with a strong current
 

On Wed, 05 Jul 2006 22:59:52 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

Maybe I was looking for a more elegant solution than
crashing into a piling, padded or not.

===========

Every airplane landing is a controlled crash, same with docking. :-)