I understand that Marchaj concludes that the Bermudan rig is not the best
for cruising.

What does he conclude and why ?

Thank you,

Courtney

Cruisers are downwind sailors and the bermudian rig has its peak
efficiency upwind.
Ever hear of someone 'purposely' beating through the tradewinds?

Rich Hampel wrote:
Cruisers are downwind sailors and the bermudian rig has its peak
efficiency upwind.
Ever hear of someone 'purposely' beating through the tradewinds?

Yes, I've had to do it to get from Panama to the NW
Caribbean. I wouldn't want to do it in a ketch or a gaff
rigged schooner . Sometimes you have to sail upwind, even
on a traditionally downwind passage.

Seriously, 95% of the boats out there are sloops or perhaps
cutters, so why worry about it?

Evan Gatehouse

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:47:47 -0700, Evan Gatehouse
wrote:


Seriously, 95% of the boats out there are sloops or perhaps
cutters, so why worry about it?

With all respect, 95% of the personal cars on the road are not very
efficient gasoline-engine driven models. The current popularity of the
Bermudan/Marconi rig is not an indication that it is the most
efficient all-around rig, or that it is the best choice by default.

A subset of that thinking gave us extreme IOR designs with stability
issues in the '70s. Sail rigs and the thinking about them is still
evolving: much of the popularity of the Bermudan rig is, I suspect,
due to its extreme simplicity, particularly when roller-furling is
involved.

And yet committed/experienced offshore cruisers still choose cutters,
cutter-ketches, gaff-rigs and even junk-rigs. Of course, the Bermudan
rig is popular with that crowd, too, but more experienced sailors
understand the trade-offs and benefits of exploring "minority opinion"
rigs and set-ups.

Just throwing it out there. I have an IOR-derived cruiser racer with a
15 foot J on a 33 1/2 LOA, which means it points high and works
excellently to windward, but the tall narrow main is not great
downwind. That's why I advocate not any particular design, but a
flexibility appropriate to the application.

Having said that, I have seen very, very few schooner rigs
commissioned lately.

R.

In rhys writes:

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:47:47 -0700, Evan Gatehouse
wrote:


Seriously, 95% of the boats out there are sloops or perhaps
cutters, so why worry about it?

With all respect, 95% of the personal cars on the road are not very
efficient gasoline-engine driven models. The current popularity of the
Bermudan/Marconi rig is not an indication that it is the most
efficient all-around rig, or that it is the best choice by default.

A subset of that thinking gave us extreme IOR designs with stability
issues in the '70s. Sail rigs and the thinking about them is still
evolving: much of the popularity of the Bermudan rig is, I suspect,
due to its extreme simplicity, particularly when roller-furling is
involved.

And yet committed/experienced offshore cruisers still choose cutters,
cutter-ketches, gaff-rigs and even junk-rigs. Of course, the Bermudan
rig is popular with that crowd, too, but more experienced sailors
understand the trade-offs and benefits of exploring "minority opinion"
rigs and set-ups.

Just throwing it out there. I have an IOR-derived cruiser racer with a
15 foot J on a 33 1/2 LOA, which means it points high and works
excellently to windward, but the tall narrow main is not great
downwind. That's why I advocate not any particular design, but a
flexibility appropriate to the application.

Having said that, I have seen very, very few schooner rigs
commissioned lately.

How many fishing boats have you seen commissioned for the cod fishing in
Grand Banks? The schooner was developed when one neede a fast boat to
get first home after he hull was full of fish, the first boat home was
getting the best price, the sailing conditions were from close to broad
reach and then it was necessary to have a big opening between the masts
so that they could work on the deck and load the fish.

You are right the rigs of present day sailing boats were developed with
the rating rules in mind. The big mast top genoa was developed because
the overlap of the foresail was not penalized by the rule and it was
favourinf the foresail as the beat was the most important leg and the
racing courses had always a beat, because it was regarded as the leg
where the tactics and the skill made the difference.

- Lauri Tarkkonen

In article ,
rhys wrote:

The current popularity of the Bermudan/Marconi rig is not an
indication that it is the most efficient all-around rig, or that it
is the best choice by default.

When racing boats use a different rig, I'll listen further.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

The current popularity of the Bermudan/Marconi rig is not an
indication that it is the most efficient all-around rig, or that it
is the best choice by default.


Jere Lull wrote:
When racing boats use a different rig, I'll listen further.


Marchaj gave pretty high marks in efficiency to the Polynesian crab-claw
rig, but I have never seen one winning the America's Cup. Perhaps it is
too heavily penalized under the rating rules

DSK