Diagonals in lofting
 

Hi All,

I'm considering building my own boat from a set of plans. It's nothing major, just a 28'
round-bottomed cutter.

I know, build a dingy first to sharpen my skills, then build the big one. Problem is, life's
getting on and, with the reaper peeking at me from over the next hill, I'd like to get out and
do some sailing before he sits down with me.

I would try to buy one, but it would seem the rest of the world has never heard of a beamy
24-30 foot wooden cutter with a transom hung rudder and a full keel using lead as ballast. So
here I am.

I do understand most of the lines used in lofting with the exception of the diagonal. What
exactly is the diagonal supposed to show me?

While I'm at it I might as well ask about frames. The plans call for steam bent frames because
it is supposedly faster, cheaper and takes up less room than sawn frames. I have a few problems
with this. 1) Where is one supposed to get the clear wood for the frames, 2] Bending a frame to
an arch isn't much of a problem but how do you bend it to match the curve laid out by the
intersection of the water lines and buttocks (i.e. the angle described gets more acute the
closer to the bow at the sheer but will be flatter on the same frame close to the keel. This
can be done on a sawn frame by changing the angle of the bandsaw table as you cut the frame).

Thanks for any help,

Frank

Diagonals in lofting
 

"Hollywood" wrote in message
...

Hi Hollywood.

Indeed an abitious plan wihout any previous experience. Your questions show
you need to learn some basics. Do yourself a favour and buy the
"Boatbuilding Manual from Robert Steward.
It can be found on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...76967?v=glance

It explains all your questions you just asked and more. It is worth the
investment.

Good luck,
Meindert

Diagonals in lofting
 

On Tue, 29 Jun 2004 08:04:37 +0200, "Meindert Sprang" wrote:

"Hollywood" wrote in message
.. .

Hi Hollywood.

Indeed an abitious plan wihout any previous experience. Your questions show
you need to learn some basics. Do yourself a favour and buy the
"Boatbuilding Manual from Robert Steward.
It can be found on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...76967?v=glance

It explains all your questions you just asked and more. It is worth the
investment.

Good luck,
Meindert

Thanks Meindert.

I do have experience in carpentry and furniture making (hence wanting a wooden boat instead of
fiberglass) and a fair amount in dingy and small craft sailing (up to 30') but somehow I've
never put the two together.

Thanks again,

Frank

Diagonals in lofting
 

Hollywood ) writes:

... 2] Bending a frame to
an arch isn't much of a problem but how do you bend it to match the curve
laid out by the intersection of the water lines and buttocks (i.e. the
angle described gets more acute the closer to the bow at the sheer but
will be flatter on the same frame close to the keel. This can be done on
a sawn frame by changing the angle of the bandsaw table as you cut the
frame). Thanks for any help, Frank

you get two burly boatbuilders with a big wooden mallet and bend the
frame in the hull. :)

note that in bend frames the grain runs along the frame, end grain exposed
only at top and bottom ends. in sawn frames end grain is exposed the
length of the frame. be sure to seal end grain well.
--
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Diagonals in lofting
 

"Hollywood" wrote in message
...
Thanks Meindert.

I do have experience in carpentry and furniture making (hence wanting a
wooden boat instead of
fiberglass) and a fair amount in dingy and small craft sailing (up to 30')
but somehow I've
never put the two together.

That's a nice approach. The only thing to get rid of now is being used to
fairly straight lines and right-angled corners.. :-)

Meindert

Diagonals in lofting
 

Hollywood wrote:

Hi All,

I'm considering building my own boat from a set of plans. It's nothing major, just a 28'
round-bottomed cutter.

Yeah, that's nothing major. sarcasm off
Sounds like a great project. What design?



I know, build a dingy first to sharpen my skills, then build the big one. Problem is, life's
getting on and, with the reaper peeking at me from over the next hill, I'd like to get out and
do some sailing before he sits down with me.

In that case, you should buy a boat rather than build one... since this is heresy for this
newsgroup, how about building something smaller & simpler that will get you on the wate sooner?



I would try to buy one, but it would seem the rest of the world has never heard of a beamy
24-30 foot wooden cutter with a transom hung rudder and a full keel using lead as ballast. So
here I am.

Really? Where have you been looking? There are plenty such boats all around.



I do understand most of the lines used in lofting with the exception of the diagonal. What
exactly is the diagonal supposed to show me?

The diagonal is supposed to show that the body plan is "fair" ie a smooth continuous surface,
hopefully capable of having planks laid along it without humps, shoulders, or needing to steam the
planks to the rigidity of week old spaghetti.



While I'm at it I might as well ask about frames. The plans call for steam bent frames because
it is supposedly faster, cheaper and takes up less room than sawn frames. I have a few problems
with this. 1) Where is one supposed to get the clear wood for the frames,

From a lumber supplier that has boatbuilding wood.


2] Bending a frame to
an arch isn't much of a problem but how do you bend it to match the curve laid out by the
intersection of the water lines and buttocks

Bend the frame tight against the inside of a set of ribbands.

You need to sit down by the fireside with a copy of Howard Chappelle's book 'Manual of Wooden Boat
Construction.' He covers it all in detail, yet clearly. Be sure to read the part about needing a
Moaning Chair ;)

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Diagonals in lofting
 

In that size range, unless you have very unusual requirements such as very high performance,
icebreaking or heartstopping beauty, you can buy a sound boat for less than it would cost you to
build it. For example, this Pearson Triton on Ebay.
Such a boat will afford opportunity for cabinetry improvements.



Hollywood wrote:

Hi All,

I'm considering building my own boat from a set of plans. It's nothing major, just a 28'
round-bottomed cutter.

I know, build a dingy first to sharpen my skills, then build the big one. Problem is, life's
getting on and, with the reaper peeking at me from over the next hill, I'd like to get out and
do some sailing before he sits down with me.

I would try to buy one, but it would seem the rest of the world has never heard of a beamy
24-30 foot wooden cutter with a transom hung rudder and a full keel using lead as ballast. So
here I am.

I do understand most of the lines used in lofting with the exception of the diagonal. What
exactly is the diagonal supposed to show me?

While I'm at it I might as well ask about frames. The plans call for steam bent frames because
it is supposedly faster, cheaper and takes up less room than sawn frames. I have a few problems
with this. 1) Where is one supposed to get the clear wood for the frames, 2] Bending a frame to
an arch isn't much of a problem but how do you bend it to match the curve laid out by the
intersection of the water lines and buttocks (i.e. the angle described gets more acute the
closer to the bow at the sheer but will be flatter on the same frame close to the keel. This
can be done on a sawn frame by changing the angle of the bandsaw table as you cut the frame).

Thanks for any help,

Frank

Diagonals in lofting
 

OOPS! that Triton is not a good choice as the engine is troubled. $15-20K
should get you a Triton or the like with a functioning diesel.

Jim Conlin wrote:

In that size range, unless you have very unusual requirements such as very
high performance, icebreaking or heartstopping beauty, you can buy a sound
boat for less than it would cost you to build it. For example, this
Pearson Triton on Ebay.
Such a boat will afford opportunity for cabinetry improvements.



Hollywood wrote:

Hi All,

I'm considering building my own boat from a set of plans. It's nothing
major, just a 28'
round-bottomed cutter.

I know, build a dingy first to sharpen my skills, then build the big one.
Problem is, life's
getting on and, with the reaper peeking at me from over the next hill,
I'd like to get out and
do some sailing before he sits down with me.

I would try to buy one, but it would seem the rest of the world has never
heard of a beamy
24-30 foot wooden cutter with a transom hung rudder and a full keel using
lead as ballast. So
here I am.

I do understand most of the lines used in lofting with the exception of
the diagonal. What
exactly is the diagonal supposed to show me?

While I'm at it I might as well ask about frames. The plans call for
steam bent frames because
it is supposedly faster, cheaper and takes up less room than sawn frames.
I have a few problems
with this. 1) Where is one supposed to get the clear wood for the frames,
2] Bending a frame to
an arch isn't much of a problem but how do you bend it to match the curve
laid out by the
intersection of the water lines and buttocks (i.e. the angle described
gets more acute the
closer to the bow at the sheer but will be flatter on the same frame
close to the keel. This
can be done on a sawn frame by changing the angle of the bandsaw table as
you cut the frame).

Thanks for any help,

Frank

Diagonals in lofting
 

Jim Conlin wrote:

In that size range, unless you have very unusual requirements such
as very high performance, icebreaking or heartstopping beauty, you
can buy a sound boat for less than it would cost you to build it.
For example, this Pearson Triton on Ebay.
Such a boat will afford opportunity for cabinetry improvements.

How about this one?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...3078 808&rd=1

Plenty to hold the interest of anyone who wants to learn boat
carpentry. Although, like most boats (and other things on Ebay) I
suspect it's badly overpriced. A boat this pretty, and this unique,
shouldn't be left to mulch.

DSK

Diagonals in lofting
 

regarding the value of diagonals, they give the designer another set of
points, which are useful for evaluating the fairness of the hull,
particularly around the turn of the bilge.

"Hollywood" wrote in message
...
Hi All,

I'm considering building my own boat from a set of plans. It's nothing
major, just a 28'
round-bottomed cutter.

I know, build a dingy first to sharpen my skills, then build the big one.
Problem is, life's
getting on and, with the reaper peeking at me from over the next hill, I'd
like to get out and
do some sailing before he sits down with me.

I would try to buy one, but it would seem the rest of the world has never
heard of a beamy
24-30 foot wooden cutter with a transom hung rudder and a full keel using
lead as ballast. So
here I am.

I do understand most of the lines used in lofting with the exception of
the diagonal. What
exactly is the diagonal supposed to show me?

While I'm at it I might as well ask about frames. The plans call for steam
bent frames because
it is supposedly faster, cheaper and takes up less room than sawn frames.
I have a few problems
with this. 1) Where is one supposed to get the clear wood for the frames,
2] Bending a frame to
an arch isn't much of a problem but how do you bend it to match the curve
laid out by the
intersection of the water lines and buttocks (i.e. the angle described
gets more acute the
closer to the bow at the sheer but will be flatter on the same frame close
to the keel. This
can be done on a sawn frame by changing the angle of the bandsaw table as
you cut the frame).

Thanks for any help,

Frank