Must be up there with "stratigery" and "nucluler"

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 14:33:16 GMT, Dick Locke
wrote:

On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that you can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)




http://www.electrician.com/articles/ampacity.htm

BB

I prefer to have the windlass and bowthruster to be powered primarily
by the engine when it is running. The Eliminator from Ample Power
is basically a DC/DC charger but it will add $300 to the project.
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexable. Just use adhesive lined
heat shrink to seal the lugs on the ends to keep out the moisture.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that you can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)

Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexible.

In my case the welding cable was priced at $1.04/ft but I decided to buy
the tinned battery cable at $1.69/ft because I planned to solder terminals
to the end. I expect this will be more successful if I start with tinned
cable. (I think the normal price for the 2/0 welding cable was something
like $1.39 but they had a spool going for $1.04)

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
I prefer to have the windlass and bowthruster to be powered primarily
by the engine when it is running. The Eliminator from Ample Power
is basically a DC/DC charger but it will add $300 to the project.
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexable. Just use adhesive lined
heat shrink to seal the lugs on the ends to keep out the moisture.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that you
can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and
generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)

Actually soldering terminals on such large cable is not
recommended. The solder wicks up into the wire
under the insulation several inches and results in a
situation that is very suseptable to cracking over time
to due to vibration. In any case, one normally tins
the end of a wire before soldering it anyway. No need
to pay top dollar when only the ends need to be tinned.
Better to just crimp the terminals on and then seal against
moisture using adhesive lined heat shrink.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Gordon Wedman" wrote in message
news:bTwOc.20$T_6.6@edtnps89...
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexible.

In my case the welding cable was priced at $1.04/ft but I decided to buy
the tinned battery cable at $1.69/ft because I planned to solder terminals
to the end. I expect this will be more successful if I start with tinned
cable. (I think the normal price for the 2/0 welding cable was something
like $1.39 but they had a spool going for $1.04)

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
I prefer to have the windlass and bowthruster to be powered primarily
by the engine when it is running. The Eliminator from Ample Power
is basically a DC/DC charger but it will add $300 to the project.
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexable. Just use adhesive lined
heat shrink to seal the lugs on the ends to keep out the moisture.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that you
can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and
generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)

Doug Dotson wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that you can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running.

Install heavy cables and plan to run the engine when using the windlass.
Some day you may have almost dead batteries but still need to weigh the
anchor.


An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On 27 Jul 2004 15:50:00 GMT, (Ray Cullum) wrote:

I am considering adding a electric windlass to my boat and I would like
some
opinions on the best way to connect to the electrical system.

The windlass will be approximately 40 feet from my house battery bank
which is
700amps. It has been suggested to me to place a small battery up close
to the
windlass so you don't have to run heavy battery cable such a distance
and
sustain the power loss. Small cable could be run to the battery
strictly
for
recharging.

Thanks for the help.

Ray Cullum
S/V FROLIC

Two For What it's Worth items:

West Marine in their Advisor pages in the catalog suggests not doing
this on the grounds that the proper cabling for full charger output or
full alternator output is almost as big as the proper cabling for the
winches. Remember most people have their engine running when raising
anchor. For a small savings in cable cost you lose storage space and
add weight in the bow.

Second, the boat I bought is wired this way and the forward battery is
connected through disconnect switches to both the windlass and a bow
thruster. It also has the capability to utilize the forward battery (I
think it's a 4D but I haven't opened the box yet) as a house battery.
It works fine but when time comes for battery replacement I'll examine
rewiring the cables that run forward ( think they are about size 0 or
2) and getting the battery out of the bow.

Yes, I've heard that the cable can become very stiff and this can cause
problems. I plan to fix the ends firmly in place with rubber covered metal
clamps. I may go to crimping if I can find a place that can do a good job
on this size cable. As for not using tinned cable, I guess this will work
but it is very hard to heat up such thick copper cable and this might
compromise a good all-round tinning of bare copper.

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
Actually soldering terminals on such large cable is not
recommended. The solder wicks up into the wire
under the insulation several inches and results in a
situation that is very suseptable to cracking over time
to due to vibration. In any case, one normally tins
the end of a wire before soldering it anyway. No need
to pay top dollar when only the ends need to be tinned.
Better to just crimp the terminals on and then seal against
moisture using adhesive lined heat shrink.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Gordon Wedman" wrote in message
news:bTwOc.20$T_6.6@edtnps89...
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexible.

In my case the welding cable was priced at $1.04/ft but I decided to
buy
the tinned battery cable at $1.69/ft because I planned to solder
terminals
to the end. I expect this will be more successful if I start with
tinned
cable. (I think the normal price for the 2/0 welding cable was
something
like $1.39 but they had a spool going for $1.04)

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
I prefer to have the windlass and bowthruster to be powered primarily
by the engine when it is running. The Eliminator from Ample Power
is basically a DC/DC charger but it will add $300 to the project.
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexable. Just use adhesive lined
heat shrink to seal the lugs on the ends to keep out the moisture.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that
you
can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and
generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)

"Gordon Wedman" wrote in message
news:62VPc.24941$hw6.14217@edtnps84...
Yes, I've heard that the cable can become very stiff and this can cause
problems. I plan to fix the ends firmly in place with rubber covered
metal
clamps.

Not sure what you are getting at here.

I may go to crimping if I can find a place that can do a good job
on this size cable.

You can get an inexpensive crimper at West Marine. Does a fine
job on 2/0 cable.

As for not using tinned cable, I guess this will work
but it is very hard to heat up such thick copper cable and this might
compromise a good all-round tinning of bare copper.

This is why soldering large cable is not recommended. Take a look
at the starting cables in your car. Not likely you will find a soldered
connection. I used to have a copy of a NASA Tech Briefs that had
a good article on soldering vs crimping. They found crimping more
reliable for many reasons. Micro-cracks in the solder joint eventually
lead to corrosion and mechanical failure due to thermal cycling
were among the culprits.

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
Actually soldering terminals on such large cable is not
recommended. The solder wicks up into the wire
under the insulation several inches and results in a
situation that is very suseptable to cracking over time
to due to vibration. In any case, one normally tins
the end of a wire before soldering it anyway. No need
to pay top dollar when only the ends need to be tinned.
Better to just crimp the terminals on and then seal against
moisture using adhesive lined heat shrink.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Gordon Wedman" wrote in message
news:bTwOc.20$T_6.6@edtnps89...
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexible.

In my case the welding cable was priced at $1.04/ft but I decided to
buy
the tinned battery cable at $1.69/ft because I planned to solder
terminals
to the end. I expect this will be more successful if I start with
tinned
cable. (I think the normal price for the 2/0 welding cable was
something
like $1.39 but they had a spool going for $1.04)

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
I prefer to have the windlass and bowthruster to be powered
primarily
by the engine when it is running. The Eliminator from Ample Power
is basically a DC/DC charger but it will add $300 to the project.
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexable. Just use adhesive lined
heat shrink to seal the lugs on the ends to keep out the moisture.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that
you
can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and
generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra
battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends
on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:17:22 GMT, "Gordon Wedman"
wrote:
As for not using tinned cable, I guess this will work
but it is very hard to heat up such thick copper cable and this might
compromise a good all-round tinning of bare copper.

=============================================

You can do the crimping with a large NicoPress tool. That's what I
use and have never had a failure. Cover it with glue filled shrink
tubing and it will look and perform very well. No soldering required.

If you have a grind stone, the $15 12 inch cable cutters from China
make a fine crimping tool, when the cutting edges are reground to a
circle when closed.
I use #2 welding cable for a short run, with copper ring terminals
crimped each end

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:17:22 GMT, "Gordon Wedman"
wrote:

Yes, I've heard that the cable can become very stiff and this can cause
problems. I plan to fix the ends firmly in place with rubber covered metal
clamps. I may go to crimping if I can find a place that can do a good job
on this size cable. As for not using tinned cable, I guess this will work
but it is very hard to heat up such thick copper cable and this might
compromise a good all-round tinning of bare copper.

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
Actually soldering terminals on such large cable is not
recommended. The solder wicks up into the wire
under the insulation several inches and results in a
situation that is very suseptable to cracking over time
to due to vibration. In any case, one normally tins
the end of a wire before soldering it anyway. No need
to pay top dollar when only the ends need to be tinned.
Better to just crimp the terminals on and then seal against
moisture using adhesive lined heat shrink.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Gordon Wedman" wrote in message
news:bTwOc.20$T_6.6@edtnps89...
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexible.

In my case the welding cable was priced at $1.04/ft but I decided to
buy
the tinned battery cable at $1.69/ft because I planned to solder
terminals
to the end. I expect this will be more successful if I start with
tinned
cable. (I think the normal price for the 2/0 welding cable was
something
like $1.39 but they had a spool going for $1.04)

"Doug Dotson" wrote in message
...
I prefer to have the windlass and bowthruster to be powered primarily
by the engine when it is running. The Eliminator from Ample Power
is basically a DC/DC charger but it will add $300 to the project.
Lots of folks use welding cable rather than the tinned marine grade
cable. It's alot cheaper and more flexable. Just use adhesive lined
heat shrink to seal the lugs on the ends to keep out the moisture.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Dick Locke" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 27 Jul 2004 17:36:58 -0400, "Doug Dotson"
wrote:

The concept is that that windlass battery is used so seldom that
you
can
trickle charge it. Personally, I installed the heavy cable and
generally
only run the windlass when the engine is running. An extra battery,
extra charger, etc seems more trouble than it is worth.

OK, I see. Doesn't seem very reliable to me...solar/wind depends on
good weather, AC-DC charger requires an inverter or being on shore
power, and I'm not sure there's a DC-DC trickle charger.

Doug
s/v Callista

ps. When did the word "ampacity" enter the alphabet?

It's not in my vocabulary either, check the person who used it ;-)