Cutting Fiberglas: How?
 

Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris

Chris wrote:
Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris


Any abrasive tool, grinder, dremel, file or hacksaw. Wear a dust
mask. How to get at it sounds like a bigger concern.

Terry K

Terry Spragg wrote:
Chris wrote:
Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris


Any abrasive tool, grinder, dremel, file or hacksaw. Wear a dust
mask. How to get at it sounds like a bigger concern.

Terry K


I assume you have checked the engine mounts and that there is not a
problem.

Any cutting tool will do fiberglass. Depending on access I would tend
to use a hacksaw. If using power tools try to run a shop vac near the
cut to remove as much dust as possible. Wear a mask and glasses.

After cutting out the chunk you will need to reglass the cutout since
you are probably exposing the ends of the glass fibers.

Whatever you use, fibreglass will dull the blake really fast.
--
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diamond blade in 4" angle grinder

mask for dust of course.

blow yourself down with air afterwards (leaf blower if no compressed air)

"Chris" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris

On 7 Aug 2005 10:45:42 -0700, "Chris" wrote:

I would look at the engine mountings first....but....

Depends on access. You could use a diamond wheel (may clog) or an
abrasive blade on a grinder. To prevent clogging, one way is to wax
the wheel. I bought a huge block of wax from the local abrasives
supply place just foe the purpose. Quite cheap too. You can use
candles etc. The idea is that the wax melts, and frees up the stuff to
fly away, I am told. Makes sense.

If it's a hands only job, then get the hacksaw blade with the carbide
grit edge. I find that normal hacksaw blades disappear pretty fast
with glass.

You can also get grit blades for jigsaws. Make sure the blade does not
pull back back into the glass any stage of its stroke, or you risk
bending/breaking the blade.

Hacksaw and jigsaw will generate a lot less dust.

As everybody else said, suck out diust as fast as possible. Wear a
mask at least. Probably get a disposable suit and do dispose of it.
Are you sensitive to Glass dust? You will pay if so. Some ideas are to
cover yourself with lanolin cream etc, then _wash_ it off afterward.
Use sticky tape to pull the foibres out etc etc Whatever, do not scrub
at glass itch.

Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris

"Chris" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris


@#@ I use an sawzal Bosch, Milwakee and others make them.

Rey

Whatever you can make work. Sawzall, jigsaw (carbid grit blades preferred),
Dremel, or 4" grinder might do the job. My favorites are twist drills, hole
saws and the Fein Multi-Master.

"Chris" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris

Before you do any cutting of fiberglass check for the cause.
I do not know what type of boat you have and how old is your engine.
First you I would investigate more and try to minimize the vibration. The
vibration could be caused by all kind of things, engine tuning, mounts, head
casket, valves adjustment, air lock etc. If it does vibrates excessively
while turning the propeller your shaft alignment may be the cause.

"Reynaud" wrote in message
...

"Chris" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris


@#@ I use an sawzal Bosch, Milwakee and others make them.

Rey

Any of the tools mentioned will work, but I'd try to find out what
caused the problem--unless you're sure this is a design flaw. you may
weaken the engine stringers, or if you may have bad engine mounts as
mentioned above, which may also be affecting your alignment. At any
rate, the one thing I wanted to add is, if you are using a power tool,
esp. if you are grinding, wear a tyvec-type overalls. You may sweat a
bit, but it sure beats the glass-itch. If you get glass itch,
alternate very hot and very cold water in the shower. It won't get rid
of it, but the scalding sensation will make you forget about it for a
spell.

good luck.

mickey

Jim Conlin wrote:
Whatever you can make work. Sawzall, jigsaw (carbid grit blades preferred),
Dremel, or 4" grinder might do the job. My favorites are twist drills, hole
saws and the Fein Multi-Master.

"Chris" wrote in message
oups.com...

Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris


I just enlarged 6 thru-hull 3/16" deep holes with my Dremel tool and a
stone gringer. It was hard to make the bigger holes perfectly round,
but all was hidden by the thru-hull flange.
My niece's husband used to work ar Rosborough boats and when he was at
my house last week, said they would use Milwaukie hole saws for same job.

yep...i agree to investagate a bit
further the source of the vibration....
unlikely a "design flaw"......my
initial opinion.....

Unless you identify what causes the vibration you may be aggravating the
situation by grinding some of the engine foundation. Conversely if you let
the water pump pounding against the foundation you may end up with a bigger
problem failure at the most inopportune moment. What I have used with
success is a hand rasp. By doing it by hand you have a better control on
the amount of material that you remove and much less dust.
If you have the skill for it you may want to use a 3/4" gouge and remove
exactly the amount you need and finish it off with a rasp and sand paper.
The mini grinder require lots of skill and produce lots of dust. Before
using them you may want to practice of a scrap piece of similar material.
After you are satisfy and feel better about the water pump not hitting the
foundation you have to seal the area with resin and paint after. This is
just a band aid solution you have to find the cause of the vibration.

"Don White" wrote in message
...
Jim Conlin wrote:
Whatever you can make work. Sawzall, jigsaw (carbid grit blades
preferred),
Dremel, or 4" grinder might do the job. My favorites are twist drills,
hole
saws and the Fein Multi-Master.

"Chris" wrote in message
oups.com...

Hi,

I noticed that during idling, my engine vibrates enough
to constantly hit the water pump on the fiberglass engine
foundation. The last two or three big jumps the diesel does
when stopped bang the water pump into the fiberglass really
hard.

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks a lot,

Chris


I just enlarged 6 thru-hull 3/16" deep holes with my Dremel tool and a
stone gringer. It was hard to make the bigger holes perfectly round,
but all was hidden by the thru-hull flange.
My niece's husband used to work ar Rosborough boats and when he was at
my house last week, said they would use Milwaukie hole saws for same job.

Chris wrote:

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

My favorite tool for cutting fiberglass is a Fein Multimaster with a
carbide tile cutting disk. It cuts pretty quickly, it's easy to control,
It's very safe to use, you can hook a vac to it and the carbide cutter
doesn't get dull like steel tools will. The downside is that it's not
cheap, though once you have one, you'll find lots of other uses for it.

In article gU3Ke.6575$eR.6555@trndny04,
Brian Nystrom wrote:

Chris wrote:

So about about half an inch of the engine foundation has to go.
What is the best tool to cut really solid fiberglass, and how
do I do this? Any advice is appreciated.

My favorite tool for cutting fiberglass is a Fein Multimaster with a
carbide tile cutting disk. It cuts pretty quickly, it's easy to control,
It's very safe to use, you can hook a vac to it and the carbide cutter
doesn't get dull like steel tools will. The downside is that it's not
cheap, though once you have one, you'll find lots of other uses for it.

Hell, I just use any saw I have to hand. KISS!

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

is that it's not
cheap, though once you have one, you'll find lots of other uses for it.

Hell, I just use any saw I have to hand. KISS!

jerelull/BVI/

Thats how I burned up 7 jigsaw blades to cut 2 6x9 holes for speakers. They
literally were hourglass shaped after 5 minutes.

Thanks for all the comments so far!

Right now I am guessing that it is a design flaw:
The engine stringers already have pieces cut out to
fit the engine. The boat had the current Yanmar from
day one, but I guess the engine space was designed
for the atomic 4, and poorly adapted to the Yanmar
by cutting out pieces. (The fuel filter had also been
touching the steps, which was corrected by a previous
owner by moving the steps a bit.)

The pump issue is a problem, because the constant banging
on the stringer slowly tilts the pump towards the engine,
releasing tension of the belt: = No cooling water.

I don't think that the engine has been used a lot, so
this problem could have been there unnoticed all the time.
(Two almost new impellers I found support this theory:
No cooling Water = change impeller.
This reestablishes belt tension,
= problem solved until next time, and
an almost new impeller to keep on the boat.) (*)

What should I look for to determine if something is
wrong other than the engine mounting tolerances?

Here is some more information:

- The gap between the water pump and the engine stringer
is between 1/2" and 1", which seemed too little to me,
hence the idea of cutting off more fiberglass.
What do you say: How much clearance should there be?

- Vibration doesn't seem excessive for a 2 cylinder diesel,
although I am not an expert at judging this.
I saw 4 cylinder car engines shake almost that much,
a five cylinder Mercedes (car) diesel about the same.

- Alignment is not part of the problem, the banging happens
in neutral as well.
Vibration stays the same (or even goes down a bit, I think)
with the propeller engaged. I haven't looked under full load,
just at a bit above idling in the slip.

- The rubber engine mounts seem ok, no visible breakage,
deformation, etc.

Thanks again for all input,

Chris


(*) This brings me to another question:
Where do I get cheaper Yanmar parts?
I paid $36 for the impeller, that seems
an awful lot of money for a tiny piece
of rubber.
It has 'Johnson' imprinted on it. Are
outboard parts cheaper?


mickey wrote:
Any of the tools mentioned will work, but I'd try to find out what
caused the problem--unless you're sure this is a design flaw. you may
weaken the engine stringers, or if you may have bad engine mounts as
mentioned above, which may also be affecting your alignment. At any
rate, the one thing I wanted to add is, if you are using a power tool,
esp. if you are grinding, wear a tyvec-type overalls. You may sweat a
bit, but it sure beats the glass-itch. If you get glass itch,
alternate very hot and very cold water in the shower. It won't get rid
of it, but the scalding sensation will make you forget about it for a
spell.

good luck.

mickey

What is air lock?

Thanks,

Chris

What specifically should I look for in the engine
mountings? They don't seem deformed or broken.

Thanks,

Chris

Chris wrote:

Thanks for all the comments so far!

Right now I am guessing that it is a design flaw:
The engine stringers already have pieces cut out to
fit the engine. The boat had the current Yanmar from
day one, but I guess the engine space was designed
for the atomic 4, and poorly adapted to the Yanmar
by cutting out pieces. (The fuel filter had also been
touching the steps, which was corrected by a previous
owner by moving the steps a bit.)

The pump issue is a problem, because the constant banging
on the stringer slowly tilts the pump towards the engine,
releasing tension of the belt: = No cooling water.

I don't think that the engine has been used a lot, so
this problem could have been there unnoticed all the time.
(Two almost new impellers I found support this theory:
No cooling Water = change impeller.
This reestablishes belt tension,
= problem solved until next time, and
an almost new impeller to keep on the boat.) (*)

What should I look for to determine if something is
wrong other than the engine mounting tolerances?

Here is some more information:

- The gap between the water pump and the engine stringer
is between 1/2" and 1", which seemed too little to me,
hence the idea of cutting off more fiberglass.
What do you say: How much clearance should there be?

- Vibration doesn't seem excessive for a 2 cylinder diesel,
although I am not an expert at judging this.
I saw 4 cylinder car engines shake almost that much,
a five cylinder Mercedes (car) diesel about the same.

- Alignment is not part of the problem, the banging happens
in neutral as well.
Vibration stays the same (or even goes down a bit, I think)
with the propeller engaged. I haven't looked under full load,
just at a bit above idling in the slip.

- The rubber engine mounts seem ok, no visible breakage,
deformation, etc.

Thanks again for all input,

Chris


(*) This brings me to another question:
Where do I get cheaper Yanmar parts?
I paid $36 for the impeller, that seems
an awful lot of money for a tiny piece
of rubber.
It has 'Johnson' imprinted on it. Are
outboard parts cheaper?


mickey wrote:

Any of the tools mentioned will work, but I'd try to find out what
caused the problem--unless you're sure this is a design flaw. you may
weaken the engine stringers, or if you may have bad engine mounts as
mentioned above, which may also be affecting your alignment. At any
rate, the one thing I wanted to add is, if you are using a power tool,
esp. if you are grinding, wear a tyvec-type overalls. You may sweat a
bit, but it sure beats the glass-itch. If you get glass itch,
alternate very hot and very cold water in the shower. It won't get rid
of it, but the scalding sensation will make you forget about it for a
spell.

good luck.

mickey



The best thing for glass itch is masking tape or packing tape. Use
it to pull the glass out of your skin, like a lint roller. It
works, if only for one pass per piece of tape!

Terry K

Chris wrote:

What specifically should I look for in the engine
mountings? They don't seem deformed or broken.

Thanks,

Chris

They should hold the motor more or less in the right place. If not
torn or broken, they are likely up to spec. The right stiffness may
make a difference to percieved vibration.

Terry K

Chris wrote:

What is air lock?

Thanks,

Chris


Air lock can be different things, but occurs when air somehow stops
a pump or drain. Air lock in a suction line may be simply an air
leak in the line, or may be a partial vacuum in a sealed tank of
fuel caused by not letting air get into the tank to relieve the
vacuum. Air lock in a drain won't let water out of i.e. your
toilet, when the drain vent, on the roof of your house, gets
plugged with snow, ice, leaves or birds' nests. The overpressure in
the drain line can impede the evacuation of the water.

Vapour lock is when fuel in the fuel line boils and acts the same as
if you had an air leak in the pump suction line, preventing a pump
from reducing pressure in the intake line sufficiently for ambient
atmospheric pressure to propel liquid to the pump.

Terry K

Good evening, Chris,

Very unlikely that's a Johnson OUTBOARD part. There's a whole different
Johnson company that manufactures a line of marine engine cooling pumps.
Check out www.johnson-pump.com then "Google around" and find a dealer
who discounts the service parts. Not West Marine/Boat US, BTW.

Ed Greeley

Chris wrote:


(*) This brings me to another question:
Where do I get cheaper Yanmar parts?
I paid $36 for the impeller, that seems
an awful lot of money for a tiny piece
of rubber.
It has 'Johnson' imprinted on it. Are
outboard parts cheaper?

(*) This brings me to another question:
Where do I get cheaper Yanmar parts?
I paid $36 for the impeller, that seems
an awful lot of money for a tiny piece
of rubber.
It has 'Johnson' imprinted on it. Are
outboard parts cheaper?

The Johnson pumps are Swedish made pump. I have one on my Yanmar
3GM30 for the seawater pump. I don't know where you got your
impeller, but I got two for that price last week. I think I
ordered out of the Lewis Marine catalog at my local marina,
where I had overnight delivery.

Johnson part # 09-810B-1

Leanne
s/v Fundy
W1WXS

Thanks for all the input! A hand rasp worked well,
took off the required 1/2" in less than 15 minutes.

Chris